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Apple Pay Competitor CurrentC Detailed as Convoluted System With Minimal Consumer Benefit

cr2 said:
I am not so clear on this. What happens if there in another Target or Home Depot style breach? If hackers get bank account, what stops them from draining the whole account?
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Nothing. :D

Why, did you think MCX would worry about that? Don't forget they passed the fraud risk onto their consumers when they agreed to use it, so why would they care?

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MacCruiskeen said:
Presumably, if Walmart were to accept ApplePay, there's a fee for them to pay. They obviously don't want to. Walmart is rather well known for not paying for anything it doesn't want to pay for.
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Your presumption is wholly incorrect. Apple pay and Google Wallet both are just enabling a credit card payment in a more secure way. Neither charge the retailer. Its not about Apple Pay or Google Wallet or even NFC, its about Walmart not wanting to pay the credit card companies their cut.

So, to avoid that they have come out with this bat **** crazy, kludgy, laughable system that consumers will find a pain to use.

BTW you said "how many Walmart customers can use Apple Pay". I could ask "How many Walmart customers would be happy when they didn't just get an unknown charge on their credit card, but their whole bank account (for those who have one) was cleaned out" ?
 
Do they really expect people to scan barcodes? :|

Why would anyone bother doing something that is more cumbersome than taking a CC from their wallet and swiping it???

That whole "thing" is ridiculous and demands too much from the costumer to be used.
 
MacCruiskeen said:
I'd be really surprised to find that Walmart spends as much handling cash as they do on swipe fees. Their swipe fee payments must run into the billions of dollars. Unless they've got 100,000 employees who do nothing but count cash all day.

Presumably, if Walmart were to accept ApplePay, there's a fee for them to pay. They obviously don't want to. Walmart is rather well known for not paying for anything it doesn't want to pay for.

Also, how many of Walmart's customers have ApplePay?
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Its not just apple pay, its also Google Wallet, SoftCard, and even RFID credit cards.

There is no fee for Walmart to accept Apple Pay. They pay the standard interchange fee they pay for accepting any credit card... under some agreements merchants get a discount because of the increased security. They pay the lowest "card present" rate.

Walmart obviously pays more in swipe fees than the cost of handling cash... because they receive far more revenue on credit vs cash. But the cost for the cashier to count it at least 3 times (when received, when put in the drawer, and at the end of the shift) and a manager to count it at least 5 times (out of the drawer, into the safe, out of the safe, and twice for the deposit), and the brinks guy to show up, pick it up, process it on their back end... that can't possibly be free.. and on a percentage basis, is likely similar to a swipe fee.
 
SusanK said:
I use cash to refill SBUX card. Not comfortable linking with a cc.
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I'm the same with my iTunes account that I've had for about 10 years. It's never been linked to a credit card.

I just throw $50 worth of iTunes gift cards at it every so often. That limits my liability.

I'll buy the gift cards when they're on sale at a bricks and mortar retailer (between 10-17% off). Free money.
 
Boatboy24 said:
Don't give them the extra profit by using cash. Use your card and force them to pay the processing fees.
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Good point.

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genovelle said:
You are if you don't want to carry your wallet or maybe never use cash like I don't. I have had to use cash at two places in the last 4 years and had to make a trip to the bank atm to get some. They loose my business because they choose to make my life more difficult when Apple Pay worked in their stores to make it easier. Apple gets my money because they work to simplify my life. Companies that do the opposite don't get rewarded.
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True, but these places still use credit card. But I'm not going to stop shopping at CVS because they don't use Apple Pay, they still accept credit cards, they still have a pharmacy I prefer, and they are still in walking distance from my house, prices are still cheaper than my local Walgreens. Not going to shop there and pay more just because it's easier for them to take my money. Now if they stopped carrying certain products I like to purchase, then as a consumer that's a real reason to boycott a store and go elsewhere. But for each is own.
 
Wow this is crazy, I mean I'm not touching it with a 10ft pole but still....

You want some of my most sensitive personal info..
You want to connect directly to my bank account...
You want to store that sensitive info in a cloud...
You want me to ignore real likelyhood of being hacked while also opening myself up to a very likely system glitch that can possibly double charge my bank accout which could lead to an overdrawn account and bounced checks which will give me heavy fees at no fault of my own....

Yeah CurrentC, you give me much confidence.

Excuse me while I move on to other actual interests...
 
acblue94 said:
True, but these places still use credit card. But I'm not going to stop shopping at CVS because they don't use Apple Pay, they still accept credit cards, they still have a pharmacy I prefer, and they are still in walking distance from my house, prices are still cheaper than my local Walgreens. Not going to shop there and pay more just because it's easier for them to take my money. Now if they stopped carrying certain products I like to purchase, then as a consumer that's a real reason to boycott a store and go elsewhere. But for each is own.
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This. Boycotting retailers for no other reason than they don't accept Apple Pay is just plain silly, and even worse, defeats the entire purpose of a convenience payment system. Impose an inconvenience on yourself just to show how much you want convenience. That will work.
 
I'd also like to point out (as I did in another thread) that CurrentC is in beta testing only. Who knows how it will work when it's rolled out to the rest of the US. it might not change a bit. It might rely on NFC itself.
 
IJ Reilly said:
This. Boycotting retailers for no other reason than they don't accept Apple Pay is just plain silly, and even worse, defeats the entire purpose of a convenience payment system. Impose an inconvenience on yourself just to show how much you want convenience. That will work.
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Right. Instead we should use a credit card at CVS and Rite-Aid even for small $$ purchases (the brand that costs them the most in interchange fees). Since CurrentC is all about avoiding interchange fees.
 
Yep, Iagree with the Today Show clip, this is about not having access to your personal info. I'm so sick and tired of stores asking for my phone number or email or zip code when I try and pay for stuff. They don't need that info, all they need is my money. I never give stores my real info and never will. For that reason alone, I'll never use CurrentC because it passes on personal data to the retailer and is nowhere near as secure as Apple Pay.
 
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caesarp said:
Right. Instead we should use a credit card at CVS and Rite-Aid even for small $$ purchases (the brand that costs them the most in interchange fees). Since CurrentC is all about avoiding interchange fees.
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Who do you think pays all those transaction fees, ultimately? It ain't your fairy godmother, that's for sure.
 
IJ Reilly said:
Who do you think pays all those transaction fees, ultimately? It ain't your fairy godmother, that's for sure.
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Sure, but the stores are paying them already. Who cares? Its just overhead for any business that they calculate into their overall pricing, like we are paying for the lights, AC, employee salaries, and rent/mortgage on the land they sit on.

Its not like the prices go up every time we use a credit card. IN fact, the larger retailers get a discount based on cc usage (so they pay less in interchange fees due to volume).
 
caesarp said:
Sure, but the stores are paying them already. Who cares? Its just overhead for any business that they calculate into their overall pricing, like we are paying for the lights, AC, employee salaries, and rent/mortgage on the land they sit on.

Its not like the prices go up every time we use a credit card. IN fact, the larger retailers get a discount based on cc usage (so they pay less in interchange fees due to volume).
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Those charges might be buried in costs, but they are there just the same. The bank and credit card company rakes are much larger than most people realize. If you are saying that we pay these costs whether we enjoy the convenience or not, this is true (save the few retailers who charge an extra fee to credit card users). But this is also true for a lot of other things. We pay for roads we never drive on, but it would be silly to go out of our way to drive on a road just because we contribute to its maintenance.
 
dotme said:
If you're a retailer selling big ticket items, you either have to get into the lending business (which carries risk and costs) or let the credit card companies do that for you. I know which one I'd choose... the one that limits my exposure. So there's a huge value to accepting credit cards, as evidenced by the fact that just about every retailer on the planet does. As a consumer, I enjoy the added fraud and buyer protection I get from using a credit card as well. All Apple Pay does is make the transaction more secure, which means even LESS chance of a chargeback on the retailer due to fraud. You'd think retailers would love it, not kill it.
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What about the way paypal does it, charging directly to your bank, or the way I gather MCX (if that the right name) plans on doing it?


appleii.c said:
Not to defend the credit card companies, but they DO allow users to buy stuff on "credit" without the merchant to be the "lender". It increases sales (consumer more likely to spend more), and its a benefit to the consumer as well. I don't need to walk around with lots of cash in my pockets at all times.

Also, whats to stop Apple or Google from linking the Bank directly to their pay systems and bypass the CC fees themselves?
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Yes, this, basically.


Jmausmuc said:
Oh really? Another capitalism hater with an iphone in his hands...
If they didn’t offer any benefits, nobody would use their cards. Do you think businesses pay them a portion of their sales just for fun?
They add benefit to the customer by offering credit, fraud protection and convenience.
Nobody is forcing people to use credit cards, you could just use cash or debit which is accepted everywhere, yet most people like to use credit cards.

Your argument makes absolutely no sense.
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Actually, I think people use them because they're the status quo (particularly in American, I gather), not because people have thought about it and decided it's the best solution. Do the fees only apply to credit cards then, not to, for example, Visa Debit cards?
 
mazz0 said:
Actually, I think people use them because they're the status quo (particularly in American, I gather), not because people have thought about it and decided it's the best solution. Do the fees only apply to credit cards then, not to, for example, Visa Debit cards?
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That argument is weak. There is a ton of data why American's have the credit behavior that they do. First, almost 50% of Americans have credit card debt. They basically live beyond their means and have to use credit cards to survive.

But the other 50% that don't have any debt have extremely valid reasons for credit cards such as reward points back (1% refund, travel points etc...), credit protection and just plain CONVENIENCE. Using cash and checks are super annoying and annoy everyone else in line. Also, debit cards offer none of the benefits of the credit cards so why use them. We are all being charged the extra markup from credit card use (2-3% markup on all items) so using a debit card makes no sense with the benefits of a credit card.
 
apprunner said:
That argument is weak. There is a ton of data why American's have the credit behavior that they do. First, almost 50% of Americans have credit card debt. They basically live beyond their means and have to use credit cards to survive.

But the other 50% that don't have any debt have extremely valid reasons for credit cards such as reward points back (1% refund, travel points etc...), credit protection and just plain CONVENIENCE. Using cash and checks are super annoying and annoy everyone else in line. Also, debit cards offer none of the benefits of the credit cards so why use them. We are all being charged the extra markup from credit card use (2-3% markup on all items) so using a debit card makes no sense with the benefits of a credit card.
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We're going off on a bit of a tangent here though. Yes, of course there are valid reasons for wanting credit, but the people running the card payments aren't the people financing the credit, are they? As I understand it (and I may well be wrong) you have the card companies like Visa offering a service to the banks. Now at one point that service added value, because cards, as you say, were convenient, but these days banks or whoever is actually financing the credit have other ways of getting money to you, such as through apps, so the card companies are an unnecessary middle man. That was my point.
 
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People are deal crazy. If you offer 50% off by trying it today, a boat load of people will do it without thinking.

That will break the barrier. People are quite sloppy with personal data, inappropriately trustful of retailers and again: coupon crazy.

Not everyone. But a lot of people!
 
mazz0 said:
We're going off on a bit of a tangent here though. Yes, of course there are valid reasons for wanting credit, but the people running the card payments aren't the people financing the credit, are they? As I understand it (and I may well be wrong) you have the card companies like Visa offering a service to the banks. Now at one point that service added value, because cards, as you say, were convenient, but these days banks or whoever is actually financing the credit have other ways of getting money to you, such as through apps, so the card companies are an unnecessary middle man. That was my point.
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The banks are the ones that created the credit card companies and eventually spun them off. They wanted a unified payment mechanism and the entire POS infrastructure is geared toward the credit cards now. They can't be so easily displaced as their networks provide security and an entire infrastructure that can handle the transaction volume. I believe the banks want this status quo in place for the foreseeable future.
 
Yeah there is no way this is going to take off. This has nothing to do with apple or apple pay. Even if all our info is securely stored people aren't going to go for the bank transactions. People use credit cards to maintain credit, rewards, card perks, customer service, simple fraud protection and of course because they don't even have the money they are spending. People aren't going to be ok with direct bank withdrawal, especially when they can easily still swipe there credit card at the register. What a waste. The smartest thing to do would be to team up with apple pay and try to get the credit fees reduced due to the extra security measures.
 
$500k, Must have gone by now!

CVS & RiteAid must have lost way more than $500k by now not allowing customers paying thorough ApplePay! It would be much cheaper for them to ditch that stupid 3 year contract than losing business altogether. By 2019, at least 50% (if not 100%) of the USA population will start using ApplePay and other modes of NFC payments. Within a week after the launch of Apple pay, if the response is so strong, it's no brainer to imagine the downfall of the companies refusing ApplePay on purpose.

I love to shop at CVS & RiteAid
OR used to :mad:.��
 
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Something like this would have been great if it wasn't for the fact a NFC is a far more convenient application of payment via phones.

It's also crazy that they even signed up to this and basically lost half a mil. It's a technology (if you can even call it that ) that is dead on arrive , in fact it was dead when they signed up this shops to the deals in 2012 with the future being very Cleary NFC based , especially since most banks were researching and developing NFC terminals back they as well.


When did Google wallet come out ? 2012? The righting was on the wall back then.

The whole deal seems a bit dodgy to me , I can see almost no one wanting to use this method of payment, even the concept seems pretty bad for the consumer , so why did these companies agree to pay half a mil and have a lock down on competition , what Bennifits have they received out of it for the last 2 years?

Oh and the technology behind it seems basic and archaic for how much they are receiving for it.
 
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