I don't agree. Aesthetics are important. Here's an article that I think does a good job explaining why aesthetics are so important:
http://www.alistapart.com/articles/indefenseofeyecandy
John Grubber points out this paragraph in particular:
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Apple Researching Carbon Fiber Composite Materials for Exterior Shells
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http://www.alistapart.com/articles/indefenseofeyecandy
John Grubber points out this paragraph in particular:
Sounds like just the thing for Apple.
I know right?
I simply don't see an apple carbon fiber made product to be put in the 999$ slot (re: laptops of course).
The skin of Airbus 380 is made out of CFRC where layers of aluminum and carbon fiber are sandwiched together to obtain optimal strength, durability, weight ratio.
Way to be realistic... it's very difficult on this forum. You make a very good point about the recent overhaul. And I don't think Apple really worries about retail costs... if they do, you'd never know.
Perhaps this could mean there will be an overhaul later in the future. I would love to get a Carbon Fiber Macbook of sorts, but not until I'm ready for a new one which won't be for at least 2 more years, if not considerably longer.
CFRC = Carbon Fiber Reinforced PLASTIC
Not aluminum.
There's no point to coating carbon fiber with aluminum. It would probably end up weighing the same as (or more than) plastic by itself, so the point of using carbon fiber at all is lost.
This is great news. The first thing I think when I pick up a MacBook Air is, "Gee, this thing weighs about a quarter pound too much."
Sometimes I think Apple has people with a little too much imagination. Put a nice-looking mid-tower series on the shelves and watch them fly off. As those stupid Microsoft ads have proven, there are a lot of people dumb enough to buy 7 pound computers. Since Apple's portables are already much lighter, I don't think this will help that much.
Sometimes I think Apple has people with a little too much imagination. Put a nice-looking mid-tower series on the shelves and watch them fly off. As those stupid Microsoft ads have proven, there are a lot of people dumb enough to buy 7 pound computers. Since Apple's portables are already much lighter, I don't think this will help that much.
I thought it was the Boing 787 or Airbus 380...couldn't remember which one. It makes the plane ligher, saving on gas and also they can adjust the humidity (so people can breather better) because it's not made out of metal.
Great another patent for existing practice.
Everybody is responding like this is a fantastic new technology but it has been done on boats for years and is common in other fiber reinforced products. One of the first things to go into a mold is a gel coat.
As to scratch resistance, sorry guys but carbon fiber in these sorts of products is only a reinforcement for the binders. Since these are often epoxy or some sort of polyester they can be scratched. Not to mention that that scrim layer isn't going to be scratch resistant either.
Don't get me wrong, a well designed carbon shell or even a frame can add huge benefits with respect to weight and stiffness. So much so that I'm hoping future tablets incorporate the material. With the right selection of carbon materials it can also be an excellent heat sink.
It just boggles my mind though that Apple can get any sort of a patent on a gelcoat layer.
Dave
Everybody is responding like this is a fantastic new technology but it has been done on boats for years and is common in other fiber reinforced products. One of the first things to go into a mold is a gel coat.
As to scratch resistance, sorry guys but carbon fiber in these sorts of products is only a reinforcement for the binders. Since these are often epoxy or some sort of polyester they can be scratched. Not to mention that that scrim layer isn't going to be scratch resistant either.
Don't get me wrong, a well designed carbon shell or even a frame can add huge benefits with respect to weight and stiffness. So much so that I'm hoping future tablets incorporate the material. With the right selection of carbon materials it can also be an excellent heat sink.
It just boggles my mind though that Apple can get any sort of a patent on a gelcoat layer.
Dave
Yes Carbon fiber parts are expensive and with the glossy weave pattern that is popular with its design it gets to be very very expensive trying to get it to mold to complex shapes inside molds and cavities. I have seen some parts in which the cavities were so complex it had to be laid by hand and then the machines took over to complete the large panel sections. Imagine molds the size of a car with guys crawling around in them doing the prepeg and then the automated machines come out and finish the layup.
Basic Carbon fiber panels that are length and width but very little depth are very easy to make and sometimes can be cheaper than aluminum. Sometimes carbon fiber parts made overseas such as China can be made so cheap that's its better in the long run to use the carbon panels due to weight and durability.
The back plates of the unibody mac books would be the perfect place for a carbon fiber molded part. Thin light and could even have recesses in the layup for a little more space for batteries or ducts for cooling. The outer coating could be rubber making the whole underside a large rubber foot instead of 4 little feet.
I see this for all the notebooks because they all use that thin aluminum plate on the bottom. But think about this HOW COOL would it be for there to be an AIR IN BLACK. ACDC would be proud.
Basic Carbon fiber panels that are length and width but very little depth are very easy to make and sometimes can be cheaper than aluminum. Sometimes carbon fiber parts made overseas such as China can be made so cheap that's its better in the long run to use the carbon panels due to weight and durability.
The back plates of the unibody mac books would be the perfect place for a carbon fiber molded part. Thin light and could even have recesses in the layup for a little more space for batteries or ducts for cooling. The outer coating could be rubber making the whole underside a large rubber foot instead of 4 little feet.
I see this for all the notebooks because they all use that thin aluminum plate on the bottom. But think about this HOW COOL would it be for there to be an AIR IN BLACK. ACDC would be proud.
I am specifically talking about Glare. Follow the link and become enlightened.
As you can see there are many reasons why you use these new composite materials. No more cracked iPhone shells and lighter weight. As an added bonus you get the 'Aluminum look'.
Airbus 380 use Glare in in the fuselage, as you can see here.
"A new material, Glare, that is highly resistant to fatigue is used in the construction of the panels for the upper fuselage. The aluminium and fibreglass layers of Glare do not allow propagation of cracks, it is much lighter than conventional materials and represents a weight saving of about 500kg in the construction"
I think it sounds like a pretty good idea.
The way to achieve high strength with low weight is aluminum honeycomb sandwiched by carbon fiber. It's too thick for electronics casing, but works great for cars, aircraft and the like.
Yeah! Same here! Not that a carbon case wouldn't be nice, but all for dropping 1/4 pound from the already thin MacBook Air? What's with Apple's obsession with anorexic products?
It's almost as bad as "the ton of" iPhone Rumors some sites post! --)))
From what I can tell from the patent, it looks like Apple is at least considering gadgets made out of Aluminum-CF composites. Besides from being lighter than solid aluminum and less prone to crack compared to solid plastic, it might also not dampen WiFi signals as much as solid aluminum. So who knows...
I might be wrong but from what I have understood Glare uses the fiber orientation for added strength, not honeycombing.
See for example here.
Each metal layer is between 0.2 - 0.5 mm thick. Since it is not suppose to be used in an airplane wing you might be able to reduce that even further.
This paper in material research states that all the layers make the Glare 1.8 mm thick.
Properly implemented this would be a huge improvement in the weight to strength ratio.
As for the snipe at cosmetics. Where does cosmetics start and good engineering end?
Though painting isn't easy, they used painted CF hoods on one of the special Corvette Z06s (Le Mans edition?) and it required a very special process for a low volume model. I would also think they might have concerns on painting a product like a phone or laptop where the device is exposed to more rough treatment than a car... in the sense that it is exposed to many different surfaces... will impact against them in many ways, durability of the paint might not be that great.
Let alone the finish applied to the roof over the Corvette ZR1 which runs around $60,000 a gallon.
All this being said, given Apple does tend to run at a higher price point they are more likely to able to pull this off than a low cost competitor.
The Boeing 787 is carbon fiber, but both the 787 & A380 will be pressurized at a lower equivalent altitude to reduce the dryness of the air and make the experience more enjoyable. To my knowledge the outer skin of the aircraft does not relate to the dryness of the air.
I've been wondering why Apple never adopted Carbon fiber, at least for part of the shell or an internal stabilization piece that they could cover with thin aluminum or other material...
I know some of Sony's high-end ultraportables have used carbon fiber to minimize weight, and say what you will about having to use Windows, Sony's high-end ultraportables are some of the best looking PC laptops I've ever seen. I'm not a Sony spokesperson, I just come from the PC side so I like to geek out over specs no Macbook will have. ;(
check out these insane specs for the Sony TT:
11.1", 1366x768 LED-backlit display
1.6Ghz Core 2 Duo
4GB DDR3
Intel X4500HD iGPU
storage options :
FireWire
HDMI out
GigE
802.11N
3G broadband
2.78lbs
10.99"(W) x 0.93"(H) x 7.87"(D)
I know some of Sony's high-end ultraportables have used carbon fiber to minimize weight, and say what you will about having to use Windows, Sony's high-end ultraportables are some of the best looking PC laptops I've ever seen. I'm not a Sony spokesperson, I just come from the PC side so I like to geek out over specs no Macbook will have. ;(
check out these insane specs for the Sony TT:
11.1", 1366x768 LED-backlit display
1.6Ghz Core 2 Duo
4GB DDR3
Intel X4500HD iGPU
storage options :
- Single 128GB SSD + 320GB HDD
- Dual 64GB SSD in RAID0 + 320GB HDD
- Dual 128GB SSD
FireWire
HDMI out
GigE
802.11N
3G broadband
2.78lbs
10.99"(W) x 0.93"(H) x 7.87"(D)
For those of us who carry a notebook computer EVERYWHERE, shaving 4oz off a computer is nothing to sneeze at. I'm wearing out my second Sony VAIO ultraportable (10" screen) and looking for a replacement which MUST be under 3 pounds (any more and I stop carrying it) yet have maxed-out (for the weight) capabilities. The only thing currently giving me pause in buying an Air (cash aside) is that tiny VAIOs still kick butt on size/weight.
Cutting weight by nearly 10% is very desirable.