Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
Apple suite is the forgotten child no body pays attention to it and idk why they are still keeping it. I think they should release a Windows+Linux version and add it as part of the iCloud subscribers program. I remember in mid 2000s they used to brag about iMovie and iTunes.

I am not a PRO but I had more pleasant time using Pages over Word, at least the online Word version. Numbers should get most people by. Keynote is better than PowerPoint I think. Apple should be more serious with this.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sorgo †
I use Pages all the time as a professional copywriter, ghostwriter, and pulp fiction maniac. It is simple to use, compatible with Word, free, and hasn't irritated me one bit... except for when they dumbed the program down to match the iOS version!

Though I will admit I supplement Pages with Grammarly to replace the grammar checker, Scrivener to organize the story/export the document, and AutoCrit to sanity-check my material before sending it to an editor.
 
Apple suite is the forgotten child no body pays attention to it and idk why they are still keeping it. I think they should release a Windows+Linux version and add it as part of the iCloud subscribers program. I remember in mid 2000s they used to brag about iMovie and iTunes.

I am not a PRO but I had more pleasant time using Pages over Word, at least the online Word version. Numbers should get most people by. Keynote is better than PowerPoint I think. Apple should be more serious with this.
I pay attention to it - it is what I use for our real estate side business. I use pages for our company documents and numbers for cost/revenue models and forecasts and Keynote. With its current features - its better than Google Docs or whatever they call it now. I even went back to Apple Mail on the Mac now that they added the new features there.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Morod
I pay attention to it - it is what I use for our real estate side business. I use pages for our company documents and numbers for cost/revenue models and forecasts and Keynote. With its current features - its better than Google Docs or whatever they call it now. I even went back to Apple Mail on the Mac now that they added the new features there.

Very interesting. You are the first I meet that says he uses Apple suite for business. Most people who work in business will immediately say "Excel"
 
Very interesting. You are the first I meet that says he uses Apple suite for business. Most people who work in business will immediately say "Excel"
You just met a second. Professional writer, editor, and general madman behind the keyboard. I got hooked on iWork '09 and have used Pages and Numbers on a near-daily basis ever since.
 
You just met a second. Professional writer, editor, and general madman behind the keyboard. I got hooked on iWork '09 and have used Pages and Numbers on a near-daily basis ever since.

how does compatibility work when you share your files with others?
 
how does compatibility work when you share your files with others?
No problems for my purposes. I have never encountered an error when sending an exported Word document. However, I will say this: I do what most professional writers neglect to do when it comes to preserving their work. I export everything, at every stage, to PDF. That way it is a simple copy/paste to replace everything if Murphy’s Law decides to rain on my parade. Plus doing so provides liability protection by providing proof of work in case of a legal dispute later on.

For my ghostwriting work, I share everything through iCloud and iWork Online. The program allows for realtime collaboration, even with PC users, making it easy enough to do everything I need to do. When I export everything, it is invariably handled by a specialist app like Vellum or Kindle Create. I have never encountered an issue when using exported documents with those apps, either.

Considering Amazon has recently started treating ePubs as first class citizens on KDP, I will have to experiment to see if the built-in ePub export tool in Pages is up to snuff.

The new Freeform app will make my life a great deal easier. Using mind mapping will help me turn complex outlines, often going into the dozens of pages, into easily understood graphics. When working with clients trying to bring their story concepts to life, a picture is easily worth a hundred thousand words!

I do have Microsoft Office installed on my computer as an emergency backup. I have loaded Word exactly once in the last five years, though not for file compatibility issues. I was working as a senior copy editor for a marketing agency and one of my writers used Word. He needed a feature built into the program and I had to refresh my memory as to how to access it. Since the material covered confidential client information, ethically I couldn’t move it to my iCloud account so I had to use Word in that one instance. Lol.
 
No problems for my purposes. I have never encountered an error when sending an exported Word document. However, I will say this: I do what most professional writers neglect to do when it comes to preserving their work. I export everything, at every stage, to PDF. That way it is a simple copy/paste to replace everything if Murphy’s Law decides to rain on my parade. Plus doing so provides liability protection by providing proof of work in case of a legal dispute later on.

For my ghostwriting work, I share everything through iCloud and iWork Online. The program allows for realtime collaboration, even with PC users, making it easy enough to do everything I need to do. When I export everything, it is invariably handled by a specialist app like Vellum or Kindle Create. I have never encountered an issue when using exported documents with those apps, either.

Considering Amazon has recently started treating ePubs as first class citizens on KDP, I will have to experiment to see if the built-in ePub export tool in Pages is up to snuff.

The new Freeform app will make my life a great deal easier. Using mind mapping will help me turn complex outlines, often going into the dozens of pages, into easily understood graphics. When working with clients trying to bring their story concepts to life, a picture is easily worth a hundred thousand words!

I do have Microsoft Office installed on my computer as an emergency backup. I have loaded Word exactly once in the last five years, though not for file compatibility issues. I was working as a senior copy editor for a marketing agency and one of my writers used Word. He needed a feature built into the program and I had to refresh my memory as to how to access it. Since the material covered confidential client information, ethically I couldn’t move it to my iCloud account so I had to use Word in that one instance. Lol.

-How do you collaborate with other PC users using iCloud and iWork online? they choose to use that too?

-I thought people want a .docx file for work meanwhile you use pdf?

-If you have Office installed why do you prefer pages? honestly asking
 
-How do you collaborate with other PC users using iCloud and iWork online? they choose to use that too?

-I thought people want a .docx file for work meanwhile you use pdf?

-If you have Office installed why do you prefer pages? honestly asking
1) The collaboration feature built into the Mac and iOS/iPadOS versions of iWork is a cinch to use. It creates a link that is emailed to the client. They click it and the online version of iWork for iCloud pops up in their preferred browser. They can sign in with their iCloud account or just access the document with the permissions I had set in the link. Additionally, if they are using a Mac or iOS/iPadOS the link will launch the file directly in the corresponding app. Assuming it is installed on their device, that is.
It works wonders for PC users, especially those running supported versions of Windows 10 and 11.
Once in, it is the same experience as using Google Docs, except more of the features are revealed to the user and I know everything that is done isn’t going to change upon export.

2) The PDFs aren’t really meant to be used except if all heck breaks loose. As I said, they provide a way of accessing the content if something weird happens and I wind up on a totally different device. A PDF, especially a simple one with just text, can be opened on a Windows 95 computer. The DOCX file format? No so much. I found myself in that situation in 2018. Yes: 2018. Windows 95 stopped being supported in 2001.

I would save the material as plain text files, but then I would be in even worse shape in protecting myself from potential liability issues.

Having multiple PDFs showing my progress on the project can make all the difference in a jury trial. Many people are inherently suspicious of word processing documents since they can easily be changed. Thus, I can say I had it up and didn’t change it after X, and even have the time stamps to prove it, but the less technically inclined may not believe it. Especially if the person suing me spins a sob story. PDFs are widely considered by many to be a pain in the caboose to change, so this is less of a problem.

I have never been sued, but am operating on the advice of a lawyer with experience handling cases like that. An ounce of prevention is worth a couple hundred grand in lawyer fees!

3) That is like saying “Why are you using a desktop app when you can just point your browser to Google Docs?” I have a one-time-paid version of Office floating around for emergency situations where nothing else works. It never happens, since everyone tries to be compatible with each other nowadays. I use Pages and Numbers since they have the features I need, none of the features I don’t, integrate with a cloud based system that I already pay for, doesn’t cost me any extra to use them, and have never failed me.
I can tell you horror stories about having to use Google Docs, Office 365, Zoho, and other niche apps over the course of my career. My clients, and employers, all insisted upon them. They all inevitably messed up. Last summer Google Docs lost an emergency project that I, as an editor, and two of my writers spent several days on. Literally poof! Thankfully, I had a backup. Google refused to help even though the company paid for advanced archival tools. We still lost several hours’ work, but it could have been vastly worse.
iCloud only messed up on me once, and that was during the transition from MobileMe to iCloud. I had an old Pages document that was synced to iDisk and tried moving it over. Apple’s team actually fixed the problem for me within a half hour, while I was on the phone with them. I use it since I can trust it. Even then, with the PDFs stored off the cloud, I have a backup in case something goes wrong.
 
Last edited:
I use Pages all the time as a professional copywriter, ghostwriter, and pulp fiction maniac. It is simple to use, compatible with Word, free, and hasn't irritated me one bit... except for when they dumbed the program down to match the iOS version!

Though I will admit I supplement Pages with Grammarly to replace the grammar checker, Scrivener to organize the story/export the document, and AutoCrit to sanity-check my material before sending it to an editor.
If you are ever looking for an amazing package to check writing, take a look at Antidote 11. It’s a big name for French proof checking, but the English version of it is just as excellent.
 
Last edited:
1) The collaboration feature built into the Mac and iOS/iPadOS versions of iWork is a cinch to use. It creates a link that is emailed to the client. They click it and the online version of iWork for iCloud pops up in their preferred browser. They can sign in with their iCloud account or just access the document with the permissions I had set in the link. Additionally, if they are using a Mac or iOS/iPadOS the link will launch the file directly in the corresponding app. Assuming it is installed on their device, that is.
It works wonders for PC users, especially those running supported versions of Windows 10 and 11.
Once in, it is the same experience as using Google Docs, except more of the features are revealed to the user and I know everything that is done isn’t going to change upon export.

2) The PDFs aren’t really meant to be used except if all heck breaks loose. As I said, they provide a way of accessing the content if something weird happens and I wind up on a totally different device. A PDF, especially a simple one with just text, can be opened on a Windows 95 computer. The DOCX file format? No so much. I found myself in that situation in 2018. Yes: 2018. Windows 95 stopped being supported in 2001.

I would save the material as plain text files, but then I would be in even worse shape in protecting myself from potential liability issues.

Having multiple PDFs showing my progress on the project can make all the difference in a jury trial. Many people are inherently suspicious of word processing documents since they can easily be changed. Thus, I can say I had it up and didn’t change it after X, and even have the time stamps to prove it, but the less technically inclined may not believe it. Especially if the person suing me spins a sob story. PDFs are widely considered by many to be a pain in the caboose to change, so this is less of a problem.

I have never been sued, but am operating on the advice of a lawyer with experience handling cases like that. An ounce of prevention is worth a couple hundred grand in lawyer fees!

3) That is like saying “Why are you using a desktop app when you can just point your browser to Google Docs?” I have a one-time-paid version of Office floating around for emergency situations where nothing else works. It never happens, since everyone tries to be compatible with each other nowadays. I use Pages and Numbers since they have the features I need, none of the features I don’t, integrate with a cloud based system that I already pay for, doesn’t cost me any extra to use them, and have never failed me.
I can tell you horror stories about having to use Google Docs, Office 365, Zoho, and other niche apps over the course of my career. My clients, and employers, all insisted upon them. They all inevitably messed up. Last summer Google Docs lost an emergency project that I, as an editor, and two of my writers spent several days on. Literally poof! Thankfully, I had a backup. Google refused to help even though the company paid for advanced archival tools. We still lost several hours’ work, but it could have been vastly worse.
iCloud only messed up on me once, and that was during the transition from MobileMe to iCloud. I had an old Pages document that was synced to iDisk and tried moving it over. Apple’s team actually fixed the problem for me within a half hour, while I was on the phone with them. I use it since I can trust it. Even then, with the PDFs stored off the cloud, I have a backup in case something goes wrong.

-I didn't know about the link thing. Interesting.

-I do not understand you about protecting yourself from the law by using PDF documents? Why are you so much under threat? you even keep time stamps.

-I am surprised to hear Google lost you document. These guys never lose anything, their game is data collection and storage with multiple version backups. Usually its the other way around, someone wants something deleted from their servers but they keep many backups. Maybe it was something wrong on your end? Amazed by Apple support they had employees to bring 1 file back to 1 consumer! I do not imagine myself calling a trillion dollar company telling them, hey my file is lost please bring it back.
 
1) Yeah, Apple has been trumpeting this feature for the last three years or so. You would have to be interested in the software to notice it, though. Considering they just stuffed the collaboration features in between all the rest, it was easy to miss.

2) Not the law. I operate fully within the law as a writer and editor. Additionally, I hold myself to the highest ethical standards when working with clients. Sometimes the clients don’t act in a similar vein. Thus, lawsuits.

Idiots on jury pools who don’t understand technology are by far the bigger concern. As I said, they tend to put more stock in PDFs than Word docs with time stamps. Especially if they don’t have any idea how to operate a computer.

I am not under threat, per say. It is just foolish to merely exist, let alone work, in our overly litigious society without taking some steps to protect yourself. If spending a few extra minutes on a project keeps me from dealing with a civil lawsuit later on by a client that wasn’t quite happy… Strong contracts, good lawyers, and always being prepared are all key to keeping your business insurance premiums low and time spent dealing with said lawyers to a minimum!

3) I was also a paid member of MobileMe at the time. Part of the service was increased support if something like that happened. Since it was connected with moving stuff from the MobileMe to the iCloud platforms…

Yeah, I was surprised about the document going missing as well. Up until that point my issues with Google Workspace mainly revolved around permissions and exporting documents. After that incident I implemented a policy of using Google Drive merely to share completed work or things that required immediate collaboration. And those instances required a designated team member to manually export everything on a regular basis.

The rest of the time my writers, and myself, kept what we were working on off the network. It wasn’t that big of a deal since the average project only took an hour or so to write and maybe ten minutes for me to edit.
-I didn't know about the link thing. Interesting.

-I do not understand you about protecting yourself from the law by using PDF documents? Why are you so much under threat? you even keep time stamps.

-I am surprised to hear Google lost you document. These guys never lose anything, their game is data collection and storage with multiple version backups. Usually its the other way around, someone wants something deleted from their servers but they keep many backups. Maybe it was something wrong on your end? Amazed by Apple support they had employees to bring 1 file back to 1 consumer! I do not imagine myself calling a trillion dollar company telling them, hey my file is lost please bring it back.
 
1) Yeah, Apple has been trumpeting this feature for the last three years or so. You would have to be interested in the software to notice it, though. Considering they just stuffed the collaboration features in between all the rest, it was easy to miss.

2) Not the law. I operate fully within the law as a writer and editor. Additionally, I hold myself to the highest ethical standards when working with clients. Sometimes the clients don’t act in a similar vein. Thus, lawsuits.

Idiots on jury pools who don’t understand technology are by far the bigger concern. As I said, they tend to put more stock in PDFs than Word docs with time stamps. Especially if they don’t have any idea how to operate a computer.

I am not under threat, per say. It is just foolish to merely exist, let alone work, in our overly litigious society without taking some steps to protect yourself. If spending a few extra minutes on a project keeps me from dealing with a civil lawsuit later on by a client that wasn’t quite happy… Strong contracts, good lawyers, and always being prepared are all key to keeping your business insurance premiums low and time spent dealing with said lawyers to a minimum!

3) I was also a paid member of MobileMe at the time. Part of the service was increased support if something like that happened. Since it was connected with moving stuff from the MobileMe to the iCloud platforms…

Yeah, I was surprised about the document going missing as well. Up until that point my issues with Google Workspace mainly revolved around permissions and exporting documents. After that incident I implemented a policy of using Google Drive merely to share completed work or things that required immediate collaboration. And those instances required a designated team member to manually export everything on a regular basis.

The rest of the time my writers, and myself, kept what we were working on off the network. It wasn’t that big of a deal since the average project only took an hour or so to write and maybe ten minutes for me to edit.

I am just confused that a ghostwriter needs to protect himself. Isn't a ghostwriter someone who writes novels and in the end have some famous author put his name on the novel? Can't see how you can be sued.
 
I am just confused that a ghostwriter needs to protect himself. Isn't a ghostwriter someone who writes novels and in the end have some famous author put his name on the novel? Can't see how you can be sued.
Ok. Imagine this situation: you write in a specific style. Everyone knows it. You have a ton of samples in it. You are hired to write a novel. In this case it is science fiction. The client knows you write a certain way and acknowledges it in the contract. No problem, right?

Six months of heck follows. You get a story outline done, approved, and have put in all the legwork for it. Character development, scene research, themes, etc. etc. You are good to go. So, you type the first part of the book. Just 5,000 words.

Client changes his mind and demands something completely different. So you go back to the drawing board. Get approvals for everything and try again. Client again changes his mind. Back to the drawing board for a third concept. Six months of this.

After 100,000 words written, just in trying to get the first dang 5,000 words of the story done, the client demands a full refund claiming you are too expensive and not what they expected. Mind you - dozens of different ideas were approved. The samples were reviewed. You kept your end of the bargain.

The client threatens to sue, claiming you did nothing. What would you do at this point? Lose six month's income and wash your hands of everything? Or do you archive everything you have done, every conversation, every approved outline and attempted story scene, and send it to the lawyer?

This happened to me in 2017. Client threatened to sue. I had my lawyer talk to his and drive home the point that I should have been charging the guy triple what he paid just in time spent. He then went around and tried to defame me with other potential clients. My lawyer threatened to expose this by revealing everything, since I put a clause in the contract withdrawing confidentiality in the event of defamation or misrepresentation by the client.

That got him to bugger off.
 
After 100,000 words written, just in trying to get the first dang 5,000 words of the story done, the client demands a full refund claiming you are too expensive and not what they expected. Mind you - dozens of different ideas were approved. The samples were reviewed. You kept your end of the bargain.

The client threatens to sue, claiming you did nothing. What would you do at this point? Lose six month's income and wash your hands of everything? Or do you archive everything you have done, every conversation, every approved outline and attempted story scene, and send it to the lawyer?

It never cease to amaze me how evil people can be. The idea I had before though is that you would be getting a paid salary by the client. In case of a publisher, he would sign a contract with the publisher and you are just an employee at the publisher so you can't be sued but maybe your publisher.
 
It never cease to amaze me how evil people can be. The idea I had before though is that you would be getting a paid salary by the client. In case of a publisher, he would sign a contract with the publisher and you are just an employee at the publisher so you can't be sued but maybe your publisher.
I sometimes work like that. In those situations, I would be sending everything to the publisher and they would have their lawyers do the talking.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MacBH928
Wow. They completely removed sharing to PDF or anything but .numbers via mail. The docs still refer to the now non-existing "Share a Copy" item in the file menu. Who allowed this to be released?
 
Register on MacRumors! This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.