Apple owes iOS6 because...

[irDigital0l]

Agree, but not entirely thrilled that FaceTime over 3G or turn-by-turn directions won't support the iPhone 4. Even Dictation can be supported.

Jailbreak mods (enable 3G), apps in the App Store like Waze (turn by turn) and Google search app (voice search).

Its not that they can't.

 

[quietstormSD]

Honestly, I'm surprised that Apple IS bringing at least some of iOS 6 to the iPhone 3GS. Apple dropped upgrade support for the original iPhone after 2 iOS upgrades from it's starting OS (last one being iOS 3.x), and the iPhone 3G after 2 iOS upgrades from it's starting OS (last one being iOS 4.x). And when they did upgrade the iPhone 3G to iOS 4, they were lacking a lot of the goodies in iOS 4 (not to mention iOS 4 crippled the iPhone 3G).

 

[BFizzzle]

I am more irked at how they continue to sell the 3gs and 4 but no plans to have upgrades for those new customers.

what are you talking about you can still upgrade to ios6 with a 3gs and 4...

----------

Agree, but not entirely thrilled that FaceTime over 3G or turn-by-turn directions won't support the iPhone 4. Even Dictation can be supported.

Jailbreak mods (enable 3G), apps in the App Store like Waze (turn by turn) and Google search app (voice search).

Its not that they can't.

yeah siri was an app on the app store, which worked fine on my ip4 and 3gs

 

[Julien]

Nice.


BTW, I am looking forward to trying some of the recipes on your page. The pizza one looks good.

Thanks, let me know how you like it.

Another thing most don't realize. We on this forum are a very small fraction of Apple's market. For the vast majority of iOS device owners, they see Siri advertisements as a "new" feature requiring a new device. They don't expect or for that matter even know Siri or iOS6 could work on their older iPad/iPhone. This drives them to "hand down" the older device and buy a new one. This is a fantastic strategy for Apple since Siri is Apple's "ace in the hole" to drive sells of new devices to current owners.

Also MOST important. Apple has made a decision and is extremely unlikely (1 in a million type odds) to change it. The small number of people complaining (or crying/whining/venting) on this form is going to have absolutely NO EFFET on Apple. So get over it and move on because it is a fact you have 3 choses: Decide to buy a new device, accept what you have or sell and move to Android/Windows/Blackberry. I will buy the new/next iPhone but will stick with my iPad 2 until at least next year knowing it will not have Siri. Do I wish it would get Siri? YES, but I understand it won't happen.

 

[Redjericho]

It still syncs with iTunes and new Apps will be made today, tomorrow and a year from now

lies, the world ends in December....

 

[Julien]

lies, the world ends in December....

You must have missed the memo.

 

[Hls811]

.
Apple is doing this just to sell more devices? Yes, Apple is a business and not a social welfare department. If you walk on a car lot does the sales person say "Hope you are enjoying your 3 year old car and plan on keeping it a a few more years. Let me update the engine control firmware for free so you DON'T have to buy a new car"?

I posted this in another similar thread, but this analogy you give to a car isn't quite accurate - if my car was under warranty, than absolutely I would expect that dealer to update my engine control firmware, or whatever else is required to keep my vehicle running, I purchased the warranty for that specific purpose. In this case, I have an iPad 1 which was purchased with AppleCare which does not expire until November 2012. Most likely iOS6 will be released by then.

My feeling on this is that as long as Apple offers valid warranties on products they should be supported/upgradable/compatible or whatever you want to call it until the last warranty expires. If iPad 1s were discontinued in March 2011 (I'm not 100% of that date) then they should be considered supported and all new OS'es should be supported 2 years out (which is the length of AppleCare). I think in doing it that way it sets a precedence and a finite timeframe for customers.

All that being said I don't necessarily think it has to have all of the features.. if the hardware can't handle Siri and it would cripple it, then don't include it.. if Maps won't work and do turn by turn because the hardware can't support it, then don't include it. (similar to how the Camera App didn't work on iOS5 because the hardware didn't support that functionality). But I think the Core OS, the enhancements, and non-hardware specific improvements should absolutely be available for the duration that any customers have a warranty. (I'm not saying make it available to only those with a warranty, but I think Discontinuation date + 2 years.)

 

[ericrwalker]

When you buy a car you buy the current features with it. The next year the car might come in new colors and have a better stereo, that doesn't mean the car dealer now owes you a new stereo. Juliens analogy was accurate.

A car warranty entitles you to get repairs for free, not upgrades.

I posted this in another similar thread, but this analogy you give to a car isn't quite accurate - if my car was under warranty, than absolutely I would expect that dealer to update my engine control firmware, or whatever else is required to keep my vehicle running, I purchased the warranty for that specific purpose. In this case, I have an iPad 1 which was purchased with AppleCare which does not expire until November 2012. Most likely iOS6 will be released by then.

My feeling on this is that as long as Apple offers valid warranties on products they should be supported/upgradable/compatible or whatever you want to call it until the last warranty expires. If iPad 1s were discontinued in March 2011 (I'm not 100% of that date) then they should be considered supported and all new OS'es should be supported 2 years out (which is the length of AppleCare). I think in doing it that way it sets a precedence and a finite timeframe for customers.

All that being said I don't necessarily think it has to have all of the features.. if the hardware can't handle Siri and it would cripple it, then don't include it.. if Maps won't work and do turn by turn because the hardware can't support it, then don't include it. (similar to how the Camera App didn't work on iOS5 because the hardware didn't support that functionality). But I think the Core OS, the enhancements, and non-hardware specific improvements should absolutely be available for the duration that any customers have a warranty. (I'm not saying make it available to only those with a warranty, but I think Discontinuation date + 2 years.)

 

[Hls811]

When you buy a car you buy the current features with it. The next year the car might come in new colors and have a better stereo, that doesn't mean the car dealer now owes you a new stereo. Juliens analogy was accurate..

In his post he mentioned a software/firmware upgrade which I do think I'd be entitled to, but of course - things like a new stereo, colors, etc are hardware features I wouldn't expect on a car, iPad or anything after the fact - warranty or not. Thats why I felt the comparison was invalid.

Asking a car dealer for an upgraded stereo a year later would be like asking/expecting Apple to put a camera in the iPad 1's because the iPad 2 had it and I don't think anyone would ever expect that.

A car warranty entitles you to get repairs for free, not upgrades.

A warranty is not specific to repairs, its also maintenance and an assurance that your car/device is performing properly and at its peak. Im sure in the list of enhancements/changes to iOS6 some could be classified that way (better security with Find my Phone, Accessibility changes, etc..)

I'm completely on the fence about the right way to handle this by Apple - As an iPad 1 owner (as well as other models) obviously I don't want to think of my equipment as "obsolete" 16 months after it was new and I want it to have the latest and greatest and make it last as long as possible, but at the same time I know there are hardware limitations and at some point an iPad 1 will be as useless as my Blackberry Pearl. It still works as well as the day I bought it, but theres plenty it doesn't do too...

I also just don't like car analogies to technology, I think theres very few that compare the same scenario..

 

[Tmelon]

The iPad got 2 major iOS updates. Android devices are lucky to even get one major update. It's all relative.

 

[squidkitten]

I'm honestly impressed that iOS 6, even parts of it, is still being given to the 3GS. I understand that for some people upgrading often isn't possible, and many people like to get a long time out of their devices, but I tend to upgrade every two years like my contract allows, and I'm pretty happy with the way Apple is updating the iPhone. iOS 5 was a nice refresher, and I'm excited to upgrade to the iPhone 5 (or whatever it's dubbed) this fall with iOS 6. I mean there will be a little layover where I have iOS 6 on the 4 (and I'm a little bummed about the lack of turn by turn, but I'll live), but I'm really impressed with the fact that a phone three generations back is still receiving the new iOS, even if it's not the full version.

Sort of disappointed about to lack of iPad 1 support. I have the iPad 3, but I don't understand why the first iPad won't at least get SOME iOS 6 upgrades, especially since it's a much pricier and less upgraded machine than the iPhones are.

 

[naveah]

I love this post, mainly because the original poster and everyone else that has commented subsequently has managed to maintain a civil and (relatively) polite discourse -- and we don't see that as often as we should.

I did want to add one point to general discussion. I have used Apple computers since I was eight years old (I'm in college now). Apple is a very special company and I love it. But because it is not like the other computer companies the argument that "Android doesn't do it, so why do you expect Apple to do it" (or something along those lines) just does not resonate with me. In the past, whenever Apple has discontinued updates for products, they have at least attempted to make a dialogue with their customers as to why they are not making available updates for a certain product (e.g., PowerPC to Intel transition, low hardware spec issues, etc.). At the very least, they make a clear statement regarding compatibility at the product launch event.

But in this case (and maybe I haven't read enough about this, so I might have missed something) Apple has not given any logical reasons for why they are not making certain features available for the iPhone 3GS and iPhone 4 (which are still on the market). They simply tried to footnote this issue away -- and that's what bothers me. It was never indicated in this year's WWDC that the iPhone 4 and the iPhone 3GS will not be getting some of these features (they did mention that the original iPad will not be getting the update, and common sense tells us that Siri was not going to come to the older models either).

I am certain that Apple has good reasons for why they are not making certain features available to some customers, and I hope they make them clear as the beta process for iOS 6 moves forward.

Anyways, I love Apple and technology, in general. All these companies (Google, Apple, Microsoft, even Sun Microsystems) have all made great innovations that have made our lives easier and better. Let's look at what these companies have achieved in the broader picture -- fifteen years ago, people were using Rand-McNally maps (turning them left, right, flipping them back and forth) to figure out what exit to take; today we're upset that our *phones* can't show us the world in 3D!

 

[Julien]

....but this analogy you give to a car isn't quite accurate - if my car was under warranty, than absolutely I would expect that dealer to update my engine control firmware, or whatever else is required to keep my vehicle running, I purchased the warranty for that specific purpose. In this case, I have an iPad 1 which was purchased with AppleCare which does not expire until November 2012. Most likely iOS6 will be released by then....

Actually it is. You car and iOS warranties don't cover new feature updates. They cover defects/problems (so only updates to correct problems, not to ADD features). So while you may expect your car to be updated with new features in all likelihood it won't be and certainly not because it's under warranty.

Updating firmware is not required to keep your car or iOS device running. Your car and iOS device will still function properly as they did without the new update features.

EDIT: More analog to the car. You buy top of the line navigation package for $2000 (4 iPads). This year they update it with 3D maps, lane asset, satellite view, Pandora and Spotify. Do you expect *warrantee repair to update you system? No way. The ONLY way you will get this is by buying a new car.

*Ford MyTouch was updated on all older cars because of bugs, disjointed interface and bad publicity.

 

[Dav1]

Updating firmware is not required to keep your car or iOS device running. Your car and iOS device will still function properly as they did without the new update features.

Then you've never experienced a need to restore your device, and been force to update? Once again the iPad 1 has been stripped of features. At one point it accepted through the camera connection kit, the ability to work with keyboards, mikes, headsets, USB memory sticks. That seems to me a lot like taking your vehicle in for an oil change, and having it returned with the audio system striped from your vehicle. Finding your after market wheels removed and the bolt pattern change so that the wheels no longer fit. It would not be acceptable!

Hell if you buy into an Apple device, Apple takes the position that they alone have the right to determine what you may add to your device, and who may ride in your car. They have a monopoly on iDevices, determining what roads you may and may not drive on, what gas you may and may not use. And apple is sure to get a cut of everything you use on your device. Apple wants it's cut of the music you buy in iTunes, the moves you buy, the books you buy....

What was the promise of GSM devices? Interchangeability at the users whim. Now we have so called unlimited data, that blatantly isn't, and that the so call "data" one purchases isn't actually yours to do with as you wish, after buying it, but is rather the sellers to alot you as they see fit.

I'll grant you that car dealers are notorious as being underhanded crooks, out to rip you off. And apple is certainly a multibillion dollar company, with deep enough pockets to buy what ever it wants.

There is massive amounts of money in this area, and sadly that money talks. In my opinion there is far too much deception, and illusion, a lack of honesty.

 

[ericrwalker]

There seems to be a miscommunication here. When you buy a car with a 2.0L engine and that engine works, you don't get upgraded to a 3.0L engine.


When you buy a phone with 5.0 OS, and when 6.0 comes out for next years model everyone seems entitled to it and all it's features. Apple is doing us a favor by allowing us to upgrade. You bought the phone with 5.0 and it still works with 5.0. It's not broken. The only updates I think they really need to allow are security updates. (though I am thankful they allow full version updates, and would be upset if they didn't).

In his post he mentioned a software/firmware upgrade which I do think I'd be entitled to, but of course - things like a new stereo, colors, etc are hardware features I wouldn't expect on a car, iPad or anything after the fact - warranty or not. Thats why I felt the comparison was invalid.

Asking a car dealer for an upgraded stereo a year later would be like asking/expecting Apple to put a camera in the iPad 1's because the iPad 2 had it and I don't think anyone would ever expect that.



A warranty is not specific to repairs, its also maintenance and an assurance that your car/device is performing properly and at its peak. Im sure in the list of enhancements/changes to iOS6 some could be classified that way (better security with Find my Phone, Accessibility changes, etc..)

I'm completely on the fence about the right way to handle this by Apple - As an iPad 1 owner (as well as other models) obviously I don't want to think of my equipment as "obsolete" 16 months after it was new and I want it to have the latest and greatest and make it last as long as possible, but at the same time I know there are hardware limitations and at some point an iPad 1 will be as useless as my Blackberry Pearl. It still works as well as the day I bought it, but theres plenty it doesn't do too...

I also just don't like car analogies to technology, I think theres very few that compare the same scenario..

 

[Julien]

Then you've never experienced a need to restore your device, and been force to update? Once again the iPad 1 has been stripped of features. At one point it accepted through the camera connection kit, the ability to work with keyboards, mikes, headsets, USB memory sticks...

What you listed are not Apple features but what Apple (not me) considered "hacks". Apple made the Camera Connection Kit to connect cameras.

So Apple features were not removed that I know of, only added.

 

[Dav1]

What you listed are not Apple features but what Apple (not me) considered "hacks". Apple made the Camera Connection Kit to connect cameras.

So Apple features were not removed that I know of, only added.

Do you actually own an Apple camera connection kit? There are two devices, included in it. One an SD card reader, and two an USB adapter. My Camera Connection Kit read my USB Memory Stick, just like the SD card reader would read SD Memory Cards. This was included in the manual/sheet that came with my reader. Question just how many "Cameras" do you own, that the Camera plugs into your SD card reader, and not an SD card? There was no "hack" until Apple hacked my device, and prevented this feature. That's the equilivant of buying a station wagon, and having it serviced, and returned with the rear filled with cement, because people where putting grocery bags on the rear seats, rather than using them to transport people as envisioned by the designers!

When I purchased my iPad one could load any firmware one desired on it, now the only firmware Apple signs is the current one, forcing one to upgrade, over time. My iPad was far more stable with 3.x firmware as far as Safari goes than with 5.1.1 firmware. A lost of usefulness! I'm not asking for a camera, that my iPad wasn't sold with, but by the same token, it is wrong to force me to upgrade, and in the upgrade process install a governor that limits my maximum speed, to less than highway speeds!

Just who actually owns my iPad after I have bought it? Me, or Apple? If I want flash on my iPad, what right does Apple have to deny me, or anyone else Flash? Does Ford or GM have the right to band, homosexuals from your car, because they don't like them? Or how about, obese people, because the gas mileage might be poorer with two or more people in the car?

ITunes by design silently deletes older Apps and replaces them with newer versions, now. The newer versions sometimes don't support the older firmware, again applying pressure to upgrade.

Apple claimed that the iPad didn't need a "Weather app" and that their developers would soon have a wealth of weather apps available for the iPad, yet show me one app that puts weather info in the Notification Center. Apple claimed that the iPad would get multitasking, yet the only way I can count on getting an alarm to go off on my iPad is to leave an app running full screen. Want to "listen" to a video running in the background? There was a firmware version that supported this feature, but once again Apple choose to remove it...

Do you remember,
- anti-aliasing while running iPhone apps in 2x mode
- lyrics in music

 

[Sylon]

I don't think I've ever complained that a new iOS wasn't enough. I love new stuff! lol The only thing that sometimes irritates me is when they don't fix the little things with the updates. Like when the iPhone autocorrect changed the word "he" to "mr" for no apparent reason. It took them over 5 iOS versions/updates to fix that damn problem.

I'm excited for iOS 6 and glad that both of my devices are fully compatible with it. Especially since I just sold my first gen iPad. I'm glad to be up-to-date.

 

[Hls811]

Actually it is. You car and iOS warranties don't cover new feature updates. They cover defects/problems (so only updates to correct problems, not to ADD features). So while you may expect your car to be updated with new features in all likelihood it won't be and certainly not because it's under warranty.

Updating firmware is not required to keep your car or iOS device running. Your car and iOS device will still function properly as they did without the new update features.

EDIT: More analog to the car. You buy top of the line navigation package for $2000 (4 iPads). This year they update it with 3D maps, lane asset, satellite view, Pandora and Spotify. Do you expect *warrantee repair to update you system? No way. The ONLY way you will get this is by buying a new car.

*Ford MyTouch was updated on all older cars because of bugs, disjointed interface and bad publicity.

In my wifes car, she was eligible to purchase Map updates for her in-car GPS system.

There seems to be a miscommunication here. When you buy a car with a 2.0L engine and that engine works, you don't get upgraded to a 3.0L engine.


When you buy a phone with 5.0 OS, and when 6.0 comes out for next years model everyone seems entitled to it and all it's features. Apple is doing us a favor by allowing us to upgrade. You bought the phone with 5.0 and it still works with 5.0. It's not broken. The only updates I think they really need to allow are security updates. (though I am thankful they allow full version updates, and would be upset if they didn't).

Again.. you're making a HARDWARE comparison. An engine is HARDWARE. No one at any point in this thread or any other ever said or expected a hardware update.

I used to have a 2005 Chevy Blazer, it was the last year it was being made before it was discontinued. In 2007, I took it to the dealer because they had a service bulletin out on it to make a change to the computer. Thats software.


Again - cars are not fair and equal comparisons to iPads or computers. Twoi different devices, two different price points and selling methods. When you buy a car you are buying it primarily for the hardware (the Engine and how it performs, the looks, the comfort, the safety, etc) - when you buy an iPad/computer you're primarily buying it for the software and the functionality that the software provides.

A car also has wear and tear. After 2 years I can't do a reset to my car and have it back to "as-new" condition. My miles don't disappear. My tires don't re-tread themselves. My paint doesn't bring back a shine and the interior doesn't get that new car smell all over again. With an iPad I can hit a button and have it work just as good as it did the day I purchased it 2 years after I bought it. Cars are not iPads. iPads are not cars.

This is just silly.. respond all you want and say that a car and an iPad analogy are the same thing and rationalize it your way and I'll rationalize it mine.

 

[ericrwalker]

I used to have a 2005 Chevy Blazer, it was the last year it was being made before it was discontinued. In 2007, I took it to the dealer because they had a service bulletin out on it to make a change to the computer. Thats software.

A service bulletin is to correct and error. Not up upgrade features or add features. Like a new operating system would.

That's why I said, I think Apple should provide updates. Make sense?

 

[moonman239]

Honestly, I'm surprised that Apple IS bringing at least some of iOS 6 to the iPhone 3GS. Apple dropped upgrade support for the original iPhone after 2 iOS upgrades from it's starting OS (last one being iOS 3.x), and the iPhone 3G after 2 iOS upgrades from it's starting OS (last one being iOS 4.x). And when they did upgrade the iPhone 3G to iOS 4, they were lacking a lot of the goodies in iOS 4 (not to mention iOS 4 crippled the iPhone 3G).

iOS6 supports the iPhone 3GS because Apple is still selling it. Apple's EULA says that iPhone users are promised free iOS updates for at least one year. So iOS7 will be the last update to support the iPhone 3GS.

 

[hobsgrg]

iOS6 supports the iPhone 3GS because Apple is still selling it. Apple's EULA says that iPhone users are promised free iOS updates for at least one year. So iOS7 will be the last update to support the iPhone 3GS.

Not quite, it promises that you will receive an update to the next major version, i.e. to iOS 6 for any device sold currently. So Apple had to include update to iOS 6 for 3GS even though normally it wouldn't have received an update (i.e. like iPad 1). So 3GS will receive iOS 6.0 however I believe it will end there and won't get update to iOS 6.1 in March/April (i.e. like 3G only got 4.2 and never got 4.3) and definitely won't get iOS 7.