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Apple to Adopt Alternative Chipsets for Next Laptops?

iMacmatician said:
Apple would most likely switch back to Intel with Nehalem.

Also people generally care less about the chipset than the processor, so Intel will still get recognition. Not to mention that Apple doesn't advertise the chipset on their website (at least I don't think so).
Click to expand...

Indeed. The average consumer will have no idea what a chipset* is, nor will they care about the manufacturer, just as long as it works!

*Me
 
CWallace said:
Based on nVidia's site, they only make "desktop class" MCPs. So does this preclude the use of Intel Mobile CPUs?

If so, I can't see how Apple can adopt them since the Wolfdale TDPs are significantly higher then the current Penryn mobile units.
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Isn't NVIDIA about to release a mobile chipset?

And maybe Intel could engineer a mobile CPU in that desktop chipset (if the chipset isn't too big).
 
Thanks, Eidorian. I was wondering if nVidia might produce a mobile chipset - either especially for Apple to use in their pre-Nehalem refresh or in general.

The MCP79 looks set to handle the new Penryns so it may very well be a go. Should make the MacBook and Mac Mini folks happy to have a "real" GPU again.
 
Also, there is nothing saying that the nVidia chipset cannot handle Nehalem once it comes out for laptops (at least a year from now). Nehalem's architecture actually gets closer to AMD's with the suppression of the FSB and the integrated memory controller. nVidia already has the expertise to deal with such configurations so while it might not be trivial, I don't see anything that would make it impossible... I guess the only impossibility could come from the absence of license. Also, if Apple is unhappy with the end product, I'm sure they will end the hypothetical relationship before Nehalem comes in...
 
FrenchKheldar said:
Also, there is nothing saying that the nVidia chipset cannot handle Nehalem once it comes out for laptops...
Click to expand...

With laptops, that is true, because "Mobile Nehalem" does not use QPI. So if Apple decides to keep using mobile platforms for everything but the Mac Pro, nVidia would work.

nVidia does not (as of yet) have a QPI license from Intel, so if Apple decides to use the desktop product in at least some models, nVidia will not be an option (until they do have a license).
 
Wow, I didn't know that. So no QPI in Mobile Nehalem, that negates a big improvement brought by Nehalem no? So while the desktop performances will probably see a big jump forward, Nehalem on laptops will be a more incremental evolution similar to Merom->Penryn transition?
 
CWallace said:
With laptops, that is true, because "Mobile Nehalem" does not use QPI. So if Apple decides to keep using mobile platforms for everything but the Mac Pro, nVidia would work.

nVidia does not (as of yet) have a QPI license from Intel, so if Apple decides to use the desktop product in at least some models, nVidia will not be an option (until they do have a license).
Click to expand...

I thought nVidia worked that out with Intel. They get QPI as long as Intel gets SLI. :confused:
 
diamond.g said:
I thought nVidia worked that out with Intel. They get QPI as long as Intel gets SLI. :confused:
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There has been some speculation that they do, but so far nobody has been able to point to a press release or statement from an Intel or nVidia executive noting that nVidia actually has a QPI license from Intel. So I guess we'll find out soon enough since Core i7 is only a few months away.
 
FrenchKheldar said:
Wow, I didn't know that. So no QPI in Mobile Nehalem, that negates a big improvement brought by Nehalem no? So while the desktop performances will probably see a big jump forward, Nehalem on laptops will be a more incremental evolution similar to Merom->Penryn transition?
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You've got it. People think that just because Bloomfield posts big (30%) improvements over Yorkfield, that'll carry over to all Nehalems. Nehalem variants differ more widely than Penryn variants.

Nehalem brings the biggest improvements in the MP server area and the smallest improvements in the desktop and notebook areas. And at least for the Extreme / DP server segments, clock speeds appear to be similar from Penryn » Nehalem.

MP Server: Beckton's improvements over Dunnington:
  1. 6 cores » 8 cores
  2. 6 threads » 16 threads
  3. 16 MB L3 cache » 24 MB L3 cache
  4. 2 channel RAM » 4 channel RAM
  5. 1067 MHz FSB » 4x QPI
  6. Core improvements
1.5 MB L2 cache/core » 512 KB L2 cache/core (downgrade)

Extreme / DP Server: Bloomfield/Gainestown's improvements over Yorkfield/Harpertown:
  1. 4 threads » 8 threads
  2. New L2 cache
  3. 2 channel RAM » 3 channel RAM
  4. 1333/1600 MHz FSB » 1x/2x QPI
  5. Core improvements
12 MB L2 cache » 8 MB L3 cache (downgrade)

Mainstream/Value: Improvements over Penryn:
  1. 2/4 threads » 4/8 threads
  2. New L2 cache
  3. Core improvements
  4. On-chip IGPU
1067/1333 MHz FSB » DMI (not an upgrade)
6 MB L2 cache » 4 MB L3 cache (downgrade)

I expect Penryn » Nehalem in the mainstream and value segments to be not unlike the Pentium M / Core » Core 2 transition.
 
iMacmatician said:
You've got it. People think that just because Bloomfield posts big (30%) improvements over Yorkfield, that'll carry over to all Nehalems. Nehalem variants differ more widely than Penryn variants.

Nehalem brings the biggest improvements in the MP server area and the smallest improvements in the desktop and notebook areas. And at least for the Extreme / DP server segments, clock speeds appear to be similar from Penryn » Nehalem.

MP Server: Beckton's improvements over Dunnington:
  1. 6 cores » 8 cores
  2. 6 threads » 16 threads
  3. 16 MB L3 cache » 24 MB L3 cache
  4. 2 channel RAM » 4 channel RAM
  5. 1067 MHz FSB » 4x QPI
  6. Core improvements
1.5 MB L2 cache/core » 512 KB L2 cache/core (downgrade)

Extreme / DP Server: Bloomfield/Gainestown's improvements over Yorkfield/Harpertown:
  1. 4 threads » 8 threads
  2. New L2 cache
  3. 2 channel RAM » 3 channel RAM
  4. 1333/1600 MHz FSB » 1x/2x QPI
  5. Core improvements
12 MB L2 cache » 8 MB L3 cache (downgrade)

Mainstream/Value: Improvements over Penryn:
  1. 2/4 threads » 4/8 threads
  2. New L2 cache
  3. Core improvements
  4. On-chip IGPU
1067/1333 MHz FSB » DMI (not an upgrade)
6 MB L2 cache » 4 MB L3 cache (downgrade)

I expect Penryn » Nehalem in the mainstream and value segments to be not unlike the Pentium M / Core » Core 2 transition.
Click to expand...
I am not going to discount what you wrote, but I think some people are confused. QPI is mainly addressing communication between CPU sockets. For mobile systems QPI isn't terribly needed as you only have one socket. So the FSB is still going away. The major issue is if Apple is going stick with mobile CPUs and chipsets for their desktops (iMac + Mini). They will look like they are lagging behind if the competitors jump to Nehalem and Apple can't.
 
Thanks for the summary, can't wait for my first Mac Pro in a 6-12 months time period :)

But to me, the continuity of architecture between Penryn and Nehalem at the mobile level makes the nVidia rumor even more likely. Hopefully, we will know for sure soon !
 
diamond.g said:
I am not going to discount what you wrote, but I think some people are confused. QPI is mainly addressing communication between CPU sockets. For mobile systems QPI isn't terribly needed as you only have one socket. So the FSB is still going away.
Click to expand...
That's true, and even more reason why Nehalem will benefit servers more than desktops/laptops.

I've also heard that QuickPath will be used in Havendale/Auburndale between the CPU and IGPU.
 
nVidia Chipset for new Macbooks/Pros??

Our nVidia rep just claimed that the new MacBook Pros/MacBooks due for refresh this Sep/Oct are going to include nVidia Chipsets as well as nVidia graphics cards (for the Pros). As Apple is developing Snow Leopard, this will allow them to utilize things like GPU processing a lot better. He showed us an example of converting a DVD to iPod format. Where normally it takes something like 8 hours on my laptop, it would only be 15min!!!
 
symota said:
Our nVidia rep just claimed that the new MacBook Pros/MacBooks due for refresh this Sep/Oct are going to include nVidia Chipsets as well as nVidia graphics cards (for the Pros).
Click to expand...
I have my doubts.

Sun's Jonathan Schwartz said:
In fact, this week you'll see that Apple is announcing at their Worldwide Developer Conference [2007] that ZFS has become the file system in Mac OS 10.
Click to expand...
 
symota said:
Our nVidia rep just claimed that the new MacBook Pros/MacBooks due for refresh this Sep/Oct are going to include nVidia Chipsets as well as nVidia graphics cards (for the Pros).
Click to expand...

Nothing against your rep, but if they know and are willing to share, the world would already have known via leaks from sources within nVidia higher up the chain then your rep.
 
expanding company

this is going to end up in history as one of many major changes apple has made. think about it, apple is known for these moves.

they made the first all in one computer. and today they are selling phones, mp3 players, music, computers, software, and that mobile me sh*t. they're a company that is expanding on most technology fields. this move will make them a more independent and self-sustaining company; creating a truly all in one company.

eh eh??

now for the snow leopard speculation. its going to support gpu tapping. so wouldn't developing a motherboard that optimizes gpu to cpu communications further benefit the system? that being the case if apple creates its own motherboard. forget amd and i've never heard of via.
 
more nVidia rumor...

You can naysay all you want. I work in the custom computer industry, but use all Apple myself. Every indicator i've been seeing points to nVidia as the new provider for Apple's mobile chipsets. The comments from our rep just confirmed it with me.

Check out these other sources:
http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=598
http://www.edbordenblog.com/2008/07/apple-dumping-intel-chipsets-maybe-for.html
http://www.insanely-great.com/news.php?id=9433

...more buzz supporting what the nVidia rep is saying.
 
I just wonder if Apple moving away from Intel's chipsets will affect their ability to quickly get the new goodies like the quad-core mobile Penryns announced today and in the near future, as well as the mobile Nehalems coming in mid-to-late 2009.

Apple already eschews Intel's "Centrino" WiFi chipset in favor of Broadcom and if they do move to nVidia and drop Intel's chipset, then Apple is just another CPU customer.

Is Intel going to want to extend them the benefits they have in the past with items like the 22mm package Memroms used in the MacBook Air or the 1066MHz Penryns and GM965 chipsets used in the latest iMac refresh?

Intel is going to be seriously constrained in delivering quad-core Penryns until 2009 due to only having one full fab available to manufacture them - and that fab is also pumping out all the other 45nm CPUs Intel offers. When it comes to allocations, will Intel stiff Apple in order to get product to HP, Dell, Sony and others who use the entire Intel Centrino package - CPU, chipset, and WiFi?
 
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