Apple Revises Snow Leopard Security Update and Pulls 10.7.3 Delta Update

[notMordecai]

The problem with this whole debacle is that, yes sometimes this can happen with any release, but that fact is:

1) This is Apple
2) This is a major release
3) It's one hell of broken release

I work for an insurance and banking company as a software developer and you cannot imagine how many times we check our stuff before a release. I am not sure on Apple's release schedule but our's is monthly. If I recall correctly, Facebook has weekly releases.

I am sure Apple is doing everything they can in regards to damage control. Although they are essentially cleaning up the damage from a 1 ton bomb.

 

[rmwebs]

I can tell that no none commenting has ever worked with software development.

Mistakes happen, its impossible to test for every single system. Its not like every person has these issues, its a select few. You can test all day in the lab but until something is released in the wild the developers will NEVER be able to know if more bugs are present in their code or not.

As a software developer I do agree with you for the most part, but Apple took 24 hours to simply pull the update. Given that we knew about 30 minutes after the update was released that it was majorly flawed, its pretty poor that it took them that long to pull it.

 

[marcusj0015]

At what point does Apple decide to stop ****ing around, and get their software back on track?

 

[chrono1081]

As a software developer I do agree with you for the most part, but Apple took 24 hours to simply pull the update. Given that we knew about 30 minutes after the update was released that it was majorly flawed, its pretty poor that it took them that long to pull it.

But you can't pull a software release because a handful of people have a few problems. As time went on they saw more and more people having a problem and then pulled it.

Not to mention the turn around time for the fix was fantastic. There are other companies *cough* Autodesk *cough* that can take months to update and patch software.

 

[linuxcooldude]

If you have one person who does something specifically and regularly, they are less likely to screw it up verses someone who jumps around doing a bunch of different things... its just common sense. Its where the whole division of labor idea also comes in.

I see what you are saying and in some situations I would agree, but:

By doing same job, over time, you would get quite good at it. But on the flip side by programming on the different areas of the operating system you could see how your programming would interact with other software. That could actually improve with what your doing now. In my area of expertise its called cross training which does have some obvious benefits.

 

[jameslmoser]

I see what you are saying and in some situations I would agree, but:

By doing same job, over time, you would get quite good at it. But on the flip side by programming on the different areas of the operating system you could see how your programming would interact with other software. That could actually improve with what your doing now. In my area of expertise its called cross training which does have some obvious benefits.

These are not different areas of the Operating system, these are completely different projects... from iOS to iCloud to Mac OS X to iTunes?

Having a working knowledge of the things your code interact with is good yes, it doesn't mean you have to be the one that creates the stuff your code interacts with in order to understand how it works or what it needs.

 

[HiRez]

I'm being offered the 10.7.3 Combo Update directly though Software Update now. Shouldn't need to download is separately.

 

[linuxcooldude]

But you can't pull a software release because a handful of people have a few problems. As time went on they saw more and more people having a problem and then pulled it.

Not to mention the turn around time for the fix was fantastic. There are other companies *cough* Autodesk *cough* that can take months to update and patch software.

Actually 24 hours is a very good response time. And it does take time to see how many people it affects. If it effects very few, then probably more of a priority to fix bigger problems for the majority of people.

I'm being offered the 10.7.3 Combo Update directly though Software Update now. Shouldn't need to download is separately.

Aw, thats cool, I didn't think of doing that.

 

[arcite]

As time passes, I am getting an impression that developers at Apple are under *immense* pressure. This leads to quite evident bugs like this.

Never EVER use a system update on first day of release, give it a week or two, then PLUDGE. Much safer that way. System updates are quite complex. Always backup mission critical work --- hell back it up in duplicate.

 

[Stridder44]

While I know the vast majority of the time it's unnecessary, it's events like this that make me happy I always use the combo updater.

I too used to be on the bandwagon of, "why bother with the combo update? It's way bigger and is the same as the normal, smaller software update." And then one day a long while back an OS X update comes out and everyone begins having issues, but only the people that didn't use the combo updater. I've seen this happen only a couple of times in the past, but that's enough times for me to realize that waiting a few extra minutes to download the somewhat larger combo updater is worth the hassle, if nothing else as a preventative measure to avoid headache issues like these.

It's also a safe bet, I've found over the years, to wait a few days after Apple releases an OS update (whether it be iOS or OS X), if nothing else just to be on the safe side.

 

[nepalisherpa]

I'm glad I did the combo update!

 

[jameslmoser]

Never EVER use a system update on first day of release, give it a week or two, then PLUDGE. Much safer that way. System updates are quite complex. Always backup mission critical work --- hell back it up in duplicate.

If NO ONE used it when it was released, waiting a week or to isn't going to matter.

A release should mean its ready to be used by anyone... if it wasn't ready then it should not have been released. They could have had a public beta release and then then this bug was found, not a big deal... its beta. But heaven forbid apple let its customers know whats going on before hand. Its not like these updates add any super secret features they don't want anyone to know about beforehand.

Also, the update for Snow Leopard was a security update.... I woulnd't wait two weeks before updating something to do with security... would you want your Antivirus/Antimalware software to be two weeks out of date?

 

[antoniofonseca]

Professionalize the software development processes

It seems clear to me that Apple needs to invest more in quality controls and processes for developing their software.

 

[neiltc13]

Of course software releases will have occasional bugs. However, the bugs with this update are so common and so obvious that it is unlikely they did not show up in internal testing.

Also, Apple has had a very good track record for releasing reliable updates that have few bugs. What I and many others have noticed is that in recent months the releases have not matched this quality. Something must have changed at Apple - either internal pressures, different staff, or as I suspect, the more experienced programmers and testers have been moved to the more profitable iOS projects.

It is sad to see Apple going this way and if it continues I am sure I will not be the only one who resorts to not buying their PCs.

 

[Eraserhead]

In all my years, I have never seen a situation where a release of software has never had any sort of bugs. You can test and test but at some point you need to decide to release the software.

+1

Microsoft would be completely trashed for this... and the funny thing is they don't get to pick all the hardware that their OS runs on. Apple pretty much does.

I would imagine this issue is probably down to third-party hardware. You can use non-Apple products in Macs.

But you can't pull a software release because a handful of people have a few problems.

Quite.

Of course software releases will have occasional bugs. However, the bugs with this update are so common and so obvious that it is unlikely they did not show up in internal testing.

If the bug is serious enough that the release needs to be pulled then I think its basically guaranteed it didn't show up in internal testing.

With the profits apple is making there is no excuse for this.

10 women can't make a baby in a month.

 

[Skoopman]

Since they pulled 10.7.3 I decided to install Lion again, thankfully it downloaded 10.7.2. I did this because .3 somehow slowed down the start of some of my apps, especially iA Writer. Thanks for pulling the update, Apple.

 

[kas23]

Anyone who doesn't download the combo updates is asking for trouble. I've never downloaded a delta update in years.

And as for people are saying "developing's hard", Apple is one of the largest and most profitable corporations on this planet. They are professions. If a doctor or pilot screws up, do they say "sorry, it's hard being a doctor (or pilot)". And if you think software development shouldn't be compared to saving lives, then you're just giving them an excuse to be lazy. My point being, a professional should act professional.

Perhaps if Apple spent the money on R&D their competitors spend, perhaps this wouldn't happen. If not, then they should re-evaluate the effectiveness of their beta community. Seems like most are on board to get the latest builds rather than to squash bugs.

 

[manu chao]

Of course software releases will have occasional bugs. However, the bugs with this update are so common and so obvious that it is unlikely they did not show up in internal testing.

So, you really suggest that they knew about the bugs and shipped it anyway hoping people would not complain instead of rectifying the bugs which only took 24 hours for Snow Leopard issue and took only a switch to serve the combo instead of the delta for the Lion issue?

I would rather question your ability to judge what is likely and what is unlikely.

 

[Eraserhead]

If a doctor or pilot screws up, do they say "sorry, it's hard being a doctor (or pilot)".

Actually, unless they've been grossly incompetent - yes you do. People make mistakes.

 

[manu chao]

Anyone who doesn't download the combo updates is asking for trouble. I've never downloaded a delta update in years.

Applying the combo update is de facto a partial OS re-install, you re-install all the files and components that were changed in the intervening updates. You might as well periodically re-install the whole OS, that should rectify any files having been corrupted or misplaced by any mishaps (be they hardware or user or other mishaps).

 

[linuxcooldude]

If a doctor or pilot screws up, do they say "sorry, it's hard being a doctor (or pilot)"

They call it malpractice insurance.

Anyone who doesn't download the combo updates is asking for trouble. I've never downloaded a delta update in years.

Been asking for trouble for 3+ plus years, unfortunately they have not complied.

 

[arnistotle2000]

wish I had done the combo update instead of the delta. I updated 2 MBPs the day it came out, one mid-2009 and one mid-2010. 2010 took the delta update with no problems. unfortunately, the 2009 managed to completely **** the bed along with corrupt all my time machine backups. So...thanks apple for losing me years of work and media!

 

[sfern]

For all of those developers out there... This update was being seeded via the developer program months ago. Why didn't you pick up on the bug and report it?

More people than just Apple developers were testing this update.

Some problems you can't simply throw money at to fix. Ever had a power outage? Why are we not up in arms at the power company every time there is a power outage, rallying to have more money spent on every power line, transformer and plant? Are the workers incompetent? No.

Mistakes, problems and issues happen. It's how we respond to it that matters. The problem is fixed now, and I'm sure some poor soul(s) that made the mistake will feel the consequences.

If you expect nothing to ever go wrong in your life, I'm sorry but your in for a shock.

 

[IzzyJG99]

Some problems you can't simply throw money at to fix. Ever had a power outage?

Actually when my power company has an outage if it last longer than one hour they deduct the time you are without power from the following month's bill. It's their way of saying "Sorry." Apple should at least release some information on these vast amount of problems with Lion to reassure their public.

Tragically Apple is no longer a tech company, but a consumer company. One without much quality control it seems...

 

[jameslmoser]

Tragically Apple is no longer a tech company, but a consumer company. One without much quality control it seems...

Isn't that the truth. I loved being able to finally use a rock solid unix os with commercial support. Those days are now gone.