Apple's Best of the iTunes Store 2014: 'Elevate' and 'Pixelmator' Win Top App Honors

[temhawk]

Pixelmator being chosen as winner over Affinity Designer is ********. Designer is the far better app. I'm almost certain Pixelmator Team and Apple have some kind of deal. They're constantly winning these awards and "top picks" even though Pixelmator is an unstable, cumbersome piece piece of junk!

Please don't listen to kd5jos's ill advice. Serif needs to make Affinity Photo and squash Pixelmator.

Serif is way, waaaaay more competent than Pixelmator Team.

 

[dalecook]

Pixelmator being chosen as winner over Affinity Designer is ********. Designer is the far better app. I'm almost certain Pixelmator Team and Apple have some kind of deal. They're constantly winning these awards and "top picks" even though Pixelmator is an unstable, cumbersome piece piece of junk!

Please don't listen to kd5jos's ill advice. Serif needs to make Affinity Photo and squash Pixelmator.

Serif is way, waaaaay more competent than Pixelmator Team.

Thanks for the support - the team are on it.

In this case Pixelmator won in the iPad app category while Affinity Designer was runner up for the Mac. So we well and truly kicked the behinds of every other Mac design app out there.

 

[MyopicPaideia]

I was really hoping this could mean that Monument Valley would finally be on sale some amount.

(Hey man, it's not that I'm cheap. I'm just not sure $7 [including the additional levels] is worth the time I'd spend with it.)

If you spend more time with it than you do eating a value meal at McDonald's then it is more than worth it.

 

[MyopicPaideia]

I do. And nearly 5 mil daily users do too.

http://thinkgaming.com/app-sales-data/1/clash-of-clans/

I'm not debating that people play it, obviously they do, otherwise it wouldn't be the top grossing app on the App Store. I'm just wondering who all these people are? I've never actually seen anyone playing it, whether that be on my daily train commute, at work in the office, or anywhere else, and we've got a lot of young sales people with iPhones and iPads in the office.

My kids are too young yet, so neither they or their friends are playing it yet...they're still on Sesame Street and similar learning/educational apps.

I see these banner and in app ads for it all over the place, but have never actually seen it being played. Aren't there way better premium strategy empire building games out there that aren't freemium?

It probably is 12+ or so?

 

[kd5jos]

Pixelmator being chosen as winner over Affinity Designer is ********. Designer is the far better app. I'm almost certain Pixelmator Team and Apple have some kind of deal. They're constantly winning these awards and "top picks" even though Pixelmator is an unstable, cumbersome piece piece of junk!

Please don't listen to kd5jos's ill advice. Serif needs to make Affinity Photo and squash Pixelmator.

Serif is way, waaaaay more competent than Pixelmator Team.

WOW, you mad bro?

Affinity Designer is a great app. I think I stated as much when I said that I would switch (from iDraw) as soon as an iPad app was available. You then move on to a conspiracy theory (which REALLY brings your post into question). Then you conclude by assuming that your experience with something is everybody's experience. I don't see how you are offering better advice after attacking mine. However it is quite easy to explain why my advice matters.

The reality of the situation is this. Pixelmator needs to focus on what they do best. What they do best is raster image editing. Affinity needs to focus on what they do best. What they do best is vector based graphics. Pixelmator has resources committed to raster editing. Affinity has resources committed to vector image editing. If both companies come together in a partnership committing all of their own resources to what they do best, you have the resources of Pixelmator PLUS the resources of Affinity creating a "suite" that can go up against Adobe.

If Pixelmator makes a raster editor and a vector editor then Pixelmators resources are divided between the two. If Affinity does this as well, then Affinity can not use all of their resources to do what they do best. Create a vector editor. You then have fewer resources from either team attempting to beat something that is well entrenched. There will be a lot of wasted time and effort.

Get rid of the infighting, commit your resources to working together and becoming more. If you and Pixelmator worked together, brought on Hype (used to create HTML5 based motion graphics), maybe iStudio Publisher (though they have stagnated)... The point is if everyone committed 100% of their resources to what they did best, you'd have a Suite that could rival CS. THAT is how you dethrone Adobe. Heck, I even provided the math...

I personally believe "ill" advice comes from emotional reactions.

 

[temhawk]

kd5jos: Pixelmator Team is incompetent. That is all.

 

[kd5jos]

kd5jos: Pixelmator Team is incompetent. That is all.

If you have some evidence of this, I invite you to provide it. You've claimed it twice. You still have not supported the claim.

To you, based on your experience with them, this may be true. Obviously it is not based on everyones experience, or it wouldn't have a huge following, would it? THAT, is all.

"Serif is way, waaaaay more competent than Pixelmator Team."

What scale did you use to measure this? How do you conclusively demonstrate it? I'd say both teams are very competent and that this isn't an either or situation. The best solution for all parties involved is a both/and approach.

 

[dalecook]

Affinity needs to focus on what they do best. What they do best is vector based graphics.

There's lots happening; Affinity Photo and Affinity Publisher are already part-written and on a common code base with Affinity Designer. When the suite is complete the apps will share around 80% of their code and this will be one of the suite's strengths. Serif has already been making graphics, image editing and desktop publishing software for decades so hopefully you will soon see that Affinity Designer is only the start of the new era, not a single competency.

Thanks again for the kind comments and support you're all showing the team!

 

[temhawk]

kd5jos: Yeah, I do. I've been using Pixelmator for 7 years - since its release. How long have you been using Pixelmator?

I've used Pixelmator on various machines, so I'm fairly certain that my experience does say a lot about Pixelmator Team.

The thing is that Pixelmator is great for small edits. It works well for short periods of time for simple things. Once you spend a little longer than 10 minutes on a project, that's when things start breaking left and right. So, my only explanation for Pixelmator's success is that most people spend very little time with it or I've been repeatedly given different builds than everyone else...

And yeah, I do have specific evidence for all of the problems I've had with Pixelmator. I have written it all down in a TXT file on my desktop. It's not formatted or written very clearly because it was intended for me to keep track of it, but if you really want to waste my time I'll show it to you. I think I even still have some installers of older versions of Pixelmator (and a 10.6.8 partition) so I could even record some of the bugs for you.

 

[kd5jos]

There's lots happening; Affinity Photo and Affinity Publisher are already part-written and on a common code base with Affinity Designer. When the suite is complete the apps will share around 80% of their code and this will be one of the suite's strengths. Serif has already been making graphics, image editing and desktop publishing software for decades so hopefully you will soon see that Affinity Designer is only the start of the new era, not a single competency.

Thanks again for the kind comments and support you're all showing the team!

Dale,

I have no doubt that you will produce a quality app. It is not my contention that you will fail at doing so. In fact, I suspect that when it comes out, I will have to evaluate it against what I currently use and see which is better.

The point I am making is that there is no such thing as someone that does everything perfectly. Adobe is my case in point. They try to be everything to everyone, and now everybody is looking for something better. Why? Because their please everyone with everything model isn't pleasing enough people.

The fact of the matter is people remember entities that are good at one thing. That focus (the term focus has to do with a single point for a reason) is what drives the individual to become the best at that thing. Could Bo play other sports, sure. When you think about basketball, does Michael Jordan come to mind? I bet he does.

It's great that Serif will be coming out with a raster editor. It really is. But there is an opportunity cost for trying to do everything so well. Adobe is paying it now. This is why I keep recommending that you work with Pixelmator. Bring their fan base into your fold, and bring your fan base into their fold. They have 3 or 4 million users. Could your company benefit from that? I bet it could.

They are already where you want to be. You have some ideas that would help them. I'l bet they have ideas that would benefit your company. Why try and go this alone when you don't have to, and benefit from not going solo? Jut opinion I know, but some pretty strongly supported opinion.

 

[temhawk]

kd5jos: I don't think Serif needs your advice. They have made Designer and if it is to be any indication I have full confidence in Serif and in dalecook, who I'm glad is not having any of your ****.

 

[kd5jos]

kd5jos: Yeah, I do. I've been using Pixelmator for 7 years - since its release. How long have you been using Pixelmator?

Since it's release.

I've used Pixelmator on various machines, so I'm fairly certain that my experience does say a lot about Pixelmator Team.

Me too, but irrelevant.

The thing is that Pixelmator is great for small edits. It works well for short periods of time for simple things. Once you spend a little longer than 10 minutes on a project, that's when things start breaking left and right.

I've done hours of editing with no problem. This is why your statement above is irrelevant. If I have only ever used the recent build of Pixelmator, and it has worked for hours, it doesn't matter if I have used every build before it.

So, my only explanation for Pixelmator's success is that most people spend very little time with it or I've been repeatedly given different builds than everyone else...

Or I must be getting different builds than everyone else right? And your assumption that everyone else is doing ten minutes of work is based on your opinion, again. Sorry you haven't really offered any evidence of the claim of incompetence yet...

And yeah, I do have specific evidence for all of the problems I've had with Pixelmator. I have written it all down in a TXT file on my desktop. It's not formatted or written very clearly because it was intended for me to keep track of it, but if you really want to waste my time I'll show it to you. I think I even still have some installers of older versions of Pixelmator (and a 10.6.8 partition) so I could even record some of the bugs for you.

Now for a huge dose of reality. You could have other software installed that is causing problems with Pixelmator. It can happen. This is part of why Apple instituted sandboxing.

The point I'm making is, you keep leveling a claim. You haven't supported it. I can't see how some bugs in software indicates incompetence. Otherwise EVERY software developer would be incompetent. So again, this falls on you to prove your claim, because you have not.

 

[dalecook]

They are already where you want to be. You have some ideas that would help them. I'l bet they have ideas that would benefit your company. Why try and go this alone when you don't have to, and benefit from not going solo? Jut opinion I know, but some pretty strongly supported opinion.

I disagree and don't know what else to say, except maybe to use hindsight later on. Look at the situation again in a year, perhaps again in a couple of years, I predict it will be quite different. Serif's creating something special and it's worth waiting for. The passion we all have for this sector will be rewarded!

Thx, Dale.

 

[kd5jos]

kd5jos: I don't think Serif needs your advice. They have made Designer and if it is to be any indication I have full confidence in Serif and in dalecook, who I'm glad is not having any of your ****.

So am I to understand your emotional "rah-rah" is in some way more valuable or valid than the facts I have presented? I have noticed you can't argue against any of the facts, so what I am saying must have some merit.

Next, good advice is good advice even if it is ignored. Can you succeed choosing the hard road? Sure. People have. And many have written memoirs saying, "gee I should have taken the easier road, I should have listened to advice given..."

Dale doesn't have to listen to me. He seems to be intelligent and reasonable. Some of his objections inside his company will be things like, "well, we already have projects under way, and we have committed resources..." This is valid. This is business. I respect that. He and I are having a reasonable public debate at the moment. But at the end of the day, I KNOW he does not have to listen to me, and I would be egocentric to think otherwise.

Is there a reason that you can not display the same respect that he is?

----------

I disagree and don't know what else to say, except maybe to use hindsight later on. Look at the situation again in a year, perhaps again in a couple of years, I predict it will be quite different. Serif's creating something special and it's worth waiting for. The passion we all have for this sector will be rewarded!

Thx, Dale.

Dale,

Thank you for the opportunity to express my opinion. I honestly hope that better software continues to be developed. That is my motivation in our conversation.

I look forward to replacing currently used software with better. Please, give me reason to. Thank you for your time.

 

[temhawk]

Me too, but irrelevant.

I've done hours of editing with no problem. This is why your statement above is irrelevant. If I have only ever used the recent build of Pixelmator, and it has worked for hours, it doesn't matter if I have used every build before it.

This is not irrelevant. Longer experience with more builds of an app is relevant when evaluating an app as a whole. How could it not be? I'm not criticizing the current version of Pixelmator - it has actually become more stable recently - I'm criticizing Pixelmator as a whole and, by extension, the developers, which I'm more qualified to do the more experience I've had with it, which, like I said, is a lot.

Or I must be getting different builds than everyone else right? And your assumption that everyone else is doing ten minutes of work is based on your opinion, again. Sorry you haven't really offered any evidence of the claim of incompetence yet...

I don't know, then. You must be lucky or something. All I know is what I've experienced and it is no less valid than your experience.

Now for a huge dose of reality. You could have other software installed that is causing problems with Pixelmator. It can happen. This is part of why Apple instituted sandboxing.

I can't imagine how an other app could randomly interfere with Pixelmator in so many different ways (my list of bugs is quite extensive and varied). I find it unlikely.

The point I'm making is, you keep leveling a claim. You haven't supported it. I can't see how some bugs in software indicates incompetence. Otherwise EVERY software developer would be incompetent. So again, this falls on you to prove your claim, because you have not.

My claim is supported by my experience. I'm not making this **** up!

Obviously every software has bugs. But the number and frequency of bugs certainly says something about the developers. How could it not? Incompetent developers create more bugs. That's a natural consequence.

Also, it's not just bugs that have upset me about Pixelmator. They have made some stupid decisions like removing the keyboard shortcut to toggle the visibility of floating windows (WHICH IS A NO-BRAINER) and removing the "Filters" menu in exchange for another floating window that shows you each filter with a gimmicky preview. Honestly, who needs those previews?

----------

So am I to understand your emotional "rah-rah" is in some way more valuable or valid than the facts I have presented? I have noticed you can't argue against any of the facts, so what I am saying must have some merit.

You have not presented any facts. You have made arguments.

Is there a reason that you can not display the same respect that he is?

I'm just being feisty. I hope you don't take it personally.

And, by the way, your argument (that Serif should try to complement Pixelmator) is ultimately flawed because, as you've said, they have already invested a lot into Affinity Photo and Affinity Publisher and they have a vision and they're not just going to drop all of that. They're going through with this and I'm excited about that!

 

[kd5jos]

My claim is supported by my experience. I'm not making this **** up!

I'm not saying you are. I am saying that if you have one experience, and I have another, we have to find a different way to determine truth than just your experience and my experience. That is what the scientific method is meant to help with.

Obviously every software has bugs. But the number and frequency of bugs certainly says something about the developers. How could it not? Incompetent developers create more bugs. That's a natural consequence.

And how many bugs is more bugs? How are you going to compare this? We have to isolate the number of developers involved, the size of the program, the number of releases.. What's your method? Simply declaring they have more bugs or an unreasonable number of bugs doesn't say anything other than you have an opinion.

Also, it's not just bugs that have upset me about Pixelmator. They have made some stupid decisions like removing the keyboard shortcut to toggle the visibility of floating windows (WHICH IS A NO-BRAINER) and

There is a difference between choosing to do something for a reason you have not been given, doing something for no reason, and doing something just to be spiteful. You have not demonstrated which of these the decision they made is...

removing the "Filters" menu in exchange for another floating window that shows you each filter with a gimmicky preview. Honestly, who needs those previews?

I like them. It works for me. Seems to work for a lot of other people too.

Now your argument is down to, "I don't like them." And that's fine. You don't have to like the Pixelmator team. Go ahead. You must have liked them enough to buy and upgrade and use Pixelmator. None of this invalidates the value of my recommendation or supports your claim of incompetence. Are we done yet?

 

[temhawk]

I'm not saying you are. I am saying that if you have one experience, and I have another, we have to find a different way to determine truth than just your experience and my experience. That is what the scientific method is meant to help with.

Okay, then. I guess we won't come to a conclusion any time soon.

And how many bugs is more bugs? How are you going to compare this? We have to isolate the number of developers involved, the size of the program, the number of releases.. What's your method? Simply declaring they have more bugs or an unreasonable number of bugs doesn't say anything other than you have an opinion.

The program should be stable enough to be used for its intended purposes with few interruptions. This doesn't have to be an exact science. Pixelmator, in my experience, had problems frequently and I have dozens of apps that I would consider stable, as opposed to Pixelmator. Put differently, if I were the developer of Pixelmator, I would not have released something with so many easy-to-encounter bugs out of self-respect. Again, this is my experience, and I'm sure if you'd had it, you would agree with me.

There is a difference between choosing to do something for a reason you have not been given, doing something for no reason, and doing something just to be spiteful. You have not demonstrated which of these the decision they made is...

I actually know the reason. The shortcut (tab) did not sit well with Apple's idea of HIGs (which is ******** because they violate it all of the time themselves) and Pixelmator Team, being the sycophants they are, just do whatever Apple tells them. And it works because they end up getting featured on the app store all the time.

It was a really useful feature and they removed it without offering an alternative. That was years ago and they still haven't come up with a solution.

I like them. It works for me. Seems to work for a lot of other people too.

Now your argument is down to, "I don't like them." And that's fine. You don't have to like the Pixelmator team. Go ahead.

True, but it's a fact that you cannot assign keyboard shortcuts to filters anymore, which is another one of those things that makes Pixelmator cumbersome to work with.

You must have liked them enough to buy and upgrade and use Pixelmator.

Yeah, like I said, Pixelmator is great for small edits that you cannot do with Preview. Also, their marketing is very good and every time there is a new version it makes me hope that they have sorted these problems out - and like I said, Pixelmator has been getting more stable recently, so there is hope - but I'm afraid it is too little too late with Affinity Photo coming out soon.

Are we done yet?

Sure. I can be.

 

[appleii.c]

Dale,

I have no doubt that you will produce a quality app. It is not my contention that you will fail at doing so. In fact, I suspect that when it comes out, I will have to evaluate it against what I currently use and see which is better.

The point I am making is that there is no such thing as someone that does everything perfectly. Adobe is my case in point. They try to be everything to everyone, and now everybody is looking for something better. Why? Because their please everyone with everything model isn't pleasing enough people.

...

I disagree and don't know what else to say, except maybe to use hindsight later on. Look at the situation again in a year, perhaps again in a couple of years, I predict it will be quite different. Serif's creating something special and it's worth waiting for. The passion we all have for this sector will be rewarded!

Thx, Dale.

I've been a long time Adobe user and I somewhat agree with kd5jos post about being all things to everyone. I haven't personally used Affinity or Pixelmator for more than just brief playing, but I have heard great things about both. I am currently in the market to switch from adobe and I'm glad to see more quality products being produced.

With that being said, I do feel that both Affinity and Pixelmator need to dabble in the others field (raster and vector). The reason being is that people tend to be brand loyal for the most part. We WANT a one stop shop as long as it suits our needs. If Affinity produces a great Image editing app and covers both areas well, while Pixelmator has the lone product, then Pixelmator could lose a few current customers, and many future customers. Same thing if only Pixexlmator does both apps. Either company cannot afford to sit on the one product.

I think either can survive and be very successful with both. Adobe was great when it was simply Illustrator and Photoshop. Its become a mess now with Incopy, Fireworks, Audition, Edge, Prelude and all the acquisitions. There are too many to even keep track of.

In the next two weeks I will be downloading both Affinity and Pixelmator and cancelling my CS subscription. And when each company comes out with their second product, I will likely choose one and stick to that company.

 

[kd5jos]

You have not presented any facts. You have made arguments.

Funny, the facts I have presented (that you either didn't read or ignored) are the same facts that economics and game theory use. Just because you ignore a fact, does not mean it is not a fact.

I'm just being feisty. I hope you don't take it personally.

No, being insulting is being insulting. Feisty does not have to include being insulting.

And, by the way, your argument (that Serif should try to complement Pixelmator) is ultimately flawed because, as you've said, they have already invested a lot into Affinity Photo and Affinity Publisher and they have a vision and they're not just going to drop all of that. They're going through with this and I'm excited about that!

Not really. Only Affinity knows how many resources and how much time have been committed. There is a huge financial potential for partnership. However, only Affinity can know if the potential exceeds the resources that have been committed.

Because of the polite discourse I have had with Affinity, I am taking their product seriously. I hope they can dethrone Pixelmator. Because if they can, I ultimately benefit. And that, is what I am excited for.

 

[Michaelgtrusa]

kd5jos: Pixelmator Team is incompetent. That is all.

How is that mate?

----------

WOW, you mad bro?

Affinity Designer is a great app. I think I stated as much when I said that I would switch (from iDraw) as soon as an iPad app was available. You then move on to a conspiracy theory (which REALLY brings your post into question). Then you conclude by assuming that your experience with something is everybody's experience. I don't see how you are offering better advice after attacking mine. However it is quite easy to explain why my advice matters.

The reality of the situation is this. Pixelmator needs to focus on what they do best. What they do best is raster image editing. Affinity needs to focus on what they do best. What they do best is vector based graphics. Pixelmator has resources committed to raster editing. Affinity has resources committed to vector image editing. If both companies come together in a partnership committing all of their own resources to what they do best, you have the resources of Pixelmator PLUS the resources of Affinity creating a "suite" that can go up against Adobe.

If Pixelmator makes a raster editor and a vector editor then Pixelmators resources are divided between the two. If Affinity does this as well, then Affinity can not use all of their resources to do what they do best. Create a vector editor. You then have fewer resources from either team attempting to beat something that is well entrenched. There will be a lot of wasted time and effort.

Get rid of the infighting, commit your resources to working together and becoming more. If you and Pixelmator worked together, brought on Hype (used to create HTML5 based motion graphics), maybe iStudio Publisher (though they have stagnated)... The point is if everyone committed 100% of their resources to what they did best, you'd have a Suite that could rival CS. THAT is how you dethrone Adobe. Heck, I even provided the math...

I personally believe "ill" advice comes from emotional reactions.

The two would be a great team.

 

[kd5jos]

Okay, then. I guess we won't come to a conclusion any time soon.

So, we are not going to use scientific method. Okay, it's a free for all then. I think Windows paint is best...

No, we can arrive at a reasonable conclusion, if we choose reason.

The program should be stable enough to be used for its intended purposes with few interruptions. This doesn't have to be an exact science.

You have said it does now, but didn't in the past. So the answer we seem to agree on is it does now.

Pixelmator, in my experience, had problems frequently and I have dozens of apps that I would consider stable, as opposed to Pixelmator.

Okay, but I am not here to argue arbitrary values. You still have unsupported claims to substantiate

Put differently, if I were the developer of Pixelmator, I would not have released something with so many easy-to-encounter bugs out of self-respect. Again, this is my experience, and I'm sure if you'd had it, you would agree with me.

This is meaningless, we have already covered it.

I actually know the reason. The shortcut (tab) did not sit well with Apple's idea of HIGs (which is ******** because they violate it all of the time themselves)

Okay, so APPLE has an opinion on something and made a recommendation. Pixelmator followed the recommendation. Good so far..

and Pixelmator Team, being the sycophants they are, just do whatever Apple tells them.

So sycophants do what is recommended by the people that build the OS they write software for? Sycophants listen to one of the most profitable companies on the planet? Or is there some other definition that supports your claim?

And it works because they end up getting featured on the app store all the time.

Because Apple is required to feature Applications that don't do what they ask/recommend/require? Your logic, it fails...

It was a really useful feature and they removed it without offering an alternative. That was years ago and they still haven't come up with a solution.

Because maybe their resources are best committed to something more important? It seems that not enough people are negatively effected by this? How do I know? Pixelmator is making a LOT of money.

True, but it's a fact that you cannot assign keyboard shortcuts to filters anymore, which is another one of those things that makes Pixelmator cumbersome to work with.

This I can agree with. It would be nice to be able to assign keyboard shortcuts to filters that are "most used." Then you could automate processing of images. I can't find a flaw in your logic here, and am even going to go over to Pixelmator's website and request it (along with everyone else that has).

Yeah, like I said, Pixelmator is great for small edits that you cannot do with Preview. Also, their marketing is very good and every time there is a new version it makes me hope that they have sorted these problems out - and like I said, Pixelmator has been getting more stable recently, so there is hope - but I'm afraid it is too little too late with Affinity Photo coming out soon.

I disagree with nothing here. I HOPE that something as good/better than Pixelmator comes along. This forces innovation. This forces development. The problem is Adobe has bigger coffers than either company alone.

You still have not supported your assertions. So, again, are we done yet?

 

[temhawk]

No, we can arrive at a reasonable conclusion, if we choose reason.

Can? Yes. Will? No. You haven't suggested a specific scientific approach and I don't think either of us have the time. Our little debate here is ultimately of no significance.

You have said it does now, but didn't in the past. So the answer we seem to agree on is it does now.

Sure, we can agree on that. In fact, I'm using Pixelmator right now and I've been using it since yesterday without any crashes or bugs. This is actually quite extraordinary.

Regarding the rest of your reply: whatever, I know my experiences and they are what they are and they have been bad. I don't want to debate this anymore. I asked you before to not take my bad manners personally but you clearly have.

 

[kd5jos]

Can? Yes. Will? No. You haven't suggested a specific scientific approach

I don't have to recommend anything. You are the one making positive claims that have no support. YOU have to do the work. I have just pointed out what work you have to do to make your claims valid. So far you have nothing valid to support what you have said.

and I don't think either of us have the time. Our little debate here is ultimately of no significance.

There is no debate that you have offered nothing substantive with your claims. I guess you have decided it is acceptable for you to voice claims and not support them. Okay, then what you say has no value based on your own determination.

Sure, we can agree on that. In fact, I'm using Pixelmator right now and I've been using it since yesterday without any crashes or bugs. This is actually quite extraordinary.

Great. So your assertion has even less support.

Regarding the rest of your reply: whatever, I know my experiences and they are what they are and they have been bad. I don't want to debate this anymore. I asked you before to not take my bad manners personally but you clearly have.

There is no excuse for bad manners. It's not required to have a debate. It does not help your argument. You look bad, period.

So at the end of this, you made claims, didn't support them, you insulted me, agree that your claims have no value, and have wasted both our time. You have made yourself look bad, and show that you have nothing substantive to say. Bravo. Well played.

 

[kd5jos]

This is not irrelevant. Longer experience with more builds of an app is relevant when evaluating an app as a whole. How could it not be?

Let's see what you say next...

I'm not criticizing the current version of Pixelmator - it has actually become more stable recently

This would be EXACTLY why, for one example.

- I'm criticizing Pixelmator as a whole and, by extension, the developers, which I'm more qualified to do the more experience I've had with it, which, like I said, is a lot.

So Pixelmator got a product on the market. Problems were found, and by your own admission, Pixelmator fixed them, and doesn't have those problems anymore.

Do you know what you are talking about when you claim someone is incompetent? It does not mean that they learn from their mistakes and improve their products over time. That is NOT a sign of incompetence.

For the record I could have said the exact same about... Apple OS (remember OS 7, 8, and 9), Windows (the glory days of Win95), Linux, and EVERY SOFTWARE PACKAGE EVER!

So, your abundance of this mythological qualification to complain is... not worth much obviously.

 

[temhawk]

Dear kd5jos, I'm not arguing with you anymore. You are not even listening to me. You do not attribute any capacity of rational thought to me. You actively try to interpret my statements in the worst possible way.

If I read my sentences as shallowly as you do, I agree with almost everything you've said. Your position makes perfect sense if I do not cut myself any slack and my starting point is that I'm a complete idiot.

You put unreasonable expectations on me to express myself with extreme care and precision. Please try to understand my view point.

If you could be less condescending to me I would be happy to continue talking. Until then I won't respond to any of the finer points you've made in your last two messages, as I feel like it would be a waste of time.