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iPhones cool. iMacs cool. Air Pods cool. VR tech is just stupid.
Then you’re ignorant of the constantly and inevitable pursuit of its use needed for a wide variety of computing needs backed by human-computer-interaction computer science.

VR and spatial computing hardware will continue to become prevalent and invaluable to more open minded generations well after we both drop dead
 
We have a headset in the office and no one will enter a space where someone is using it: the weird googly-eyes on the front makes them either nervous or nauseous. Too horror-flick inducing appearance. So those could easily go to cut costs. Perhaps even reduce the battery drain and maybe about 4 pounds of weight dragging your head forward.

As I was typing this I wandered over and checked on ours. Completely dead batteries and covered in dust and discarded usb cables. In a room full of tech enthusiasts and technologist.

Tim is right. This is an early adopter product. At this point much like the Newton or Second Life: a product in search of a market…fingers crossed a product can be created that is actually wearable AND also does more than offer a novel experience.
Alex Heath, a writer at The Verge was invited to Meta, along with other journalists and developers to test the Meta Quest Pro 2 a few years ago. One thing he said that I'll never forget is that it felt like the staff at Meta were "begging developers to give people a reason to use their device."

Meta has spent tens of billions and many more years than Apple working on this, even creating their own universe, and they still can't get people interested in these things outside of a bit of gaming and watching movies.
 
I see absolutely no path to popular calls like $999-$1999 pricing without hammering the "vision" part of it and adopting what cheaper competitors offer (1080p quality)... which would then be hammered by not-fans for being "blurry." Whatever we would imagine Apple doing to deliver some price we want to call would need to factor in Apple's target of near 50% margin. So even if you can get the parts assembled in some Vpro Jr for up to $700, layer on the marketing budget, etc to make total COGS more like $1K, Apple's target margin will point to starting at $2K. And I've seen more than once that the 4K lenses alone cost Apple more than $700 by themselves. The $1K price means $500 in total costs, which would have to be towards a piece of junk relatively.

Here's my best shot at "cheaper" Vpro 2 without compromising 4K per eye:

  • drop the googly eyes front feature that seems towards universally lambasted- even among Vpro fans, I don't see many talking that up as important. However, that's mostly just a screen and probably generously could only cut maybe up to $100 from the total price.
  • drop built-in audio, basically jettisoning audio to "sold separately" buds/phones. Apple is no stranger to "subtraction" of key features- especially if they help sell accessories available from Apple. But again, my guess is that could probably only generously drop maybe $100 from total price too.
So let's get more meaningful "cuts" in place but again, without resorting to killing 4K per eye:

  • ADD the Apple cellular modem to avoid the Qualcomm premium and bring cell service subsidies into the pitch. That seems to be towards about $1000, so this one thing- albeit with only financing trickery- would appear to cut about $1000 from the up-front price.
  • Offer special financing through Applepay whereby buyer pays taxes and maybe a small amount down to get the balance under $3600 and then offer 36 months @ 0%. Buyer is still paying full price so Apple gets theirs but now the proposition is $99 vs. $3499... even if the former is "PER MONTH." Many view and make purchases based upon fitting into a monthly payments capacity and this would transform the perception of $3499 into a perception of $99 in one simple stroke.
  • Combine the two together with 48 month 0% to make the $99 become $49.
  • Or bend either term more like the Volkswagen tactic of 39 or 51 months with no payments for the first 3 months to make $99* or $49* become $0* for 3 months.
  • And, of course, cell service capability would quickly have cellular partners offering better-than $49-99 payment offers from Apple by going on to the "free*" pitch like they do with iPhone now.
Yes, much of that is just marketing/financing "trickery" but that works just fine to make $1500 iPhones "sell" over and over every few years. Few question laying out towards half of Vpro pricing via phone or Mac financing every couple of years and, in fact, defend such pricing and set alarms to wake up in the wee hours to be among first to spend the money. Financing trickery works... so apply some novel variation of it to this product.

Lastly, the ultra-wide virtual screen is a signature feature of the "as is" so consider creating a cheaper version that is primarily just capable of that one thing... dropping the many cameras, etc and even making the processing to render the view happen within the Mac itself. In short, this would be a gigantic virtual display "for your face" vs. being a VR/AR thing at all. I would guess this could possibly get to about $1799-1999 Apple MSRP, which could then have Apple financing to position it at well below $100/month instead of $1799-1999. Maybe Mac battery can own the powering too to jettison the battery portion of this product.

All this "$1000 and I'll buy" stuff probably doesn't come for a decade+ without deep compromises to the quality of the "vision" and the functionality driven by all those cameras. Apples target margin alone just can't support competing on price with the cheap ones already available. Those wanting something for $1000 or less should buy those already in the market at those prices... and live with inferior "vision" (resolution), inferior "functionality" etc... just like one can live with cheap Android smart phones, cheap tablets and cheap PCs instead of Apple's "expensive" offerings.
 
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I think one major issue with this technology is the price point as it stands and I am not convinced even at £1k, it is appealing enough to the mainstream. I love my Apple products, but I really can't think of a use case for this device for my uses.

I think it has the danger of being an occasional device which is really cool for watching a movie on or trying out live sport and browsing the web, but it might just end up being left in a drawer and become a bit more of a chore to use, much like some gaming devices that expire once the fad stage has worn off. It'll be different for everybody for sure.
 
IMHO, Apple threw everything up to the kitchen sink at the Vision Pro - all the bells and whistles they could think of, just to see what sitcks. They'll be reviewing how all the features went down - what worked, what didn't - and the same with the apps.

Then v2 and/or the consumer version will drop the lesser-used bits, cheapen some, and enhance others.

Apple are in the enviable position that they can do this: release something a bit OTT in terms of features and price, and then still sell enough to make it worthwhile and learn for the v2.

I could, of course, be wrong, and the Vision Pro could be dropped in 2025 like a hot turd. But it seems to me that they are exploring the space. Personally, I'd ditch the creepy front eye screen, seems pointless and must be using valuable weight and power. But, kudos to Apple for at least trying an approach that makes an intrinsically personal, single-user device a bit more sociable. I don't think it worked though!
 
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They can make it as "affordable" as they want, I'll never buy one.
Screenshot 2024-12-19 at 09.41.24.png


I am sure Apple and their nearly $4 trillion dollar market cap are concerned.
 
If Apple fostered a serious gaming ecosystem instead of a swamp of gacha p2w gambling, maybe the vision pro would have a solid use case. As it stands the most compelling use for VR is gaming. As much as Apple tries to not call the Vision Pro a VR headset, that’s just what it is. If Apple is truly serious about this platform and product they need to be directly funding startups and companies making content for the Vision Pro, just like Meta has been for the Quest. But it really doesn’t seem like Apple is willing to do that.
No. That’s narrow minded and ignores various other use cases of spatial
computing that can simultaneously grow in usefulness and effectiveness with less hurdles than gaming with today’s spatial computing tech constraints in costs and feasibility.

You’re also ignoring more serious use cases of spatial computing to be on par with non-computing platforms Apple is good at is combative with the sacrifices gaming hardware makes in picture quality and HDR support.

Gaming-focused headset companies have yet to execute spatial computing gaming that’s compelling enough to many incumbent AAA gamers—let alone none of them are on par with non-VR current gen consoles—they don’t even have HDR FFS! 😩

Apple is not going entitled nor obligated to accommodate that use case and help AAA gamers with an option when manufacturers who focus on accommodating them specifically like Sony and Meta won’t.

Meta is disingenuous because they believe mobile level AAA gaming spatially is good enough while they sell unrealistically priced low-end headsets to the masses losing billions of dollars per year to support their metaverse aspirations they renamed their company about.

That’s not understandably appealing to AAA gamers who have to settle with that when they don’t have to when non-VR consoles cost as much (PS5 Pro) or less yet offer far better games.

Apple is again not obligated to enter that space to “save the day”.

Spatial computing software engineering is expensive, especially games that take a years to make.

If again the likes of Sony and Valve won’t do it, why the heck Apple starting from scratch should?

Also Apple’s software ecosystem and app store isn’t exactly optimized for gaming development nor does Apple again needs to prioritize that with their customers not primarily gamers on their hardware.
 
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If this were $100, I still wouldn’t buy it.

The only interesting thing that has come of this is its use by doctors. I have no interest in one single thing this has to offer.

If you want my money, Apple, you’d make another Mini iPhone.
Then why the heck you’re following news about this kind of device? Apple has many teams working on a variety of tech and devices that release asynchronously
 
The world doesn’t revolve around your use cases nor mine and you’re not obligated to have a need for every computing device a manufacturer comes up with to sell.

Headset form factor can fundamentally not work with people with legit and worthwhile spatial computing needs needing glasses instead (even because of hair or their on-the-go needs) similar to not everyone needs or want a desktop compared to a laptop/tablet
Perhaps then it’s up to Apple to create or facilitate those use cases. Make us want one, or better yet, make us need one.

It’s the job of a product maker to create a market for it. They did it with the iPhone, but can’t say this product will be the same.
 
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Price has a lot to do with why the sales are lagging for the vision pro, but I also feel it’s physical appearance has a lot to due as well and it has not caught on as a fashion trend for young generation. Example: AirPod's, Apple Watch, iPhone are all matured stage, physically small and have become a Fashion trend among young people.
 
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It's ironic because making stuff affordable used to literally be Tim Cook's job. It's what he did so well that he ended up being CEO - he managed to secure agreements with suppliers for the iPod that effectively gave Apple a monopoly as everyone else had to work with parts that were inferior and/or more expensive for a 5+ year period. By the time those agreements ended and everyone could produce iPod knockoffs, Apple had already pivoted over to the iPhone where they'd done the same thing and so similarly had a lock on the market for ~5 years where competitors couldn't come close.

Managing cost of production seems to also be what Elon Musk excels at.

I kind of thought the Vision Pro was so expensive because Apple just wanted to rake in profits on it (the way they do on their other Pro products)... but this article suggests the issue is actually that Apple is just completely failing to manage costs for it?
 
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I think the price isn’t necessarily the only show-stopper for a lot of people.

Even at $300 for the exact same headset, I wouldn’t buy one for myself because I don’t see a use case for it, for me at least.
I can't even fathom this line of thought. I've dreamt of such tech since I was a child in the 80's lol. And the Vision Pro is the best thing apples made since the original iPhone. Its just a joy to use daily
 
IMHO, Apple threw everything up to the kitchen sink at the Vision Pro - all the bells and whistles they could think of, just to see what sitcks. They'll be reviewing how all the features went down - what worked, what didn't - and the same with the apps.

Then v2 and/or the consumer version will drop the lesser-used bits, cheapen some, and enhance others.

Apple are in the enviable position that they can do this: release something a bit OTT in terms of features and price, and then still sell enough to make it worthwhile and learn for the v2.

I could, of course, be wrong, and the Vision Pro could be dropped in 2025 like a hot turd. But it seems to me that they are exploring the space. Personally, I'd ditch the creepy front eye screen, seems pointless and must be using valuable weight and power. But, kudos to Apple for at least trying an approach that makes an intrinsically personal, single-user device a bit more sociable. I don't think it worked though!

In my opinion, they didn't (throw everything and the kitchen sink):

  • Why not make it a Mac for one's face? Add a bluetooth keyboard and mouse/track pad and run macOS apps? Yes, that's only a 2.5 hour or perhaps less virtual Mac, but so was the PowerBook G4 I purchased back in the early 2000s for almost as much. How did I deal with only 2-3 hour battery life back then? I bought a couple of batteries for it.
  • Why not put a virtualized latest iPhone in it with automatic updates to newest iPhone every year in virtual form (obviously requiring them to build in a cellular modem too). Virtual iPhone runs in software on Macs for development purposes, so make that a unique app for this device too. Latest iPhone VR every year with zero E-waste and the cellular piece could deliver the cell phone subsidy of about $1K off. I could even envision ads run by the "big 3" pitching Vpro for free* just like they do with iPhones now.
  • Why not make the battery connector also a direct-to-Mac connector letting the bigger battery in Macs (or perhaps a special Mac) Power the view as well as supply the view rendered on Mac? Then the long delay for an ultra-wide screen would not have been necessary as it could have been rendered on Mac. And the desire for multiple active displays could be rendered on Mac too.
And last but very far from least, KNOW that unique content will make or break this thing. Instead of trying to utilize a "make it and they will come" strategy leaning on third parties, allocate an AppleTV+ (service)-like budget for the software side of things and have very desirable, unique content/apps for Vpro steadily being released? For example, I STILL can't believe they launched it at a time when people spend thousands on big screen TVs in preparation for the Super Bowl but Apple cut no deal with the network to offer a couple of prime virtual seats for Vpro users to feel like they are AT the game... and in fantastic seats. Then came March Madness, Olympics, NBA playoffs, etc. with no such offerings too.

Cut a deal with Taylor Swift to have anyone with Vpro enjoy prime virtual seats at the ERAs tour near the end of the tour. And do the same with countless other bands, stage plays, events, etc.

There's PLENTY more that could have been done (and still could be done) to make this more desirable and successful. Obviously, waiting for developers to make it have more appeal is not a great strategy. Apple is not exactly broke. If AppleTV+ can create many movies & TV shows, what could the equivalent budget in support of Vpro do?
 
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Price has a lot to do with why the sales are lagging for the vision pro, but I also feel it’s physical appearance has a lot to due as well and it has not caught on as a fashion trend for young generation. Example: AirPod's, Apple Watch, iPhone are all matured stage, physically small and have become a Fashion trend among young people.
as a device you wear in your home who cares what it looks like? it's still more attractive than the competition and Young people can't afford it anyways
 
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Apple is planning to introduce both a next-generation Vision Pro and a mainstream headset, which would likely be named "Apple Vision" without the "Pro" modifier.
I think Apple will likely call it “Apple Vision Air” since most of consumer product are under the “air” family and probably going to be much thinner and comfortable to wear for mass consumers considering it’ll be simplified components to keep the costs down.
 
Perhaps then it’s up to Apple to create or facilitate those use cases. Make us want one, or better yet, make us need one.

It’s the job of a product maker to create a market for it. They did it with the iPhone, but can’t say this product will be the same.
Make you want one? It appeals to you or it doesn’t being a prosumer product. The white papers and specs are all there to bare.

This device category isn’t new and there’s plenty of similar products coming by no coincidence by other manufacturers indefinitely.

It’s OK for a device category to not resonate with you. That’s the case of tablets, DSLRs, PC handhelds, and so on.

Apple has every right to be as broad in computing needs they accommodate with them also not needing to accommodate every segment they’re a manufacturer in.

They have no mainstream headset nor monitor nor tower desktop, and that’s OK.
 
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The Vision Pro never had mainstream aspirations as its primary success metric much like the Pro Display XDR, Mac Pro, Mac Studio, Macbook Pro, iPad Pro, and so on.

Apple is a very known brand with a lot of window shoppers who were never the intended audience scoffing the price people will pay for with latent worry of it successful it would make all headsets closer to its price.

It’s like incumbent Honda Civic buyers more appropriately needing to wait for EVs like the Honda Preclude scoffing at and fear mongering about the price of higher-end EVs because of $100,000+ Porsche Teycans, Lucid Airs that appeal to what more affluent drivers seek for themselves.

It’s the side effect of social media where everyone can voice an opinion and have echo chambers of irrational and unfounded sentiment of the original thought

I disagree. First of all, the MacBook Pro does have 'mainstream aspirations' - and it's been selling in the millions for years. Sure, the iPad Pro and XDR and, maybe even the Mac Studio fall into the 'niche' category, but you're still comparing Apples to oranges: all the Macs can run the same software - so as an application developer the ENTIRE MAC base is my potential market. Similarly with the iPad Pro. So Apple doesn't have to worry about getting developers to adopt those devices. But with the Vision Pro, Apple clearly does and it has a chicken-and-egg problem.

Besides, Tim Cook clearly has much greater plans for the Vision Pro than it does for some Mac or iPad variant: he grandiosely talked about a whole new computing platform - spatial computing! There's no way something this grand was meant for a tiny market - Apple is a for-profit corporation, so with that much investment in R&D it clearly hopes to sell in the mass market - maybe not with the initial version, but eventually.
 
as a device you wear in your home who cares what it looks like? it's still more attractive than the competition and Young people can't afford it anyways
Young tech professionals absolutely can. I made hundreds of thousands since I was 26 in Silicon Valley where Apple and others are primarily based at
 
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Then why the heck you’re following news about this kind of device? Apple has many teams working on a variety of tech and devices that release asynchronously
Yeah. And they all suck. This company has lost focus. With nearly every update in hardware and software, chips aside, they’re making the user experience measurably worse. I am on a path of eliminating Apple products from my life because of how unintuitive and frustrating they’ve become. They’re exactly doing what they did in the 90s and throwing anything they can to the wall to see what sticks. Vision Pro is just the new Newton. Apple should get back on track to making easy and pleasurable to use devices. But they won’t do that because stock holders and more important than users. Profit is more important than usability. Stagnation and predictability is more important than innovation. They’re using this Vision Pro OS to inform the design language of al their devices. This makes as much sense as stuffing an iPhone UX onto a Mac (see System Settings).
 
I can't even fathom this line of thought. I've dreamt of such tech since I was a child in the 80's lol. And the Vision Pro is the best thing apples made since the original iPhone. Its just a joy to use daily
I respect that. Everyone is different, I suppose.

I know I’m not in the boat alone and your point of view is not alone, either.
 
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