Apple Stops Signing iOS 16 and iOS 16.0.1, Downgrading From iOS 16.0.2 No Longer Possible

[FeliApple]

Funny choice of words here: “Apple routinely stops signing older versions of software updates after new releases come out in order to encourage customers to keep their operating systems up to date”.

I’d say: “In order to force customers to keep their operating systems up to date if they have any issues which require restoring, or if Apple has a bug in their own activation servers which forcibly deactivate devices, rendering the user helpless and irreversibly shattering battery life and performance in the process”. Yes, I think that would be the accurate way to say it.

 

[russell_314]

The day will soon come that Apple is forced to stop these customer unfriendly signing practices, it's part of EU's RightToRepair bill.

Yes, I can see that. Forcing those poor customers to have security updates on their phones so they don’t become victims of cyber crime. I bet the association of black hat hackers is lobbying for this heavily. 😂

Even Microsoft forces updates on windows but I guess you can get around it more on a PC by going offline or doing some hack. I don’t think that’s part of right to repair.

 

[SactoGuy18]

Now you wonder if iOS 16.0.3 is coming very soon BEFORE iOS 16.1 arrives later in October.

 

[calstanford]

I always find this tidbit of news weird. It's after the fact. So what am I supposed to do now anyway?

 

[IIGS User]

If you're complaining about Apple no longer signing old versions of their software, you're in the wrong room. The Android party is down the hall.

I'm fine with this. This is how Apple keeps their platform secure. Once a security issue is fixed for a new version of the OS, it becomes increasingly difficult to maintain security.

A flaw or bug that was fixed in one release won't necessarily be secure in future releases. EVERY code change brings unexpected results, flaws, bugs, and changes.

Just because something was fixed once doesn't mean that a subsequent code change won't bring about the same flaw, or another flaw. You can't just assume the flaw is forever fixed.

I mean, you missed it the first time.

This is a good thing. People should stop kvetching.

 

[FeliApple]

If you're complaining about Apple no longer signing old versions of their software, you're in the wrong room. The Android party is down the hall.

I'm fine with this. This is how Apple keeps their platform secure. Once a security issue is fixed for a new version of the OS, it becomes increasingly difficult to maintain security.

A flaw or bug that was fixed in one release won't necessarily be secure in future releases. EVERY code change brings unexpected results, flaws, bugs, and changes.

Just because something was fixed once doesn't mean that a subsequent code change won't bring about the same flaw, or another flaw. You can't just assume the flaw is forever fixed.

I mean, you missed it the first time.

This is a good thing. People should stop kvetching.

Fine, so when battery life is obliterated just buy a new device and throw the previous one away, right?

 

[IIGS User]

Fine, so when battery life is obliterated just buy a new device and throw the previous one away, right?

Who said THAT?

I never said that. YOU said that.

 

[zilchfox]

How do you downgrade to IOS 15 if its not signed anymore via Mac or PC ?

iOS 15.7 is still signed.

 

[russell_314]

Fine, so when battery life is obliterated just buy a new device and throw the previous one away, right?

Battery life is always obliterated when you do an update. It has nothing to do with the new version but rather the actual update process. Every time Apple comes out with an update I see multiple posts asking about this.

You wait a week or so and then your battery life will go back to normal. If it doesn’t go check under battery and see what’s actually using so much battery. It could be a rogue app.

My iOS 16 my battery life was terrible so I checked under battery and saw Facebook was running in the background even with background app refresh turned off. I uninstalled it and battery life was good after that. I have since reinstalled it, so I’m going to have to see if it’s fixed with the last few Facebook app updates.

 

[FeliApple]

Who said THAT?

I never said that. YOU said that.

I said that. You said “this is because of security, it is okay for Apple to restrict downgrades because it keeps iOS secure”. If I were to voluntarily update (won’t happen, best case scenario), or if I were to be forced to update by Apple (which has happened), battery life will eventually be inevitably destroyed. The only solution is to buy a new device. Why? Because Apple doesn’t allow downgrades.

 

[FeliApple]

Battery life is always obliterated when you do an update. It has nothing to do with the new version but rather the actual update process. Every time Apple comes out with an update I see multiple posts asking about this.

You wait a week or so and then your battery life will go back to normal. If it doesn’t go check under battery and see what’s actually using so much battery. It could be a rogue app.

My iOS 16 my battery life was terrible so I checked under battery and saw Facebook was running in the background even with background app refresh turned off. I uninstalled it and battery life was good after that. I have since reinstalled it, so I’m going to have to see if it’s fixed with the last few Facebook app updates.

This argument has been rehashed into oblivion, and it is patently, demonstrably false. Update far enough, and battery life is irreversibly demolished. What you do doesn’t matter. Wait, restore, tweak settings, replace the battery, it’s all pointless. Update far enough, and battery life will never be what it was on the original version of iOS.

The first major version is generally okay, yeah, update an iPhone 6s to iOS 10 and it will be okay (in fact, I am using one! There’s no difference compared to iOS 9. I used mine on iOS 9 for three years, I know exactly how much it should last). Now, grab an iPhone 6s on iOS 15. Do whatever you want, restore, replace the battery 142 times, tweak every single setting in the entirety of iOS, and it will never match my 6s on iOS 10. At best, you can get half, and I reckon the figure is closer to 40% of what I’m getting. I have tried it...


The former applies (or will apply, eventually) to every single iOS device ever released. As long as Apple maintains this customer-harmful practice, it will happen. The only solution is, if possible, never to update. That can fail, if you have to restore, if there’s a problem, or if Apple randomly deactivates the device, like it happened to me.

This deactivation bug happened to me on my 9.7-inch iPad Pro on iOS 9. I had to update to iOS 12, otherwise it wouldn’t get past the activation screen. Battery life was reduced by 40%. This was back in 2019. Did it ever get better? No. The same thing happened to my iPhone 6s: from iOS 9 to iOS 13. It now lasts 50% of what it used to last on iOS 9/10 (remember, I have a 6s on iOS 10, I’ve compared them directly. The one on iOS 13 has far better battery health. Battery life, however, was cut in half). Is there anything I can do? Yes! What I did! I bought new devices. (An iPhone XR running iOS 12, and an iPad Air 5 running iPadOS 15).

 

[JohnyTango]

Is this newsworthy?
Common practice to stop signing old versions. Doesn't really matter of it is faster or slower this time around.

 

[redheeler]

Is this newsworthy?
Common practice to stop signing old versions. Doesn't really matter of it is faster or slower this time around.

It's only newsworthy for a minor version if it patches a jailbreak or something like that. No mention of a jailbreak in the article so MacRumors must have the new release jitters...

 

[WoodTableFromIkea]

Funny choice of words here: “Apple routinely stops signing older versions of software updates after new releases come out in order to encourage customers to keep their operating systems up to date”.

I’d say: “In order to force customers to keep their operating systems up to date if they have any issues which require restoring, or if Apple has a bug in their own activation servers which forcibly deactivate devices, rendering the user helpless and irreversibly shattering battery life and performance in the process”. Yes, I think that would be the accurate way to say it.

Ah, so now even updating the OS is "forcing" users.

Jesus Christ this forum is really something sometimes...

Fine, so when battery life is obliterated just buy a new device and throw the previous one away, right?

You clearly loathe Apple, why do you buy their products then?

This argument has been rehashed into oblivion, and it is patently, demonstrably false. Update far enough, and battery life is irreversibly demolished. What you do doesn’t matter. Wait, restore, tweak settings, replace the battery, it’s all pointless. Update far enough, and battery life will never be what it was on the original version of iOS.

The first major version is generally okay, yeah, update an iPhone 6s to iOS 10 and it will be okay (in fact, I am using one! There’s no difference compared to iOS 9. I used mine on iOS 9 for three years, I know exactly how much it should last). Now, grab an iPhone 6s on iOS 15. Do whatever you want, restore, replace the battery 142 times, tweak every single setting in the entirety of iOS, and it will never match my 6s on iOS 10. At best, you can get half, and I reckon the figure is closer to 40% of what I’m getting. I have tried it...


The former applies (or will apply, eventually) to every single iOS device ever released. As long as Apple maintains this customer-harmful practice, it will happen. The only solution is, if possible, never to update. That can fail, if you have to restore, if there’s a problem, or if Apple randomly deactivates the device, like it happened to me.

This deactivation bug happened to me on my 9.7-inch iPad Pro on iOS 9. I had to update to iOS 12, otherwise it wouldn’t get past the activation screen. Battery life was reduced by 40%. This was back in 2019. Did it ever get better? No. The same thing happened to my iPhone 6s: from iOS 9 to iOS 13. It now lasts 50% of what it used to last on iOS 9/10 (remember, I have a 6s on iOS 10, I’ve compared them directly. The one on iOS 13 has far better battery health. Battery life, however, was cut in half). Is there anything I can do? Yes! What I did! I bought new devices. (An iPhone XR running iOS 12, and an iPad Air 5 running iPadOS 15).

Lol, sure.

Well Apple is restraining themselves by continuing to sign iOS 15.7

Because there are more iPhones than the last shiny ones that still use old OS versions... Maybe?

 

[IIGS User]

The first major version is generally okay, yeah, update an iPhone 6s to iOS 10 and it will be okay (in fact, I am using one! There’s no difference compared to iOS 9. I used mine on iOS 9 for three years, I know exactly how much it should last). Now, grab an iPhone 6s on iOS 15. Do whatever you want, restore, replace the battery 142 times, tweak every single setting in the entirety of iOS, and it will never match my 6s on iOS 10. At best, you can get half, and I reckon the figure is closer to 40% of what I’m getting. I have tried it...

So let me get this straight..

You're running a phone who's design is about 7 years old. Now let's say actual device isn't 7 years old, but it's not brand spanking new either. Right there, your battery life is gonna take a hit.

So for the past 7 years, you've gotten free software updates that ensure the security of your device. Now because the software is meant to run on newer devices, you're battery life isn't as good. OK, I get that. Sort of.

EVERYTHING moves forward sooner or later. Cars stopped using leaded gasoline. In the not too distant future, a majority of cars probably won't use gasoline at all. We don't ride horses around anymore. Landlines are all but a distant memory, along with cable TV and pagers.

Things progress. You can't expect your iPhone 6 to last FOREVER. It's simply not feasible. Technology moves forward.

If you expect your iPhone 6s to run like it did when it was new over half a decade ago, while running free software that is meant to run primarily on devices made with the latest technology, then your expectations are unrealistic.

Sorry if that sounds blunt, but it's honest.

 

[FeliApple]

Ah, so now even updating the OS is "forcing" users.

Jesus Christ this forum is really something sometimes...

You clearly loathe Apple, why do you buy their products then?

Lol, sure.

Because there are more iPhones than the last shiny ones that still use old OS versions... Maybe?

What? Updating the OS isn’t forcing users, not allowing downgrades is.

I love Apple devices! (iOS devices especially). They work so well when on their original versions, for many, many, many years. Their longevity is astonishing (again, when on their original iOS versions).
Which is why it bothers me that they artificially limit their longevity by not allowing downgrades. Sooner or later they will be impacted to such a degree which makes continuous flawless usage untenable. The fact that I love Apple devices is the sole reason for which it bothers me, otherwise I wouldn’t care.

Regardless of your dismissal, what I said is true and hasn’t changed since the beginning.

 

[antiprotest]

I thought 16.1 was coming this week but I guess not.

 

[poseidondev]

This argument has been rehashed into oblivion, and it is patently, demonstrably false.

I for one would like to see those sources of yours.

Would love to see some scientific research that, somehow, tests two new iPhone 6s with 0 battery degradation comparing battery life on the iOS it came with v. two or three iOS versions down the line.

Until then I can't do anything other but consider your claims unfounded based on anecdotal evidence that more than likely doesn't take into account battery degradation and that doesn't take into account the fact that battery degradation isn't linear.

 

[FeliApple]

So let me get this straight..

You're running a phone who's design is about 7 years old. Now let's say actual device isn't 7 years old, but it's not brand spanking new either. Right there, your battery life is gonna take a hit.

So for the past 7 years, you've gotten free software updates that ensure the security of your device. Now because the software is meant to run on newer devices, you're battery life isn't as good. OK, I get that. Sort of.

EVERYTHING moves forward sooner or later. Cars stopped using leaded gasoline. In the not too distant future, a majority of cars probably won't use gasoline at all. We don't ride horses around anymore. Landlines are all but a distant memory, along with cable TV and pagers.

Things progress. You can't expect your iPhone 6 to last FOREVER. It's simply not feasible. Technology moves forward.

If you expect your iPhone 6s to run like it did when it was new over half a decade ago, while running free software that is meant to run primarily on devices made with the latest technology, then your expectations are unrealistic.

Sorry if that sounds blunt, but it's honest.

It is not blunt, it is absolutely true! The device is indeed seven years old (well, six, but it was released in 2015 so it applies anyway). I am not asking Apple to optimize iOS updates so that, for example, iOS 15 has the same battery life as iOS 9. I know that is unrealistic. I know technology improves, new functions and features are added, processor load increases, and that takes a toll on the battery. I know it is, if not impossible, extremely difficult to optimize iOS to that degree.

I am not asking for iOS 15 to work correctly. I am not asking for perfect battery life on iOS 15. I am asking Apple to let me downgrade. Can I run apps on my 6s on iOS 10? Barely! I don’t get app updates, I lose app support, and because Safari is outdated, many websites don’t run at all. And it’s okay! I’m not asking for anything different. I’ll adapt. To anything. WhatsApp drops support for iOS 10 in one month. I use it. Fine! I am not complaining. Like I said, I’ll adapt. I’m not asking anyone to cater to me. I’m not asking for websites to work on iOS 10. I’m not asking for WhatsApp to support iOS 10 forever. I’m not asking for iOS 15 to work like iOS 10. All I want is for Apple to give me the choice. I’ll cope with no apps. I’ll cope with a half-useless Safari. I’ll cope with anything. Let me make that choice.

You said: “If you expect your iPhone 6s to run like it did when it was new over half a decade ago, while running free software that is meant to run primarily on devices made with the latest technology, then your expectations are unrealistic.”
It would be unrealistic if I wanted to run new software. Like I said, I don’t want to run new software. I want to run old software. Let me deal with the consequences of that. Apple won’t let me. If I am forced to update like it happened, I can’t go back.

 

[pinkkie]

iPhones or whatever portable device should be resetable to the iOS/watchOS/whateverOS it came with from the factory just like you can downgrade macOS if you install newer one. Of course newer versions are going to be optimized primarily for the latest hardware, so why not allow people to revert?

 

[FeliApple]

I for one would like to see those sources of yours.

Would love to see some scientific research that, somehow, tests two new iPhone 6s with 0 battery degradation comparing battery life on the iOS it came with v. two or three iOS versions down the line.

Until then I can't do anything other but consider your claims unfounded based on anecdotal evidence that more than likely doesn't take into account battery degradation and that doesn't take into account the fact that battery degradation isn't linear.

Here you have a test:

Minute 4:15. iOS 10 has 50% remaining, iOS 15 has 26% remaining. This is heavy use. With light use, battery life on iOS 10 is even better.

It’s anecdotal, but I’ll say it anyway: iPhone 6s, 84% health. iOS 13.4: Using notes with 0% brightness, it dropped from 100% to 65% in 1 hour and 44 minutes.
iPhone 6s, iOS 10.0, 64% health (yes, not a typo. Original Sep 2016 battery): Exact same usage. It dropped to 65% in 2 hours and 50 minutes. This isn’t even debatable anymore. Not after this many years.

 

[frifra]

I am waiting for iPadOS 16. It doesnt make much sense to upgrade my iPhone to a (buggy) iOS 16 if I have iOS 15 running on other devices with the same Apple ID. Just complicates things.

 

[poseidondev]

Here you have a test:

Minute 4:15. iOS 10 has 50% remaining, iOS 15 has 26% remaining. This is heavy use. With light use, battery life on iOS 10 is even better.

It’s anecdotal, but I’ll say it anyway: iPhone 6s, 84% health. iOS 13.4: Using notes with 0% brightness, it dropped from 100% to 65% in 1 hour and 44 minutes.
iPhone 6s, iOS 10.0, 64% health (yes, not a typo. Original Sep 2016 battery): Exact same usage. It dropped to 65% in 2 hours and 50 minutes. This isn’t even debatable anymore. Not after this many years.

Interesting.

There's a slew of things in their test that make it flawed and their end conclusion isn't supported by the video, but the most interesting takeaway for me is that, despite the flawed setup, the time it takes to deplete the iPhones in a uniform way (i.e. the GeekBench test) is all within 21 minutes and the time difference between the oldest iOS version and the newest iOS version is 11 minutes.

Taking into account the flaws (and the unexplained) in the test with the the time difference described above, I say it's safe to hypothesize that battery discharge is nearly the same across iOS versions.

 

[FeliApple]

Interesting.

There's a slew of things in their test that make it flawed and their end conclusion isn't supported by the video, but the most interesting takeaway for me is that, despite the flawed setup, the time it takes to deplete the iPhones in a uniform way (i.e. the GeekBench test) is all within 21 minutes and the time difference between the oldest iOS version and the newest iOS version is 11 minutes.

Taking into account the flaws (and the unexplained) in the test with the the time difference described above, I say it's safe to hypothesize that battery discharge is nearly the same across iOS versions.

Geekbench is irrelevant, as the latter iOS versions’ performance isn’t reflected in daily use. It’s a lot worse than the Geekbench test implies, as the actual runtime test shows. Any user of the iPhone 6s throughout its lifetime will tell you that. If you were to try it, you’d agree too.

I don’t care about Geekbench if results don’t extrapolate into actual mixed use. The video and my experience and that of countless others shows that it doesn’t. Have you tried it? Like I said, it’s impossible not to notice should you try.

I can’t explain why the Geekbench test is close. All I know is it doesn’t extrapolate into actual use, which in the end, it’s all that matters. I don’t know if it’s the Geekbench version that varies between devices that tests differently, or if there’s some other factor, but it’s irrelevant.

 

[sdf]

The day will soon come that Apple is forced to stop these customer unfriendly signing practices, it's part of EU's RightToRepair bill.

Right. Because every user should have the right to wreck their camera with 16.0.