Apple Suggests Apple TV 4K Will Gain Dolby Atmos Support in Future tvOS Update

[ZeRoLiMiT]

ATV4 is two years old. As a techie I’d never even heard of Atmos two years ago, so it’s not a priority for Apple since normals don’t care. Apple products are for the mass market of normals.

exactly! I totally agree with this! I know a lot of home video guys and out of 10 of them 2 know about atmos or care about atmos. Not to many people have atmos and not to many movies have atmos! I have it myself and wish they did add it but a update nearby will be great!

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

1080p movies from Apple are not "highest quality". I've downloaded them from the store. They tend to be around 5GB in size and in no way can compete with a movie that is roughly 30GB from a Blu ray. The sound is especially a weak point.

Sorry, I didn't mean literally. I assumed you were ALREADY accustomed to 1080p from iTunes and were now apparently faulting it because Apple is touting 4K quality. And your post reads like you think you have to buy a new TV to get good quality, as if you think a 4K TV is going to get better streams than the 1080p set you already have. The reality is that the standard or substandard streams of one is probably going to be standard or substandard streams of the other. Resolution may step up but if- say- Netflix is streaming what you judge as a poor quality 1080p stream, I would not automatically assume Netflix is going to send what you judge as a much higher quality 4K stream.

If you want highest (literal) quality (in a consumer product), get the discs. None of these other options are going to fully compete with the quality of the discs in picture or sound. If you are happy (unhappy) with the quality of some source of streaming video, their crack at 4K streams will probably be similarly positive (negative).

 

[melchior]

Is the Apple TV 5 still gimped by having a USB port on the back but purposely not allowing you to connect an external drive so apps like VLC can playback content natively?

no. they fixed that. they removed the usb port completely.
[doublepost=1506004055][/doublepost]

If you want highest (literal) quality (in a consumer product), get the discs. None of these other options are going to fully compete with the quality of the discs in picture or sound. If you are happy (unhappy) with the quality of some source of streaming video, their crack at 4K streams will probably be similarly positive (negative).

This. 4K is of little benefit if the bitrate stream is stuck at around 15mbps.

 

[Alan Wynn]

Why is this a big surprise? It's not like the Apple TV has to process the audio signal in any way. It just has to send the data straight out to the receiver, speaker bar, etc.

I believe that Apple does have to process the sound to add its UI sound effects. That means they need to figure out how to add it to the multiplex for decoding at the receiver.

Early TiVo DirecTV HD receivers forced a choice of Dolby Digital or UI sound effects.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

no. they fixed that. they removed the usb port completely.
[doublepost=1506004055][/doublepost]

This. 4K is of little benefit if the bitrate stream is stuck at around 15mbps.

I support the idea of watching the highest possible quality picture and listening to the best quality sound. Thus, I endorse DISCS. The post to which I was replying was making a personal & subjective judgement about quality relative to that guys eyes & ears. Some guy could make some argument that 5mbps yields spectacular quality... or you at 15mbps+ or disc-minded people at much higher levels. That's all eye (and ear) of the beholder debate. Since I'm a quality hound, I continue to believe buying the discs and making your own file for streaming yields best results. But others are quite happy with the qualities in streaming files.

 

[scott911]

Why Apple didn't have this in place for the launch of ATV5 is beyond belief, if ATV5 has HDCP 2.2 all you have to do allow audio passthrough and bitstream to the receiver to allow it to decode the audio.

I was so disappointed the ATV5 didn't have this, I ordered an Nvidia Shield straight away. I found this hard to believe I was doing this as I have used ATV since the first generation. I will Keep ATV4 but I love the HD sound the Shield allows me to have.

Please Apple Hurry up and Implement this.

they are so behind. very disappointed in the numerous unexpected limitations of his device. But I did buy one hoping that they start catching up. They will not be able to add the hoped for second HDMI port, but I will be pleased if they start adding features and un-crippling others via software updates.

I so want this to become the hub of my living room, Not an extra box that is only sometimes used...

 

[Alan Wynn]

I'd like 4K but it's still too pricey for me. I'm a few-hundred-dollar TV guy, not 4 digits and beyond. Additionally, I'd have to update my Roku, and considering there's not much 4K content that I wish to stream means I'm not looking yet. Of course, this is all chicken-and-egg. Someone (consumers or providers) needs to move first and provide a reason for the other to move too. I think it's more affordable for them.

TCL has a 55" DolbyVision 4K HDR that lists for $649. It is a Rokou TV. While it will not give you the ultimate HDR experience (being LCD with zone dimming), DolbyVision will at least optimize the picture for the set, unlike HDR10 only systems.

iTunes has quite a few UHD titles available at launch, with the additional benefit of my existing titles being upgraded as they become available.

As for ATV, I have an older model without the hard drive and a real old model with a hard drive. Honestly, I never liked Apple's interface nor their lockdown. I switched to Roku as I can put unofficial channels on it, if I like, and it seems to embrace things more quickly than Apple. Speaking of this, does Apple still consider the ATV a hobby?

Since AppleTV 4, it is pretty easy to add an app for a channel (hence Plex, VLC and VuDu being available). As for Rokou embracing things earlier, from what I can tell, they still do not have a standalone streaming box with DolbyVision support.

 

[viettanium]

No Youtube in 4k. Deal breaker for me.

wait for they to updating their app

 

[dabotsonline]

I'm completely torn on my current TV setup. I have a 2012 Panasonic plasma which is quite good for 1080p blurays but so much content is moving over to streaming that's it's frustrating getting low quality HD stream from say Netflix that I'm considering 4k TV. Granted things get released to bluray but it's an expensive option and for example if i wanted to get Narcos season 3 i'd have to wait until the summer of 2018 for the bluray version which destroys the current HD version I get on my Roku.

I don't want to get rid of my plasma for no reason when it works so well but I also don't want to watch the Roku streams. The only way to get access to really good streams is 4k and investing money in blurays at this point seems stupid.

Why not keep your current TV, buy a $180 USD HDFury Linker to downsample 2160p streams to 1080p and strip the HDR metadata yet maintain the benefit of the higher bitrate?

 

[mooeymoose]

Does anybody understand how dolby Atmos is going to work. Say if Apple supports it then your TV would have have to support it right? Also, I would think the crappy Tv speakers would be worthless for this and you would need a sub, sound bar and some rear speakers so your speaker setup would need to support it too? Also, can opitcal support this or does it need hdmi out for support. I am guessing this is going to be difficult to get to work properly.

 

[scott911]

I'm completely torn on my current TV setup. I have a 2012 Panasonic plasma which is quite good for 1080p blurays but so much content is moving over to streaming that's it's frustrating getting low quality HD stream from say Netflix that I'm considering 4k TV. Granted things get released to bluray but it's an expensive option and for example if i wanted to get Narcos season 3 i'd have to wait until the summer of 2018 for the bluray version which destroys the current HD version I get on my Roku.

I don't want to get rid of my plasma for no reason when it works so well but I also don't want to watch the Roku streams. The only way to get access to really good streams is 4k and investing money in blurays at this point seems stupid.

I'm on my second 4K screen, meaning I retired my first one, and got a second. Always surprised when I hear people say they don't think 4K is main stream.

Anyway - If I were in your shoes, I'd wait for January. I think that's when a new crop of TVs come in - and at that point 4K HDR won't be special - it will be main stream. When i got my last 4K (about a year ago) HDP was brand new in stores and carried a huge premium - so I skipped it. I don't think that will be the case early next year, and a screen you buy them should be solid technology for you for many, many years.
[doublepost=1506005163][/doublepost]

Does anybody understand how dolby Atmos is going to work. Say if Apple supports it then your TV would have have to support it right? Also, I would think the crappy Tv speakers would be worthless for this and you would need a sub, sound bar and some rear speakers so your speaker setup would need to support it too? Also, can opitcal support this or does it need hdmi out for support. I am guessing this is going to be difficult to get to work properly.

Take a look at audioholics.com for info on Atmos, and good audio advice in general. Atomos generally requires good dedicated speakers in specific locations, and yes, optical digital audio doesn't carry any of the newer formats.

 

[fathergll]

Sorry, I didn't mean literally. I assumed you were ALREADY accustomed to 1080p from iTunes and were now apparently faulting it because Apple is touting 4K quality. And your post reads like you think you have to buy a new TV to get good quality, as if you think a 4K TV is going to get better streams than the 1080p set you already have. The reality is that the standard or substandard streams of one is probably going to be standard or substandard streams of the other. Resolution may step up but if- say- Netflix is streaming what you judge as a poor quality 1080p stream, I would not automatically assume Netflix is going to send what you judge as a much higher quality 4K stream.

If you want highest (literal) quality (in a consumer product), get the discs. None of these other options are going to fully compete with the quality of the discs in picture or sound. If you are happy (unhappy) with the quality of some source of streaming video, their crack at 4K streams will probably be similarly positive (negative).

What I saying is that from my experience so far 1080p streams and downloads are low quality across the board. Bluray came out in 2006 therefore thats the quality im pretty much used to for HD movies. The reality is that streaming is becoming a huge thing and a lot of content is being released straight to streaming platforms so I would like to take advantage of this fact but without actually taking an obvious step backwards in quality that has been available in the U.S. like Bluray since 2006. The only way to make this leap over to streaming without taking a hit quality wise is some of the new 4k streaming options but that would require a new TV in order to support HVEC. From what I read Vudu basically cracked this barrier for streaming quality. It's across the board better than 1080p Bluray from what I read and pretty close to 4k Bluray in some areas.

My biggest gripe is not taking a step backwards in quality from 1080p Bluray ....something that has been around since 2006.

 

[predation]

another feature that will introduced at a "later" date.

 

[fathergll]

Why not keep your current TV, buy a $180 USD HDFury Linker to downsample 2160p streams to 1080p and strip the HDR metadata yet maintain the benefit of the higher bitrate?

I actually never heard of that device. I will have to look into it to see how much of a benefit the higher bitrate shows.

Thats a neat idea though.

 

[lique831]

Does anybody understand how dolby Atmos is going to work. Say if Apple supports it then your TV would have have to support it right? Also, I would think the crappy Tv speakers would be worthless for this and you would need a sub, sound bar and some rear speakers so your speaker setup would need to support it too? Also, can opitcal support this or does it need hdmi out for support. I am guessing this is going to be difficult to get to work properly.

Most Dolby Atmos setups are run through a receiver and dedicated speakers. There are a few soundbars that support it, but not many and they cost a premium. You will need to use HDMI.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

What I saying is that from my experience so far 1080p streams and downloads are low quality across the board. Bluray came out in 2006 therefore thats the quality im pretty much used to for HD movies. The reality is that streaming is becoming a huge thing and a lot of content is being released straight to streaming platforms so I would like to take advantage of this fact but without actually taking an obvious step backwards in quality that has been available in the U.S. like Bluray since 2006. The only way to make this leap over to streaming without taking a hit quality wise is some of the new 4k streaming options but that would require a new TV in order to support HVEC. From what I read Vudu basically cracked this barrier for streaming quality. It's across the board better than 1080p Bluray from what I read and pretty close to 4k Bluray in some areas.

My biggest gripe is not taking a step backwards in quality from 1080p Bluray ....something that has been around since 2006.

OK. Personally, I doubt that streaming- even with HEVC- is going to compete with disc quality. I suspect h.265 offers the opportunity for that idea but I suspect it will be squandered to go for "thinner" instead of filling the "added capacity" with more detail. I suspect h.265 at 4K is simply going to be striving for comparable file sizes as h.264 for 1080p... that someone somewhere in charge of such thinking is targeting some arbitrary bandwidth capacity target, and thus jamming 4K resolution into nearly the same amount of virtual (file) space as 1080p in h.264 containers.

That written: if you believe h.265 is going to bring higher quality streams but you are happy with your Panasonic, there is nothing I know of to stop you from opting for the 4K file stream to then be downconverted to the 1080p Panasonic screen. It will deliver the quality in that stream to the fullest it can be displayed on your Panasonic. Buying a 4K TV is not going to automatically improve the quality of the stream, nor is it necessary to access the (presumably) better quality file.

In short:

• if quality is still king for you, discs is still THE way to go
• if you perceive HEVC streams will deliver better quality, you can opt for those and feed them to a new 4K set or the existing 1080p Plasma. Yes, the latter won't be playing them back at 4K but the downconversion from 4K should yield a very impressive 1080p picture. And if there is more actual data in the 4K stream, it will likely show in a better 1080p picture than streaming the h.264 version of the same file.

 

[cube]

number of 24p TVs > number of 4K TVs > number of HDR TVs > number of HDR10 TVs > number of Dolby Vision TVs > number of Atmos HTs

 

[iFan83]

well this will make many happy!

 

[Jarman74]

Ahhhhh, "just one future update away..." the appeasing spin solution to all things any Apple product lacks. The same was slung for all of the bugs and issues with the "4" too. And then we wait and wait and wait for such updates, hoping even seemingly simple improvements are delivered in a timely manner.

What is lacking with the this oft-slung spin is the corresponding concept of WHEN. For example, it's also a phone in just one future update. It's also a super computer cluster node in just one future update. In other words, it can be almost anything possible in modern software if the software is written for it. So WHEN is it this... or that? It becomes this or that whenever Apple decides to get around to writing the software.

Maybe it actually will adopt ATMOS next week? Or maybe that's next year? Or maybe there will be ATMOS2 in play before it adopts ATMOS? My guess: tangibles like that left out usually find their way into the next hardware model (where new money can be made from touting them). In spite of this rumor, I suspect ATMOS is much more likely in the future "6" than in some upcoming software update even in the next year or two. We've seen this before. We should know how this works by now.

But I'll hope right with anyone else interested in it!

100% agreed - this is why I will be holding out for the Atmos update, and I'm going to buy the device only when the update gets released. Apple, there you have my WHEN!

 

[Shlooky]

And novels!

Audio books

 

[Alan Wynn]

As to "low quality HD streams," just step back to any 4K thread about TV posted more than a week ago and the bulk of this crowd will ridicule 4K to no end, calling it a useless gimmick, "that I can't see" (so you can't either), and a whole host of recycled arguments they also used against 1080p while Apple still clung to 720p as HD before they released the "3." Unless all those people didn't know what they were talking about, you are already perfectly equipped "as is."

I have little interest in 4K as with my 55" display, my viewing distance is it on the edge of being able to see the improvement. HDR in general (and DolbyVision in particular) are the killer features for me. To really get the benefit of 4K I would need a 70" set.

Of course, they all seem to have mysteriously disappeared as soon as Apple rolled out this new 4K box, not daring to call Apple stupid for embracing the "gimmick" that "no one can see" per "the chart"... even without the whole internet being upgraded to handle the bandwidth and storage options being exactly the same as they were before, etc. Where have those people gone?

For most people's viewing environment, UHD is a gimmick. As larger sets become cheaper that will change. On the other hand, HDR provides a visible benefit right away (with an HDR set). TCL's 55" DolbyVision set lists for $649.99. Their 65" set is just under twice the price and they do not yet have pricing for their 75" set. If I could buy an 55" HD set with DolbyVision for $400, I would be perfectly happy. Unfortunately, display manufacturers have chosen to include HDR only with UHD sets.

I live in LA in Frontier territory and have 150Mb/s FiOS service, but even so, streaming sometimes has issues (service was much better when it run by Verizon). Most people in this country have lower speed and performance than what FiOS provides - meaning receiving high quality UHD streams will be a challenge.

Wait, I see some of them in new threads showing enthusiasm for what Apple has for sale now. Apparently 4K was just a useless, stupid thing last week and before. Now that Apple has embraced it in this new box, it's "shut up and take my money" time for all.

While I never posted about it on here before, I still care little about the resolution upgrade. The increase in Dynamic Range is a big deal for me. I also like not having to pay $30 for the UHD/HDR version on iTunes (still the price on VuDU - not sure if that will change tomorrow), for movies I can get for $15 on iTunes. In addition, upgrading my whole library with no additional cost will be save me a great deal of money. As far as I have found, VuDu did not even have an option to upgrade my titles to the higher quality format at any price. That may change now that Apple has forced this on the studios.

 

[bladerunner2000]

no. they fixed that. they removed the usb port completely.

LOL, what a joke. I can't believe people actually would buy the Apple TV. Terrible value.

 

[kyjaotkb]

Given the lack of Dolby TrueHD support, I guess we are getting LOSSY Atmos, i.e. Dolby Digital+ Atmos, which is the lesser version that compares unfavourably to UHD Blu-ray or theaters. A lot of the "soundstage" elements are in the high frequencies, which get cut-off by compression algorithms, making the positioning of sounds much less precise.

Getting 7.1 non-Atmos TrueHD, like on 2K Blu-ray, would have been a better option.
[doublepost=1506008881][/doublepost]Also - this thing does not support 24p playback and iTunes doesn't seem to have films in 24p, which is disastrous for anyone vaguely interested in re-creating a cinematic experience...

 

[bladerunner2000]

Does anybody understand how dolby Atmos is going to work. Say if Apple supports it then your TV would have have to support it right?

Your receiver gets Atmos, not your TV. And yes, the receiver would need Atmos compatibility as well.

 

[rpe33]

[doublepost=1506009455][/doublepost]

LOL, what a joke. I can't believe people actually would buy the Apple TV. Terrible value.

I disagree, but I welcome your opinion.