So you make over half a million dollars a year? Roughly $575,00?!?!
No, he only works 1 hour a week.....
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Apple Offers Additional Details on Touch ID, iPhone 5s Won't Store Fingerprint Images
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No, he only works 1 hour a week.....
Doesn't matter. Nobody gives a crap about what the actual fingerprint looks like - the only thing that matters is what it hashes to, because *that* is what triggers the Go/NoGo security system.
Speculating about how hard it would be to reconstruct the fingerprint completely misses the point - all that matters is how hard it is to construct the hashed version - and that ain't hard at all.
This system will be broken wide open inside 3 months, count on it.
It would depend a lot on the circumstances of course. I don't think it could be used as the only evidence, but could be used to strengthen additional evidence.
Basically, how fingerprint evidence already works. It puts someone at the scene of a crime, but might not indicate they committed it. A fingerprint in a room is very different then a fingerprint on a weapon.
3 months ? It will be far less then that. My guess is 12 hours before someone finds a way to extract a fingerprint from someone and use it to unlock a device without their knowledge.
Mythbusters did one on this. Anyone with a minor electronics background would fully understand how easy the etching process is. Even though, they didn't show all the steps, its *VERY* easy to do. I still laugh at how they tried to make it sound like you couldn't figure it out based on what they showed.
It will be broken in far easier ways then what it stored in memory, using far less technical solutions.
Yes, let's just assume that the Germans in Third Reich were completely incomparable to people living in America today. They probably were a different species, like demons or something. The comparison is really ridiculous.
Seriously though: This is not really a topic that needs to be discussed on an Apple rumors board, but as a German I can't stand that "Don't compare anything to Nazi Germany"-attitude. It is destructive. Most of the people that were in whatever ways responsible for the happenings were normal people. It is an important responsibility to find out what made it possible. Not just out of curiosity, but because keeping this from happening again is an active process. It needs people to observe, to think and speak freely, critically and consistently. And that is what the comparison is about, I think. Ignorance, naivety and hate fueled the regime's power. Without that we probably wouldn't even know their names.
fingerprint vs. passcode
I've heard of cases and been involved in cases where authorities request access to a persons device that is locked with passcode and are unable to gain access to device because the owner of the device refuses to provide the passcode or say they "forgot the passcode."
Since the iPhone 4s the implementation of hardware encryption and ability to use complex passwords makes a device for all practical purposes secure.
If device is locked with a fingerprint I wonder the repercussions? Could authorities force you to unlock your device with your finger or successfully use a fingerprint on file in some creative manner?
Fingerprint unlocking should be used not as a more secure method of securing a device but as a more secure and convenient method than having no password at all.
I've heard of cases and been involved in cases where authorities request access to a persons device that is locked with passcode and are unable to gain access to device because the owner of the device refuses to provide the passcode or say they "forgot the passcode."
Since the iPhone 4s the implementation of hardware encryption and ability to use complex passwords makes a device for all practical purposes secure.
If device is locked with a fingerprint I wonder the repercussions? Could authorities force you to unlock your device with your finger or successfully use a fingerprint on file in some creative manner?
Fingerprint unlocking should be used not as a more secure method of securing a device but as a more secure and convenient method than having no password at all.
- So how does this work, are you going to use that time saved to bill another customer, or what... I assume you're not on salary, or good luck convincing your employer you should get a $5k raise for the time saved
- Your calculation also assume that all those times unlocking your phones, is time you could have worked. So I am guessing you never unlock your phone when relaxing in bed, driving your card, walking outside, etc... Saving time there doesn't really give you extra time to work
- Also, congrats on making half a million dollars a year, and yet still finding time to come entertain us in these forums
- Finally, I am afraid to tell you but... the iPhone 5S comes with iOS7. As you may or may not know, iOS7 has a lot of new cool animations, but unfortunately, they slow down the use of the phone for power users. After unlocking the phone, you lose at least a second waiting for the zooming transition to end before you can open an app. Also, there are some substantial performance problems at this time, keyboard lags, etc.. Overall, I would say the 4-5 seconds you gain when unlocking the phone, you lose them and then some when going through different screens.
You may want to do a full cost/benefit analysis before jumping on iOS7, looks like this thing could cost you millions.
That is nonsense. All it's doing is storing enough data to allow one to compare a previously scanned fingerprint to the currently scanned one and verify that they are indeed the same because the data works out to be the same.
Basically it's like saying 'I had an equation before that worked out to 11223344, does the one I'm testing now do that too?'. From that you can not tell that the original equation was '1020304 / 11', because it could just as well have been '2040608 / 5.5' or anything else that works out to that number.
If I were to store the original fingerprint(/equation), I could go and give that to the system so as to pretend I was someone else. With just the derivative data, I can do no such thing because I can't satisfy the system that takes the original data and does the comparison.
So a fingerprint scanner on an Apple device is all of a sudden a recipe for the coming of a Nazi like regime in the USA.
This is just ludicrous.
I agree.
I used to hate that my company laptop would lock up and need a password after 5 minutes of inactivity. (I understand the company's mandate for short timeouts, but it was a pain.)
But, 5 or 6 years ago we switched to laptops with fingerprint sensors. (Apple, what took you so long? And when will AppleBooks have fingerprint sensors?)
Now - if it locks up, I just slide the middle finger across the sensor and I'm back in within a second.
The company is happy, I'm happy. Win-Win.
It's cut off in that image. The home button is on the bottom of the device, dead center. In fact, you can't even see all of the screen.
My prints have been on file for a very very long time. I had 2 different jobs that required FBI background checks.
You see, Nazi Germany didn't only happen because of a handful of crazy people. There were many people in Germany that legally voted for those guys. Many of the people who voted for them were naive and ignorant. I'm not sure what they were exactly thinking, but I see a similar kind of blind trust when I'm reading comments along the lines of "If you've got nothing to hide, why do you care?". They are the government, they can't just do that! And who knows, maybe it's good for all of us. Do you see the similarities? I'm not saying that something remotely comparable to the Third Reich is happening in America, hell, no, but I'm saying that history should have taught us by now that some critical thoughts about the NSA are very appropriate.
Too many keep misappropriating people's concern with this feature. I doubt anyone cares about the possibility of some entity outside of Apple simply having their fingerprints. The concern lies with the possibility of that fingerprint being tied to locations, data usage, and phone calls. The possibility of logs on your life being kept somewhere.
The phone company didn't steal your dime. The phone company gets millions of dimes every day. They would single out YOUR dime to steal.
If you think the pay phone stole your dime, you must be paranoid. Crazy. It wouldn't happen.
The data Apple collects on you that the NSA can access is not the problem. It's a tiny part of a much bigger problem. A tiny part. If you took Apple out of the equation completely, the problem would still be there. If you took Obama out of the equation, the problem would still be there.
Given their less-than-transparent recent handling of all kinda of user data, I think your dismissal of any concerns and "just trust apple" seems a little glib. Yes, I'm glad they have implemented security procedures. Yes, those procedures appear adequate. No, that is NOT a given.
Wouldn't this create an issue with unlocking it in your pocket? I can count so many times where I've received a text or some sort of notification and that's how I pick it up, is by the home button.
I can foresee a lot of accidental unlocks happening with this device, all the threads will pop up in the forums haha.
I can foresee a lot of accidental unlocks happening with this device, all the threads will pop up in the forums haha.
It's a guarantee that they are kept somewhere. It's a possibility that we'll know about it in any detail.
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To me, this is like saying it doesn't matter for 'the government' (or whomever) to put up cameras on every street and in every room. You had your picture taken when you got your driver's license, passport, or whatever, so they already have your picture on file.
It's not the data itself, it's the ability to link it to behaviors. The fingerprint thing doesn't just say this phone was at this place, it says this person unlocked this phone at this place.
(For the record, I'm generally happy with what these security measures seem to be about, this is just my explanation of why the "they already have your fingerprints" argument doesn't carry water)
200 percent faster than already fast enough doesn't make it a worthy upgrade.
the only reason I could imagine a fingerprint sensor to be of any value is if the phone had NFC technology and we can use it for payments
the only reason I could imagine a fingerprint sensor to be of any value is if the phone had NFC technology and we can use it for payments
Precisely. I'm baffled at the fact that people cannot understand this concern.
I'm baffled that we've reached a point where the lead article can use a term like "privacy hawk." It's like we're starting with the premise that you have no privacy, then being told how nice it is to occasionally have some privacy.