Apple Restricting Use of NFC Antenna in iPhone 6 and 6 Plus to Apple Pay

[kas23]

hmmm...now I star to think having Apple Pay as my backup payment method can be useful at some point. Although I have never left my wallet in the car, if it's not in my pocket, it would be at home, which is way worse.

God knows how long it will take for Apple to get the service going in Australia. I probably won't need to worry about it till next year.

Me too. I'll admit, it was a rare event for me to leave my wallet sitting on the passenger seat of my car, but I have left my wallet at home a countless number of times. That's why I love the Starbucks screen scanner. If I have my phone (always), I'll never go without a cup of coffee.

 

[pmau]

Yes but the thing is that as far as I know banks individually negotiate fees with card processor so card processor would't be able to fix a one fee to give away to apple. Thus system would be far to complicated - they have to talk with banks

I would think Apple has fancy charts and diagrams to show that their # of transactions will skyrocket

I know these kinds of presentations .... 4 million new customers in 1 week

 

[nfl46]

Good! Smart move for security reasons. I, for one, won't be using the jailbreak tweak (if there will be one) to not make it restricted anymore. I sure as heck don't want my credit card information stolen on a jailbroken device.

 

[Glassed Silver]

Disappointing. I hope they open it by iOS 9 or earlier. There are a lot of great uses for this beyond payments.

http://trendblog.net/creative-and-useful-ways-to-use-nfc-tags-with-your-smartphone/

True, there's a lot.
Me personally I'd use them to tag boxes or special items in the attic to find them using proximity sensing.
Sometimes that one box you need isn't where you begin to look for it and you waste time doing what we all "love": Spending time in the dusty, dirty attic, moving around heavy boxes that are stacked on each other, ... Eugh...

Glassed Silver:mac

 

[doelcm82]

How is it anyway more secure? It works identical to how it does on my BlackBerry. And I imagine it works exactly the same on Android too. And to top it off, all of the storage on my BlackBerry is encrypted. If someone stole my phone they would have to work out my device password then my BlackBerry account password, all before I got round to disabling the device remotely.

I think my security is just fine.

With Apple's system, no one can look over your shoulder and watch as you enter your security code as you prepare to make a payment. The more payments you make, the greater the risk of someone seeing you enter that code. When I say "you" I mean the average user who doesn't check for security cameras or anyone wearing Google Glass before hunching over and covertly entering that code.

Apple's system is more secure. With your head held high and in full view of everyone, you simply place your finger on the touch ID sensor. No codes to enter, so no risk that someone can see your code. A one-time-only token gets generated and sent via NFC to the vendor, who is happy not to have your credit card information in their system where it might be hacked. The vendor uses that token to get paid by your credit or debit card's financial institution.

 

[samcraig]

facetime does not equal hardware.
any app can use the camera and microphone.

You've missed my point. Others have argued that Apple opens up that which it locks down. My point was that - it's not always the case. EVEN when they state that they will.

The Facetime protocol should have long been made available to 3rd parties.

NFC may or may NOT be opened up to 3rd parties in the future.

But I agree with what another poster said - it's very clear that this move by Apple is to ensure their Apple Pay (or as I like to call it Pay Apple) is successful or at least given exclusivity. It protects them on two levels. The first - at the basic level - if another app can't use NFC, then they don't compete with Apple Pay. Further - they don't have to worry about accepting/rejecting apps based on NFC. Once they do open it up (if they do) then they play that game of accepting/rejecting and dealing with any PR about it.

 

[lazyrighteye]

Oh yeah and card payment processor will be so happy to share his cut with Apple... for what? more transactions? more trendy...?

Less fraud. Duh.

 

[GRSM-IE]

I would think Apple has fancy charts and diagrams to show that their # of transactions will skyrocket

I know these kinds of presentations .... 4 million new customers in 1 week

I bet they do have a chart like this

I really don't see any reason for banks in EU to queue for Apple Pay - they tested NFC mobile/phone payments and it's not a pot of gold in NFC CC EU. It's interesting but except some additional convenience (minus battery) there's nothing really new/interesting.

If they decide however to implement it, it would be definitely a Premium Service for additional fee.

 

[samcraig]

Good! Smart move for security reasons. I, for one, won't be using the jailbreak tweak (if there will be one) to not make it restricted anymore. I sure as heck don't want my credit card information stolen on a jailbroken device.

NFC can be used for more things than payments

 

[GRSM-IE]

Less fraud. Duh.

Would you elaborate? What specific freud you're talking about? What's the scale of the freud in EU?

 

[GoCubsGo]

I think initial restriction is good. They opened up TouchID, right? So give it time.

 

[jinnj]

They are locking it down to make sure ApplePay is successful first. They wouldn't want someone else building a better platform on their hardware before they first get their system rolled out.

Not really. They don't mind getting there last as long as they come in first. This is more of a security issue. Same with Bluetooth and TouchID. The proposed APIs are used internally by the Apple devs to make sure they allow as much flexibility as possible without providing an open door to the rest of the phone. The Android "I got here first!" crowd got a taste of this with NFC when a hacker at a conference was able to stand next to an android phone and access all of the data on the phone. This was eventually patched but given the adoption rate of updates you can be sure there are still a few units out there with this flaw.

 

[nfl46]

NFC can be used for more things than payments

That is true, but I'm good. You can do as you please. I'll jailbreak for other reasons, but NFC won't be one of them. Heck, I never used NFC on my Android devices. But to each its own.

 

[Bare]

Apple's effort is half assed and US only.

Meanwhile the rest of the world will be progressing apace with contactless cards, and Apple will be left behind. Third parties might have been able to fill the gap, but instead this is iTunes Radio and Apple TV all over again - a parochial solution by a company blinded in it's US centricity, missing the boat.

Nice try at Apple and US bashing, but the US has had "contactless payments" for a long time, too. I don't even know how many years ago it was at this point -- at least four or five -- that I received a replacement credit card with this sideways wifi (NFC) symbol on it. You can hold that card up against card readers all over the US and make payments. That's what Apple Pay will be using, and it's pretty widespread.

I'm with the people that think, at least for now, this is a good thing. Get Apple Pay working and then open up the NFC API.

 

[roadbloc]

With Apple's system, no one can look over your shoulder and watch as you enter your security code as you prepare to make a payment. The more payments you make, the greater the risk of someone seeing you enter that code. When I say "you" I mean the average user who doesn't check for security cameras or anyone wearing Google Glass before hunching over and covertly entering that code.

Apple's system is more secure. With your head held high and in full view of everyone, you simply place your finger on the touch ID sensor. No codes to enter, so no risk that someone can see your code. A one-time-only token gets generated and sent via NFC to the vendor, who is happy not to have your credit card information in their system where it might be hacked. The vendor uses that token to get paid by your credit or debit card's financial institution.

Touch-ID is just a password replacement. As far as I'm concerned it makes things less secure. It is easier for a thief to force/trick you to unlocking your phone with a thumbprint. And if they were really desperate they'd just take your finger from you.

With friends like mine, Touch-ID is very insecure. They'd just wait until I fell asleep and then unlock my phone. All my messages, contacts and money available for them super easy.

Touch-ID changes nothing. It is just an alternative to a password, which are often much more secure.

 

[Glassed Silver]

It's just starting to get a lot more common in the UK these last six months or so - if you've got a chip and pin card most supermarkets, pubs, shops are starting to have NFC on the card reader for transactions under £20, just touch the card on the reader and you're done. No pin needed, really easy. I see Apple Pay as an extension of that but who knows if it will ever make it to the UK.

It's like the HD calls and Cellular call transitioning to WiFi features, all pointless unless you're on the EE network in the UK. I think a lot of Apple users outside the US are massively short-changed on features that should be offered by all major networks. That's another reason this keynote was a big disappointment - all the "wow" features aren't available to many iPhone users and in many cases probably never will be, at least until the iPhone 7 or later.

I'm beginning to think the high prices for Apple hardware are a bit of a con (as many think they are anyway) for those outside the US as we seem to be just subsidising all the features we can't get for the US customers.

I'd really love for websites like Macrumors to highlight this and put pressure on Apple, as they seem to be picking up critique a lot more these days, I'd hope they would lose their strong US-first approach or at least losen it.
Yes I get it's easier to negotiate with those partners that "live around the corner" (in the same country) or to have a kind of soft-launch, but every non-US Apple users knows that once you don't even get some dates for your country, or some initial support right away you really feel left out by the company as a whole.
Yes, those features will end up being useful over here in Germany in probably two years time, give or take. By then however we all know too damn well that there will be the next features you'll be waiting for, it's an eternal waiting game, all the time and the features that make US-customers happy are the ones that make you specifically frustrated not necessarily over technological progress, but the companies missing the beat that hey, this could easily boost their business!

At least the multi-national companies could shift a gear up once in a while.

Glassed Silver:mac

 

[HowEver]

Your slip is showing.

Would you elaborate? What specific freud you're talking about? What's the scale of the freud in EU?

 

[satcomer]

I am starting to think Apple did this because the terms they have with banks. If you really think about the terms Apple had to jump through and third party people could invalid those terms.

 

[cmChimera]

Just like they did with Bluetooth too right?

Is bluetooth closed?

 

[ob81]

They have way too much heat these days about security. A 1st year Information Security major would be smart enough to recommend them not opening it up at this point.

 

[lazyrighteye]

Would you elaborate? What specific freud you're talking about? What's the scale of the freud in EU?

Oops. Missed we were talking EU fraud. I was just acknowledging overall plastic fraud would drop and that is exactly how Apple was able to negotiate with the major card companies.

But since you asked...
http://www.theukcardsassociation.org.uk/plastic_fraud_figures/index.asp

 

[GRSM-IE]

Your slip is showing.

And?

 

[GoCubsGo]

Less fraud. Duh.

Would you elaborate? What specific freud you're talking about? What's the scale of the freud in EU?

Well, it's fraud…but there is fraud in the EU. In fact, I am certain I can provide information supporting my theory. These things are usually published for the public.

My assumption is that lazyrighteye believes that fraud can be reduced because there is no card for someone to walk off with, card skimmers can't be used, thieves tampering with the internal swipe mechanism in an effort to copy data as a card is swiped, cards equipped with RFID can be intercepted by someone nearby who is gathering the data as you "tap" the card on a device to pay and so forth.

If you take the card out of the equation then you can reduce fraud. However, just as anyone has seen throughout the years, technology moves forward and so do thieves. If Apple Pay is live then you can be the unscrupulous will look for a way to breach the walls. Until then, can you say fraud will be or can be reduced? I suppose so.

Nice try at Apple and US bashing, but the US has had "contactless payments" for a long time, too. I don't even know how many years ago it was at this point -- at least four or five -- that I received a replacement credit card with this sideways wifi (NFC) symbol on it. You can hold that card up against card readers all over the US and make payments. That's what Apple Pay will be using, and it's pretty widespread.

I'm with the people that think, at least for now, this is a good thing. Get Apple Pay working and then open up the NFC API.

Once you open up payments via radio, you open up a world of electronic pickpocketing. It happens now with RFID enabled cards as you're referring to.

 

[ptb42]

Simply? LOL

Compared to the alternatives, it's a LOT simpler. Apple doesn't have to negotiate with individual merchants. And they don't have to deal with the different transaction processors.

And, it makes it much easier for the consumer to determine if pay will work in a particular instance. A merchant has the NFC icon on the terminal: will pay work? It's determined by the bank's logo on the card.... not the merchant, or the transaction processor.

In the US, the banks supporting pay are making a big deal about it. My bank has the announcement on their home page. Others have reported seeing banners in the bank offices. A couple of banks quickly scrambled to announce they are working with Apple to implement it soon. US banks see pay as a differentiator between them and a competitor bank. And they don't want to lose existing or potential customers to another bank because they don't support pay.

I'll ask European members: are there a handful of major banks or credit card issuers that are available to nearly all European Union residents? If so, those will likely be the first to support pay. I'd wager that Apple is already talking to them: the only question is who called who first.

 

[lazyrighteye]

Yep. That was my gist.
In the end, you can't have good sans evil. There will always be fraud. It just appears Apple is taking a nice step towards a more secure electronic financial transaction. And I'm ok with that.