Apple TV dont understand the Concept

Discussion in 'Apple TV and Home Theater' started by GRuizMD, Nov 29, 2008.

  1. GRuizMD macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2007
    #1
    I know this will sound like a real noob question but here it goes:

    I thought an ATV would let you load your dvds into it just like I do with my Music CDs and iTunes. But I am learning in this forum this is not its role.

    Example

    I have 50+ DVDs that I have bought in 3 years or so... I was hoping to be able to Convert this DVDs into something Itunes can Play and Stream, to an ATV but then I realized that I will have to use 3rd party software to get an very incomplete replica of my DVDs

    This is not about ripping DVDs and avoiding buying stuff I want to be able to replicate the DVD functionality (Menus, Subtitles Etc)

    Apple TV does not do that... on top of that If I rent or Buy (!) a movie from the iTunes Store I will also be paying for an incomplete product with no Subtitles, menus or extra features and I will not be able to make a physical back-up of the purchase anyway!

    Why is different from the music?

    Then if an ATV does not do this natively, what is it good for?
     
  2. Tallest Skil macrumors P6

    Tallest Skil

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2006
    Location:
    1 Geostationary Tower Plaza
    #2
    Apple TV was never designed to do that. You should have researched your purchase.

    Apple TV is meant to be a repository of media (music, photos, movies, TV shows) connected to your TV. You can also stream additional content from your computer or online. That's all it does right now.

    I don't believe there is a standalone product on the market that replicates DVD menus. I'm also unsure as to why you'd even WANT this to happen.
     
  3. Chris Rogers macrumors 6502a

    Chris Rogers

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2008
    Location:
    my house
    #3
    look into Boxee, you will be able to do more with your ATV.

    ATV is a media server for accessing media files from your computer/network on your TV. What menus and subtitles do you need? My movies are all in english, and I can stop, rew, ff, and play.

    Then again, I could care less for bonus material. If you want that use Mac The Ripper, it copies the DVD exact.
     
  4. kolax macrumors G3

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2007
    #4
    Yes, use HandBrake. Put in your DVD, select the Apple TV preset and click start.

    And incomplete replica of your DVD's? Do you really care about all the "extras"? They are just a waste of time in my opinion. You don't get any "extra" junk when you see a movie at the cinema, you see the movie and that's it.

    I can't believe you'd rather use DVD titles than just browse using the Apple TV viewer! Within Apple TV, you can turn subtitles on and off.

    When you buy a movie using the Apple TV, it'll sync it back to your Mac. You can then backup that movie (found in Music/iTunes/iTunes Music/Movies) to an external hard drive, DVD etc.

    Again, when you go to see a movie in the cinema, you don't have "menus" and "extras" do you? Why do you even want annoying menus to have to navigate with?! When I select a movie, I just want to have to press play and start watching immediately. I hate when I watch a DVD having to navigate using a dodgy DVD remote and select the start of the movie.
     
  5. Keebler macrumors 68030

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2005
    Location:
    Canada
    #5
    the question begs: is it AppleTV that don't get the concept, or perhaps you, the consumer, don't get a product before buying it?

    Honestly, i know that's harsh, but you should have done your research before buying n'est pa?

    it does most of what you list, but research would have shown that you do need to rip DVDs a certain way to get the extra features etc..

    i believe apple doesn't have their own ripping software for 2 reasons:
    1. so folks can buy through itunes
    2. so they don't tick off the movie studios with copy infringement issues

    hope that helps.
    keebler
     
  6. hitekalex macrumors 68000

    hitekalex

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2008
    Location:
    Chicago, USA
    #6
    I think some people are just stuck in the "old world' concept of DVD players, physical disks, 5 remote controls, and useless menus/extras junk that studios include to make the consumer feel like somehow they're getting more value for the buck.

    I got over 100 DVDs ripped on my AppleTV, each title is perfectly tagged and comes with full set of artwork. I can play any movie with one click and get consistent experience.. as opposed to navigating through different sets of menus and filling up disk space with whatever "extra" filler studios decide to include on the disks.

    So to the OP I'd say - give the "new way" a try - you would be surprised how much you won't miss the old experience.
     
  7. GRuizMD thread starter macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2007
    #7
    woa woa !

    Thanks for the replies!

    To make things clear, I have not bought the ATV.... LOL. I am on the research phase, that's why Im asking this.

    This is my situation to make it clear.

    Perhaps you have noticed English is not my primary language, but I like to watch movies in english, however, for some members of my family, subtitles are paramount.... With my original DVDs I am able to watch the movie as any american will do... But there are people that need subtitles, gesh!, even People that are impaired and need CC, If I were able to put my collection of DVDs into the ATV will it let me turn those On and OFF?

    Again sorry If I made myself not clear, but that's is why the menus are important for me (perhaps Im the only one who has family from overseas here... LOL)...
     
  8. GRuizMD thread starter macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2007
    #8
    Thanks Chris, but I have the original DVDs, so I would not be looking to physically duplicate them, I was thinking more on the lines, of: After putting my music collection in iTunes My 100s of music CDs are in a box, now I can access my music on the fly from my computer, Is there anything that would do the same with my DVDs???
     
  9. spacepower7 macrumors 68000

    Joined:
    May 6, 2004
    #9
    Real was going to come out with a software that the OP was looking for.
    It was called RealDVD and would rip DVDs including all menus, extras, and even the copy protection. Then it would be encoded in Real's own copy protection, so it couldn't be share via file-trading on the net.
    Real and the MPAA are busy suing each other so this product that was ready has not been released yet.

    Another home theater company (Kaleidescape) has made a product that does this, which stores the full DVDs on a bunch of 1TB drives. The product cost around $27,000 for a system that holds 160 DVDs

    Kaleidescape spent 3 years in court against the DVD Copy Control Association and finally won. Real is hoping to do the same.

    If Real wins, then theoretically Apple will be able to let people legally rip their DVDs into iTunes. Apple probably won't do this bc they would prefer that you buy a digital copy from them.

    Also, before criticizing the OP for not researching before making a purchase,
    the OP hasn't stated that he/she actually has bought an AppleTV. The OP is obviously reading this forum and asking questions, which I consider doing research.
     
  10. kolax macrumors G3

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2007
    #10
    Yes, you can turn subtitles on and off.

    Still don't see why you need the DVD menu though...
     
  11. GRuizMD thread starter macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2007
    #11
    Thanks Kilamite.

    If I get to keep the Audio streams and subtitles I will be a happy camper!

    handbrake is not the tool for this... I guess... Maybe Mac the Ripper...(downloading) does this thing has a manual???

    Thanks!
     
  12. kolax macrumors G3

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2007
    #12
    HandBrake is the tool for this ;)
     
  13. sandman42 macrumors 6502a

    sandman42

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2003
    Location:
    Seattle
    #13
    You absolutely can rip your DVDs to iTunes and have access to them, via :apple:TV, just like your music in iTunes. You just have to use third party software, such as Handbrake, VisualHub, etc, to do it. The reason Apple doesn't include this functionality 'out of the box' is because, crazy as it may seem, it's illegal in the US (under the DMCA) to do that - yes, the rules are different for CDs and DVDs here. Apple has to live by those laws, so they can't, at least for now, build that ability in, but you can (and of course many people do) do it.

    Incidentally, the :apple:TV has turned out to be WAY more useful to me than I ever expected it to -- couldn't imagine the living room without it!
     
  14. GRuizMD thread starter macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2007
    #14
    well based on what I have researched and the version of Handbrake that I have here, it will Burn the subtitles into the movie (hard subtitles), So no toggle on off (soft Subtitles). This seem to be confirmed by searching the Handbrake Forum too.:confused:

    Version 0.93 handles multiple audio tracks tho....
     
  15. kolax macrumors G3

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2007
    #15
    Ah yeah - I didn't realise you wanted to turn off subtitles on the ripped DVD's.
     
  16. Chris Rogers macrumors 6502a

    Chris Rogers

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2008
    Location:
    my house
    #16
    I'm sure if you use Boxee, it will allow you to toggle subtitles on/off.
     
  17. zap2 macrumors 604

    zap2

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2005
    Location:
    Washington D.C
    #17
    I find it useful, I rarely use the extras on DVDs(although I sometimes buys the DVDs still)

    I rip my DVDs, watch them on my AppleTV for movies and TV shows, and of course music, music videos. I'm not saying its for everyone, and most of my media is still enjoyed from my Mac, but its a useful item for me
     
  18. jaw04005 macrumors 601

    jaw04005

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2003
    Location:
    AR
    #18
    The next version of Microsoft's Windows Media Center supports ripped DVDs (Video_TS). It has full DVD menu support. However, it's not due out until Windows 7 ships in Q4 2009 at the earliest.
     
  19. NeoMayhem macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2003
    #19
    Isnt it legal under the DMCA to bypass copy protection schemes in order to play content you own on the device of your choice? (I know the RIAA/MPAA disagree with this)
     
  20. BoulderBum macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2008
    #20
    I think the Apple approach just makes things simpler/more streamlined.

    You still get subtitles if you want, and you still have chapter selection (press and hold the "Ok" button) and "about" info (press the up arrow twice), but most of it is concealed behind what you want to do in the first place; Think about it: 99% of the time you put the DVD in the player, what do you want to do? Watch the movie, right?

    Well, with a DVD, you may have to navigate one or several menus to eventually accomplish that task so it's labor intensive and inefficient. With Apple TV, you just select the video and it's ready to go.

    I think another thing to consider is that the Apple content isn't designed solely for use with a TV. You can also take your movies and TV shows with you on your iPod/iPhone, where menus don't make a whole lot of sense (screen is too small, and iPod controls weren't necessarily made to navigate DVD menus).

    It is sort of a bummer that you miss out on special features that come on DVD's sometimes, but given the other advantages, it's worth it, IMO.
     
  21. hitekalex macrumors 68000

    hitekalex

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2008
    Location:
    Chicago, USA
    #21
    You don't have to miss out on anything. If a DVD comes with a special feature you want to keep - just rip/encode that extra feature as a separate title. Latest aTV v2.3 allows to group multiple parts of the movies into the same logical feature. So you can easily group "extras" with the main feature, pretty much what you would have with original DVD.
     
  22. VideoFreek macrumors 6502

    VideoFreek

    Joined:
    May 12, 2007
    Location:
    Philly
    #22
    Absolutely not! The DMCA outlaws circumvention of "access control measures" (e.g., DVD CSS) period, regardless of purpose or intent. This is why the DMCA is a bad law, because it does not discriminate between criminal and legitimate uses, and thereby tramples on consumer rights that were pretty well established before the law came along. For example, the right to make one backup copy of a disk in case the original is damaged.

    The proposition that consumers ought to be able to play content on ANY device of their choosing is a lot shakier, legally speaking. In general, copyright law gives content owners pretty broad control over their content, so that if for example a Hollywood studio decides that they want to charge you extra for the right to play a movie on your iPod or from your media server, they can do it. I'm not saying I agree with this approach (I don't), I'm just saying that's the law. And, at least in the USA, people often cite "fair use" to refute this, but this is incorrect. Fair use doctrine is poorly-understood by most people, but the key thing to understand is that what is "fair use" is determined case-by-case in court, so that essentially fair use is whatever a court says it is. And therein lies the problem with this topic--very little of this has been tested in court YET.
     
  23. voodoofish macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2004
    Location:
    London
    #23
    Where do your DVDs come from? Elgato's turbo.264 will include soft Closed Captions automatically in the files it converts, which can be toggled on and off, but it will only do this from discs which have Closed Captioning on them, it doesn't work with regular subtitles. US discs often have closed captions but European discs never do (or at least I've never seen one with closed captioning) - they only have ordinary subtitles (whereas US discs can have both). However, turbo.264 will only support one language track in the file (it will add a AAC track and AC3 of that same language tho).
     
  24. kolax macrumors G3

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2007
    #24
    Doesn't the OS X DVD Player do that for ripped DVD's too..
     
  25. sandman42 macrumors 6502a

    sandman42

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2003
    Location:
    Seattle
    #25
    Couldn't've said it better. Unfortunately, this is all true as I understand it too. I don't like it any more than anyone else, but I think it's important we understand what the scope and intent of the existing law is.
     

Share This Page