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I doubt any of the people in this thread other than myself that have claimed to work at Apple actually have.

False.

Based on your attitude, I am curious at how long you have worked at your apple store. Clearly you haven't hit that jaded blow-my-brains-out-after-my-shift-is-done mentality that everyone does. The genius team from my store kept the local bars in business.

Everyone I know that worked in a busy apple store for any amount of time (myself included) got burnt out and realized that working for Apple is just a job. Apple is just a company trying to make money. There are bean counters and paper pushers that have more interest on squeezing 10% more productivity out of you than they are in retaining your sanity.

You are right, it's not a technical job. That is one of the reasons I left the job. I accepted a job there as a genius assuming that I would be doing actual technical work at a reasonable salary. In the beginning, this was true. I could overlook having only 1/10 weekend days off. I could overlook working 1-10PM shifts and never getting to see my wife. At first... Then when they introduced all these "diagnostic tools" that were REQUIRED for us to submit any sort of repairs and whose sole purpose was to appease the customer and make them feel like we weren't just shafting them, I felt less and less like a technician and more like a button pusher. Then everyone of us that quit was replaced by a less qualified person and payed 10% less than the previous person's starting salary until we have what we have today.

When my lead told me that they were going to start overnight repair shifts and that you were going to spend all your "regular" hours in the red zone or family room, he looked at me square in the face with his dead soulless eyes and parroted to me what management told him to parrot to me; that it would be a GOOD thing for us, it would reduce our work load and make things less stressful. He was full of crap, and we both knew it. That was the final straw. It wasn't worth it. There are better jobs that have better scheduling requirements and pay more and don't make you feel like some retail shill filling the pockets of corporate big-wigs.

There are a lot of overqualified people working in apple stores. They won't be there long. The ones that are left behind are the ones who have the qualities that they are looking for in an apple retail employee, gullible, friendly, a hipster, and willing to drink the kool-aid.

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I won't complain about one other habit I've noticed: having an employee look in the Apple Knowledge Base for answers right after I told them that I've already looked in the Apple Knowledge Base (I even tell them what I learned there and what it didn't cover). I know that they can't trust customers to have done a thorough check for information that may already be there; I'm always thorough but they don't know that, so I think they are correct to check it themselves. Then, if they agree with me that the answer isn't there, we can proceed from there.

I did find it funny that the last time I asked for help they clicked into a thread about it at MacRumors.

Benefit of the doubt, certified apple techs (including geniuses and AASPs) have access to more information in kbase articles than you do.

Also, in training they encourage you to use every and any avenue to locate answers. Macrumors, apple discussions, whatever. "I don't know but lets find out together" still makes me ill, but it's valid. A significant amount of the answers I provided to people were simply because I know how to use google.

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The job is nothing more than a poorly paid store clerk with no job security and minimum benefits and attracts mostly students who need a job while in school.

The benefits are one of the few things I do miss. I made quite a lot of money off stock and 401k growth. And you can't complain about the computer discounts. As far as job security, the only way you'll lose your job is if you quit, are absolutely incompetent, or steal from the store.
 
"Your business model of no cash registers is all wrong!"
Well, our record-breaking profits would disagree with you. As would the vast majority of my customers who tell me that the ability of me to check them out with my EasyPay right then and there is really awesome and convenient.

I was pissed once when the person helping me didn't have one of the credit card devices. I still had to wait a few minutes to get checked out (pre-Easypay).

And some people don't like change. They are concrete thinkers and anything out of the ordinary riles them. It's amazing how blocked these people are. As I have gotten older, I have really tried to not automatically hate new things or different ways of doing things. Well, and after saying that, I am predicting two things: 1) Windows 8 will fail hysterically, and 2) Dell will be on life support within the year after their current mad buying binge. They will have corporate indigestion for quite a long time. I mean, they bought SonicWALL, Appasure, and now Wyse, all in a few months. Three very different corporate philosophies and ways of doing things. Now after the 'post purchase flight' of people from those new purchases, and the fights over management styles and the force down of 'The Dell Way' of not pushing the envelope too hard, I have strong feelings that Dell is just pouring more sewage on an already putrid mess.

But I could be wrong... Although I wouldn't want to be a Dell shareholder. Remember HP and Compaq?

But anyway, back to the topic: Apple Stores are like a college dorm, or a study in positive anarchy. I remember brainstorming sessions in college and it was often a chaotic, flowing, and productive, place. You could literally feel the power and the intelligence at work. Ok, maybe I reach with that a little, but there are often very creative people at Apple Stores helping and spreading their love for knowledge and a product.
 
Ahem, you mean "if everyone *were* a rocket scientist..." (its called subjunctive, look into it).

Also, you're wrong. If you want good people then you need to pay good money. Good people go where the money is. If flipping burgers paid six figures a year (and rocket science paid minimum wage) then we would have geniuses finding new ways to flip burgers and idiots designing rockets (no satellites, no space flights).

Don't be a tool. In speech/informal writing 'was' is perfectly acceptable in the same way 'Manchester United are beating Chelsea...' is more common than the 'correct' 'Manchester United is beating Chelsea'.

Plus, it doesn't matter how much of a genius you are if the only jobs going are low grade and low paid. McDonalds don't care if you've found a way to cooked burgers in two seconds with cold fusion - you're there to 'love it' and shut up. It's not some meritocracy where the good float to the top.
 
Don't be a tool. In speech/informal writing 'was' is perfectly acceptable in the same way 'Manchester United are beating Chelsea...' is more common than the 'correct' 'Manchester United is beating Chelsea'.

Plus, it doesn't matter how much of a genius you are if the only jobs going are low grade and low paid. McDonalds don't care if you've found a way to cooked burgers in two seconds with cold fusion - you're there to 'love it' and shut up. It's not some meritocracy where the good float to the top.

Actually, there are plenty of jobs available for well-qualified applicants. I was laid off two years ago due to the economy (they laid off 500 of the newest employees at FedEx), but found a great job and was employed again 13 days later.

If you're good enough at what you do, you can always get a better job.

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Benefit of the doubt, certified apple techs (including geniuses and AASPs) have access to more information in kbase articles than you do.

Also, in training they encourage you to use every and any avenue to locate answers. Macrumors, apple discussions, whatever. "I don't know but lets find out together" still makes me ill, but it's valid. A significant amount of the answers I provided to people were simply because I know how to use google.

Agreed, but even if they have access to the same information... sometimes people are "better" at using search engines. For instance, my mother telling me she Googled and couldn't find a solution won't prevent me from finding the answer in two minutes on Google myself...
 
I hear you. I applied in the midst of my Phd when there was a new store opening in town, I decided not to go ahead when I found out the minimum was 19 hours. Then when my Phd funding did actually run out, I reapplied and heard nothing from them. Luckily my supervisor was able to employ me (and is still employing me) while I finish off.

Alas they don't really do the whole hiring while finishing off thing where I am. Luckily we have a lot of undergraduate marking available although even racking up the hours in that, it won't be enough to make up for the funding. I'm considering looking at tutoring as I hear that pays quite well around London. Luckily though, my fiancée earns several multiples what I do and has just taken a new job with an even higher salary and bonus scheme so I should hopefully be ok although it does mean that I will not be staying in academia once I finish.
 
As I read this thread it reminded me of my 2 years (2007-2009) working part-time at a local Apple store. They were accommodating with my full-time work schedule and my family life. The store even let me off most of the holidays, which in retail is unheard of. Furthermore, I had weekends off most of the time to go to my son's baseball games. I even got laid off from my full-time job and they increased my hours for me to help out. Sure, I had my times of dealing with hipster co-workers and store cliques (that's a whole other story) but overall the experience was okay. Would I ever go back? Only if my family was starving and it was a last resort.
 
Really? All I have to do is use the iPad next to the product I'm interested in and a specialist turns up and sorts out the sale - even if it's just an accessory (I just go to the nearest mac and use the iPad next to it).

Sure, the specialist won't turn up immediately when it's really busy but I've never been let down by the service.

I have been really let down by service the last 3-4 times I have been in an Apple store. If a customer isn't willing to hobnob with one of the blue clad dorks around an imac or a macbook pro, you aren't going to get much help.
I have even gone so far as taking out my amex, tapping it on a table when associates whisk by to the next person hovering around a macbook air. Sometimes I will plead out loud, "Please take my money, PLEASE TAKE MY MONEY!"
And I am serious!
 
I have been really let down by service the last 3-4 times I have been in an Apple store. If a customer isn't willing to hobnob with one of the blue clad dorks around an imac or a macbook pro, you aren't going to get much help.
I have even gone so far as taking out my amex, tapping it on a table when associates whisk by to the next person hovering around a macbook air. Sometimes I will plead out loud, "Please take my money, PLEASE TAKE MY MONEY!"
And I am serious!

Have you tried the iPad? I mean, I often visit the Covent Garden and Regent St stores - both VERY busy stores - and I'm never left waiting that long, probably thanks to the iPad. Without it I'd probably resort to the same actions as you.
 
Don't be a tool. In speech/informal writing 'was' is perfectly acceptable in the same way 'Manchester United are beating Chelsea...' is more common than the 'correct' 'Manchester United is beating Chelsea'.

Wrong. Is 'informal' your way of saying 'grammatically incorrect'? Using the wrong conjugation for singular/plural subject is not quite the same thing as using an entirely wrong verb tense. Allow me to suggest learning how to speak English properly instead of making up ********* excuses for your errors. ;)

Plus, it doesn't matter how much of a genius you are if the only jobs going are low grade and low paid. McDonalds don't care if you've found a way to cooked burgers in two seconds with cold fusion - you're there to 'love it' and shut up. It's not some meritocracy where the good float to the top.

Actually I'd say that most jobs that offer opportunity for advancement are meritocracies. Proven performers usually get more responsibility (and sometimes more money, imagine that!). Talk to any hiring manager and they will tell you that the 1st or 2nd best indicator as to how productive or how much responsibility a potential hire can handle is their previous salary.
 
I want to know more about these overnight repair shifts. Does this mean the retail stores have guys in the back doing repairs all night?

Not all night, but until 3AM or around that they do. They spend the rest of the regular retail hours on the floor swapping phones and pushing buttons on iRepair until it tells them how to fix a computer.
 
As a current Apple Retail employee, I'd like to address some of the comments going on in this thread.
"Working Apple Retail sucks because we're overworked!"
I doubt any of the people in this thread other than myself that have claimed to work at Apple actually have. It's just not true that we're overworked. For the part-timers, most of us want MORE hours, not less. I think the person who wrote this article that said something like "whatever drove them to apply for part-time in the first place" doesn't actually understand the Apple Retail process. Almost everyone is hired PT. Getting FT is more like a promotion rather than about availability. It's not like all the PT people want to be PT and are crying themselves to sleep because they had to work 24 hours instead of 20. Maybe a handful really want to stay PT, but most don't.
This has already been said, but you surely don't work in a place where much students apply.

(...) No one wants to be asked by 10 people in a row "do you need help?".
Somehow I guess Apple will figure out a way to use augmented reality to "tag" customers who already have been asked this question :rolleyes:

"The customer IS always right, why do they argue with me?"
Specifically to Moduz's experience, we do our best to make sure our customers get what they need. The best way to do that is to get to know the customer. Now for a rare power-user like yourself, yes you want to be in and out. And maybe the employee should have gotten a better read that you were ready to go. We aren't perfect. Next time just politely say "I appreciate your advice but I'm sure this is the model I want and I'm ready to check out." 99% of Apple Employees will ring you up at that point, no questions asked.

Keep in mind though we do this to help. Not just to make sure you get the right computer, but for other reasons too. One, making you aware of everything we have to offer. Most electronics stores don't do training on their products right in the store. So customers don't expect it. But we do. So sometimes if we talk a bit you find out, "wow you guys do training right here in store? I didn't know that!"
And what about the power user who knows its needs, but is unsure about the exact model? Why can't Apple Store employees answer in a clear and precise fashion, asking for clarification if needed?

When asking precise questions about what model I should buy mid-February, having reduced between three possible models, I asked 1- If I could install Snow Leopard on them 2- What would be the best model considering I don't use much power so often, but would find a use for a higher-resolution screen, and that I always take the laptop with me, wherever I go? This was clearly a "lifestyle" and usability issue, yet the blue-clad dork answered 1- "Easily", and 2- only approved to my slightest preference. I was expecting some more detailed talk yet only got "yes", "probably", "Oh, I totally understand" kind of answers I would have gotten out of an automatedchat system. And he never went to get a more precise answer.

They don't come? I've never understood internet trolls. Why complain repeatedly about a business but continue to shop there and visit rumor sites about their products?
In smaller cities sometimes you have no choice but to come to an Apple Store to get what is unique to them.

(...)I literally called, emailed and walked into the store several times asking for a response and not once did I get to speak with anyone even remotely in charge. It was really rude and unprofessional in my opinion. (especially considering how easy a mass "thanks for trying" kind of email would be to send out)

Anyways, good luck.
Same experience. Sorry to say it bluntly, but managers act as *******s. Never there when you want to know what's going on about your application, never willing to help a customer out of a simple productivity issue.

I hear you. I applied in the midst of my Phd when there was a new store opening in town, I decided not to go ahead when I found out the minimum was 19 hours. Then when my Phd funding did actually run out, I reapplied and heard nothing from them. Luckily my supervisor was able to employ me (and is still employing me) while I finish off.
Not on the topic, but are you located in Australia? How much does a PhD typically cost there, both for a foreigner and a resident?

I have been really let down by service the last 3-4 times I have been in an Apple store. If a customer isn't willing to hobnob with one of the blue clad dorks around an imac or a macbook pro, you aren't going to get much help.
I have even gone so far as taking out my amex, tapping it on a table when associates whisk by to the next person hovering around a macbook air. Sometimes I will plead out loud, "Please take my money, PLEASE TAKE MY MONEY!"
And I am serious!
Already experienced that. Managers just don't fo their job in ensuring there aren't too many people at the same time in a store.
 
As a current Apple Retail employee, I'd like to address some of the comments going on in this thread.

"Apple Retail employees have no technical knowledge!"
We are not hired to be robots. Customer service and social skills are valued over technical knowledge. That is not to say we don't have tech knowledge, I happen to be quite the geek myself. But the point is the HR department doesn't emphasize that as much as personality. Maybe the 1% of power users want to have a sales experience with an unfriendly, barely sociable hardcore nerd who can tell them the exact specs of every chip inside the machine, but the vast majority of customers don't. They want to find out what machine best suits their lifestyle from someone they can relate to.

And for those 1% by the way, that's WHY you're handed off. Because we want to serve 100% of the customers and if your questions do exceed our knowledge we find someone who has the answers.

"Working Apple Retail sucks because we're overworked!"
I doubt any of the people in this thread other than myself that have claimed to work at Apple actually have. It's just not true that we're overworked. For the part-timers, most of us want MORE hours, not less. I think the person who wrote this article that said something like "whatever drove them to apply for part-time in the first place" doesn't actually understand the Apple Retail process. Almost everyone is hired PT. Getting FT is more like a promotion rather than about availability. It's not like all the PT people want to be PT and are crying themselves to sleep because they had to work 24 hours instead of 20. Maybe a handful really want to stay PT, but most don't.

As for the full time people, they aren't overworked either. They work 40 hours, just like any other FT job. In fact, HR actually gets a bit pissed if you run over 40. You're not allowed to take OT unless the management approves it, which is rare. The only time I've ever worked OT (and true for most employees) is during a launch. And as you all know, that's only once or twice per year.

In terms of the work itself making us "overworked", that's not the case either. Granted, it's busier than other retail. But if anything that makes the time go by faster. I think the reason people think it's so "horrific" is because our society has become accustomed to the idea that "work" is texting and surfing for 90% of your shift, and grudgingly helping customers the other 10%. That's not how it's supposed to be, and so no it's not the way it is at Apple. We get a 15 minute break for every 4 hours of work, a half-hour lunch for a 5.5-7.5 hour shift, and an hour lunch for an 8-9 hour shift. Spaced out evenly it's usually only about two hours of continuous work before you get a breather. And the managers are usually pretty good at making sure you get your breaks. If we're really busy and you go past your break time, they'll come find you and tell you to take it, even if there's a line.

"Apple Retail employees just stand around!"
We don't have chairs and for the most part don't have cash registers anymore, so yes, we stand around on the floor. That doesn't mean we won't help you. Just ask. We do our best to ask customers first if they need help, but sometimes that can get repetitive. No one wants to be asked by 10 people in a row "do you need help?". Besides, one of the biggest reasons you need help at other retail store is because the electronics are fake models. At Apple, you can experience the real products. Would you rather listen to one of us drone on about an iPad or play with one yourself?

Sure sometimes when it gets slow we socialize with each other. That happens in any workplace. Coworkers who like each other and know each other are more productive in my experience. But if you see us standing there talking about football, walk up and either join in, telling us about your team, or ask us if we can assist you. But don't just brood in the corner, then storm out, go home, and rage online.

"They put me in a queue!"
Most stores I go to (non-Apple, that is) have ropelines near checkout, where you stand and wait to pay for your merchandise. It get's pretty boring standing in a line. At Apple, we too get busy, but instead we have a virtual "line" called iQueue, that allows you to continue to walk around and browse while still retaining your place "in line". This is a feature of our stores, not a detractor. If we can help you instantly we will. If we can't, we ask you to wait just like any other business would, except you can do it without the confines of standing still in a physical line.

"Just give me one of those scanners and I'll check myself out!"
It's called EasyPay for customers, it's in the Apple Store App for iOS devices available on the App Store. Go download it and next time check yourself out.

"The customer IS always right, why do they argue with me?"
Specifically to Moduz's experience, we do our best to make sure our customers get what they need. The best way to do that is to get to know the customer. Now for a rare power-user like yourself, yes you want to be in and out. And maybe the employee should have gotten a better read that you were ready to go. We aren't perfect. Next time just politely say "I appreciate your advice but I'm sure this is the model I want and I'm ready to check out." 99% of Apple Employees will ring you up at that point, no questions asked.

Keep in mind though we do this to help. Not just to make sure you get the right computer, but for other reasons too. One, making you aware of everything we have to offer. Most electronics stores don't do training on their products right in the store. So customers don't expect it. But we do. So sometimes if we talk a bit you find out, "wow you guys do training right here in store? I didn't know that!"

"Your business model of no cash registers is all wrong!"
Well, our record-breaking profits would disagree with you. As would the vast majority of my customers who tell me that the ability of me to check them out with my EasyPay right then and there is really awesome and convenient.

"I don't like how busy Apple Stores are. I don't like their employee's attitude. I don't like their model. I don't like any of it."
They don't come? I've never understood internet trolls. Why complain repeatedly about a business but continue to shop there and visit rumor sites about their products?

Straight to the point. Great!
 
Part-time employees can only work a max of 19 hours with no benefits. The next step up is 29 hours with partial benefits ( like vacation but no health). 24 hours is odd and will cost Apple these partial benefits. I bet Apple is saying "we want you to work 19 hours but if we need you an extra 5 hours this week you have to make yourself available." Basically they will be asking every part-timer to work for 19 hours yet commit for 24. Want to bet?
 
Same experience. Sorry to say it bluntly, but managers act as *******s.

Not the managers I ever dealt with as a customer and I am shopping between 6 different stores in the LA area

Never there when you want to know what's going on about your application,

Well perhaps they aren't jumping to go find out that info because they are helping actual customers at the time. Also companies aren't required legally to give you daily updates. If you feel that they aren't taking it upon themselves to do so and they should then that's a big sign they aren't the company for you so move on.

never willing to help a customer out of a simple productivity issue.

Not their job. They are there to manage not to sell, repair or teach. And because it is not their job they likely don't have the answers anyway. And depending on the question, the staff might not either. They are the Apple store not the everything about computers store. So they aren't trained on things like Office, Pro Tools, etc. And they can't make decisions like is Pages or Word better for you. Only you can do that. And yet I've heard sales people called things like stupid bitch because they couldn't answer questions about Access (which I don't think Microsoft even makes for Windows anymore much less Mac)

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"Apple Retail employees just stand around!"
We don't have chairs and for the most part don't have cash registers anymore, so yes, we stand around on the floor. That doesn't mean we won't help you. Just ask.

As a customer I am going to firmly disagree here and state that anyone that agrees with you, at any retail job, needs to leave or be fired.

It gets repetitive, too damn bad. It is your job to ask. Every time, every customer. Not to stand around with your buddies until someone comes to you. That's why you are there, being paid to WORK, not paid to play.

And if there are no customers at that moment I bet there are iPads and iPhones covered in fingerprints you can clean up or porn you can clear off the MacBooks etc. Because again, you are paid to work, not hang out. So do some work
 
Not the managers I ever dealt with as a customer and I am shopping between 6 different stores in the LA area
You're very lucky.

Well perhaps they aren't jumping to go find out that info because they are helping actual customers at the time. Also companies aren't required legally to give you daily updates. If you feel that they aren't taking it upon themselves to do so and they should then that's a big sign they aren't the company for you so move on.
There's a gap between requesting an update after a day or two, and requesting one after ten days. When you phone the store, the clerk claims manager is unavailable and, 10 minutes later, you go in the store, you see her standing near the stockroom door while the store is mostly empty, one would have a hard time considering her too busy to answer the phone for a few minutes.

The company may be right, but managers are only humans, and can be stupid asses, so to say. In fact, it seems to be pretty common in my town since there are so many people willing to be exploited for the minimum wage.

Not their job. They are there to manage not to sell, repair or teach. And because it is not their job they likely don't have the answers anyway. And depending on the question, the staff might not either. They are the Apple store not the everything about computers store. So they aren't trained on things like Office, Pro Tools, etc. And they can't make decisions like is Pages or Word better for you. Only you can do that. And yet I've heard sales people called things like stupid bitch because they couldn't answer questions about Access (which I don't think Microsoft even makes for Windows anymore much less Mac)
Surely they are trained in Mac OS X, especially when it hampers productivity. The manager is also the one in charge of dealing with customers when customers couldn't get their issues resolved by the floor staff. Yet they wouldn't accept responsibility for what their "specialists" told me, no downgrade, no "under the table" repair, not even a small freebie to try to make forget the inconvenience of losing a week's worth of work.
 
Not on the topic, but are you located in Australia? How much does a PhD typically cost there, both for a foreigner and a resident?

Yes I am. I actually don't know since my scholarship paid my research funding as well as giving me a living allowance. I don't actually know anyone self-funding a phd (we're all on scholarships), but I'm assuming it's in the order of 10-20 thousand per year.
 
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