Apple Store Employees in St. Louis Reject Unionization Efforts

[ronntaylor]

In the USA, for the most part, unions do not enjoy a positive relationship with the majority of people.

That's not even remotely true. Unions are supported by the majority of Americans. Have been for many, many years.

U.S. Approval of Labor Unions at Highest Point Since 1965

Seventy-one percent of Americans approve of labor unions. Although similar to last year's 68%, approval is up from 64% before the pandemic.

news.gallup.com

Support for labor unions was highest in the 1950s, when three in four Americans said they approved. Support only dipped below the 50% mark once, in 2009, but has improved in the 13 years since and now sits at a level last seen nearly 60 years ago.

 

[aParkerMusic]

I miss the old days when most Apple users were of above-average intelligence and understood history.

Yes, the shady and often glossed-over history of union fanaticism, racism, manipulation, and greed.

 

[no_idea]

Well, so you rather corporations dictate whatever they want? While sometimes unions can be detrimental, they are one of the very few options workers have to have their rights and dignity held against powerful interests.
Greed is the engine of the American, Inc empire and it's not surprising the middle and lowers classes are being squeezed at a rapid pace since the 80s.

Lol…no one is forcing you to work at said corporation

 

[gugy]

Lol…no one is forcing you to work at said corporation

Easy for you to say if you have the means to quit a job you dislike. Lots of people don't have the ability to jump or quit a job due to many circumstances. Stop being selfish and empathize with others that might not as blessed. smh

 

[CapitalIdea]

Finally, someone who’s making sense in this thread. For all you capitalists that are okay will Apple exploiting their employees for peanuts on the dollar, the billionaires will never pick you and you’ll never be invited to their club. Stop defending the ultra wealthy and start sticking up for the working class. Unions assure that working conditions are safe and if it wasn’t them, we’d still have child labor and sixteen hour days.

You immediately lost when you claimed apple is giving their employees "peanuts on the dollar." For retail, they are pretty well compensated. Stop exaggerating and pretending these Apple Store employees finish their shift and then go sell matches in order to afford porridge.

 

[britboyj]

Some unions are good and necessary. Some industries (and specifically companies) are literally squeezing workers dry. The video game (and tech) QA movement to unionize is very, very important and worthwhile.

Apple retail pays well, does decent insurance, and doesn't make you work insane hours. For a retail gig it is the *dream*. I'm not surprised these votes failed, and what union VOTES are good.

There are other unions that are terrible and should be done away with police, for one, (but I often don't see the anti-union sentiment swing that way... wonder why?) but the UAW as well.

 

[frenchcamp49er]

Great! Keep your money out of the hands of rich union bosses

 

[bruinsrme]

It’s sad how completely we’ve forgotten the lessons of the past.

Do you at least like the memory of the idea of a 40-hour work week? State and federal governments define the work week, non-exempt and exempt.

Or, how much do you appreciate the fact that it’s illegal for your workplace to have doors locked such that those inside cannot leave? Unions crested it, laws enforce it. No longer a union matter

Without unions, we wouldn’t even have that much. The did some great work in the past, past bring the key word

“Divide and conquer.” “United we stand; divided we fall.” Why work you work at a pace where you needed that mentality

A trivial analysis will show that “right-to-work” states get paid less, work longer hours, have less job stability … I’ve been paid well in the right to work states.

… and all y’all think this is a good thing?

b&

Interesting post. Bring in a union shop as a non union employee of the company, the union people complained non-union employees get better benefits and time off, yes we did

 

[bluecoast]

I'm in the UK and so I'm following the Apple Union story from afar (I'm not a member of a union).

Whatever your view of unions are in the USA, think on this:

In nearly every country in Europe, we have statutory sick pay for employees in private and public companies whether you are in a union or not.

And unions were undoubtedly part of the reason why this happened here.

(see also: the desire for more stable societies post WW1 and 2 to stop communism from spreading & to stop anything like the situation in 1930s Germany from ever happening again).

Unions are often far from perfect - sadly, many seem to hold onto outdated working practices etc.

But this often happens in countries where there is an antagonistic relationship between unions, employees and governments.

For example, I read that in Germany the situation is a lot more healthier, where employees are seen as partners by big companies (VW is run in that way, for example).

IMHO think it's better for companies - and society - to share more of the pie with everyone - and not just senior employees and shareholders (again, see VW).

We don't have to have unions to ensure this outcome, but - weirdly! - they are often needed, as very rich people don't like sharing any of their pie, so it seems.

 

[monster620ie]

I support unions. Yes, they get bad raps for some ills, but they are needed especially nowadays when employers take full advantage of folks to work extra for little or NO compensation. This applies not just to hourly works but salaried workers who are made to work many extra hours for no compensation or formal arrangements to get time off.

 

[brofkand]

European here. Attitudes toward unions is definitely one of the major divides between the USA and Europe. We have a lot of sympathy for unions here, they stand up for the little guy in commoditised jobs.

In America they’re basically PACs.

 

[cmcbhi]

Not to forget paid sick days (a month when starting a new job up to multiple months at 100% salary), maternity protection, special vaccation days for marriage, death or moving to a new appartment, obligatory breaks and idle periods after a certain number of working days/hours and a lot more

And taxes out the wazoo.

 

[CapitalIdea]

Easy for you to say if you have the means to quit a job you dislike. Lots of people don't have the ability to jump or quit a job due to many circumstances. Stop being selfish and empathize with others that might not as blessed. smh

The job market is very good right now, and retail is always hiring nowadays. Unless this is a free-standing Apple Store NOT in a mall, and with NO nearby retail of any kind (which I don't think even exists) I'm curious what kind of circumstances you think are going on that are not VERY much edge cases. Are other stores going to reject someone for having worked at Apple? Are the employees going to get confused about which door to walk into at the mall?

 

[WaxedJacket]

you know why in Europe they get 5 weeks or more paid vacations and zilch here? UNIONS

That's baked into each countries law, not some union mandate.

 

[God of Biscuits]

“which suggests that Apple's efforts to improve benefits to stymie unionization have been successful.”

no, it doesn’t. It MAY suggest it, but that’s as far as you can take it. If you’re going to editorialize in your articles, make it clear that you’re doing so when you’re doing so.

 

[God of Biscuits]

Unions just need to die…end of discussion

ok Apple goon squad.

 

[kingtj1971]

Unions just need to die…end of discussion

I see this a bit differently. The union helped Apple's employees collectively get a better pay/benefits arrangement because they posed a threat to Apple.

I'm not a fan of unions in most cases. But the possibility a group will really unionize is a good incentive for an employer to voluntarily provide a better arrangement.

 

[Macusercom]

And taxes out the wazoo.

We're used to this in the EU and we here are definitely not a bunch of poor countries. The US system with little taxes it superb if you are working continuously with no unexpected things happening. Working full time for 40 years might yield higher wages but imho the US system bites you in the butt if you become unemployed and especially if you need medical treatment. Things like giving birth, surgery, even staying in a hospital for a few days are peanuts compared to what US hospitals charge you.

The EU system gives a foundation of security like a rubber band. The more you go in either direction (very rich or completely bankrupt), the more you're being pushed back to the middle. The US doesn't have that. There is no band to put you back in either direction and while this is awesome if you go up and up and up, once you go down you're on your own.

 

[icanhazmac]

In America they’re basically PACs.

Internal documents reveal Oregon teachers union exodus is a crisis of its own making

Internal documents reveal the Oregon Education Association lost nearly 20 percent of its membership.

www.foxnews.com

tl;dr:

Nothing illustrates the union’s priorities better than its own finances. The National Education Association (NEA), OEA’s parent affiliate, reported spending more than twice as much on political expenditures than it did on representational activities for its members.

Nuf said!

 

[gugy]

The job market is very good right now, and retail is always hiring nowadays. Unless this is a free-standing Apple Store NOT in a mall, and with NO nearby retail of any kind (which I don't think even exists) I'm curious what kind of circumstances you think are going on that are not VERY much edge cases. Are other stores going to reject someone for having worked at Apple? Are the employees going to get confused about which door to walk into at the mall?

You missed the point. I was talking about the overall situation of labor/unions/corporations and not specific to Apple's situation here.

 

[maxoakland]

Almost like actually engaging with employers and having reasonable, closed discourse is the solution to most of these problems. You know, instead of going whining to the press, or going on / threatening strikes.

It’s really naive to think that. Employees almost always try the easy way first. Going on strike, unionizing, and going to the press is the hard way

 

[maxoakland]

Yes, the shady and often glossed-over history of union fanaticism, racism, manipulation, and greed.

Unlike those saintly corporations

What a silly take

 

[amartinez1660]

you know why in Europe they get 5 weeks or more paid vacations and zilch here? UNIONS

I can agree to that, however I think also the culture has a lot to do too.

Doing a quick and dirty search, countries which are perceived as big on work culture have more public days off than North America: Japan has 16 days, China has 7 holidays (but that system one is unique, each holiday is several days long and if you were to count them it seems more like 20), US says it has 11.
Here in Canada it was the first time I experienced going through a full month without a single day off due to holidays.

One would think that with all the turmoils and riots that happen at times, one of them would be for shrinking the work week to four days, making “9 to 5” job be really 9-5 and not 9-6 “because lunch” and more like 8-7 because commuting… but the efforts are definitely put elsewhere.

Heck, I would take a 1/5th pay cut for a 4/5th of the work week. I’ll just buy 1/5th less of a home, 1/5th less of fast foods, streaming services and other stuff that’s not needed. But this is definitely against the trend.

 

[compwiz1202]

Yup, my dad (police officer, UK) went to his union for legal support (a service they claimed to offer), however they decided it “wasn’t in their interest” and declined to provide the support to him.

Unions are a waste of time and money.

This how my wife's was when she worked somewhere with one. In the very beginning they were great, and then I remember them being insanely toward the workers where all the benefits were part of the reason businesses crumbled, and now today they are useless. They need a happy medium again

 

[compwiz1202]

I can agree to that, however I think also the culture has a lot to do too.

Doing a quick and dirty search, countries which are perceived as big on work culture have more public days off than North America: Japan has 16 days, China has 7 holidays (but that system one is unique, each holiday is several days long and if you were to count them it seems more like 20), US says it has 11.
Here in Canada it was the first time I experienced going through a full month without a single day off due to holidays.

One would think that with all the turmoils and riots that happen at times, one of them would be for shrinking the work week to four days, making “9 to 5” job be really 9-5 and not 9-6 “because lunch” and more like 8-7 because commuting… but the efforts are definitely put elsewhere.

Heck, I would take a 1/5th pay cut for a 4/5th of the work week. I’ll just buy 1/5th less of a home, 1/5th less of fast foods, streaming services and other stuff that’s not needed. But this is definitely against the trend.

Even in US, it used to be better. I remember when I worked in the 80-90s, vacation would be huge after a few years. Then they lumped it all into one PTO bucket with the amount vacation only used to be. Today PTO caps out fast. The one job my wife interviewed for capped at two weeks. I think here we get four at least eventually