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I'm sure the medical profession as a whole will do their best to make no use of the iPad until it meets whatever exotic specifications required then.

http://www.imedicalapps.com/

Interesting site. Reminds me of Car and Driver's review of all the cool concept cars. Nothing you can buy yet, but full of promise. That site is full of things like atlases. Stuff that, if a doctor needs to carry it around with him, he shouldn't be working on real people yet. Oh yeah, the spine surgeon that could see x-rays on his iPad. Yeah, that's what I want, a spine surgeon templating my spine in the OR on an iPad instead of a dedicated DICOM viewer running dedicated DICOM templating software. Remote viewing of xrays? Been around for years already.

All those things are interesting little doodads. Useful? Not so much, and virtually nothing that wouldn't work just as well on an iPhone or iPad Touch, or one of the thousands of actual computers that are scattered throughout any given modern hospital.

You find a way to make an iPad do what doctors need a computer to do most -- interface their record-keeping software -- and then we'll have something really useful. Until then, Peggle it is. Like I said, that other stuff is of only occasional usefulness in day to day practice.



Personally I think the onus is on the Practice Management software providers is to provide decent multi-touch web interfaces as no patient data should be stored on an easily stolen device anyway.

Patient data isn't ever stored on individual devices. All server based. Your lack of knowledge about that indicts your first opinion.
 
Interesting site. Reminds me of Car and Driver's review of all the cool concept cars. Nothing you can buy yet, but full of promise. That site is full of things like atlases. Stuff that, if a doctor needs to carry it around with him, he shouldn't be working on real people yet. Oh yeah, the spine surgeon that could see x-rays on his iPad. Yeah, that's what I want, a spine surgeon templating my spine in the OR on an iPad instead of a dedicated DICOM viewer running dedicated DICOM templating software. Remote viewing of xrays? Been around for years already.

All those things are interesting little doodads. Useful? Not so much, and virtually nothing that wouldn't work just as well on an iPhone or iPad Touch, or one of the thousands of actual computers that are scattered throughout any given modern hospital.

You find a way to make an iPad do what doctors need a computer to do most -- interface their record-keeping software -- and then we'll have something really useful. Until then, Peggle it is. Like I said, that other stuff is of marginal usefulness in day to day practice.


The interface aspect is what has been done on the iPhone for at least one commercially available practice management system and several large custom systems.

If the other poster was indicating he was actually "running" the whole practice on his netbook, including storing patient data, he is most likely in violation of nearly every single regulation regarding the storage of patient records.
 
The interface aspect is what has been done on the iPhone for at least one commercially available practice management system and several large custom systems.

Uh huh. Yes, there are some EHR's that have mobile client applications. Can you tell me how many EMR "solutions" are out there? I honestly don't know, but it has to be thousands. Having been involved in the process, all that I've seen have a variety of disqualifying factors for many practices. On product A you can do some work on your iPhone, but there's no e-prescribing. On product B you can do lab orders, but there's no billing software or interface. The problem is that the needs of various practices are so different depending on the nature of the practice, whether it includes management software, bookkeeping, lab, order entry, xray, its ability to interface...and there is simply no one software package that meets all those needs.

And all of that also has to be in an affordable package. The one promising package we looked at that had a good mobile interface didn't help us with our billing and accounting, and a custom interface was close to $100,000. There isn't that much money in medicine. A mobile client for an iPhone would have been cool, but it provided no return. We'd never get that money back. We couldn't spend $6 figures for "cool". If it didn't improve patient care or save some money (replace FTE's) then we couldn't afford it.

If the other poster was indicating he was actually "running" the whole practice on his netbook, including storing patient data, he is most likely in violation of nearly every single regulation regarding the storage of patient records.

I don't think he said that, but you're right...data is never stored on the device.
 
Why wasn't there a question "How about getting more iPhone sales by selling it unlocked in the US?"
 
All those things are interesting little doodads. Useful? Not so much, and virtually nothing that wouldn't work just as well on an iPhone or iPad Touch, or one of the thousands of actual computers that are scattered throughout any given modern hospital.

No, that wasn't the point I was making. The point is that medical content for the iPad (or other PDA's) is rudimentary - perhaps valuable to someone like a medical student with a limited knowledge base and in need of what we call a "paper brain". The kind of stuff that a medical student would find useful because they're newbies. I can assure you that after your girlfriend has been in practice for a few years and has some experience, she'll put the Merck Manual away too, whether it's the paperback pocket version that medical students and residents have been carrying for 30 years, or the electronic version on her iPad.

The problem is that this "new-fangled iPad", cool as it is, just simply isn't useful in medicine. Yet.

Maybe it will be someday. That would be cool. But those of you who think some 15 year old just has to sit down and write an app for that....you don't even begin to grasp the complexity or expense involved in developing computing devices that would be day-to-day useful in patient care. I've seen this same song and dance over and over and over going back to the original Palm Pilots, and how pundits predicted how doctors would now have an entire hospital in the palm of their hand. Every single medical meeting has at least a couple of exhibitors with some new interface software. I was at a meeting two years ago. A fancy exhibit for a monitoring package that would wirelessly interface operating room monitoring functions with a Palm device (don't remember which one). It was VERY cool, and I lusted after it. It was $250,000 for the package. Hospital CFO just laughed when I proposed it after I got back.

So you're making post after post after post whining about the iPad because YOUR $250 K gadget wasn't accepted and the iPad is.

You can claim that it has no medical uses all you want - that doesn't make you right. Doctors are buying these things by the thousands. There are quite a few applications:

- Data entry
- Accessing reference works (drugs, drug interactions, diseases, etc). I'd rather have my doctor have immediate access to all this stuff than just going with what he thinks because he doesn't want to go back to his office
- Accessing patient records via VPN off the main, protected server
- AND WHATEVER ELSE THE DOCTOR THINKS HE CAN USE IT FOR

It's a tool. No one said it was going to revolutionize medicine. But anything that makes a doctor's life easier is a good thing. And real doctors think it's useful, so all your whining is nothing more than sour grapes.

What an idiotic statement about netbooks. It does EVERYTHING the giant iPod Touch doesn't. In other words, it's a computer. Not just a giant single-threaded overpriced joke. LOL at the Apple fanboys trying to pass their turd off as a computer.

LOL at people who have no clue what the iPad is. Try standing at a trade show talking with a customer holding a netbook in your hand and showing them a presentation. Now, try the same thing on an iPad. Try doing touch screen data entry for things like surveys on a netbook.

It is not supposed to do everything a netbook does. Apple learned years ago that making a device that does EVERYTHING is a sure route to failure. Rather, it does some tasks better than a netbook while eliminating those things that are unnecessary for its main purpose - content delivery.

Frugality is much more gratifying for me currently and I don't seek to be materialistic.

Why would I buy something that wouldn't make me happy?

No one ever said YOU should buy it. If you don't want to spend the money for ANY reason (frugality, not having money, being a luddite, whatever), that's your prerogative. I simply objected to your statement that it has NO use and that NO ONE would buy it.

The iPad IS supposed to be the answer to the netbook market but it fails at completing all the requires tasks.
It is small (9.7" which is SMALLER then my Macbook Mini at 10.1")
Has a decent screen resolution (imagine what could be with 2" more?)
Small keyboard that is usable ONLY because of the addition keys on different pages (my HP is 92% standard size. With 1" more you could fit a standard iMac keyboard)

Hell, Apple even has made accessories to make it more like a netbook. Keyboard docking station. 32 pin connector to USB port for adding photos.

But Apple has limped it's way into the market because of it's lack of being able to use more powerful apps that people WANT to use.

I couldn't even attempt to try and describe to you how the two operating systems could combine to create the best user experience ever. The only way that I could put it for you to understand is this: Simplicity like an iPhone, application prowess like a Mac.

If you can't imagine a perfect blend of what's best from both, I feel sorry for you.

The problem is that adding all those features takes away from its main purpose. Apple is masterful at distilling devices down to the bare essentials and weeding out functions that don't add to the results. The fact that they have a long string of very successful devices supports that.

You don't make a Ferrari a better performance car by adding 4 wheel drive, 20" mud and snow tires, off road capability, a back seat, and 5,000 pound towing capacity. Simply starting with a device and saying "I could make it better by adding this, and this, and this" indicates simply that you don't have a concept of the fact that every design feature has tradeoffs. I'll take Apple's understanding of that over yours any day.
 
What an idiotic statement about netbooks. It does EVERYTHING the giant iPod Touch doesn't. In other words, it's a computer. Not just a giant single-threaded overpriced joke. LOL at the Apple fanboys trying to pass their turd off as a computer.

Thanks for your worthless post.
 
So you're making post after post after post whining about the iPad because YOUR $250 K gadget wasn't accepted and the iPad is.

You can claim that it has no medical uses all you want - that doesn't make you right. Doctors are buying these things by the thousands. There are quite a few applications:

- Data entry
- Accessing reference works (drugs, drug interactions, diseases, etc). I'd rather have my doctor have immediate access to all this stuff than just going with what he thinks because he doesn't want to go back to his office
- Accessing patient records via VPN off the main, protected server
- AND WHATEVER ELSE THE DOCTOR THINKS HE CAN USE IT FOR
I'm not whining about anything. I'm saying that it's a very cool device and I like it a lot. But despite its coolness for watching movies and reading books, it doesn't have any significant medical applications that make it useful. Yet. And believe me, I've tried. But I'm not whining because I don't really care. The iPad has already exceeded my expectations as a personal entertainment device and I don't NEED it to do anything for me at work. Your criticism of my posts indicates that a) you haven't really read them and b) you aren't a doctor and dont' really have a clue how such devices might be usefully employed.

-data entry. What does that mean? What kind of data? I can't think of any data I'd want to enter in a iPad I'm carrying around on rounds.

--accessing reference works. I agree, reviewing medication dosages and interactions is useful. I have epocrates and Medscape on my Blackberry Curve. It works great and fits on my belt, and I have to carry the Blackberry anyway. iPad provides no advantage. Other reference works? Like what. Again, the point is those reference works aren't used by doctors on a day to day basis. And when necessary, there's no need to be carrying around your iPad to look them up since there's a computer with a 21 inch display right around every corner.

--accessing patient records. Yes, I stated this. The problem is that IT and I haven't been able to get it to work yet. I already do this with my MacBook Pro and it works, but using the VPN and Citrix server is painfully slow. Because of that, it's not useful on rounds or seeing patients, especially compared to the other less elegant but more functional devices (like the Fujitsu tablet or a netbook or a standard laptop running Windows) that are ubiquitous around hospitals and clinics these days.

--AND WHATEVER ELSE THE DOCTOR THINKS HE CAN USE IT FOR. Yes, that's the problem. I am a doctor and a geek. I have an iPad, will have another one on the 30th, and I'd love to find a use for the device at work. To make it tax deductible if no other reason. So far, no joy...but I'll keep looking.

I'm not whining because the iPad's lack of medical functionality isn't interfering with my ability to do any work. I really don't care. My iPad has already met or exceeded my expectations relative to the reason I bought it. It's just not very useful at work. That's OK. If and when it is....bonus. And no, "real doctors" haven't found it any more useful than I have. And no, it doesn't really provide anything that makes a doctor's life easier when compared to the tools that are already there.
 
No. I wouldn't buy it.

The MBA isn't supposed to compete with netbooks. It's supposed to compete with devices such as the SONY Vaio VPCX11S1 and other "Ultra-Portables".

The problem with netbooks are: small, low resolution screen; Small, cramped keyboard. Why would Apple build anything like that?

Also; a mix of OS X and iPhone OS? Just... Just no. Firstly, iPhone OS was built for touch interaction, not a cursor. Secondly... Just no. And being able to run standard OS X apps, and iPad/iPhone apps? Are you high!?

"small, cramped keyboard"? just like the iPad's keyboard? yeah, you can attach a real keyboard to it, but you can do the same thing with a netbook.

Yeah this thread devolved into a MBA vs. Netbook discussion, which is asinine in, and of, itself based on price alone. However, you have to admit the iPad's keyboard isn't that great to type on. Yes, i have tried it.
 
Yes they can

Given that my girlfriend is a 3rd year med student and works for doctors who are already using iPads, my knowledge is a little more extensive than internet searches.

The doctors aren't running their practice on the iPad or NetBooks, they are accessing information and performing data entry that goes back to a real server. To say they are running their practice with these devices implies that it's performing the backoffice functions as well.
 
The doctors aren't running their practice on the iPad or NetBooks, they are accessing information and performing data entry that goes back to a real server. To say they are running their practice with these devices implies that it's performing the backoffice functions as well.

They use their Macs for that.
 
Q: Does the iPad compete with netbooks?
A: It's a no-brainer that someone would opt for the iPad over the netbook. The netbook doesn't do anything well.

This keeps surprising me. People comparing a real computer towards a oversized ipod/iphone.
You can't compare something that's not equal.
 
You have much to learn.

The iPad IS supposed to be the answer to the netbook market but it fails at completing all the requires tasks.
It is small (9.7" which is SMALLER then my Macbook Mini at 10.1")
Has a decent screen resolution (imagine what could be with 2" more?)
Small keyboard that is usable ONLY because of the addition keys on different pages (my HP is 92% standard size. With 1" more you could fit a standard iMac keyboard)

Hell, Apple even has made accessories to make it more like a netbook. Keyboard docking station. 32 pin connector to USB port for adding photos.

But Apple has limped it's way into the market because of it's lack of being able to use more powerful apps that people WANT to use.

I couldn't even attempt to try and describe to you how the two operating systems could combine to create the best user experience ever. The only way that I could put it for you to understand is this: Simplicity like an iPhone, application prowess like a Mac.

If you can't imagine a perfect blend of what's best from both, I feel sorry for you.

In your list of fails, don't forget PRICE and FLASH :rolleyes:
 
Your criticism of my posts indicates that a) you haven't really read them and b) you aren't a doctor and dont' really have a clue how such devices might be usefully employed.

-data entry. What does that mean? What kind of data? I can't think of any data I'd want to enter in a iPad I'm carrying around on rounds.

--accessing reference works. I agree, reviewing medication dosages and interactions is useful. I have epocrates and Medscape on my Blackberry Curve. It works great and fits on my belt, and I have to carry the Blackberry anyway. iPad provides no advantage. Other reference works? Like what. Again, the point is those reference works aren't used by doctors on a day to day basis. And when necessary, there's no need to be carrying around your iPad to look them up since there's a computer with a 21 inch display right around every corner.

--accessing patient records. Yes, I stated this. The problem is that IT and I haven't been able to get it to work yet. I already do this with my MacBook Pro and it works, but using the VPN and Citrix server is painfully slow. Because of that, it's not useful on rounds or seeing patients, especially compared to the other less elegant but more functional devices (like the Fujitsu tablet or a netbook or a standard laptop running Windows) that are ubiquitous around hospitals and clinics these days.

--AND WHATEVER ELSE THE DOCTOR THINKS HE CAN USE IT FOR. Yes, that's the problem. I am a doctor and a geek. I have an iPad, will have another one on the 30th, and I'd love to find a use for the device at work. To make it tax deductible if no other reason. So far, no joy...but I'll keep looking.

I'm not whining because the iPad's lack of medical functionality isn't interfering with my ability to do any work. I really don't care. My iPad has already met or exceeded my expectations relative to the reason I bought it. It's just not very useful at work. That's OK. If and when it is....bonus. And no, "real doctors" haven't found it any more useful than I have. And no, it doesn't really provide anything that makes a doctor's life easier when compared to the tools that are already there.

I HAVE read your posts and they don't make any sense. The fact that I'm not a doctor has nothing to do with it - lots of people who are doctors agree with me.

- Data entry. Oh, things like the nurse entering my BP and pulse into her iPad rather than a paper chart? Things like entering symptoms and complaint into the computer rather than onto a paper chart which will later need to be transcribed?

- Reference works. Sorry, but trying to access reference works on a screen the size of the iPhone is nowhere near as useful as doing it on a 9.7" screen. It's not the same thing at all.

- Accessing IT records. Sorry, it's not my fault that you and your IT group are incompetent. There are quite a few VPN systems for the iPad already.

- So the fact that YOU haven't been able to figure out how to use it means that it has no use in medicine?LOTS of doctors ARE finding it useful, so your claims that it has no place in medicine are just plain wrong. How do you get from "I don't see a use for it" to "There IS no use for it"? Look up narcissistic personality disorder.
 
"Q: Does the iPad compete with netbooks?
A: It's a no-brainer that someone would opt for the iPad over the netbook. The netbook doesn't do anything well."


Same question answered with Steve Jobs Reality Distortion Field disabled...

A netbook's WIFI isn't buggy & works at Princeton U, unlike the iPad.

A netbook can surf the internet including Flash sites, which make up a high percentage of internet sites, unlike the iPad.

A netbook can also run 2 programs at once in multiple windows and multi-task.

A netbook has a camera and USB.

So yeah, it's a no-brainer alright. Oh, and the iPad is more expensive too!

PS: Before the fanboys pounce, I do like the iPad and will probably eventually get one in revision B or C when some of above things are fixed, but it's just amazing how Apple manages to so quickly dispense with reality even in financial statements!
I can't think of too many other companies that have groupies show up at their Financial Reports! LOL
It really is unbelievable that that question went unchallenged when it's answered in such a patently false manner.

PPS: If you quote more than 10 people in a thread here & take them to task, guess what?
You have WAAAAAAAY too much time on your hands! LOL
 
Don't worry my friend I'm sure a Mac Pro update is in the "pipeline" as we speak. On topic, this is wonderful news for Apple…I hope we get an equivalent to Adobe's Photoshop as one of those new products that Steve was referring to.

This is extremely unlikely. I believe that Apeture came out at a time when Apple was unsure as to which direction to take the business. The investment was simply to cover their bases.

Given their focus on the consumer market (with perhaps the exception of wanting to make the iPhone a corporate standard), we are likely to only see updates to iLife. Even iWeb is dying because it serves little purpose in a cloud based world.

People want to talk, not create.
 
"Q: Does the iPad compete with netbooks?
A: It's a no-brainer that someone would opt for the iPad over the netbook. The netbook doesn't do anything well."


Same question answered with Steve Jobs Reality Distortion Field disabled...

A netbook's WIFI works at Princeton U, unlike the iPad.

A netbook can surf the internet including Flash sites, which make up a high percentage of internet sites, unlike the iPad.

A netbook can also run 2 programs at once in multiple windows and multi-task.

A netbook has a camera and USB.

So yeah, it's a no-brainer alright. Oh, and the iPad is more expensive too!

PS: Before the fanboys pounce, I do like the iPad and will probably eventually get one in revision B or C when some of above things are fixed, but it's just amazing how Apple manages to so quickly dispense with reality even in financial statements!
I can't think of too many other companies that have groupies show up at their Financial Reports! LOL
It really is unbelievable that that question went unchallenged when it's answered in such a patently false manner.

I don't necessarily disagree with you on anything. However I do believe that SJ believes it and justifiably so: he does not imagine a user ticking off spec sheets. I would conjecture that to get to an SJ and Apple zone you have to imagine a person with a phone and a computer, but no netbook. Then you run through their daily lives again and again, noting all the little things that they do: imagine someone not sending an email because they couldn't be bothered to turn on the computer; imagine someone putting off reading a book because they don't have one; imagine another person gripped by the desire to read, but not having a book that they feel like reading and so they browse to sate that appetite and potentially buy; imagine another person laying on the couch (sofa for me) and wandering where they've seen that bloke on TV before but not bothering to look as they have to go to the PC; imagine someone having just cooked a great meal or imagining a great meal that they got in their head and want to note down; imagine someone watching a cooking programme and seeing that they need to visit yyyyyyyy.com for the recipe and so they do so and note it down; etc, etc etc.

Before long you are not imagining a person with a netbook, you are imagining someone with a pad of some kind. Perhaps you are not because you have adjusted to having a netbook, but SJ hasn't and so with no intuitive point of reference he imagines the pad and so he believes in it whole heartedly.

To moe more than the absence of Flash is the absence of the camera. For all my imaginings I see myself thinking I may just video call a friend or parents and find that I don't bother 'cos I have to pop to the computer. So I don't.

One last point, many of these gaps are closed when the user has a laptop and the justification for an iPad becomes one of experience and sensation. $600 is a lot to pay for a feeling.
 
I don't necessarily disagree with you on anything. However I do believe that SJ believes it and justifiably so: he does not imagine a user ticking off spec sheets. I would conjecture that to get to an SJ and Apple zone you have to imagine a person with a phone and a computer, but no netbook. Then you run through their daily lives again and again, noting all the little things that they do: imagine someone not sending an email because they couldn't be bothered to turn on the computer; imagine someone putting off reading a book because they don't have one; imagine another person gripped by the desire to read, but not having a book that they feel like reading and so they browse to sate that appetite and potentially buy; imagine another person laying on the couch (sofa for me) and wandering where they've seen that bloke on TV before but not bothering to look as they have to go to the PC; imagine someone having just cooked a great meal or imagining a great meal that they got in their head and want to note down; imagine someone watching a cooking programme and seeing that they need to visit yyyyyyyy.com for the recipe and so they do so and note it down; etc, etc etc.

Before long you are not imagining a person with a netbook, you are imagining someone with a pad of some kind. Perhaps you are not because you have adjusted to having a netbook, but SJ hasn't and so with no intuitive point of reference he imagines the pad and so he believes in it whole heartedly.

To moe more than the absence of Flash is the absence of the camera. For all my imaginings I see myself thinking I may just video call a friend or parents and find that I don't bother 'cos I have to pop to the computer. So I don't.

One last point, many of these gaps are closed when the user has a laptop and the justification for an iPad becomes one of experience and sensation. $600 is a lot to pay for a feeling.

I'm also not denying that the iPad is a revolutionary idea and device.

I just think comparing it to a netbook is a little silly, especially if you're talking to someone who's actually used a netbook before.

Now for someone with more limited demands looking for their first netbook, I could see that person not noticing as much the limitations that the iPad has and hence the success of the device.

Personally for me though, the iPad just does not yet replace anything I already own or add anything that I want at this time. I expect that to change in the future.

By the way, you should consider writing copy for Steve Jobs, that was a very eloquent statement.
Even I was moved and I'm a cynic! LOL
 
I HAVE read your posts and they don't make any sense. The fact that I'm not a doctor has nothing to do with it - lots of people who are doctors agree with me.

- Data entry. Oh, things like the nurse entering my BP and pulse into her iPad rather than a paper chart? Things like entering symptoms and complaint into the computer rather than onto a paper chart which will later need to be transcribed?

- Reference works. Sorry, but trying to access reference works on a screen the size of the iPhone is nowhere near as useful as doing it on a 9.7" screen. It's not the same thing at all.

- Accessing IT records. Sorry, it's not my fault that you and your IT group are incompetent. There are quite a few VPN systems for the iPad already.

- So the fact that YOU haven't been able to figure out how to use it means that it has no use in medicine?LOTS of doctors ARE finding it useful, so your claims that it has no place in medicine are just plain wrong. How do you get from "I don't see a use for it" to "There IS no use for it"? Look up narcissistic personality disorder.


Tsk tsk. I presume that since you've had to resort to ad hominem attack, you must be out of any kind of substantive argument. Your love of Apple makes you want to believe so bad that you're willing to shoot your mouth off about an area where you are simply clueless. I mean, seriously... you simply have no idea what in the world you are talking about. Your contribution to the subject is simply pointless. In fact, worse than pointless since it's an area of tech about which you simply have no knowledge, not even a vague concept.

But by all means, keep posting if it makes you feel better, exercises your love for all things Apple, and you don't mind looking stupid (more stupid). But pardon me if I don't waste my time replying to any more of your blathering.
 
Why did I sell my Apple stock in 2000 :mad:

Don't feel bad. I remember when Apple stock was like $20/share and I had a pretty good job at the time and the owner of my company introduced me to his broker and I told him that I'd like to have him advise me on some stock purchases, but that I definitely wanted to buy quite a few shares of Apple Computer stock. I was young at the time.

He told me in front of other company employees and the owner that buying Apple stock would be like pissing money down a sewer drain and they all laughed at me, so I was too embarrassed to buy any and never did. I would probably be independently wealthy today otherwise. :(
 
Don't feel bad. I remember when Apple stock was like $20/share and I had a pretty good job at the time and the owner of my company introduced me to his broker and I told him that I'd like to have him advise me on some stock purchases, but that I definitely wanted to buy quite a few shares of Apple Computer stock.

He told me in front of other company employees and the owner that buying Apple stock would be like pissing money down a sewer and they all laughed at me, so I was too embarrassed to buy any and never did. I would probably be independently wealthy today otherwise. :(

Totally know how you feel. Decided against getting into AAPL when they were $12/sh (pre split :eek: ). I finally did get some AAPL, but at a post-split price of $95.95.
 
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