Apple Pay Overtakes Starbucks as Most Popular Mobile Payment Platform in the US

[stephenschimpf]

It's a fallacy for anyone to think they have to pay interest when they use a credit card. It baffles me that half of USA citizens carry a balance on a credit card, and does in fact pay interest - that's very bad and I can hardly believe it when I think about it a bit.

I always pay my balance and have never paid any interest charges. I even put part of my new car on a credit card, not because I didn't have the money (I paid cash for the car, as I've always done) but because I wanted the cash back. The dealership allowed me to put $5000 of the total on a credit card.

Unfortunately, a lot of Americans simply can't do that. I believe half of Americans, perhaps more, said they couldn't come up with some small amount like $400 in cash if an emergency happened. They simply have no savings and live paycheck to paycheck, so constantly paying off a credit-card balance is a way of life. It's sad, but true.

 

[dontwalkhand]

All the places I frequent now use Apple Pay. Whole Foods, Best Buy, subway, Acro gas station..... target was the last hold out and now they have it finally. Dominos is probably the only other spot that I go all the time that doesn’t use Apple Pay.

Dominos has Apple Pay here.
But their app doesn’t have it.

 

[konqerror]

Unfortunately, a lot of Americans simply can't do that. I believe half of Americans, perhaps more, said they couldn't come up with some small amount like $400 in cash if an emergency happened. They simply have no savings and live paycheck to paycheck, so constantly paying off a credit-card balance is a way of life. It's sad, but true.

And while you're complaining about how bad Americans are, go learn about overdraft in Europe. Europeans are in more debt, as a percent of household disposable income, than Americans are. (Triple whammy: lower incomes, higher taxes, higher cost of living) Plus go to Spain, where until very recently, personal bankruptcy wasn't a thing. You were stuck with most debts for life.

 

[deeddawg]

Not all. At least in the US some credit cards do have an annual membership fee. I have a mastercard with a fee of about $20 a year (not much, but not free) and an Amex with a fee of just over $100/year. That’s why apple touts the lack of any fees on their card as a selling point for it.

In my experience fee-free credit cards are quite common and readily available here in the US.

Yes, there are also cards which do have a fee, and they typically provide higher rewards in certain categories or provide other perks to offset that cost.

 

[megfilmworks]

Every major supermarket in SoCal has ApplePay now EXCEPT Ralph’s/Kroger who are still pushing their data stealing proprietary Kroger app.
I won’t shop their anymore until they upgrade to contactless.

 

[bkaus]

I just don't understand how they come up with the 70% of retailers statistic. I live in Phoenix, AZ (USA), one of the largest cities in the country... Apple Pay is nowhere to be found, in comparison to places that don't have it. Yeah, McDonald's, Whole Foods, Starbucks, random other coffee shops. That's about it. No gas stations, no grocery stores (beyond Whole Foods), no Walmart, no Target, very few stores in malls.

Thank god BevMo accepts Apple Pay, or I would have to move!

Target just added it here. Likely there too.

I'm finding a lot of small shops have it but don't know it.

 

[rcoda]

I was the first to use it at the grand opening of the Scottsdale, AZ White Castle yesterday! I was customer #6 but 1-5 were using cash!

 

[lartola]

Dominos has Apple Pay here.
But their app doesn’t have it.

Dominos has always had Apple Pay at their physical locations in the US, I used it myself as far back as 2017, they just don't have it in the app or on the website to pay for delivery orders. Ironically, in Mexico -where theoretically Apple Pay is not available- Dominos Pizza is indeed able to accept Apple Pay even on delivery orders, since the delivery couriers are provided standalone wireless POS terminals that allow them to offer the option of credit/debit card payment upon delivery and the terminals do have the contactless reader enabled and working.

 

[bkaus]

I agree, though it goes both ways. Why should the merchant spend money to adopt contactless and give up the ability to track purchases. That's the way some see it unfortunately.

ApplePay doesn't totally give up the ability to track. It still gives a number, and its the same number every time (until reset). It does take away the name - ApplePay comes across as "Valued Customer" on our Verifone VX520 instead of an actual name. But names aren't unique so they are already tracking on name/card number combination and making guesses on who is who, possibly helped by asking for zip code.

 

[dontwalkhand]

ApplePay doesn't totally give up the ability to track. It still gives a number, and its the same number every time (until reset). It does take away the name - ApplePay comes across as "Valued Customer" on our Verifone VX520 instead of an actual name. But names aren't unique so they are already tracking on name/card number combination and making guesses on who is who, possibly helped by asking for zip code.

The stores that want to track should just have a loyalty card.

 

[Duane Martin]

I'm unsure where in the US you live (or when you last visited if you live elsewhere), but this really doesn't match my experience here.

I don't know if you have ever left the US but I visit the US a couple times a year (last time in April and Las Vegas). I will stand by my statement that contactless payment is not widespread in the US; there are, of course, certain markets, like San Francisco, that are approaching the saturation of, say, Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan. Have you ever even heard of Moose Jaw?

I am frequently amused watching US visitors in Canada being handed a wireless debit machine at their table in a restaurant and they act as if they have never seen one before. You don't need to go to the US to appreciate how far behind the US is. To be clear, I am referring to contactless payment.

 

[stephenschimpf]

And while you're complaining about how bad Americans are, go learn about overdraft in Europe. Europeans are in more debt, as a percent of household disposable income, than Americans are. (Triple whammy: lower incomes, higher taxes, higher cost of living) Plus go to Spain, where until very recently, personal bankruptcy wasn't a thing. You were stuck with most debts for life.

I'm sorry you took my statement of fact, as I understand it, as a "complaint" about how bad Americans are.

 

[lartola]

I don't understand this. Does Apple Pay have to be individually accepted by a store in the US? In Europe you can use Apple Pay anywhere where there is a contactless option, which is almost everywhere...

Apple Pay doesn’t have to be individually accepted by the stores, they can accept it as long as they have contactless payment just like in Europe and the rest of the world. However, in the US contactless payment is still in the process of being rolled out to the merchants. To give you an idea of the situation, 3% of the merchants in the US had contactless when apple pay launched in 2014. Just 3%. It’s the only country in the world where apple decided to launch apple pay regardless of contactless payment penetration among merchants, and that’s one of the reasons why they’re seeing such a low adoption of apple pay by the end users of their products there. Now, five years later, the percentage has increased to 70% according to Apple, but I’m pretty sure that number doesn’t include places that are not stores but still charge for their services and accept credit and debit cards such as gas stations, sit down restaurants, bars, doctors offices, post offices, sports clubs, schools and universities and many others. Including those places, I’m positive that the true percentage of contactless penetration among merchants in the US is substantially lower than 70%.

 

[deeddawg]

I don't know if you have ever left the US but I visit the US a couple times a year (last time in April and Las Vegas).

Sure, visiting Las Vegas is truly representative of the living day to day in US...

I will stand by my statement that contactless payment is not widespread in the US

You're certainly entitled to your opinion.

Not really sure what Moose Jaw SK has to do with anything, but I'm aware of it - a bit outside Regina. Haven't been there, but I've visited Caribou YT if you're keeping up with towns named after ruminants.

I am frequently amused watching US visitors in Canada being handed a wireless debit machine at their table in a restaurant and they act as if they have never seen one before.

Meh. Paid for dinner with a mobile terminal at a restaurant in Maine last week. They weren't confusing in Toronto ten years ago either (when I first saw them). Not really sure why you are amused watching someone else struggle? Maybe connected with your apparent condescension. *shrug* Whatever.

I've seen mobile terminals elsewhere as well but never give it much thought. Chili's chain has pay-at-table kiosks though I don't remember checking for contactless the last time I was there a few months ago. Most independent restaurants with pay-at-the-counter setups that I've visited in recent months have contactless enabled. (whether quick-service or table-service). It's pretty common really, though you need to get out to smaller chains and independents and skip the big chains / walmarts / krogers / publix stores.

 

[lartola]

Meh. Paid for dinner with a mobile terminal at a restaurant in Maine last week. They weren't confusing in Toronto ten years ago either (when I first saw them). Not really sure why you are amused watching someone else struggle? Maybe connected with your apparent condescension. *shrug* Whatever.

I've seen mobile terminals elsewhere as well but never give it much thought. Chili's chain has pay-at-table kiosks though I don't remember checking for contactless the last time I was there a few months ago. Most independent restaurants with pay-at-the-counter setups that I've visited in recent months have contactless enabled. (whether quick-service or table-service). It's pretty common really, though you need to get out to smaller chains and independents and skip the big chains / walmarts / krogers / publix stores.

I've only really seen mobile terminals (see picture below for what I call a mobile terminal) at one place in the US: an Outback Steakhouse location in Houston, TX, and they had the NFC disabled at the time (it was in 2017, though, so it may be enabled by now). Other than that, I haven't seen them in use anywhere else in the US. Not even in New York City, which is supposed to be one of the largest and most cosmopolitan cities in the US. Except for the restaurants that do payment at the front, I've only seen a few restaurants using pay at the table kiosks such as Chilis and Olive Garden and a few others accepting Apple Pay through their app such as The Cheesecake Factory, but the overwhelming majority of US restaurants (over 80%) don't accept contactless payment at all; they still need a physical card and have to take the card away from the table to process the payment using either a chip reader or an old magnetic stripe reader. So no, mobile terminals are not common at US restaurants, they're actually extremely rare to see. Also, I don't think any Americans who see those mobile terminals in Canada or Mexico are confused, I think they are probably uncomfortable. Americans generally aren't used to paying at the table and seem to utterly dislike it because of their tip culture among other things.

 

[deeddawg]

So no, mobile terminals are not common at US restaurants, they're actually extremely rare to see.

Yes, this is correct. (BTW another place they're used is Studio Movie Grill, though not contactless AFAIK)

The context of my comment was overall availability. Yes, table-service restaurants are a substantial hold-back on mobile terminals and contactless -- they're also but a fraction of US retail and restaurant merchants. Oddly it seems a substantial number of Latin restaurants in my area are pay-at-the-register even with table-service - and they largely use newer POS systems now which do accept contactless.

American's generally aren't used to paying at the table and seem to utterly dislike it because of their tip culture among other things.

Seems like an odd conclusion to make -- not really sure what one would have to do with the other. *shrug* I can't speak for the ~327 million other Americans, but I suspect we're no more all alike than all Mexicans or Canadians or others are all alike.

 

[tmiw]

The context of my comment was overall availability. Yes, table-service restaurants are a substantial hold-back on mobile terminals and contactless -- they're also but a fraction of US retail and restaurant merchants.

Not only that, I suspect most people don't eat at table service restaurants all that much anyway. Most day to day spending is likely gas pumps (or mass transit if you're lucky enough), counter service restaurants and grocery stores; cover those and most people won't need to take their cards out much at all.

 

[dontwalkhand]

Not only that, I suspect most people don't eat at table service restaurants all that much anyway. Most day to day spending is likely gas pumps (or mass transit if you're lucky enough), counter service restaurants and grocery stores; cover those and most people won't need to take their cards out much at all.

I use Apple Pay 95% of my day. It’ll easily be 100% most of the time if it was not for gas pumps and restaurants (and walmart and Kroger but I do use their crappy apps to pay)

 

[Biu_miu]

The technical piece of enabling contactless is generally not complicated at all.

On the business side, there are other factors. I don't know how it works in your country, but in the US it's pretty common for banks to issue debit cards that can also act like credit cards (i.e. no PIN required, gets authorized like a credit card even though it ultimately comes out of the checking account). They do this because the gov't here capped the interchange fee that big banks can charge to authorize debit transactions. The fee the banks charge for credit transactions isn't capped, so it's in the banks best interest that customers choose to process transactions from their checking account as "credit".

Merchants know this, and many big merchants (once they figure out you've swiped/dipped a combo card into the payment terminal) will attempt to get you to process the transaction as "debit", not "credit". It saves the merchant money if they're able to get you to do that, plain and simple.

That workflow isn't "out-of-the-box" for contactless payments, which I think is one of a few business-related reasons that some of the larger merchants in the US haven't enabled contactless yet.
[/QUOTE

I see. But Apple Play also is limited by retailers, isn’t it? Even if the place has contactless POS, the retailer itself could just say “Nah, you can pay by beeping your card, but no Apple Pay”

 

[dontwalkhand]

No it is not. If they don’t have Apple Pay they also don’t have contactless.

 

[compuguy1088]

I just don't understand how they come up with the 70% of retailers statistic. I live in Phoenix, AZ (USA), one of the largest cities in the country... Apple Pay is nowhere to be found, in comparison to places that don't have it. Yeah, McDonald's, Whole Foods, Starbucks, random other coffee shops. That's about it. No gas stations, no grocery stores (beyond Whole Foods), no Walmart, no Target, very few stores in malls.

Thank god BevMo accepts Apple Pay, or I would have to move!

I recently used Google Pay at a Target a couple of weeks ago. I guess they haven't rolled out support for NFC payments to all of their stores...

 

[compuguy1088]

I use ApplePay regularly at Sprouts, TraderJoes, WholeFoods, DicksSportingGoods, AcademySports, BassPro/Cabelas, QuikTrip gas station (inside only though), Costco, a local independent grocery store, local liquor store, many other places.

Can't use it at Walmart, Publix, Kroger, Home Depot, Sams, or Lowes though.

My local Giant, Safeway, and Aldi grocery stores also accept NFC payments.

 

[lartola]

I see. But Apple Play also is limited by retailers, isn’t it? Even if the place has contactless POS, the retailer itself could just say “Nah, you can pay by beeping your card, but no Apple Pay”

No, they can't do that. The contactless reader is just one more electronic reader that the terminals have built into them. And just like with the chip reader and the magnetic stripe reader, when the contactless reader is enabled, the merchant will be able to accept anything and everything it can read. That includes contactless cards, Apple Pay, Google Pay, Fitbit Pay, and many other forms of payment. Retailers can't individually lock specific forms of contactless payment out of their stores. If a retailer doesn't want to accept Apple Pay at all, they have to turn off the contactless reader, locking out of their system every single other form of contactless payment too in the process. That's why Walmart, Publix, Kroger and a few others shut off all their contactless readers. They didn't know (or if they knew they didn't give a damn) that locking apple pay out of their stores by turning off the contactless readers meant they were also locking out of their stores every single other form of contactless payment that exists, limiting the customers to just use cash or chip and magnetic stripe cards if they don't want to use the store's own QR code based app. Only Samsung Pay and LG Pay could get around such a restriction because they can communicate with the magnetic stripe readers, and the contactless holdout retailers don't seem to really be aware of this so far (even if they were aware they cannot disable the magnetic stripe reader on their terminals because they still often need it for swiping cards).

 

[tmiw]

No, they can't do that. The contactless reader is just one more electronic reader that the terminals have built into them. And just like with the chip reader and the magnetic stripe reader, when the contactless reader is enabled, the merchant will be able to accept anything and everything it can read. That includes contactless cards, Apple Pay, Google Pay, Fitbit Pay, and many other forms of payment. Retailers can't individually lock specific forms of contactless payment out of their stores. If a retailer doesn't want to accept Apple Pay at all, they have to turn off the contactless reader, locking out of their system every single other form of contactless payment too in the process. That's why Walmart, Publix, Kroger and a few others shut off all their contactless readers. They didn't know (or if they knew they didn't give a damn) that locking apple pay out of their stores by turning off the contactless readers meant they were also locking out of their stores every single other form of contactless payment that exists, limiting the customers to just use cash or chip and magnetic stripe cards if they don't want to use the store's own QR code based app. Only Samsung Pay and LG Pay could get around such a restriction because they can communicate with the magnetic stripe readers, and the contactless holdout retailers don't seem to really be aware of this so far (even if they were aware they cannot disable the magnetic stripe reader on their terminals because they still often need it for swiping cards).

Technically, a store could block all mobile wallet transactions and still accept contactless cards by immediately declining if they see that CDCVM's supported by the "card" that just tapped the terminal. Of course, that's very not allowed by card network rules (not to mention that there might be particular NFC based mobile wallets that they're okay with).

 

[lartola]

Technically, a store could block all mobile wallet transactions and still accept contactless cards by immediately declining if they see that CDCVM's supported by the "card" that just tapped the terminal. Of course, that's very not allowed by card network rules (not to mention that there might be particular NFC based mobile wallets that they're okay with).

It’s never done in practice, though. What they always do is simply turn off the contactless readers and block every single form of contactless payment. Like Walmart did. Plus the original question was whether they could choose a specific mobile wallet and block it, which they can’t. They may be technically able to distinguish between contactless cards and other contactless payments, but that’s it. They can’t, say, specifically block Google Pay and still allow Apple Pay.