Apple Responds to Questions About Location Tracking and Privacy

[Earendil]

It is interesting how many people volunteer personal information to people they don't know. It's the Gowalla/FourSquare/Twiter world of full disclosure with people you don't know.

Volunteering information to people I don't know is how I let them get to know me. Out of curiosity, how do you let people get to know you?

I watched a girl in line at the grocery store chat up another girl and (she) asked what city she was originally from, what college she went to, how old she was, and in kind, told her full name, what bars she likes to attend on what days, and what time she got off of work and where she was going tonight (a party and address).

So a principle that has been around since humans have been communicating still applies: Be discerning what information you share with who. The volunteering of information is hardly a bad thing. And just because there is a chance that the action could have a negative outcome should not prevent one from taking the action. Crossing the street has a chance of a bad outcome, and some people are paranoid about doing it, and thus don't. Sharing information is just like crossing the street, there are quantities locations and frequency that will increase you chance of getting hurt in both events. Neither one should be avoided entirely.

While this is innocent stuff (sounded like they wanted to date), it doesn't take James Patterson/Dean Koontz/Steig Larsson to write up how this could go bad for someone.

It also doesn't take a genius to follow you through your daily actions and list all the ways in which you choices could turn out terrible. But thank God we aren't limited to only choosing things that are guaranteed to have a perfect outcome!

 

[SaaGua]

Neat factoid:
Most of those club cards use the same type of bar code, so if you sign up for more than one, you can use the card from a different store when you shop. You get the discounts, but they don't have the slightest idea who is actually buying the stuff associated with that card number.

Really? Cool, You have peaked my curiosity. I gotta go try it now.

Cashier: Sir, this isn't our store card.
Me: Can you please try scanning it?
Cashier: No!

 

[ten-oak-druid]

Exactly my point...this has been going on for ages. The fact is, if you are not COMPLETELY off the grid, you are on the grid, period. To think otherwise is delutional.

To not be concerned about privacy and the Bill of Rights is un-American.

Don't bother throwing the word "freedom" around if you don't get that.

 

[gtsipad]

To not be concerned about privacy and the Bill of Rights is un-American.

Don't bother throwing the word "freedom" around if you don't get that.

Talk about a wasted reply...i never mentioned anything about freedom, and this has absolutely nothing to do with the bill of rights. Way to spread your FUD. And i am expressing my opinion, which, by the way, is very american.
Next

 

[ten-oak-druid]

Talk about a wasted reply...i never mentioned anything about freedom, and this has absolutely nothing to do with the bill of rights. Way to spread your FUD. And i am expressing my opinion, which, by the way, is very american.
Next

To not be concerned about privacy and the Bill of Rights is un-american. People who waive flags, speak about freedom and get emotional about the pledge of allegiance do not get a free pass on that. This is a general statement. Don't take it so personally. It's not directed at you. That is unless you reflected on it and it bothered you a bit.

Next.

 

[gtsipad]

To not be concerned about privacy and the Bill of Rights is un-american. People who waive flags, speak about freedom and get emotional about the pledge of allegiance do not get a free pass on that. This is a general statement. Don't take it so personally. It's not directed at you. That is unless you reflected on it and it bothered you a bit.

Next.

You directly quoted me...if u wanted it to be general u should not hv quoted me. Just saying. And again...what on earth does this hv to do with the bill of rights? Please, explain that. And u r the one quoting freedom and the bill of rights...time to put the mirror down.

 

[ten-oak-druid]

You directly quoted me...if u wanted it to be general u should not hv quoted me. Just saying. And again...what on earth does this hv to do with the bill of rights? Please, explain that. And u r the one quoting freedom and the bill of rights...time to put the mirror down.

You made it sound like we are all on the "grid" so its no big deal.

Well privacy is a big deal. And we have a right to know what data is being collected about us, by whom and who is using it. I don't know if you specifically are a flag-waiver who doesn't understand the true benefits of our constitution or not. But your dismissal of the issue is flat out wrong. And I'm sure there are many who agree with your statement who are clueless flag-waivers.

Next.

 

[sndcj1]

Really? Cool, You have peaked my curiosity. I gotta go try it now.

Cashier: Sir, this isn't our store card.
Me: Can you please try scanning it?
Cashier: No!

Ahh, but thats why you use the self checkout. No weird looks. I do know that Jewel and Dominics use the same key, and the cards are interchangeable. Course the downside is the targeted marketing that they try to do for you goes out the window, so no more coupons for stuff you actually buy...

 

[gtsipad]

You made it sound like we are all on the "grid" so its no big deal.

Well privacy is a big deal. And we have a right to know what data is being collected about us, by whom and who is using it. I don't know if you specifically are a flag-waiver who doesn't understand the true benefits of our constitution or not. But your dismissal of the issue is flat out wrong. And I'm sure there are many who agree with your statement who are clueless flag-waivers.

Next.

Read my text again. I wrote nothing about "all of us being" on the grid. What I wrote implies that the grid is everywhere in our lives. Here it is again: If you are not COMPLETELY off the grid, then you are on the grid. Where in that sentence does it even come close to implying that "we are all on the grid"?

And once again you ignore explaining any link to the bill of rights or freedom in general. Freedom does not imply privacy at all. And by the way, the bill of rights applies to governing, it has NOTHING to do with commerce.

And what issue did I dismiss? "True benefits of our constitution?" Please enlighten me, oh wise constitutional scholar. Oh, by the by, this is a forum on the internet (you know that the thing with all the tubes that connects across the oceans and stuff?). You may want to think outside the US borders once in a while. Oh but then again, that may be un-american too.

You know what? Forget it, don't bother. I'm done with this thread. My head hurts from banging it against the wall trying to converse with you.

Peace be with you.

 

[dampfdruck]

This is the most serious privacy violation of any company I have heard of so far. Someone at apple should go to jail for that.

Recording and storing the geo positions of all users all the time. UNBELIEVABLE.

 

[Earendil]

This is the most serious privacy violation of any company I have heard of so far. Someone at apple should go to jail for that.

Recording and storing the geo positions of all users all the time. UNBELIEVABLE.

So did you fail to comprehend what you were reading, or fail to read it at all?
Apple has no clue where you, as an indavidual, is located, nor do they care. What they do track is where a device is and the reception it's getting. In no way is that tied back to you. I do find it amusing that you think apple cares where you are, as if you are somehow important to them in a capacity beyond a customer.

AT&T on the other hand know aproximately where you as an indavidual any time your phone is on. In fact every time you interact with an electronic system location information is recorded. If you want to minimise that that, only turn on you phone when making calls. Otherwise this is like expecting your mail man to hand deliver your mail to you, and then getting mad when he knows where you are!

 

[dampfdruck]

So did you fail to comprehend what you were reading, or fail to read it at all?

No and No

Apple has no clue where you, as an indavidual, is located, nor do they care. What they do track is where a device is and the reception it's getting. In no way is that tied back to you.

They know. The device is linked to a user. Whether they care or not is speculation and irrelevant.

AT&T on the other hand know aproximately where you as an indavidual any time your phone is on. In fact every time you interact with an electronic system location information is recorded.

No, it's not recorded. There are laws against that. Your service provider does not track you and does not store your location. Apple does.

 

[JordanNZ]

No and No



They know. The device is linked to a user. Whether they care or not is speculation and irrelevant.



No, it's not recorded. There are laws against that. Your service provider does not track you and does not store your location. Apple does.

Did you READ it?!

 

[Earendil]

No and No

They know. The device is linked to a user. Whether they care or not is speculation and irrelevant.

No, they explicitly state that they DON'T know. Now if you choose to ignore that part of the document, than you might as well call into question the entire thing. At that point, why even bother coming here and discussing it, if you choose not to believe the truthfulness of the document? It should hold exactly zero relevance to you at that point.

No, it's not recorded. There are laws against that. Your service provider does not track you and does not store your location. Apple does.

You couldn't be more wrong. Apple does not track where you are, and only has the information available IF you have iPhone tracking turned on through MobileMe. If the FBI wants to know where you are, they do not go to Apple, they go to AT&T.
See Here and again Here. There was even a big stink last year about Verizon having a website specifically for law enforcement to look up locations of cell phones, which was incidentally being abused I believe.

As for other electronic means storing your location, that happens to be incidental. When you buy something with a CC you location is known because you are dropping your name and time stamp at a physical location. If you withdraw/deposit money with a bank, the exact same thing is happening. Mobile phones are only more complicated because they are Mobile. Most other electronic systems are tied to a physical location, so your location is known and recorded every time you interact with that system.

 

[namdnalsiroj]

We are moving towards a society where our personal information is an asset, and a form of currency.
Apart from the privacy aspects, it bothers me that all kinds of information is just taken, without fair compensation.