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d5aqoëp

macrumors 65816
Original poster
Feb 9, 2016
1,146
1,667
I had a battery replaced Apple OEM one on 2 iPhone X devices after 2 years from a local shop last December 2019. Now yesterday, suddenly it is saying that battery needs service. I had previously noted the serial number of my battery using 3u Tools. But now 3u Tools cannot determine serial number. It means that Apple has extended their evil lockdown to iPhone X series as well after beta testing for XS and XR series last year. This lockdown has gone too far.

My phone is operating perfectly though. 3u Tools still reports 100% battery capacity and 55 charge cycles. Just that iOS won’t show the %. This happened on both the devices on exactly same date. If you have iOS 13.3.1, after restart, it invalidates your 3rd party battery even if it is genuine Apple battery. You have to transfer the circuitry from old battery to new one and use some spot welding under microscope as per youtube video to make it work as original.

Is this anti consumer? If the customer decides to use aftermarket battery, let them use it at their own risk. At least Apple genuine OEM batteries should have been spared.
 

BugeyeSTI

macrumors 601
Aug 19, 2017
4,038
2,771
Arizona
I had a battery replaced Apple OEM one on 2 iPhone X devices after 2 years from a local shop last December 2019. Now yesterday, suddenly it is saying that battery needs service. I had previously noted the serial number of my battery using 3u Tools. But now 3u Tools cannot determine serial number. It means that Apple has extended their evil lockdown to iPhone X series as well after beta testing for XS and XR series last year. This lockdown has gone too far.

My phone is operating perfectly though. 3u Tools still reports 100% battery capacity and 55 charge cycles. Just that iOS won’t show the %. This happened on both the devices on exactly same date. If you have iOS 13.3.1, after restart, it invalidates your 3rd party battery even if it is genuine Apple battery. You have to transfer the circuitry from old battery to new one and use some spot welding under microscope as per youtube video to make it work as original.

Is this anti consumer? If the customer decides to use aftermarket battery, let them use it at their own risk. At least Apple genuine OEM batteries should have been spared.
How do you know it's an Apple battery? Unless it came from an authorized Apple service provider Apple doesn't sell parts to anyone else. There are 3rd party batteries that iOS recognizes and displays battery data properly but not all do..
 
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Darth.Titan

macrumors 68030
Oct 31, 2007
2,793
518
Austin, TX
If you have iOS 13.3.1, after restart, it invalidates your 3rd party battery even if it is genuine Apple battery.
That makes no sense. A "genuine Apple battery" is not a third party battery by definition, so how would Apple know to "invalidate" yours and leave all the other Apple batteries alone?

You got sold a cheap knockoff battery unfortunately.
 
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cynics

macrumors G4
Jan 8, 2012
11,630
1,909
Not believed by the critics a NEW Apple OEM battery comes in a locked state, simply installing it and it being used for the first time activates it to that phone. Most after market "OEM" batteries are just knock offs with an Apple logo silk screened on it though. They are lucky to be 3/4 the capacity of an new OEM battery. Plus they they obviously haven't been UL listed / Underwriter labs tested. The knock off battery chip will be reprogrammed to read 100% usually indefinitely regardless of capacity. They use a tool like this, you can clear cycles count, put in a serial number and change health variables....

https://www.jcprogrammer.com/jc-b1-battery-repair-tester.html

I watched a guy in NYC do that for me when he replaced my iPhone 6S battery for 5 bucks. Phone last an hour now but still reads 100%.

All that said, battery health algorithms absolutely require the battery being a precisely known quantity to even be remotely accurate. The health measurement needs to start above 100% to gauge the degradation so it needs a battery with over 100% the shipped mAh. Since an iPhone can't tell actual capacity to determine health a used iPone battery is just as much of an unknown as a knock off.

If battery health was easy to gauge then everything with a battery would have a battery health gauge (instead of nothing).

Aside from a health gauge that wouldn't be accurate the iPhone works doesn't it? Just ignore the warning it goes away after a while, your not locked out of anything. You completely have the right to replace your own battery, no one is stopping you. You're just being a bit unrealistic expecting Apple to accommodate that right to change your own battery.
 
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The-Real-Deal82

macrumors G4
Jan 17, 2013
11,106
17,018
Wales, United Kingdom
I don’t think Apple would legally be allowed to cripple a battery within an iPhone whether it’s OEM or third party. It’s your property and deliberately affecting components through software updates would leave them wide open to being sued.
 
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oVerboost

macrumors 68000
Sep 17, 2013
1,561
1,029
United Kingdom
The battery you were sold wasn’t a genuine Apple one I expect.

Should have gone to Apple and had them replace the battery as you’d have got a warranty with it and peace of mind it was a high quality battery for not much more money.

And it’s not Apple crippling your battery, it’s the quality of the battery itself that’s causing you issues!
 
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The-Real-Deal82

macrumors G4
Jan 17, 2013
11,106
17,018
Wales, United Kingdom
It does beg the question though, the iPhone X came out less than 3 years ago and battery is needing replacement? I would have had a conversation with Apple about this as the cost of these phones aren’t cheap and a battery shouldn’t degrade in such a short space of time, even if you bought it at launch.
 
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Lekro

macrumors 6502a
Mar 23, 2019
532
274
Budapest, Hungary
Not believed by the critics a NEW Apple OEM battery comes in a locked state, simply installing it and it being used for the first time activates it to that phone. Most after market "OEM" batteries are just knock offs with an Apple logo silk screened on it though. They are lucky to be 3/4 the capacity of an new OEM battery. Plus they they obviously haven't been UL listed / Underwriter labs tested. The knock off battery chip will be reprogrammed to read 100% usually indefinitely regardless of capacity. They use a tool like this, you can clear cycles count, put in a serial number and change health variables....

https://www.jcprogrammer.com/jc-b1-battery-repair-tester.html

I watched a guy in NYC do that for me when he replaced my iPhone 6S battery for 5 bucks. Phone last an hour now but still reads 100%.

All that said, battery health algorithms absolutely require the battery being a precisely known quantity to even be remotely accurate. The health measurement needs to start above 100% to gauge the degradation so it needs a battery with over 100% the shipped mAh. Since an iPhone can't tell actual capacity to determine health a used iPone battery is just as much of an unknown as a knock off.

If battery health was easy to gauge then everything with a battery would have a battery health gauge (instead of nothing).

Aside from a health gauge that wouldn't be accurate the iPhone works doesn't it? Just ignore the warning it goes away after a while, your not locked out of anything. You completely have the right to replace your own battery, no one is stopping you. You're just being a bit unrealistic expecting Apple to accommodate that right to change your own battery.

Third party batteries can be the same as Apple batteries. Even in capacity. There are also some batteries with original PCB that are salvaged from used batteries.

If you buy two iPhone 11s and just swap the battery between them, it will read “battery needs servicing”. These things are there to make people think like you do. Like all those evil people making a buck resetting your cycle count.

Please stop spreading misinformation, the legitimate third party repair community have to deal with enough trust issues already.
 
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cynics

macrumors G4
Jan 8, 2012
11,630
1,909
Third party batteries can be the same as Apple batteries. Even in capacity. There are also some batteries with original PCB that are salvaged from used batteries.

If you buy two iPhone 11s and just swap the battery between them, it will read “battery needs servicing”. These things are there to make people think like you do. Like all those evil people making a buck resetting your cycle count.

Please stop spreading misinformation, the legitimate third party repair community have to deal with enough trust issues already.

If by misinformation you mean putting words in my month then I apologize. However when I say "most" I don't mean "all".

We aren't talking about legitimate third party repair centers in this thread if you haven't noticed. An authorized repair center can purchase iPhone batteries directly from Apple still in their new state and if that was the case this thread wouldn't exist. We are likely talking about a guy that sells mostly iPhone cases at a kiosk in the mall.

Want to see hundreds of those people in one place?


Pretty cool video actually. There is another one where he builds an iPhone from individual parts purchased from those shops.

Swapping batteries in 2 brand new phones isn't the point, the point is there is no way for Apple to know that. Maybe it came out of a new phone in good condition, maybe it came out of a new phone that was charging on the dash of a hot car in the middle of summer for 3 weeks. There is no way for them to know if you deformed the batteries while swapping them from the adhesive that holds them down (its virtually impossible if those pull tabs break). I think like I do because energy storage technology is my career (although not small li-po batteries like an iPhones).

And the consequence? An alert that eventually retreats to the battery health screen? A battery health meter for a battery that isn't in the phone no longer works? Not exactly the end of the world even less so if you did get a high quality aftermarket battery.
 
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Lekro

macrumors 6502a
Mar 23, 2019
532
274
Budapest, Hungary
If by misinformation you mean putting words in my month then I apologize. However when I say "most" I don't mean "all".

We aren't talking about legitimate third party repair centers in this thread if you haven't noticed. An authorized repair center can purchase iPhone batteries directly from Apple still in their new state and if that was the case this thread wouldn't exist. We are likely talking about a guy that sells mostly iPhone cases at a kiosk in the mall.

Want to see hundreds of those people in one place?


Pretty cool video actually. There is another one where he builds an iPhone from individual parts purchased from those shops.

Swapping batteries in 2 brand new phones isn't the point, the point is there is no way for Apple to know that. Maybe it came out of a new phone in good condition, maybe it came out of a new phone that was charging on the dash of a hot car in the middle of summer for 3 weeks. There is no way for them to know if you deformed the batteries while swapping them from the adhesive that holds them down (its virtually impossible if those pull tabs break). I think like I do because energy storage technology is my career (although not small li-po batteries like an iPhones).

And the consequence? An alert that eventually retreats to the battery health screen? A battery health meter for a battery that isn't in the phone no longer works? Not exactly the end of the world even less so if you did get a high quality aftermarket battery.

Alright thanks for clarifying. I’m a third party repair technician and I do my work up to the level of the original manufacturer. I pay very close attention to detail and quality in terms of work techniques, suppliers, parts and precision during my repairs.
Just to point out something common, I replace display and battery adhesives with original ones, not cheap double sided tape.

I’m a little bit disappointed every time I read discouraging posts about third party repair, based on botched repairs by lousy people.

I’ve had Apple mess up repairs on my own personal devices, leaving debris inside the phone, affecting camera quality.

The reason for lazy repairs is not always because it’s third party.
 
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Batt4Christ

macrumors member
Oct 14, 2014
90
23
Arkansas
It does beg the question though, the iPhone X came out less than 3 years ago and battery is needing replacement? I would have had a conversation with Apple about this as the cost of these phones aren’t cheap and a battery shouldn’t degrade in such a short space of time, even if you bought it at launch.

One can not account for HOW a device is used. Last December, all four in my household bought new iPhones (iPhone 11 - the only difference, minenisn a 128, the rest 64).

The current battery health/life is already measurably different because of how each of us use and charge our phones. Really hard use and poor charging practices still can take a toll on battery health/life.
 
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zorinlynx

macrumors 603
May 31, 2007
6,462
10,529
Florida, USA
I'm not sure what the problem is. Your phone still works fine, it's just the battery info hidden in settings that doesn't work quite right. I'd rather find out that a knockoff battery was installed in my phone than be blissfully ignorant.
 
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Six0Four

macrumors 6502a
Mar 27, 2020
594
445
The current battery health/life is already measurably different because of how each of us use and charge our phones. Really hard use and poor charging practices still can take a toll on battery health/life.

Can you please give me an example of poor charging practices ?
 
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Batt4Christ

macrumors member
Oct 14, 2014
90
23
Arkansas
Can you please give me an example of poor charging practices ?

Deep discharge of battery between charges would be the one I see, especially my daughters. Couple that with heavy use (games, videos, etc), it can mean my, triple nearly-fullmdischarges andnpartialmrecharges in a day.

My most recent phone I sold, after owning and using it for 20 months (iPhone X), under my ”normal” use, lasted all day, with nearly no noticeable drop in battery charge life. But I rarely (about 1X per month) allowed the battery to mostly discharge. I'm then ALWAYS charged it fully before using again.
 
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johny328i

macrumors regular
Mar 27, 2016
153
77
Bulgaria
I'm using higher capacity Baseus polymer battery (2200mah), which according to 3utools is legit, in a 6s, and the phone lats as long as my 3 month old Xs.

I've changed the battery myself, and couldn't be happier. Mind you there are Chinese nobrand batteries with unrealistic capacities, that are crap.

Nohon (YouTube reviews tested) and Baseus (I've tested it myself) are legit. And they make higher capacity batteries for a variety of iPhones.

BTW the battery itself was around 20-25$.

I think being li-poly and not li-on, helps making them denser to achieve the higher capacity.
 
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The-Real-Deal82

macrumors G4
Jan 17, 2013
11,106
17,018
Wales, United Kingdom
One can not account for HOW a device is used. Last December, all four in my household bought new iPhones (iPhone 11 - the only difference, minenisn a 128, the rest 64).

The current battery health/life is already measurably different because of how each of us use and charge our phones. Really hard use and poor charging practices still can take a toll on battery health/life.

My point is we’ve been using smartphones for 10+ years now and only in the last 3 years has the suggestion of battery replacements come up. Apple have added the battery health percentage software to iOS and all of the sudden we have a datum by where people are happily changing their batteries of it falls below a certain percentage. It seems to me people have accepted quite an unacceptable business model for earning money off a device that has already cost many hundreds of pounds and should be capable for 2 years.

My contract is 2 years long and in Europe the warranty period is 2 years long. If my battery is deemed unworthy during this time, i’ll be demanding a free repair. You wouldn’t buy a television and happily replace the power supply at you own cost after 18 months would you? All electrical goods have an average life expectancy as supported by the ‘Consumer Rights Act’, ‘Sale of Goods Act’ etc etc.
 
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Batt4Christ

macrumors member
Oct 14, 2014
90
23
Arkansas
My point is we’ve been using smartphones for 10+ years now and only in the last 3 years has the suggestion of battery replacements come up. Apple have added the battery health percentage software to iOS and all of the sudden we have a datum by where people are happily changing their batteries of it falls below a certain percentage. It seems to me people have accepted quite an unacceptable business model for earning money off a device that has already cost many hundreds of pounds and should be capable for 2 years.

My contract is 2 years long and in Europe the warranty period is 2 years long. If my battery is deemed unworthy during this time, i’ll be demanding a free repair. You wouldn’t buy a television and happily replace the power supply at you own cost after 18 months would you? All electrical goods have an average life expectancy as supported by the ‘Consumer Rights Act’, ‘Sale of Goods Act’ etc etc.

No manufacturer can account for the practices of the end user. I can speak from my own experiences- I've had no battery life issues out of any iPhone I've owned, even when over 2 years old. Likewise, my experiences with Macbook/Macbook Po batteries- getting years of service when others complain. Best practices make all the difference. Apple’s tight OS integration and API helps keep battery use under control, so overall battery longevity is pretty well user-dependent. Extreme conditions/temperatures, frequent deep discharges, high-drain usage, and inconsistent charging all impact the lifespan of batteries.
 
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rui no onna

Contributor
Oct 25, 2013
9,781
5,855
My point is we’ve been using smartphones for 10+ years now and only in the last 3 years has the suggestion of battery replacements come up. Apple have added the battery health percentage software to iOS and all of the sudden we have a datum by where people are happily changing their batteries of it falls below a certain percentage. It seems to me people have accepted quite an unacceptable business model for earning money off a device that has already cost many hundreds of pounds and should be capable for 2 years.
In the US at least, back in the days of 2-year contracts it was $100 to replace the battery and $200 to replace the phone. The extra $400-450 subsidy is baked into the service cost.

For us, battery's good during 1st year, mostly ok in 2nd year but starting to go near the end of it, just in time for a phone upgrade on 2-year contract. That works out in terms of firmware, too, since by end of the 2nd year the next major update slows the phone to unacceptable levels.

It wasn't until the 6S (A9/2GB) that we had an excess of performance and could handle future iOS updates with nary a performance drop. Plus, we started switching to device installment plans so what used to be a $200 upgrade is now a glaring $600-800.
 
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The-Real-Deal82

macrumors G4
Jan 17, 2013
11,106
17,018
Wales, United Kingdom
No manufacturer can account for the practices of the end user. I can speak from my own experiences- I've had no battery life issues out of any iPhone I've owned, even when over 2 years old. Likewise, my experiences with Macbook/Macbook Po batteries- getting years of service when others complain. Best practices make all the difference. Apple’s tight OS integration and API helps keep battery use under control, so overall battery longevity is pretty well user-dependent. Extreme conditions/temperatures, frequent deep discharges, high-drain usage, and inconsistent charging all impact the lifespan of batteries.
Whether you use your phone for 2 or 5 hours a day, nobody should be expected to pay for a battery replacement under 2 years. It should be very difficult to deplete a battery by using it for its purpose in such a short space of time. I wouldn’t expect to take my iPhone to an Apple store and be told I’ve used it too heavily therefore I need to pay £70 for a new battery. I’d tell them to get stuffed.
 
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d5aqoëp

macrumors 65816
Original poster
Feb 9, 2016
1,146
1,667
As an update, the battery health according to coconut battery is now at 79%. The shop did sell me a nulla quality. The apple service centre is closed here in Mumbai. Has anyone had any experience with those high capacity 3500 mah batteries for iPhone X from AliExpress?
 
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