Apple TV 4K vs. Nvidia Shield

[BODYBUILDERPAUL]

They saw my many posts about Auto frame rate switching so thank me i don’t care much about atmost

Haha you're funny dude! You complain at everything It was because The Verge review on its launch day did SO MUCH DAMAGE to the Apple TV and EVERY reviewer then seemed to pick up on the problem. But the Verge editor was very up his own *** by opening the review criticising that it didn't play YouTube in 4K. (Just use your TV app or let the ATV upscale it - heck it's highly compressed anyway instead of saying all of the wonderful things that Apple had designed into the ATV. Opening a review with negativity leaves a bad taste and is highly unprofessional. Maybe he is new at journalism, I don't know.

 

[Regime2008]

I did do a Google search...and I did preface my comment about DirecTV Now by saying I was not sure if it was yet available. However...

1) Channels is NOT available on Android TV. Android TV does offer an app called Live Channels. However, Channels is iOS only (see https://getchannels.com)

2) DirecTV Now's own support site does not list Android TV or the Shield (see https://help.directvnow.com/hc/en-u...es-and-browsers-can-be-used-with-DIRECTV-NOW-)

You say "But like I said, Nvidia shield is better than Apple TV". This is an example of a subjective statement. YOU think Shield is better because of your use case. That's perfectly fine. Shield is a great device. I prefer AppleTV for MY use case. It's really that simple.




Yes, there are options to view live TV on the Shield. I never stated otherwise. I explicitly stated "Channels" app is only on AppleTV. Channels is a fantastic app, and I've tried Live Channels on Android TV. I prefer Channels by a mile.


I've used every box out there including apps within Sony, Samsung, and LG smart TVs. Each has pros/cons.

You download the app and install it. I don't get what is so hard to understand about this. Its a better device in MAJORITY of peoples eyes who are deciding between the two, I have explicitly stated that it isn't just my opinion, but majority of others as well. Look up video comparisons on youtube, or reviews comparing the two. Then look into the comments section, or check out reddit. Even on the /Apple subreddit, many prefer the Shield, and moan and gripe about lack of HD audio and 4k Youtube, lack of good games, etc.

Didn't DirecTV give out a bunch of AppleTV's for free or something with their service? Guess that's one way to get ppl to use them...

 

[archer75]

Unless the iTunes store supports these audio files in a few years, it's highly unlikely that we'll see this. Apple is investing so much into 4K DV iTunes that ATV really is the ultimate compliment for it & the Apple family. Yes Dolby Atmos will come - once iTunes films carry it I guess but I could be wrong! Never say never, look how they gave us Auto Frame Rate switching etc But...

Oh we'll never see it. They may add atmos but it will be lossy. I want lossless. All for local playback. I simply wish the ATV would do it so I could then use just 1 streaming device. Instead I have to use another for my movie rips.

 

[BODYBUILDERPAUL]

Oh we'll never see it. They may add atmos but it will be lossy. I want lossless. All for local playback. I simply wish the ATV would do it so I could then use just 1 streaming device. Instead I have to use another for my movie rips.

You know what Mr Archer. It's very clear to me that Apple want iTunes 4K to be regarded as the best in the world, an industry leader. What if, in the next few years we start seeing 3-5GB becoming a reality for the internet. Surely we could see iTunes sending a 4K DV film at 100+mbps or over with a lossless audio format. Surely, Apple want to be better in the long term than the quality offered today by 4K BluRay. Surely, Apple who will not sacrifice anything for top quality have this as their ultimate iTunes goal?
A typical example, looking back at cities in the UK and Paris. In 2007, 1-2mbps was the Internet speed, now we expect 250-350mbps upwards

 

[archer75]

There are still far too many areas that don't even have access to high speed internet period. And it certainly doesn't need to be 100+ mpbs. They can do it with FAR less bandwidth. I don't need them to add lossless audio for their store. I'm not buying streaming content. I need them to add it for our local content.

Other devices do it now. The shield for example.

 

[jdag]

You download the app and install it. I don't get what is so hard to understand about this. Its a better device in MAJORITY of peoples eyes who are deciding between the two, I have explicitly stated that it isn't just my opinion, but majority of others as well. Look up video comparisons on youtube, or reviews comparing the two. Then look into the comments section, or check out reddit. Even on the /Apple subreddit, many prefer the Shield, and moan and gripe about lack of HD audio and 4k Youtube, lack of good games, etc.

Didn't DirecTV give out a bunch of AppleTV's for free or something with their service? Guess that's one way to get ppl to use them...

1st, what you are stating as "fact" is the definition of an opinion. My opinion is that the AppleTV is better for the way I use it. You cannot argue that, just like I cannot argue against your preference for the Shield. I've said it at least 2-3x...if you prefer the Shield that's great. If you prefer the AppleTV, that's great too. By the way, I've never said the Shield is bad...not by a long shot.

2nd, what do you mean "you download the app and install it"? Which app? As I mentioned, the Channels app (the one developed by the company who's web site is www.getchannels.com) is fantastic...and ONLY available for iOS. That is not an opinion, it is a fact. If you are referring to the Android "Live Channels" app which is on the Google Play store, that is a different app altogether and not the one I was referring to (as mentioned when I brought it up initially).

And you mention that DirecTV Now is available for Shield. Are you sure? I checked the DirecTV site and do not see it.

As for DirecTV giving away an AppleTV, that is an ongoing promotion for their service. Sling has given away Rokus and FireTVs. Neither promotion has anything to do with the quality/demand for the devices.

 

[priitv8]

Other devices do it now. The shield for example.

The correct way to put it - Apple should allow audio pass-through.
Current problem is that they've decided to handle audio deconding and mixing (and if you insist, re-encoding into AC3 5.1) inside tvOS.
Maybe, just maybe, if they listened to the users' requests to do adaptive video output, they get to address audio pass-through next?
Current lossless formats have been even defined for MP4 container.

 

[BODYBUILDERPAUL]

There are still far too many areas that don't even have access to high speed internet period. And it certainly doesn't need to be 100+ mpbs. They can do it with FAR less bandwidth. I don't need them to add lossless audio for their store. I'm not buying streaming content. I need them to add it for our local content.

Other devices do it now. The shield for example.

According to Flatpanel... "I’ve also spoken to several other movie streaming services who tell me that Atmos will be supported soon. It seems that Hollywood studios are preparing for it."
Interesting times!

 

[archer75]

According to Flatpanel... "I’ve also spoken to several other movie streaming services who tell me that Atmos will be supported soon. It seems that Hollywood studios are preparing for it."
Interesting times!

Yes, lossy atmos on top of DD+. This is already here on several streaming services.

Again, I want lossless that is with Dolby TrueHD.

 

[Mac 128]

I am not sure if it is the identical version of Android, but I had a Sony 4K TV with the Android OS and could not stand it. I returned the TV because of a picture issue, but I did not get another Sony partly because of the convoluted system.

I use ATV and don't think there's any comparison. It is miles better IMO:

Smoother operation
More intuitive (granted, I've used ATVs for years)
Android froze/crashed at least 6-8x in just 2-3 days of use

For what I watch, ATV covers 90% of of my needs. Of course, you might have other viewing requirements.

Sony's implementation of Android TV OS is not at all the same as the Shield. They should not be confused.

There's no better picture than the current crop of Sony 900e series for the money. The Android TV OS is improving, and I haven't had a crash in months, though I still use it sparingly. Still, the Shiled is an entirely different experience.

 

[Sanlitun]

I have both the Shield and the ATV4 and have used them side by side on the same TV. In my opinion the only place the Shield is better is Youtube with some 2160p content, but not necessarily with all content. The actual implementation of the Youtube app is far superior on the ATV with the channels plainly laid out.

For playback of HDR content on Netflix and general image quality the ATV was somewhat better in my opinion.

YMMV etc.

 

[FranknStein7]

I've used both extensively. Still go back and forth between the two.

IMO, the major advantages of the Apple TV 4K are:
-Dolby Vision support
-Automatic refresh rate switching for majority of apps (only a few Shield apps like Plex/Kodi/SPMC support this)
-High quality upscaler

Advantages of the Shield TV are:
-Passthrough of HD audio and Atmos/DTS:X
-Best Plex client available (supports every conceivable blu-ray and UHD format)
-Chromecast (far superior to AirPlay IMO)
-Gaming (particularly emulators for me)

 

[Mac 128]

I've used both extensively. Still go back and forth between the two.

IMO, the major advantages of the Apple TV 4K are:
-Dolby Vision support
-Automatic refresh rate switching for majority of apps (only a few Shield apps like Plex/Kodi/SPMC support this)
-High quality upscaler

Advantages of the Shield TV are:
-Passthrough of HD audio and Atmos/DTS:X
-Best Plex client available (supports every conceivable blu-ray and UHD format)
-Chromecast (far superior to AirPlay IMO)
-Gaming (particularly emulators for me)

How is Chromecast superior to AirPlay? I've had nothing but trouble with casting and it's often awkward to use.

 

[err404]

Yes, lossy atmos on top of DD+. This is already here on several streaming services.

Again, I want lossless that is with Dolby TrueHD.

I find it funny that you draw the line at lossless audio while giving the shield a pass for lacking DV support. High quality lossy audio is far harder to notice than the improved tone mapping that DV adds to the scene.
There is no perfect streamer yet since they all lack something. But DV (or at least HDR10+) are vital.

 

[archer75]

I find it funny that you draw the line at lossless audio while giving the shield a pass for lacking DV support. High quality lossy audio is far harder to notice than the improved tone mapping that DV adds to the scene.
There is no perfect streamer yet since they all lack something. But DV (or at least HDR10+) are vital.

Because I find audio to be very important, maybe even more so than video. Especially for an emotional response.
In most cases the content author doesn't take advantage of Dolby Visions features and results in HDR video that often looks the same from DV compared to HDR10 in most content currently.

DV can be added to the shield via software and lossless audio could be added to the ATV as well. However DV on the shield is significantly more likely.

 

[djphat2000]

I too have both. Had the Shield first, mainly due to the ROM emulation abilities and I could finally play Street Fighter IV (only, but whatever I had to have something and it be cheap since I already have an Xbox One). At the time no street fighter for Xbox One. So, in order to get all I wanted in one device and not be expensive, a friend of mine bought me the Shield. I do like it, even though I am not an Android fan. It does work and when I got my ROM games to work, it wasn't terrible. Not great, but not terrible. Still too much work for limited enjoyment.

I have since gotten an Apple TV, and well. That gets used ALL THE TIME. I very rarely use the Shield, except for KODI and or well, by mistake. The Apple ecosystem just works better (AirPlay). It does what it's supposed to do, and that's it. But a lot of the times. At least for me. That's what makes it great.

 

[err404]

Because I find audio to be very important, maybe even more so than video. Especially for an emotional response.
In most cases the content author doesn't take advantage of Dolby Visions features and results in HDR video that often looks the same from DV compared to HDR10 in most content currently.

DV can be added to the shield via software and lossless audio could be added to the ATV as well. However DV on the shield is significantly more likely.

I find your assessment of what is more likely to be added to be a bit biased. For technical/license reasons, I doubt either will be added. So for the sake of argument we are best off going by what is available today, or at least what has been publicly committed to.
I get the impression that you have not seen HDR10 directly compared to DV. The difference can be profound. Everything HDR10 does to make the the bright areas pop, DV also does to the low and mid tones. The picture is far more balanced. HDR10 just looks dark by comparison. You don’t need trained eyes to see the difference. Whereas in double blind studies, lossless audio improvements are imperceptible to most consumers.
DV is actually being widely embraced in both physical and streaming services, to the extent that the base layer for HDR10 is being compromised to better suit the dynamic metadata.
I understand that audio may be more important to you than video quality, but you need to understand that your position is the minority for a reason. That is, most people can see the difference DV offers, but can’t hear what lossless adds.

 

[archer75]

I get the impression that you have not seen HDR10 directly compared to DV. The difference can be profound. Everything HDR10 does to make the the bright areas pop, DV also does to the low and mid tones. The picture is far more balanced. HDR10 just looks dark by comparison. You don’t need trained eyes to see the difference. Whereas in double blind studies, lossless audio improvements are imperceptible to most consumers.
DV is actually being widely embraced in both physical and streaming services, to the extent that the base layer for HDR10 is being compromised to better suit the dynamic metadata.
I understand that audio may be more important to you than video quality, but you need to understand that your position is the minority for a reason. That is, most people can see the difference DV offers, but can’t hear what lossless adds.

I have indeed seen a comparison. Since my TV supports both(LG OLED) as well as a few devices I have I can indeed compare. In most content both end up looking the same. Note I said most, not all.
I understand that I am in a minority when it comes to audio. You need a decent system to hear the difference. Most people dismiss audio simply because they don't know and installing large speakers takes more room than they have available or wish to take up. I get it.
But I listed what I want and what's important to me based upon my experience. I didn't say it's for everyone. At this point for me, my TV and my speakers, I would indeed take lossless audio and HDR over DV and lossy audio.

 

[FranknStein7]

How is Chromecast superior to AirPlay? I've had nothing but trouble with casting and it's often awkward to use.

What about it is awkward? It was definitely buggy for me in the early days of my Nvidia Shield, but most of the kinks were worked out. Chromecast is superior IMO because it tells the device to pull the media directly from the internet instead of relying on a direct connect between the two devices. My other frustration with Apple TV is that if any sort of media pops up on my iPhone while I'm airplaying music (or streaming a video) to the Apple TV, the media on the TV is interrupted. I find this infuriating. For some reason too, on the mobile reddit app, Airplay seems to think I want to send every video on reddit I scroll past to the Apple TV, even if I don't click it. So basically it's impossible to Airplay music from my iPhone to my Apple TV while also browsing reddit on my iPhone.

 

[Mac 128]

What about it is awkward? It was definitely buggy for me in the early days of my Nvidia Shield, but most of the kinks were worked out. Chromecast is superior IMO because it tells the device to pull the media directly from the internet instead of relying on a direct connect between the two devices. My other frustration with Apple TV is that if any sort of media pops up on my iPhone while I'm airplaying music (or streaming a video) to the Apple TV, the media on the TV is interrupted. I find this infuriating. For some reason too, on the mobile reddit app, Airplay seems to think I want to send every video on reddit I scroll past to the Apple TV, even if I don't click it. So basically it's impossible to Airplay music from my iPhone to my Apple TV while also browsing reddit on my iPhone.

Airplay mirrors whatever is on the mobile device to the TV, so there's no need to tell it to stop casting then start casting after making a selection. Often, video buffering stutters and staggers. It's a horrible experience every time I've tried to use it.

AirPlay absolutely hands off streaming of video to the ATV from a device. In fact that feature has prevented me from using AirPlay the way I wanted to, without connecting the ATV to the internet and just using it as a local streaming box. Not sure why you think it doesn't.

As for media popping up when I'me streaming, I find that I can't do anything else when casting. It's infuriating.

The Reddit sounds like a coding error on the Reddit side to me. I don't have this problem with any AirPlay streams.

 

[archer75]

I have zero issues with casting. Start, stop, I can navigate away on my phone and casting continues no issues.

Most chromecasts are run wirelessly though you can purchase a wired kit for them. Is your ATV wired? I wonder if your buffering issues are really just a wifi problem.

 

[BODYBUILDERPAUL]

Because I find audio to be very important, maybe even more so than video. Especially for an emotional response.
In most cases the content author doesn't take advantage of Dolby Visions features and results in HDR video that often looks the same from DV compared to HDR10 in most content currently.

DV can be added to the shield via software and lossless audio could be added to the ATV as well. However DV on the shield is significantly more likely.

Out of interest, today being Thursday was our weekly film night.
I rented a new film from iTunes called '20th Century Women' it's 1080p HD - no 4K as yet.
It was a great film - artistic, original and highly quirky set in 1979 during the punk music era.
It's studio is ENTERTAINMENT ONE.
What struck me was its INCREDIBLE audio - not just the music from punk to a Bryan Ferry track but also to the dialogue throughout the entire film. It was crisp, levels were consistent - it was as though it was the most beautiful lossless audio master.
It's clear that the audio on this film had been beautifully mastered. What I can say for definite is that, for my 9 years of buying film from iTunes, this is the clearest, most dynamic audio that i've ever heard from a iTunes film. It beats any downloaded film that i've ever come across. Having worked in radio & studios all of my life, i've a good ear for something really great. And my, the mastering on this film really did shine!
Hopefully the start of things to come!

 

[Mac 128]

I have zero issues with casting. Start, stop, I can navigate away on my phone and casting continues no issues.

Most chromecasts are run wirelessly though you can purchase a wired kit for them. Is your ATV wired? I wonder if your buffering issues are really just a wifi problem.

I was speaking specifically of a Windows PC, but have had issues on apps which cast via the iPhone. Since AirPlay has zero issues with buffering, I'd say it's a Chromecast problem and not a wifi problem.

Why would I wire anything when I have flawless 30Mbps wifi that easily streams 4K HDR movies with zero issues? I also have no interest in investing any time or money into figuring out how to better implement Chromecasting when my Apple products just work.

Only Google products cause these kinds of issues in my setups. Complicated, poorly thought out interfaces, needlessly clunky control functions, and Android TV OS is a complete nightmare on my state of the art Sony 900E.

 

[Michelasso]

I have zero issues with casting. Start, stop, I can navigate away on my phone and casting continues no issues.

I have all kind of issues with my Chromecast. I have done a "factory reset" few weeks ago and only partly solved them. It doesn't like much my Plex server (on macOS), getting stuck when subtitles (SRT!!) are on, I have to close and reopen the apps to have the Chromecast icon showing in my Xperia X Compact (with Android 7.1.1 and monthly security updates), the apps loose the connections to the device, with the videos keeping playing by themselves and no control. And it seems to get worse with time instead of improving.

Which is in line with how Android TV works in my Bravia. Bugs everywhere. Sure the Shield has much better hardware and support, but I am tempted myself on buying an ATV 4K, use the TV as a display, and forget about that awful (and slow) Android TV. Although I would still use the Android part for YouTube 4K (no HDR, yet. Although the HW is ready) and TIMvision here in Italy. Kodi is cool but is too heavy and I just use it as a media player, being the only one working (on Bravia) with all video and audio formats. Plex keeps transcoding for no reasons. But I read the ATV has Infuse and that should solve my LAN streaming problems.

 

[priitv8]

Although I would still use the Android part for YouTube 4K (no HDR, yet. Although the HW is ready) and TIMvision here in Italy.

It is really strange, what prevents it coming to AndroidTV, for Sony at least. YT player on Sony's UHD bluray player plays all aspects of 4K and HDR, so it can not be that Sony does not know how to.

Plex keeps transcoding for no reasons.

I actually prefer the Plex client on Bravia much to that on tvOS. One of the reasons is exactly the display of transcoding cause on-screen (might have had to enable it in settings first). Plex client on tvOS has just plain simple player UI.