Apple Removes Old Non-Customer Reviews from App Store

[johnmcboston]

It's a nice first step... Now they need to tag each review with the a) date and b) version of the software reviewed.

I'm tired of reading reviews of an app that say "it has this bug", when the product has been upgraded several times and the bug they complained about is long gone. That review is now as damaging as a "non-owner" reviewing.

Someone made the analogy to Amazon. Well, when a new version of software goes for sale on amazon, a new review chain is started. Why not something like that? The only reviews you see are for the latest version of the software - and reset the star ratings. Leave a "Reviews of older versions" link if someone wants to read reviews of old versions of a product. (although there is the potential for developer abuse, but it could also encourage developers to fix bugs in order to get reviews up...)

 

[itickings]

DOES AMAZON FORCE YOU TO BUY A BOOK TO REVIEW IT? No, it takes your word for it. Why ? Because a positive or negative review can be as biased or as wrong/irrelevant by someone who bought the book/app as that by someone who didn't. Buying the app is no guarantee that all of a sudden you develop good judgement to rate the app in a helpful way.

I think you got it a bit wrong there. Amazon can get away with not requiring you to buy the book first, because you can buy a book from multiple sources, or even borrow it from a library, whereas you can only get an app from the app store.

Not having bought the app makes having experience with it unlikely. A person at least having used an app is far more likely to post a relevant review than someone not having used that app. Really.

ASK YOURSELF WHAT REVIEWS ARE MOST HELPFULL, POSITIVE OR NEGATIVE ONES? OF COURSE IT'S NEGATIVE. AND APPLE LIMITING THESE FOR WHATEVER REASON MEANS MORE $$$ SALES TO THE APP STORE FOR THEM LESS INSIGHT INTO THE APP. FOR US.

No need to scream. And what do you mean with limiting negative reviews?

Also, I strongly disagree with "of course it's negative". Bashing from someone who haven't even used the application is as worthless as glorified words from the developer's next of kin. Neither positive nor negative is by itself helpful. Reports of what is good and what is bad is.

 

[Don't panic]

When customers delete your app, they're asked to rate it.
A far larger majority of 'reviews' come from there, not the storefront.

the problem with the system is that it biases the review towards the negative ones ( there must be a reason if you are deleting it). they should have a default feature popping up when you use a specific app for a while -say every 50 times, or once a month- asking :
"we see you use this application frequently, would you like to rate it?"
once its rated it stays rated and you are not bothered by the pop up anymore.

Or simply substitute the "rate on delete" with the option to rate the app from the phone at any time (and change the rating whenever).

 

[hayesk]

I will miss some of the non-customer reviews because some named free alternatives in the App store. There's no need to pay for an app whose functionality is the same or worse than a free one.

I disagree. If I made the paid app, and paid for the advertising and marketing to help you find my app, why should the screen with my app be a showcase to tell you about my competitors.

If you find my app simply by browsing, not through my marketing, then you'll likely find the free one on your own.

 

[nkawtg72]

glad they did this.

i would have done it different though, and it would have been simple to do too.
anyone could have been able to review an app, but only those that purchased could have rated it.

additionally, a purchaser could have selected to hide/unhide reviews of non-purchasers. except for the constant "this app should be free" crap, there were times when i saw a review from a non-purchaser that was informative.

however you look at it though, i'm still glad apple cleaned up the history.

 

[danuff]

I Agree With Apple Removing Reviews

As a registered developer, I am glad to see Apple removing the reviews of "whiny" customers who did nothing more then whine about the price of an app when they didn't even download and try it.

As both a developer and a customer, these reviews do help in making or breaking an app, and the last thing a developer needs is a bad review from someone that has no idea what he/she is talking about.

Dan

 

[branjosef]

Does this mean they removed the reviews from the people that wrote the app, because I see all the time, people who wrote the app responding to other people's critical reviews of their app as if they are leaving feedback on Ebay. Of course, they give themselves 4-5 stars (whatever) and say that the other poster should have read the description before purchasing and that their app is awesome. This of course influences the app rating and the ratio of positive/negative reviews. I seen apps with the app creator responding to every comment left thereby effectively counteracting the negative reviews. I guess anything for a dollar.

 

[bruce1369]

Good, about time!

I can think of nothing more useless than a review by someone who never used the product. Just an open invitation to trolls.

 

[DavidLeblond]

Customer reviews to me can be good and bad.

When they have constructive critisism that is good... although when you go and make the changes they suggest, as previously noted, their review does not go away. I much prefer people to email me their feature suggestions. It kind of annoys me to see "if you add X feature, I'll give it 5 stars" in a 4 star review. They never update the review.

As an aside, I wish Apple would fix the "Report a problem" button on the app pages... those reports never make it to the developers (at least I don't get them.) I've gotten scathing 1 star reviews because someone "repeatedly reported a problem" through one of those buttons and were ignored. For a bug that was easy to fix too. And of course those reviews never go away.

 

[GoCubsGo]

This is flawed because anything I reviewed I bought or got for free (if it was meant to be free). I can say that two of my reviews are gone and yet ... here I stare right at the downloaded application.

I'm not saying it is not good, but their system for cleanup is flawed. My reviews were actually quite decent in terms of giving pros and cons of the app as well as the cost/benefit.

 

[Schtumple]

This is flawed because anything I reviewed I bought or got for free (if it was meant to be free). I can say that two of my reviews are gone and yet ... here I stare right at the downloaded application.

I'm not saying it is not good, but their system for cleanup is flawed. My reviews were actually quite decent in terms of giving pros and cons of the app as well as the cost/benefit.

I'm pretty sure it was done automatically, not by a person, probably a few other peoples reviews disappeared as a result of a glitch or something.

 

[ucfgrad93]

Seems pretty fair, how can you write a review on an app you haven't used, I remember seeing a 1 star review for an app, that started with, "I haven't actually used this app but...", why are you reviewing something you haven't used?!

Agreed, this is a good thing.

 

[milo]

I wish they'd do the same in the iTunes Store. You can't realistically review a song based a 30-second preview. Only those who buy the song or album should be able to rate them.

Songs are different since you can buy the CD or hear the song a million times on the radio.

Makes sense to limit it for apps, but not really for songs (or movies and TV).

Bad move for customers, good move for apple as this will enable more positive reviews hence (possibly) more buyers, but for customers to limit the opinions for whatever reason is bad.

No, if someone who doesn't have the app reviews it, I don't even consider that an "opinion". I totally agree with eliminating ones from people who don't actually have it.[/QUOTE]

DOES AMAZON FORCE YOU TO BUY A BOOK TO REVIEW IT?

Not comparable since you can buy a book elsewhere, which isn't the case with an iPhone app.

ASK YOURSELF WHAT REVIEWS ARE MOST HELPFULL, POSITIVE OR NEGATIVE ONES? OF COURSE IT'S NEGATIVE. AND APPLE LIMITING THESE FOR WHATEVER REASON MEANS MORE $$$ SALES TO THE APP STORE FOR THEM LESS INSIGHT INTO THE APP. FOR US.

Neither. Most helpful is reviews from people who have used the app.

And you can quit shouting, it's annoying.

 

[Will_reed]

I've also seen 1-star reviews that start with "This is the BEST app I ever got!!11!!11!!!"

I wish they'd do the same in the iTunes Store. You can't realistically review a song based a 30-second preview. Only those who buy the song or album should be able to rate them.

Not to mention the amount of people who review the price of the album instead of the album, that just drives me nuts.

I don't care if they don't want to pay $14 for Beowulf the soundtrack I want to see a REAL review.

 

[Darkroom]

let's hope MacUpdate takes note. that site could certainly use less trolls who are up way past their bedtime...

 

[jackfrost123]

Now if they could just figure out a way to remove all those 5 star ratings that are obviously posted by the developer themselves.

AMEN, FINALLY AN INTELLIGENT COMMENT. But they are not worried about removing positive review because that means more five starred apps and hence more incentive to buy, while negative reviews impact badly on them (irregardless of them being helpful to consumers).

 

[heeb]

Apple is still missing something...

I have read a lot of these replies and think what Apple has done here is good.

However, there are two MAJOR problems that still remain with the rating system - and they are important because a lot of people (although they shouldn't) base their decisions on ratings - especially if there is a choice between two similar apps. The problems:

1 - This one has already been mentioned a lot: there is bias toward negative reviews because people are asked to review upon deleting an app. This is the only time I've ever reviewed an app because they make it so convenient - otherwise I wouldn't think of doing it.

2 - This is a HUGE one that I haven't seen mentioned yet: Apps change over time!!!!!!! This is unlike the situation that exists in any other online rating system I've seen. For example, say that a product has been getting terrible reviews on Amazon and then the company takes note of the complaints and makes a new product. The new product is a separate entity and receives separate reviews. Apple should give smaller weight to older reviews or reviews from previous versions.

 

[GQB]

Ok, that's a start

Next step is to tag reviews according to the revision number. Nothing is more useless than seeing criticisms of features that have long since been upgraded.

iTunes can see the version you have at the time you write the review, so it should tag it thus.

BTW, regarding iTunes in general, am I just not able to find it, or does it not have a simple 'wishlist' feature?

 

[jackfrost123]

I think you got it a bit wrong there. Amazon can get away with not requiring you to buy the book first, because you can buy a book from multiple sources, or even borrow it from a library, whereas you can only get an app from the app store.

Not having bought the app makes having experience with it unlikely. A person at least having used an app is far more likely to post a relevant review than someone not having used that app. Really.

No need to scream. And what do you mean with limiting negative reviews?
Also, I strongly disagree with "of course it's negative". Bashing from someone who haven't even used the application is as worthless as glorified words from the developer's next of kin. Neither positive nor negative is by itself helpful. Reports of what is good and what is bad is.

Amazon cannot guarantee you've read the book neither can apple guarantee that you have not used the app on a friends iphone or happened to have the developer as your roommate and seen all the flaws of the app. In any case everyone has a right to opine and it's a matter of their responsibility where and how they got to experience the item under review. Amazon just wants more information on a item (especially in the old days when they did not have the look in option in a book) irregardless of how the person reviewing got it so they can enable you to choose out of the 10000's of titles they have, you are going to buy anyway. Apple on the other hand seem to think that bad reviews or reviews pointing to a free item will impact negatively on the sale and hence they make the reviewing difficult be letting only those who have bought the app review. That to me is bad for the consumer. As a great comment here went, how about them removing all the five star reviews from the developers themselves.

Songs are different since you can buy the CD or hear the song a million times on the radio.
Makes sense to limit it for apps, but not really for songs (or movies and TV).
No, if someone who doesn't have the app reviews it, I don't even consider that an "opinion". I totally agree with eliminating ones from people who don't actually have it.
Not comparable since you can buy a book elsewhere, which isn't the case with an iPhone app.
Neither. Most helpful is reviews from people who have used the app.
And you can quit shouting, it's annoying.

Give me break, I used caps from empasis I did not shout in your ear, I am not bothered by caps when used spearingly, so If you are DON'T READ THEM. You 've missed the points I made completely, they flew over you, I suggest you re-read what I wrote and make more of an effort to understand my point of view. It's not a matter if you can or cannot buy an app or a book elsewhere, even if you bought the book elsewhere the fact that you are reviewing for amazon and letting that become property of amazon means that you want to take part in the amazon reviewing community and this is what amazon want to enable you to. The fact that you cannot buy an app elsewhere DOES NOT mean that you cannot be familiar and have an opinion about it in any 100s of ways that may have come about. Unless you can equate "buying an item"="having a valid opinion on it" your argument doesn't hold ground at all. Apple is wrong in doing that. If I have an opinion on an item and I want to express it they should allow me. Paying 20 $ for a 0.9 app that will buy you twenty reviews or so, and the developper can then easily ridge the system by submitting all 20 of them positive ones. So? So, nothing. So to me their decision to ban non paid reviews is a. not going to impact much or b. impact on a negative way for the buying public. If someone has a valid point to make and writes a good review then they should let all reviews in and make me the judge of who is making sense or not, having bought the app doesnt mean you are going to write a valid review - this is just a way to appease developpers, have more sales and generally higher rated apps, but ALSO a way to disable the buyers from making a correct choice by barring diversity in the reviews. Of course it seems you won't understand this time around either, but I wouldn't really expect you to.

 

[alansky]

So what gives with the completely inaccurate average rating numbers? I've noticed many iPhone apps that have average ratings of two stars, for example, when it's obvious that the average of all the POSTED ratings is much higher. Is it so hard to calculate the average of a bunch of numbers between one and five???

 

[Gasu E.]

because it is impossible have heard the song somewhere else?

Absolutely right. In the case of songs, most songs are probably bought by people who already know they like the song, because they heard it elsewhere. The ratings would be hopelesly skewed to the 4-5 range. I find the ratings slightly helpful now; if the ratings were restricted, they would be useless. Besides, I doubt the song "developers" are up in arms about the situation.

 

[Gasu E.]

I've also seen 1-star reviews that start with "This is the BEST app I ever got!!11!!11!!!"

I wish they'd do the same in the iTunes Store. You can't realistically review a song based a 30-second preview. Only those who buy the song or album should be able to rate them.

LOL, no system is perfect, given that idiots stride the earth. Perhaps we should allow people to dispute ratings and challenge them in a Court of Ratings Appeal. Then the Court could review each rating/comment combination and decide on "Reviewer Intent." Of course, I have in mind the US election resolution process, which as we know works incredibly well.

 

[Silverfist]

Sheesh...

blah blah blah blah blah blah

Boldface is still yelling. Learn some 'Netiquette, please.

.

 

[maestro55]

I have mixed feelings here. On the one hand there are people who indeed gave poor rating to apps they haven't used, there are others who might have tried an app on their friends iPhone. This will limit the number of reviews out there and therefore only the people who bought the app (and they probably bought it because their friend had it and they liked it) will review and it may skew the reviews.

 

[GQB]

I have mixed feelings here. On the one hand there are people who indeed gave poor rating to apps they haven't used, there are others who might have tried an app on their friends iPhone. This will limit the number of reviews out there and therefore only the people who bought the app (and they probably bought it because their friend had it and they liked it) will review and it may skew the reviews.

Playing with it on a friends phone doesn't cut it for me as having an informed opinion.
I want reviews by someone with 'skin in the game', or who at least may have spent some time with it.