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Dude, the two are not even in the same universe in terms of performance. Jump on the offer!
GPU is worse tho.
There’s nothing worse about the replacement that they’re offering you.

Jesus. Take it and be grateful. From the sound of it, they’re offering you a base model for a base model. That’s a huge upgrade.
not true. base model was radeon 450, OP has 460 (built to order) and its better than the 555x
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It can be a hard thing to do is to get Apple pinned down to anything in email. When I was dealing with them they would only call, never email. You could email them, but they said it was their policy to only call, claiming it was because they had to have a more personal “face to face” experience with the customer. While that may be true in part, I suspect it was also because they aren’t allowed to put anything in writing.

Depending on your states laws I believe you could record them. In some states that only requires the permission of one party. But they also try to say that if you accept you aren’t suppose to disclose the details of what they offered.

In Apples case I declined their offer, but I did agree to a deal with Triumph Motorcycle with those sort of terms back in 2013 and had to sign that I wouldn’t disclose the details of the agreement.
my experience as well.

they offered me a refund for my issues with the i9. If they wrote it in email, i could put it online and people could jump on it and use it as proof for their cases, now i have no proof of anything that happened. :)
 
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GPU is worse tho.

not true. base model was radeon 450, OP has 460 (built to order) and its better than the 555x
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my experience as well.

they offered me a refund for my issues with the i9. If they wrote it in email, i could put it online and people could jump on it and use it as proof for their cases, now i have no proof of anything that happened. :)

Exactly my experience. I ended up declining and then later re-buying when the Vega 20 and the extended holiday return period came out. Other than that everything was a series of phone calls from a couple of folks who identified themselves as Management Representatives for the Apple Online Store
 
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That is correct. I paid for 1 step up better cpu, 1 step up better storage and a maxed out gpu. In total it was 3390 euro actually instead of 3200 that I mentioned earlier. What they offer now is a base model that costs 2400 euro in most stores here in the Netherlands. There is a difference, although maybe performance wise I am better of with the base model now. Except for the gpu that is. And that together with the price difference makes it hard to be happy with their offer for me.

The highest they should be offering you then is the 2.6ghz and the 560. Push for it if you want to, but I wouldn’t expect anything more than that.

Don't patronizingly 'Jesus' the OP.
Five part-replacements/repairs within 2 years. Basically the thing never worked properly.

The original model the OP bought was a lemon and also not a base model as you claim, but a model with a, paid extra for, updated CPU/GPU. Apple should offer a new machine with at least the same specs, sincere apologies and a free trip to Disneyland for all I care.

Why should the OP be grateful to Apple? The OP bought a premium laptop for premium money and has had nothing but trouble.

You take apologizing for Apple to a whole new level.

I just spit coffee all over my computer. Jesus. Thanks for the hearty laugh, but you owe me a new laptop now. Pssst. I’m an adult, and you aren’t my mommy, so I can gladly say Jesus whenever I want.

It’s not apologizing for Apple. It’s being appalled that someone is bitching and moaning about a FREE brand-new laptop that is years newer and considerably more powerful than the one that they bought.

Apple doesn’t owe us anything once we make it past the one-year warranty period, barring AppleCare. Try this crap with a Dell, or any other manufacturer for that matter, and they’ll piss themselves with laughter and tell you that they will gladly repair it for the price of a new computer...much like Apple does in some cases and it is what they SHOULD do. If you want more than a year of protection, buy AppleCare. Once that runs out, guess what, they definitely still don’t owe you anything either.

Again, Apple owes us nothing once we make it out of the warranty period, and the fact that they’re willing to replace a computer for FREE is a testament to their kindness. The fact that OP is willing to just walk away and turn it down or demand more than what is fair is both patronizing and elitist enough to embarrass Donald Trump. Jesus.
 
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The highest they should be offering you then is the 2.6ghz and the 560. Push for it if you want to, but I wouldn’t expect anything more than that.



I just spit coffee all over my computer. Jesus. Thanks for the hearty laugh, but you owe me a new laptop now.

It’s not apologizing for Apple. It’s being appalled that someone is bitching and moaning about a FREE brand-new laptop that is years newer and considerably more powerful than the one that they bought.

Apple doesn’t owe us anything once we make it past the one-year warranty period, barring AppleCare. Try this crap with a Dell, or any other manufacturer for that matter, and they’ll piss themselves with laughter and tell you that they will gladly repair it for the price of a new computer...much like Apple does in some cases and what they SHOULD do. If you want more than a year of protection, buy AppleCare. Once that runs out, guess what, they definitely still don’t owe you anything either.

Again, Apple owes us nothing, and the fact that they’re willing to replace a computer for FREE is a testament to their kindness. The fact that OP is willing to just walk away and turn it down or demand more than what is fair is both patronizing and elitist enough to embarrass Donald Trump. Jesus.

You wouldn't "accept" anything more? Give me a break.

He didn't get a FREE new laptop and he probably wouldn't want one if Apple didn't sell a faulty one in the first place.

I got a full refund for a faulty i9 but I had to spend hours on the phone with apple, had to drive around, repack it, install the i9, reinstall it, wipe it again, then reinstall the new one. Do you think my time is free?

If someone sells you a faulty product and causes professional downtime, they are eligible for compensation for damages.

Apple isn't kind, they aren't even willing to give him what he paid for.

If he was pushy enough he could sue them for damages; they told even me for the replaced i9 that they could compensate me in some way but i didn't pursue it... Because frankly it would just mean more wasted time.

And in europe, you are protected under EU consumer law for 2 years, regardless of warranty, and Apple owes you a working machine for 2 years after purchase date at the very least.

They are offering him a replacement because under EU law he could easily claim FULL REFUND!
 
You wouldn't "accept" anything more? Give me a break.

He didn't get a FREE new laptop and he probably wouldn't want one if Apple didn't sell a faulty one in the first place.

I got a full refund for a faulty i9 but I had to spend hours on the phone with apple, had to drive around, repack it, install the i9, reinstall it, wipe it again, then reinstall the new one. Do you think my time is free?

If someone sells you a faulty product and causes professional downtime, they are eligible for compensation for damages.

Apple isn't kind, they aren't even willing to give him what he paid for.

If he was pushy enough he could sue them for damages; they told even me for the replaced i9 that they could compensate me in some way but i didn't pursue it... Because frankly it would just mean more wasted time.

And in europe, you are protected under EU consumer law for 2 years, regardless of warranty, and Apple owes you a working machine for 2 years after purchase date at the very least.

They are offering him a replacement because under EU law he could easily claim FULL REFUND!

Agreed. Apple isn’t being kind at all, they are attempting to meet the requirements of the Magnuson Moss Warranty Act, since the original has been sent in 3 or more times for the same issue as well as a couple of other problems. They aren’t in the habit of random acts of kindness by handing out free laptops. That’s Oprah.

The incident I mentioned earlier regarding Triumph Motorcycles was likewise a Magnuson Moss settlement for similar issues. Number of repairs for the same issue, length of time in the shop, etc. They aren’t in the business of random acts of kindness either.

Edit: As mentioned in my earlier post about Triumph, I signed saying I couldn't divulge the specifics of the settlement. But I can say in vague terms, that I definitely did NOT come out behind.
 
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I am still waiting for a response from Apple. They asked me initially if I would be satisfied with their offer and secondly, after I said I would’nt, if I would accept the exact same offer. I said no and asked about their policy, told them about the worse gpu and basically asked for my money back if they will not meet my basic and in my opnion modest demand. I am in the Netherlands, under EU consumer law, so two year minimum of product functionality does indeed apply here.

After reading all the comments here I am fairly sure that they will offer me a 560x, or my money back. Still haven’t heard back from them though. Thanks for your support and a few good laughs, I will post the end result when matters have been settled between the Goliath company and their disgruntled and elitist customer.
 
Im sure it will end up okay for you. its not that they value their customers all that much, but they have smart enough lawyers to know when to back off lol
 
Again, Apple owes us nothing once we make it out of the warranty period, and the fact that they’re willing to replace a computer for FREE is a testament to their kindness. The fact that OP is willing to just walk away and turn it down or demand more than what is fair is both patronizing and elitist enough to embarrass Donald Trump. Jesus.

OP had issues during the warranty. Apple clearly should have replaced OPs machine earlier. And no, it is not entitled to expect a replacement to be on-par, spec wise, with what is being replaced. This is not generosity on Apples part, just fair business practice.

Replacement should be apples to apples (no pun...)

BTW (and I don't mean this as a political statement) - Donald Trump is objectively shameless and incapable of embarrassment so bad example :p
 
OP had issues during the warranty. Apple clearly should have replaced OPs machine earlier. And no, it is not entitled to expect a replacement to be on-par, spec wise, with what is being replaced. This is not generosity on Apples part, just fair business practice.

Replacement should be apples to apples (no pun...)

BTW (and I don't mean this as a political statement) - Donald Trump is objectively shameless and incapable of embarrassment so bad example :p
I would take 550 over 560, frankly. And I am not just saying this. GPU performance delta between the two is insignificant, in my opinion, but the machine would run a lot cooler, and the CPU would throttle less. Less heat generated by the 550 gives the i7's cores more headroom. This is what I value the most. The real jump in performance for GPU-intensive tasks is from 5xxx series to Vega series. Honestly, if I were buying entry level now I would get the 550.
 
It depends on the consumer law in his/her country. In many EU countries, a 'like for like' replacement can only occur within a certain number of days of the product going faulty. If the company is not able to offer a 'like for like' because they do not have a same spec machine available, they either have to offer the customer a 'better spec'd' machine (company can decide what part is the better spec) or a refund of the original machines purchase price.

The OP can keep pushing for a better spec gpu but you will find Apple are not obligated in doing so. A better CPU than the original covers the 'better spec'd' requirement. But as i already said, it depends on the countries consumer law how far the OP can go with it.
 
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If the company is not able to offer a 'like for like' because they do not have a same spec machine available, they either have to offer the customer a 'better spec'd' machine (company can decide what part is the better spec) or a refund of the original machines purchase price.

My guess is the last thing they would want to do is refund the original machines purchase price when the difference in cost to Apple between the 555X and 560X is probably about $10. Give the man his GPU :)
 
It depends on the consumer law in his/her country. In many EU countries, a 'like for like' replacement can only occur within a certain number of days of the product going faulty. If the company is not able to offer a 'like for like' because they do not have a same spec machine available, they either have to offer the customer a 'better spec'd' machine (company can decide what part is the better spec) or a refund of the original machines purchase price.

The OP can keep pushing for a better spec gpu but you will find Apple are not obligated in doing so. A better CPU than the original covers the 'better spec'd' requirement. But as i already said, it depends on the countries consumer law how far the OP can go with it.
I would be pushing for what is best for my needs. The difference between what Apple is offering him and what he has is night and day. There is no comparison. The two machines are not on the same level. GPU speed only comes into play in vary narrow scenarios. Things like Final Cut, for example, do not really care about how beefy discreet GPUs are (to a degree). The QuickSync on the new 6-core i7 is what's important. Along with the number of cores and efficiency of those cores. In every day use the 560 is actually a liability, in my opinion-- it robs the CPU of headroom, and hampers my workflows, namely virtualization.
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My guess is the last thing they would want to do is refund the original machines purchase price when the difference in cost to Apple between the 555X and 560X is probably about $10. Give the man his GPU :)
Especially, since it's a lousy $100 upgrade.
 
For giggles I looked up my 3dmark benchmarks with 555x and compared them to 460 from notebookcheck. They're identical. Literally. TimeSpy is the same 1374 and Firestrike differs by one (4104 vs 4103). And it actually checks out because I was doing this to compare with 560x and 560x scores on notebookcheck are exactly the same as posted here on forum when we were doing the comparison between them. FYI 560x was 29% faster in TimeSpy and 20% faster in Firestrike. I got to say the trustworthiness of notebookcheck just significantly increased in my eyes.

If you don't believe me:
https://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-Radeon-Pro-460.181783.0.html
https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...2ghz-macbook-pro.2131845/page-2#post-26339738

@Eerriikkoo - looks like with 555x you'll get the same performance as with 460, same 4GB of VRAM, but you will save 5W of power (30 vs 35W on 460) resulting in cooler laptop, so actually you'll be better of with 555x. To be honest if I were you I'd push for a refund, or at least to work out some kind of a deal, that if you buy a new one on your own they will refund the old one, kind of what people were doing when Vega came out. The should really bend backwards to accommodate you.
 
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For giggles I looked up my 3dmark benchmarks with 555x and compared them to 460 from notebookcheck. They're identical. Literally. TimeSpy is the same 1374 and Firestrike differs by one (4104 vs 4103). And it actually checks out because I was doing this to compare with 560x and 560x scores on notebookcheck are exactly the same as posted here on forum when we were doing the comparison between them. FYI 560x was 29% faster in TimeSpy and 20% faster in Firestrike. I got to say the trustworthiness of notebookcheck just significantly increased in my eyes.

If you don't believe me:
https://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-Radeon-Pro-460.181783.0.html
https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...2ghz-macbook-pro.2131845/page-2#post-26339738

@Eerriikkoo - looks like with 555x you'll get the same performance as with 460, same 4GB of VRAM, but you will save 5W of power (30 vs 35W on 460) resulting in cooler laptop, so actually you'll be better of with 555x. To be honest if I were you I'd push for a refund, or at least to work out some kind of a deal, that if you buy a new one on your own they will refund the old one, kind of what people were doing when Vega came out. The should really bend backwards to accommodate you.

Amen, brother.
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Amen, brother.
the i7 2.2 with AMD 555x is the optimal MacBook Pro 15 to buy for general use. For me there are only 2 options: i7 2.2/16/555 or i9/32/V20 (I have the latter.). Nothing in between makes any sense.
 
Amen, brother.
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the i7 2.2 with AMD 555x is the optimal MacBook Pro 15 to buy for general use. For me there are only 2 options: i7 2.2/16/555 or i9/32/V20 (I have the latter.). Nothing in between makes any sense.

arguably i7 2.6/16/V16 makes sense as well
It will be closer to performance to the i9/32/v20 than to 2.2/16/555X, and it will only cost 600$ more. (while i9 config costs 800$ more than the 2.6/v16 config)

to top it off, except in single core applications, for multicore i9 isn't really any better.
 
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arguably i7 2.6/16/V16 makes sense as well
It will be closer to performance to the i9/32/v20 than to 2.2/16/555X, and it will only cost 600$ more. (while i9 config costs 800$ more than the 2.6/v16 config)

to top it off, except in single core applications, for multicore i9 isn't really any better.
Maybe. I think, if you are going to shell out all this money, you might as well go with the i9. And if budget is a consideration, the entry level is the best all around choice. If cooling was not a consideration, then entry level with a 560 would be a better choice, but seeing how performance improvements between 555 and 560 are minimal -- and are only meaningful in video creation workflows, where you would get a Vega 20 anyway -- and cooling takes a big hit, the stock 2.2 entry level machine makes the most sense to me. Let's be honest, once Vega 20 came out, it made 560x (and, frankly, Vega 16) a supernumerary option -- either get 550x and get the best cooling, or get Vega 20 and get the best performance.
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arguably i7 2.6/16/V16 makes sense as well
It will be closer to performance to the i9/32/v20 than to 2.2/16/555X, and it will only cost 600$ more. (while i9 config costs 800$ more than the 2.6/v16 config)

to top it off, except in single core applications, for multicore i9 isn't really any better.
The number of returned machines with 560X purchased 14 days before Vega 20 was announced must have been horrendous. And then apple had to deal with all the appeals to exchange for a better model from people outside of the 14 day window. The whole thing was so poorly handled. Dave Lee's review of the Vega 20 equipped MBP was titled ...So much better!...Multiple positive reviews from the army of prolific youtubers followed extolling the power efficiency and performance virtues of the Vega chip. If I had to be stuck with 560X, I would be furious.
 
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The number of returned machines with 560X purchased 14 days before Vega 20 was announced must have been horrendous. And then apple had to deal with all the appeals to exchange for a better model from people outside of the 14 day window. The whole thing was so poorly handled. Dave Lee's review of the Vega 20 equipped MBP was titled ...So much better!...Multiple positive reviews from the army of prolific youtubers followed extolling the power efficiency and performance virtues of the Vega chip. If I had to be stuck with 560X, I would be furious.
I was :)
but when the i9/560x was refunded (for issues, not vega) i didn't buy a vega.

15" was a botched release. throttling, the vega chip that should've been there to begin with (seriously, 560x is a 3y old chip) haphazardly announced a few months later... flickering displays. ouchy
 
I was :)
but when the i9/560x was refunded (for issues, not vega) i didn't buy a vega.

15" was a botched release. throttling, the vega chip that should've been there to begin with (seriously, 560x is a 3y old chip) haphazardly announced a few months later... flickering displays. ouchy
Good for you. My i9/32/v20/1TB is great! I have yet to see the flickering. Mine does not flicker. I tried multiple scaling modes. Temps are not bad. For what I do, Vega 20 makes perfect sense. Since I don't hit the video much, the i9 processor has more breathing room. And I do need the extra cache and higher core boost of the i9, since my workflows are not those of a video creator. My only beef with it is the screen. Why can't apple make sure that these damn screens have uniform backlighting and tint. Mine has the pink to blue tint shift from left to right that every 2018 15-inch exhibits. Thankfully, the problem with mine is minimal, and I think I can live with it.
 
Good for you. My i9/32/v20/1TB is great! I have yet to see the flickering. Mine does not flicker. I tried multiple scaling modes. Temps are not bad. For what I do, Vega 20 makes perfect sense. Since I don't hit the video much, the i9 processor has more breathing room. And I do need the extra cache and higher core boost of the i9, since my workflows are not those of a video creator. My only beef with it is the screen. Why can't apple make sure that these damn screens have uniform backlighting and tint. Mine has the pink to blue tint shift from left to right that every 2018 15-inch exhibits. Thankfully, the problem with mine is minimal, and I think I can live with it.
the 13" and the mini+ultrafine that replaced the i9 both have better screens... I don't know what's with the 15" screens, i noticed something was off first time i tried it, compared to my old rMBP ... sure it had more contrast and colors, but viewing angle and look of it were kinda off.
Curious, what's the use case for higher cache and single core boost?
 
the 13" and the mini+ultrafine that replaced the i9 both have better screens... I don't know what's with the 15" screens, i noticed something was off first time i tried it, compared to my old rMBP ... sure it had more contrast and colors, but viewing angle and look of it were kinda off.
Curious, what's the use case for higher cache and single core boost?
I know. I have a 2.7/16/1TB 2018 13-inch as well. I take that one off site, because it's so damn portable. The screen has the best color uniformity I've ever seen on a MacBook, and I've had a ton. I mean, it's Eizo quality!
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the 13" and the mini+ultrafine that replaced the i9 both have better screens... I don't know what's with the 15" screens, i noticed something was off first time i tried it, compared to my old rMBP ... sure it had more contrast and colors, but viewing angle and look of it were kinda off.
Curious, what's the use case for higher cache and single core boost?
I run virtual machines. When I work with clients, is simply fire up a Windows VM that's joined to their domain and connected via VPN. I often run 2 or 3 VMs at a time. Perfect scenario for maximizing single core performance (while still leveraging multicore power) and only minimally getting video involved.
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the 13" and the mini+ultrafine that replaced the i9 both have better screens... I don't know what's with the 15" screens, i noticed something was off first time i tried it, compared to my old rMBP ... sure it had more contrast and colors, but viewing angle and look of it were kinda off.
Curious, what's the use case for higher cache and single core boost?
Oh, by the way, I know that most people will say that spending 4,500 on a machine to stand up VMs is silly, as a Windows laptop would do the same thing for half the price. I agree. And I have a windows laptop designed for that purpose. But using Windows causes reverse peristalsis in me. I hate the esthetic, I hate its innate lack of security, I hate the fonts, I hate most things about it. Ironically, my income comes primarily from clients with Windows environments. Oh, well. I have a robust Windows 10 box (i9 7900x-based) I built it to "play" and "test" games. I turn it on once a week to update it, and that's about it. Using Windows (no matter how hardened) in Internet facing scenarios is less than advisable, in my opinion, when other options, such as Mac OS, are available. So I will always use Macs for production. Windows is for VMs, which can be discarded when problems occur and replaced by copies.
 
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I know. I have a 2.7/16/1TB 2018 13-inch as well. I take that one off site, because it's so damn portable. The screen has the best color uniformity I've ever seen on a MacBook, and I've had a ton. I mean, it's Eizo quality!
[doublepost=1548511142][/doublepost]
I run virtual machines. When I work with clients, is simply fire up a Windows VM that's joined to their domain and connected via VPN. I often run 2 or 3 VMs at a time. Perfect scenario for maximizing single core performance (while still leveraging multicore power) and only minimally getting video involved.
[doublepost=1548512047][/doublepost]
Oh, by the way, I know that most people will say that spending 4,500 on a machine to stand up VMs is silly, as a Windows laptop would do the same thing for half the price. I agree. And I have a windows laptop designed for that purpose. But using Windows causes reverse peristalsis in me. I hate the esthetic, I hate its innate lack of security, I hate the fonts, I hate most things about it. Ironically, my income comes primarily from clients with Windows environments. Oh, well. I have a robust Windows 10 box (i9 7900x-based) I built it to "play" and "test" games. I turn it on once a week to update it, and that's about it. Using Windows (no matter how hardened) in Internet facing scenarios is less than advisable, in my opinion, when other options, such as Mac OS, are available. So I will always use Macs for production. Windows is for VMs, which can be discarded when problems occur and replaced by copies.
Haha you don’t mind going off topic at all do you? Ah well it gives the visitor something interesting to read so just go ahead
 
"Am I right to think it is not acceptable or should I be happy and accept?"

BE HAPPY.
Accept it with a BIG smile.
Then walk out of there with a smile on your face!

Dude, the two are not even in the same universe in terms of performance. Jump on the offer!

Both bad advice. Apple as a general rule only replaces machines with the same or better in every spec. I'll give Apple the benefit of the doubt that maybe whoever arranged the replacement didn't realize that the GPU they were offering was worse than the one the OP had, since it may not be immediately obvious to a layman, like say an NVIDIA GT460M (or whatever) is obviously higher up the food chain than a GT330M.

FWIW, as another data point, in 2010 I had an American-purchased Macbook Pro being replaced by AppleCare Australia, in Japan after service in Japan, and they had to BTO me a machine just to get a 7200 RPM drive because I had a 7200 RPM drive in my 2008 machine that was being replaced. That one thing alone prevented an off the shelf replacement, and Apple was more than happy to BTO it.
 
Finally a confirmation today that Apple will replace my Macbook pro 2016 2.7 ghz, radeon pro 460 with the 2018 version with 2.6 ghz and the 560x! I am glad that they offered me this in the end. I will sell it once I receive it and will wait for a new version to come out that has better keyboards, or I will buy an iMac instead.
 
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