Apple Sweatshop Labor

Discussion in 'Apple, Inc and Tech Industry' started by malman89, Jan 17, 2012.

  1. malman89 macrumors 68000

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    #1
    Not surprised to not see a story on the main page about the slave labor tactics exhibited in Apple's Chinese suppliers. Not our problem or not our concern?

    A Google search brings up a variety of articles, but as someone who doesn't own a TV (and ignores broadcast journalism even if I did), I doubt the TV news has ignored it, The Daily Show gives coverage to the essentially slave labor tactics utilized against Foxconn employees in China that have been so publicly protested against US companies in Mexico employing the same tactics, but they don't make as important products as iPhones and iPads, so who cares?

    Where's the outcry of the public? Or who cares as long as their iPads are shiny and perfect and don't increase in price?

    Edit: Even 9to5mac.com has their own unbiased coverage.
     
  2. mrsir2009 macrumors 604

    mrsir2009

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    #2
    What about all the other companies that use FoxConn?
     
  3. Caliber26 macrumors 68000

    Caliber26

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    #3
    This kind of answer always gets to me. Just because other companies are doing it, does that make it okay for Apple to follow suit???? Since when does Apple operate to the standard of OTHER companies?

    If Apple wishes to conquer mindshare, they'll have to take the praise AND the scrutiny. That's a given.
     
  4. mrsir2009 macrumors 604

    mrsir2009

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    #4
    Ok... So if Apple did push for better conditions and such for FoxConn workers, who would the extra cost be passed onto? FoxConn? Apple? The customers? Who's going to want to take the hit?
     
  5. johnmacward macrumors regular

    johnmacward

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    #5
    I think you've answered the question about the morality of capitalism there.
     
  6. ctucci macrumors regular

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    #6
    And you the immorality of the left.
     
  7. Shrink macrumors G3

    Shrink

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    #7
    Thanks for the tip of the hat to us immoral folks. I'm on my way out to do something really immoral. Even worse, something really left wing immoral.:rolleyes:
     
  8. ctucci macrumors regular

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    #8
    Have fun, it's probably legal there.
     
  9. *LTD*, Jan 18, 2012
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2012

    *LTD* macrumors G4

    *LTD*

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    #9
    It isn't actually "slave labor." I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that it is.
     
  10. interrobang macrumors 6502

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    #10
    Since 1976.

    Apple exists in a competitive environment. It can't just unilaterally decide to change the basic economics of manufacturing. So long as its competitors are exploiting third-world labor to keep costs down, Apple has to do the same, or go out of business.

    Unless, that is, people were willing to pay more to buy goods produced by well-paid workers in safe conditions. Which, history has shown, only a tiny minority of people are willing to do.
     
  11. aristobrat macrumors G4

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    #11
    IMO, it sounds like Apple is taking steps in the direction I think most people here would want them to.

    https://www.fairlabor.org/fla/Public/pub/Images_XFile/R514/Apple_Joins_FLA.pdf
     
  12. Shrink macrumors G3

    Shrink

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    #12
    Yes, lots of things are legal here.

    It's called individual freedoms.

    But, I'll try to find something immoral. I just have to figure out who will decide that for me - or if I get to decide that myself.:rolleyes: :D
     
  13. ctucci macrumors regular

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    #13
    You misunderstand, I think. My argument is that capitalism is moral because it's the only system that allows the most people the most freedom.

    That includes individual freedoms, like those you imply you're going to enjoy. And since capitalism is one of the most important reasons Americans have the freedoms they do, then I stipulate the left is immoral in their attempts to remove personal choice by attacking capitalism as they currently do.
     
  14. Thomas Veil macrumors 68020

    Thomas Veil

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    #14
    Is this the morality of capitalism? Is this what anyone would really want the US to become to compete?

    So what does this sound like to you? "THX 1138"? The Apple "1984" commercial?

    No wonder those people threatened to commit suicide.
     
  15. Shrink macrumors G3

    Shrink

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    #15
    I think you are mistaking, or interdigitating, the economic system and the political system, as if they are the same, or necessarily intertwined.

    It is possible to have a democratic political system and a non-capitalistic economic system. You are arguing that a the freedoms (hopefully) inherent in a truly democratic system are necessarily supported by a capitalistic economic system. I'm not an economist, but I suggest that it is possible to have a somewhat regulated capitalist system. You are suggesting, I believe, that only a totally laissez faire, unregulated, free market capitalism is the only kind of capitalism.

    Individual freedoms are not inherent in a capitalistic economic system. The freedom to question the economic system (capitalism) in in the political system (democratic), not inherent in the economic system.

    By your standards, it is immoral to question the economic system. To this canard, I say a fulsome b********t.
     
  16. malman89 thread starter macrumors 68000

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    #16
    Yes. To explain capitalism in its most basic form is to maximize profits. Doesn't matter what needs to be done to achieve that.

    There was a lengthy article in the NYTimes yesterday was well. Being forced to work 6 twelve-hour days, live on campus away from your friends/family, eat and consume goods on campus so you probably don't even end up 'taking home' much wages to begin with... geez, doesn't that sound like slavery?

    True, they're not "technically" forced to do anything. However, if they want to keep their job, they must work the hours mandated. If they want to keep the job, they must live on campus to be awoken in the middle of night to begin a shift because Steve Jobs wanted a glass screen last minute to prevent scratches. If they want to keep their job, they have no time to go anywhere that isn't on the campus. There's no social mobility, no freedom. Slave labor.
     
  17. ctucci macrumors regular

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    #17
    But, they are intertwined. A good example is the crony capitalism we suffer under in the US today.

    You're way off in your understanding, but, that's your problem, not mine.
     
  18. aristobrat macrumors G4

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    #18
    Is not also true that they're also able to quit these jobs? Any thoughts on what responsibility the Chinese government has to regulate these practices?
     
  19. chrono1081 macrumors 604

    chrono1081

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    #19
    Another one of these threads???

    No offense to anyone but if you think Apple doesn't work with its Chinese suppliers for better working conditions, you're just ignorant and need to read this:

    http://www.apple.com/supplierresponsibility/

    Download the report, read it, and see that companies like Apple are working to IMPROVE conditions. Without Apple, conditions would probably still be much worse at Foxconn.
     
  20. Nebrie macrumors 6502a

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    #20
    While some of this is bad, some of this is ignorance of other cultures.

    The 6 day/12 hour workweek is fairly standard in most parts of Asia including modern economies such as Taiwan. I spoke to an American who went to Taiwan and had to endure this work schedule despite the fact that the written work day was much shorter. As far as he could tell, anyone in his office was free to leave at the appointed hour with no consequences (other than silent admonishment from their co-workers) but they just didn't. He wasn't working in a factory; he (and his co-workers) were making big bucks at a tech firm. His feeling was that people went with this simply because it was the cultural norm.

    Work dorms are pretty standard. I have family members who did this after high school and before getting married/college/real job. Factory cities tend to be in the middle of nowhere where land is dirt cheap. The company has to build their own housing because there is no housing there and the workers would rather live in the housing because they'd rather save the money for college or an apartment when they get another job. In traditional Chinese culture, the parents expect you to live with them after you grow up so they can nag you to death all day long so it's a great way for some of these kids to get out of the house. It's the Asian equivalent of getting a job at Mc Donalds.

    Also, about as many people there eat dogs as Americans eat roadkill.

    If you want to talk about 1984, why move the factories back to America? Lets move them to Europe; America is an atrocity in terms of workers rights and conditions compared with Europe.
     
  21. FX120 macrumors 65816

    FX120

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    #21
    ********. If Apple really gave a damn about worker conditions, they wouldn't continue to support them with more work.

    Don't kid yourself. Apple and any other company who does business with Foxconn knows exactly what goes on on the factory floors, and have since day one.
     
  22. chrono1081 macrumors 604

    chrono1081

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    #22
    Please read the link. You obviously didn't.
     
  23. Bonch macrumors 6502

    Bonch

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  24. FX120 macrumors 65816

    FX120

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    #24
    I read the link. You're quite daft if you believe it. It's a typical PR response by a company that has known full well what the conditions are like, and is only now trying to excuse themselves to a public which has just gotten a peek behind the curtain and discovered who and how that shiny toy in their pocket was assembled.

    Apple doesn't care about the lives of the workers. Apply only cares that the consumer doesn't care, and they want to make sure that the public doesn't start care.
     
  25. MorphingDragon macrumors 603

    MorphingDragon

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    #25
    No, you have politicians that choose to intertwine them together. You could in theory have a dictatorship and capitalism.
     

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