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autrefois

macrumors 65816
It's nice that Apple is continuing its commitment to clean energy. Since this is a data center though, I bet the NSA is following these developments closely.

At Apple, they are committed to going green because they firmly believe that destroying your civil liberties doesn't have to mean destroying the environment... :eek:
 

grs

macrumors member
Jul 13, 2008
56
5
Reno, NV
I thought server farms work best in cool climates.

Reno is not Las Vegas. This week notwithstanding (104 degree temps), the climate is generally very nice, and cool to downright cold in autumn, spring, and winter.
 

iOzzie

macrumors regular
Feb 22, 2010
136
15
Melbourne
Reno is not Las Vegas. This week notwithstanding (104 degree temps), the climate is generally very nice, and cool to downright cold in autumn, spring, and winter.

Generally humidity is the biggest concern for data centres, not overall temps themselves.
 

ToomeyND

macrumors 6502a
Sep 14, 2011
563
378
Before anyone gets nit-picky about the 100% clean energy from solar. No, they are not directly using solar energy in the middle of the night. They are likely getting a mix of coal, natural gas, and the geothermal that is referenced. They are, however, producing enough extra energy from solar during the day that it covers all of their usage at night. So their investment in solar covers all of the energy that their data center uses (assuming they size it correctly, which is a different argument). It just produces all of that power during the daytime.

Unless some company brags about disconnecting from the grid and runs on renewables and batteries, this is how it is counted every time. Net renewable generation paid for = net energy consumer = "100% renewable" regardless of the time of generation.
 

tomguy99

macrumors newbie
Jul 2, 2013
3
0
finish date?

I made an account just for this thread,

Do any of you know when this will be completed,

I live in Reno, and the job market is very bad.

I don't want to leave my hometown, but I'm running out of options.

It would be great to work here.



I wouldn't be surprised if competition here was fierce, considering apple will offer much better pay then most companies in Reno. --- I hope
 

PracticalMac

macrumors 68030
Jan 22, 2009
2,857
5,242
Houston, TX
lol fusion is actually 100% safe..

1307032252_atomic_bomb_mushroom_cloud_explosion.gif


True


;)

----------

I made an account just for this thread,

Do any of you know when this will be completed,

I live in Reno, and the job market is very bad.

I don't want to leave my hometown, but I'm running out of options.

It would be great to work here.



I wouldn't be surprised if competition here was fierce, considering apple will offer much better pay then most companies in Reno. --- I hope

Chances are the construction will be contracted out like any other, but the IT, apply to Apple now.

But it seems the center is already built, so its just the solar expansion.
Apply to the solar company listed.
 

sransari

macrumors 6502
Feb 11, 2005
363
130
This is great, but I am wondering how much of this is being subsidized by the government through tax credits (i.e., money that is to be borrowed from China in order to make up for the lost tax revenue). Sorry for being a debbie downer :(
 

phillipduran

macrumors 65816
Apr 30, 2008
1,055
607
I thought server farms work best in cool climates.

Yes, that is why they put it in Reno. Look it up.

----------

They work best in highly air conditioned buildings. Yes it's easier to keep buildings cool in cool climates. However, since the big air conditioners will be powered by solar it's cool. :) I'm sure they got a great deal partnering with Reno NV. energy also.

Reno has great weather for someone looking to reduce the costs of keeping a server farm cool.

http://www.rssweather.com/climate/Nevada/Reno/

----------

This is great, but I am wondering how much of this is being subsidized by the government through tax credits (i.e., money that is to be borrowed from China in order to make up for the lost tax revenue). Sorry for being a debbie downer :(

You don't make up for lost tax revenue, you cut costs.

Government is too big. There is no paying for tax cuts, there is only reducing the beast that is our government that pays so many people $100k+. Govt is too self absorbed and needs to be downsized to irrelevancy.
 

carlgo

macrumors 68000
Dec 29, 2006
1,806
17
Monterey CA
137 acres of moving, tracking reflectors? And this particular system is supposed to be the most efficient commercial one...!

It is fine to sell solar power to the utilities and then buy it back at night, but that still requires coal, gas, etc. Hopefully something like flywheel technology will make sites like this closer to utility-free 24/7.

Lots of interesting info out there on this technology. Some real heavy hitters working on this, not the usual reclusive inventor types who are always almost there...
 

AidenShaw

macrumors P6
Feb 8, 2003
18,667
4,676
The Peninsula
137 acres of moving, tracking reflectors? And this particular system is supposed to be the most efficient commercial one...!

It is fine to sell solar power to the utilities and then buy it back at night, but that still requires coal, gas, etc. Hopefully something like flywheel technology will make sites like this closer to utility-free 24/7.

Lots of interesting info out there on this technology. Some real heavy hitters working on this, not the usual reclusive inventor types who are always almost there...

Pumped hydro. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pumped-storage_hydroelectricity

Use the solar power to pump water into a high reservoir, then generate hydro power at night.

It makes more sense for Apple to just sell daytime solar and use nighttime gas, though. Pumped hydro works, but there's a huge capital investment.
 
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sransari

macrumors 6502
Feb 11, 2005
363
130
Yes, that is why they put it in Reno. Look it up.

----------



Reno has great weather for someone looking to reduce the costs of keeping a server farm cool.

http://www.rssweather.com/climate/Nevada/Reno/

----------



You don't make up for lost tax revenue, you cut costs.

Government is too big. There is no paying for tax cuts, there is only reducing the beast that is our government that pays so many people $100k+. Govt is too self absorbed and needs to be downsized to irrelevancy.

Good luck waiting for the government to cut costs and stop handing out $100k+/yr welfare jobs :(
 

alephnull12

macrumors regular
Jan 13, 2012
180
0
Since Steve Jobs died, still waiting for this company to do something that actually makes a ****ing difference.

----------

I made an account just for this thread,

Do any of you know when this will be completed,

I live in Reno, and the job market is very bad.

I don't want to leave my hometown, but I'm running out of options.

It would be great to work here.



I wouldn't be surprised if competition here was fierce, considering apple will offer much better pay then most companies in Reno. --- I hope

Move.
 

appleisking

macrumors 6502a
May 24, 2013
658
3,022
Before anyone gets nit-picky about the 100% clean energy from solar. No, they are not directly using solar energy in the middle of the night. They are likely getting a mix of coal, natural gas, and the geothermal that is referenced. They are, however, producing enough extra energy from solar during the day that it covers all of their usage at night. So their investment in solar covers all of the energy that their data center uses (assuming they size it correctly, which is a different argument). It just produces all of that power during the daytime.

Unless some company brags about disconnecting from the grid and runs on renewables and batteries, this is how it is counted every time. Net renewable generation paid for = net energy consumer = "100% renewable" regardless of the time of generation.
Yes, the problem with solar tech. is it's not very efficient and expensive to implement (ud be lucky to get 20% of the energy irradiated by the sun), and storage during low sun output (night, cloudy, etc.) is an issue too. Batteries are not environmentally friendly and any type of shipping and transport takes up energy uses we were trying to avoid in the first place.
 

ChrisA

macrumors G5
Jan 5, 2006
12,537
1,644
Redondo Beach, California
I thought server farms work best in cool climates.

They work best whereever the cost of power is low, in areas like this solar power is very much available. No need to shovel the snow off the panels in winter.

----------

I made an account just for this thread,

Do any of you know when this will be completed,

I live in Reno, and the job market is very bad.
.


You know, of course that the ideal data center does not even need lights inside the building, Maybe two security guards in the parking lot.

But we are not to that point yet so they still have lights ad a very few techs inside who can do jobs like swapping out broken hardware. But it is NOT a large workforce in there. All the higher paid jobs are still in California where they write the software do the design work and push the data to the centers.
 

ToomeyND

macrumors 6502a
Sep 14, 2011
563
378
Yes, the problem with solar tech. is it's not very efficient and expensive to implement (ud be lucky to get 20% of the energy irradiated by the sun), and storage during low sun output (night, cloudy, etc.) is an issue too. Batteries are not environmentally friendly and any type of shipping and transport takes up energy uses we were trying to avoid in the first place.

I didn't mean to explain that as a problem. I'm all for the solar generation. I just didn't want someone to come on and complain that there was no way that they were 100% renewable when they are running in the middle of the night. I was explaining the difference between net energy and real-time consumption. At this point, you can be looking at a roughly 8-15 year payback for a system like this. Most people don't like that kind of return when they have a home and family to take care of. A company will take that in a heartbeat. That means the remaining 10-22 years (depending on estimated life) on the plant is pure profit.
 

Internaut

macrumors 65816
Well, Nevada is certainly a good place to build solar panel farms, while guaranteeing a return on the investment. It will be interesting to see if Apple have managed to do something with the heat generated by the servers on this site*.

* Saying that because I once complained of being too cold in a customer's server room. The customer directed me to the back of a rack full of HP servers..... Toasty!
 

Liquorpuki

macrumors 68020
Jun 18, 2009
2,286
8
City of Angels
137 acres of moving, tracking reflectors? And this particular system is supposed to be the most efficient commercial one...!

It is fine to sell solar power to the utilities and then buy it back at night, but that still requires coal, gas, etc. Hopefully something like flywheel technology will make sites like this closer to utility-free 24/7.

Lots of interesting info out there on this technology. Some real heavy hitters working on this, not the usual reclusive inventor types who are always almost there...

Energy storage of a flywheel sucks though. Imagine how many of those they'd have to build to match load capacity of the data center

The point of solar tracking is to maximize energy absorption though. Given the proper cost analysis, that makes the installation more efficient.

Before anyone gets nit-picky about the 100% clean energy from solar. No, they are not directly using solar energy in the middle of the night. They are likely getting a mix of coal, natural gas, and the geothermal that is referenced. They are, however, producing enough extra energy from solar during the day that it covers all of their usage at night. So their investment in solar covers all of the energy that their data center uses (assuming they size it correctly, which is a different argument). It just produces all of that power during the daytime.

Unless some company brags about disconnecting from the grid and runs on renewables and batteries, this is how it is counted every time. Net renewable generation paid for = net energy consumer = "100% renewable" regardless of the time of generation.

It shouldn't make a difference anyway. Physically, there's no difference between an electron produced through a solar array and one produced by burning coal.
 

AidenShaw

macrumors P6
Feb 8, 2003
18,667
4,676
The Peninsula
It shouldn't make a difference anyway. Physically, there's no difference between an electron produced through a solar array and one produced by burning coal.

If generators produced electrons it would have a very negative effect on the planet.

Generators just move our current electrons around....
 
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AidenShaw

macrumors P6
Feb 8, 2003
18,667
4,676
The Peninsula
"The term hadron refers to composite particles composed of quarks held together by the strong force (as atoms and molecules are held together by the electromagnetic force). The best-known hadrons are protons and neutrons; hadrons also include mesons such as the pion and kaon, which were discovered during cosmic ray experiments in the late 1940s and early 1950s." Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Large_Hadron_Collider

Wow, picky, picky, about terminology. It smashes hadrons, which are sub-atomic particles. Even though I'm not a nuclear physicist, I suspect you got the gist of my post, but were just in the mood to pick an argument. Fine.

Not sure what your last point is about, but the collider at CERN is officially refered to as the "Large Hadron Collider". I wasn't implying it smashes large hadrons.

I'm sorry that you were offended by what I meant as a tongue-in-cheek clarification. My apologies.

And the parentheses around the "large" comment were meant to separate it from your comment - it was just an explanation of LHC, not a rebuttal to you.

And you totally missed the joke about Alice. I'm sure that the people at CERN that I worked with on the LHC got it.
 

tomguy99

macrumors newbie
Jul 2, 2013
3
0
Can't find the job listing

Thank you to people who responded to my post,

I check the apple job site, and they said there isn't anything offered yet.

I'm just hoping now, that it's still under construction and the jobs haven't been posted yet.
 
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