Apple (or any other company) will never ever beat Google

ecrispy

macrumors regular
Original poster
Oct 27, 2013
166
4
Apple announced a lot of features aimed directly at Google, such as Proactive, new Siri, Maps, as well as multitasking features from Windows and Android.

I'm not going to play the 'who copied who' game, that's not really important. The key thing is that things like Google Now, Google Maps have had many many years of refinement, and there is no possible way Apple's versions can ever be as good.

- GNow is powered not just by Android, but by google.com and Gmail, which is how it can know so much. It builds knowledge based on what you've searched for across multiple devices, not just your phone. The same applies for Cortana which is going to be built into Windows 10, and will use data from bing.

- Google is unquestionably the leader in software and data. Microsoft is also a software company. Apple is primarily a hw company.

- Apple's offerings are tied to iOS and OSX. Apple has no search engine, no email, no other cross platform services which power this.

- Its nice that Apple will try to recreate Street View data, but to be honest they're can only doing this because they lots of extra money. There is no possible way any other company will company will come close to Street View data. Bing has been trying for years and haven't come close. By the time they reach parity, if they ever do, Maps will have advanced that much more.

I think competition is really good for users, but in this case the gap is simply too wide. e.g. no one today can hope to launch a web based email service to compete with GMail.

The right thing to do, to actually benefit users, would've been to integrate with Google services and allow them to be defaults, instead of locking people into Apple platform services.
 
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Paddle1

macrumors 68040
May 1, 2013
3,416
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We have a better Google Maps app because of Apple removing the old one, this way is better for consumers.

And there's nothing wrong with having more options.
 
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VERTIC

macrumors newbie
Jun 10, 2015
2
4
Delden, Netherlands
Every tech company will have their ups and downs.

In the end I don't think it matters whether a company will ever beat Google.

As long as Google won't create a monopoly, things will be fine and customers will have tons of choice, which is a good thing.
 

MRU

Suspended
Aug 23, 2005
25,318
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.

The right thing to do, to actually benefit users, would've been to integrate with Google services and allow them to be defaults, instead of locking people into Apple platform services.
You are free to install Google apps and use their services on an iOS device. If you want more such as ability to change default messaging a apps - then android is there for you. Apple main selling point is the integration of its services and hardware - even if it's not for you.

Apple will never catch up with apple sales wise because 1 company making a single (or couple of variants) of iOS mobile device each year will never sell as many as a platform that has hundreds of manufacturers producing devices. It's just common sense maths.
 

Armen

macrumors 604
Apr 30, 2013
7,375
2,249
Los Angeles
Apple announced a lot of features aimed directly at Google, such as Proactive, new Siri, Maps, as well as multitasking features from Windows and Android.

I'm not going to play the 'who copied who' game, that's not really important. The key thing is that things like Google Now, Google Maps have had many many years of refinement, and there is no possible way Apple's versions can ever be as good.

- GNow is powered not just by Android, but by google.com and Gmail, which is how it can know so much. It builds knowledge based on what you've searched for across multiple devices, not just your phone. The same applies for Cortana which is going to be built into Windows 10, and will use data from bing.

- Google is unquestionably the leader in software and data. Microsoft is also a software company. Apple is primarily a hw company.

- Apple's offerings are tied to iOS and OSX. Apple has no search engine, no email, no other cross platform services which power this.

- Its nice that Apple will try to recreate Street View data, but to be honest they're can only doing this because they lots of extra money. There is no possible way any other company will company will come close to Street View data. Bing has been trying for years and haven't come close. By the time they reach parity, if they ever do, Maps will have advanced that much more.

I think competition is really good for users, but in this case the gap is simply too wide. e.g. no one today can hope to launch a web based email service to compete with GMail.

The right thing to do, to actually benefit users, would've been to integrate with Google services and allow them to be defaults, instead of locking people into Apple platform services.
I bet someone like you was praising Microsoft back in the day saying they were the best and how no one could touch them. Now look at Microsoft.
 
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VERTIC

macrumors newbie
Jun 10, 2015
2
4
Delden, Netherlands
And you know this.. how, exactly? Crystal ball? Did you invent a time machine and travel to the future?

Clearly your post is not based on facts, but rather on opinion.
Exactly, and I think Apple could actually get on the same level as Google if they'd put more effort into those things than Google was doing back then.

And it actually seems Apple is doing exactly that.
 

mi7chy

macrumors 603
Oct 24, 2014
6,472
7,450
For all the contextual stuff Apple is borrowing from Google they will need to collect and index personal data so Apple need to be truthful about it and stop using it against the competition.
 

ecrispy

macrumors regular
Original poster
Oct 27, 2013
166
4
And you know this.. how, exactly? Crystal ball? Did you invent a time machine and travel to the future?

Clearly your post is not based on facts, but rather on opinion.
Of course its opinion, but I gave plenty of facts to back it up. e.g. MS has been competing in the same space with Bing Maps for many many years.

Look, if Apple launched a new search engine to compete with Google tomorrow, most people would say there's little to none chance they'd ever match Google. Its the same thing with GNow.
 
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ardchoille50

macrumors 68020
Feb 6, 2014
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Look, if Apple launched a new search engine to compete with Google tomorrow, most people would say there's little to none chance they'd ever match Google. Its the same thing with GNow.
I remember hearing people say the same thing about Google when it first appeared. People just knew Google would never surpass the likes of Altavista, Yahoo, and the many others that were prominent at that time. Those people were proven wrong.

The safest thing to say is "only time will tell".
 
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Skoal

macrumors 68000
Nov 4, 2009
1,624
426
Oh, one of these threads.... Yippee!

What exactly do you mean by "beat" anyway?
 

Abazigal

macrumors G5
Jul 18, 2011
12,660
10,647
Singapore
Apple announced a lot of features aimed directly at Google, such as Proactive, new Siri, Maps, as well as multitasking features from Windows and Android.

I'm not going to play the 'who copied who' game, that's not really important. The key thing is that things like Google Now, Google Maps have had many many years of refinement, and there is no possible way Apple's versions can ever be as good.

- GNow is powered not just by Android, but by google.com and Gmail, which is how it can know so much. It builds knowledge based on what you've searched for across multiple devices, not just your phone. The same applies for Cortana which is going to be built into Windows 10, and will use data from bing.

- Google is unquestionably the leader in software and data. Microsoft is also a software company. Apple is primarily a hw company.

- Apple's offerings are tied to iOS and OSX. Apple has no search engine, no email, no other cross platform services which power this.

- Its nice that Apple will try to recreate Street View data, but to be honest they're can only doing this because they lots of extra money. There is no possible way any other company will company will come close to Street View data. Bing has been trying for years and haven't come close. By the time they reach parity, if they ever do, Maps will have advanced that much more.

I think competition is really good for users, but in this case the gap is simply too wide. e.g. no one today can hope to launch a web based email service to compete with GMail.

The right thing to do, to actually benefit users, would've been to integrate with Google services and allow them to be defaults, instead of locking people into Apple platform services.
Here's the thing - who gets to decide what "good" entails?

A bit of personal experience - I know people who have Google Now turned off because they simply are not comfortable with Google scanning their phones for data. They even refuse to log in to Google+. Basically, while they love Google's services, they don't like the idea of parking their data with Google. So it doesn't matter how wondrous Google's services are - my friends refuse to use them.

Apple's services may never be as good in Google's, but the question then is - does it need to be? What Apple is offering consumers is an alternative to Google's offerings. That you can have a comparable experience without needing to park all your data with Google. Apple has made it very clear in their keynote - they are not interested in my data at all. What is on my phone, stays on my phone.

And we all know what happened the last time Apple collaborated with Google to include Google Maps on iOS. Google got greedy and iOS users suffered as a result. I am all for Apple weaning themselves off Google. Apple is benefiting users by offering a comparable alternative, and in the process, giving Google the competition it needs to improve. Apple doesn't need to be as Google as Google, it just needs to hit Google where it hurts - ad clicks, since iOS is still far more profitable than Android for Google.

In this sense, I find myself preferring Apple's route in that their stance seems far more "human" than Google's. The problem here is that Google may not be offering people more of what they want, but instead getting more creepy by the day.

And it will be interesting to see where iOS 9 goes with adblock. Death by a thousand cuts for Google on iOS?
 
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ardchoille50

macrumors 68020
Feb 6, 2014
2,142
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Google has a better track record especially after Apple's Fappening that exposed private pictures of customers' orifices to the world to see.
Ok, first of all Apple was not at fault in the leaked iCloud photo debacle, that was the result of people using weak passwords and/or using the same password for multiple sites. Most people who researched that issue know this by now and the fact that you brought this point into your post leads me to believe that you're working from outdated information.

Secondly, I have to question the security of Android especially since Android chief made a public admission that Android isn't designed to be safe.

Finally, I joined the Google ecosystem when I bought the htc Dream/G1 a week after release. One of the reasons I moved to Apple products in 2012 is that I felt Apple was more stable - Google can't seem to make up their mind what they want, as evidenced by the attached info graphic.

image.jpg

Some people dislike the "walled garden" but it is one of the reasons that iOS is a better system, in my opinion.
 
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Michael Goff

Suspended
Jul 5, 2012
13,329
7,414
Ok, first of all Apple was not at fault in the leaked iCloud photo debacle, that was the result of people using weak passwords and/or using the same password for multiple sites. Most people who researched that issue know this by now and the fact that you brought this point into your post leads me to believe that you're working from outdated information.

Secondly, I have to question the security of Android especially since Android chief made a public admission that Android isn't designed to be safe.

Finally, I joined the Google ecosystem when I bought the htc Dream/G1 a week after release. One of the reasons I moved to Apple products in 2012 is that I felt Apple was more stable - Google can't seem to make up their mind what they want, as evidenced by the attached info graphic.

View attachment 560446

Some people dislike the "walled garden" but it is one of the reasons that iOS is a better system, in my opinion.
Oh joy, an opinion piece where what he said was made to seem like something else. Read the update.
 
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Abazigal

macrumors G5
Jul 18, 2011
12,660
10,647
Singapore
For all the contextual stuff Apple is borrowing from Google they will need to collect and index personal data so Apple need to be truthful about it and stop using it against the competition.
I dunno. This is the sort of stuff I doubt Apple can afford to be caught lying about. We will know when iOS 9 is released, but if Apple shows that they are able to simulate a "Google Now" experience while keeping your data on device, it could be huge if more people start demanding that Google starts doing the same.
 

Michael Goff

Suspended
Jul 5, 2012
13,329
7,414
Yes, I didn't see the update that seems to have changed the meaning of his original post. Thank you.
No problem. I was kind of afraid you were going to take my post as attacking you, to be honest. My gripe, though, comes from these so-called journalists that post first and correct later. Facts be damned.
 

ardchoille50

macrumors 68020
Feb 6, 2014
2,142
1,216
No problem. I was kind of afraid you were going to take my post as attacking you, to be honest. My gripe, though, comes from these so-called journalists that post first and correct later. Facts be damned.
Yeah, I know exactly how you feel. We could benefit from having a "last edited" time stamp to show that the original posting was edited and the quoted content wasn't altered.
 

josephkrishna

macrumors member
Jun 7, 2014
31
25
Melbourne, Australia
What is wrong with you Americans, I wish Apple had followed Google Now and stored this stuff in iCloud, as well as going through all your personal files. These features are needed to make a useful digital assistant, and as long as Apple has good security protocols in place who cares if their AI is trawling through your data.
 
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