Apple's Director of Machine Learning Resigns Due to Return to Office Work

[jonnyb098]

Yeah, except you'd miss the real interaction with people. I think most people have no idea of the importance of seeing another human being face-to-face, instead of face-to-screen.
There are so many details, so many feelings that get filtered while having a face-to-screen conversation.
This I think will inevitably cause these people to be less in contact with reality, and in this specific job - but really, probably any job - it's paramount to be as connected to reality as possible.

This is so 100 percent spot on. We already have screwed an entire generation of kids keeping them home, test scores are lower than the lows they were before 2020. Cheating little kids out of learning and seeing human faces and social interaction. The collateral damage from the last two years will impact MANY MILLIONS more than the amount of people died from it.

But it’s all going according to plan. Siloing people even more and putting them against each other. Arguing over remote work or how many jabs they should stick their five year old with. Priming the pump for the metaverse where you never have to see another human in person, ever. What a time to be alive (sarcasm)

 

[Analog Kid]

Lol really? Show me 5 major corporations where the entire team is ok with work at home and allowed to do so now that pandemic is pretty much over and done with and has major expensive commercial property’s. Especially those with major impact on the world and is publicly traded not a small team of 100 or less.

I’ll wait.

Yep, most of where I hear about full WFH workforces is startups using it as a carrot to pull employees from other companies. I don't expect it to last. Over time, those companies will do one of the 3 things startups do: they'll go out of business and everyone will need to find another gig, they'll get acquired and have to conform to the policies of the new corporate overlords, or they'll be one of the very few that grows big enough quickly enough to remain independent and will have to figure out how to make WFH scale over a larger workforce or start to look more like a normal company with an office.

People forget how obsessive Apple was with bringing everyone that works for them to Cupertino before the pandemic even hit. They really believed on having their workforce colocated. It wasn't a productivity thing, it was a community building thing. And it wasn't to save cost, because it cost them a fortune to do that rather than open R&D offices in less expensive areas.

This is a phase. There was turmoil when WFH started, and there's going to be turmoil when it ends. If much of the tech world stays hybrid, and large parts of it might and possibly should, I think that will be as significant a change as we'll see.

 

[- rob -]

This article doesn’t mention it but the departure seems likely to coincide with the vesting schedule for his initial equity grant.

The reason that should be stated or at least mentioned, is because it offers more context on “why now?” than simply mentioning misgivings about required on site presence.

Apple should get on this train fast.

I also work fully remote and have for the past five years.

There are some teams, in Apple, where this probably just wouldn’t work, though.

For example, physical product design or prototyping.

Or even in working with products or devices that have not seen the light of day. These kinds of things need to be used and used a lot and that can only really be done in the safety of headquarters.

That said there’s far more jobs that should be allowed to be completely remote. So, in my mind it doesn’t have to be black-and-white.

In this case if the person is leadership I can see reasons to want to have them physically present. There are some people who do want to be in the office. If the team lead won’t do that, I think that could be a problem.

 

[The_Martini_Cat]

I’ll just say this. EVERY product Apple is shipping right now was designed with teams working remote. I own one of these products, And it’s really THE best. Ever. Evitty-Ev-Ev Ever.

 

[tridley68]

Good riddence to him now they will be able to get someone that appreciates Apple and it's company values

 

[Enlightened Doggo]

On the surface it seems like a silly reason to leave an otherwise great jon. However, if he or key members of his staff moved during the pandemic while everything was fully remote, then it makes a lot of sense to leave during that kind of turmoil caused by higher management.

 

[Whathappened]

It’s a free country. Everybody can leave if they feel they’ll be treated better somewhere else…

Nobody doubted that.

 

[Freeangel1]

Why do they Hire LAZY People?

WOW

 

[mikethemartian]

Possibly but is it enough for just him or for generational wealth? Hmmm.
Also he’s a director, not an executive.

That’s his business. He is an adult and can make his own financial decisions without input from you or me.

 

[Enlightened Doggo]

Because they want you back in the office instead of taking numerous breaks? Slacking off? Running and doing errands while on the clock?

There's evidence that productivity and working hours for office jobs went up during the pandemic. Also, a hallmark trait of terrible managers is they think their job is to babysit workers. The best engineering teams are going to be ones with managers that build upon individual autonomy and mastery through carefully designed processes.

 

[pmbooks]

Absolutely no reason for anyone to work in the office. Zoom/Teams is perfectly fine, and likely more efficient than being in an office. I mean, you at least save the hour or 2 you waste commuting every day.

In-person meetings/work are to zoom meetings as voice conversations are to texting. Not seeing the value of working in-person is like saying that not seeing faces is really no big deal.

 

[Boris Bronson]

On the surface it seems like a silly reason to leave an otherwise great jon. However, if he or key members of his staff moved during the pandemic while everything was fully remote, then it makes a lot of sense to leave during that kind of turmoil caused by higher management.

It’s not a great job if it’s impinging on your life and there is plenty of testimony that Apple considers they own your time 24/7. I mean some folk are happy to be ground to dust for a corporation but others might like to work hard but have time to enjoy the fruits of their labour.

I’m still laughing at the comments about making a stand. What’s likely happened is he’s pushed Apple to see if they would consider a policy change, they’ve said no, he’s quit and merely sent an email to his subs to explain the sudden departure. No grandstanding but it’s clear out blue collar conservative buddy here (not you) thinks work is like an episode of Trump-era The Apprentice. ?

 

[anthogag]

The guy was probably paid too much and he just left because he had better things to do.

 

[femike]

Even though I believe that Tim Cook should leave Apple, unless they have a valid reason to work from home they should come in. You really don't know what the real reason is here though. He may not like Tim Cook's agenda as many don't, could have family issues, has enough money anyway so can be choosey, lack of interest in the job, etc, and they are all valid reasons but only he knows.

 

[jdoyle]

Officially my workplace also wants me to work in office 3 days a week, but they dont enforce it. I barely go in these days yet I am doing some of my best work while WFH. We have O365, JIRA, Confluence, etc. I am actually more confident in meetings over Teams and have less technical problems running meetings in teams than trying to book a room and get the tech working in the meeting room to dial in people remotely. My company invested in analysing productivity while working remotely and found no drop at all and actually an improvement. So Apple, a tech company, can't be progressive and find a way to collaborate using tech? Bizarre. Post COVID there should be a new normal rather than trying to get every one back to the office. Its better for mental health, better for the environment. People can live and work where they want to and where they can afford. Come on Apple!!!

 

[Quu]

I feel most of their software development could be done from home. My own software team all work from home and if anything we're more productive now due to not wasting time traveling to and from the office and all the exhaustion and stress that causes. I had some employees who had to travel for an hour each morning and evening to/from work and that just sucks.

Also a fringe benefit to working from home is employees are able to work outside of normal hours on things. When you're writing software and you're in the zone you don't want to stop, you want to chase that motivation you have in the moment. So if you're up at 2am at home coding that's your prerogative and it wont happen in a physical work space, it's just not possible to travel into work at 2am to knock out some code. You clock out at 6 PM and go home and hope you still have that motivation the next day.

And you know sometimes I might code something on a friday, go home and when I come back on a monday it takes me an hour just to read the code and remember what it was I was doing with it. That's just not a thing now that I code from home because I stop and start projects on my own time, I might take a 15 minute break and come back to it. I might do some over the weekend just because it's enjoyable.

I can't speak to the experience for their workers who do hardware, I imagine it's a lot harder due to the need to produce prototypes, accept a lot of physical deliveries from component providers etc but for most software I think they could go remote and if anything produce better software, I speak from experience in that it didn't just work for us, it made us better.

 

[mactactic]

As someone who’s had a 20+ Year tech career in Silicon Valley you can’t have spontaneous collaboration while sitting on your ass at home!!

 

[Naraxus]

lol ! How is it vacationing if one is still producing the same quality and quantity of work ? No one was hired to work in a building, but only to fulfill the requirements of the job. Whether it's done onsite, remotely, in a suit, or pjs is mostly irrelevant.

But, it takes a certain mindset, experience with leadership, and maturity to realize this concept. Unfortunately, this clearly eludes you and others with a similar thought process, as is evident in this thread.

Apple hired them to work in their building, not at home. The job application didn't say "We're going to hire you to loaf at home for the duration of your employment." or does that concept elude you?

Apple clearly feels that they're not producing the same quality work at home as opposed to being in the office or does that concept elude you as well?

 

[DeepIn2U]

That’s his business. He is an adult and can make his own financial decisions without input from you or me.

You’re right.

Yet the topic at hand is not how much he has squirrelled away or how much he’s made, and it doesn’t seem his decision was financially based in any way from the quote of his send off email.

His decision is his and his alone. When and how he went about it …

That’s what the article opened up for discussion here, allowed by Macrumors.

But yes you’re right.

 

[thejadedmonkey]

At-home productivity will never equal at-work productivity. At-home discipline will never equal at-school discipline.

Speak for yourself. At my work, our metrics went up when we started working from home. There's a directive from above that we should begin transitioning away from work-from-home, and the director or our division said, and I'm paraphrasing now, "over my dead body".

 

[mikethemartian]

My experiences are not a topic of discussion here. Also you’d be assuming he is secure enough to do so.

I’ve been fired and adapted regardless and at a very quick pace except during the pandemic which wasn’t due to my work ethic, experience, nor education nor personality - EVERYONE was affected at getting any jobs during the pandemic.

Not sure what you’re trying at here.

So I ask back your question .. have you?

Your experiences are a topic of discussion since you have already elaborated on them.

I don’t mean fired. I mean quitting a job on your own terms because it just didn’t fit your needs anymore without having the security of knowing where your next paycheck will come from. I’ve done so plenty of times. I’ve quit secure easy well paying jobs before where I was basically doing nothing so I could work on something more intellectually challenging for a lot less money. I currently work as an electrical engineering contractor. Sometimes I am up and other times I have been way down. Currently I’m up but when my contract ends I may be back down. Life is a gamble.

 

[ghostface147]

I’m actually one of those who prefers to be in the office to work. I’m not productive at home.

 

[Rafterman]

This is so 100 percent spot on. We already have screwed an entire generation of kids keeping them home, test scores are lower than the lows they were before 2020. Cheating little kids out of learning and seeing human faces and social interaction. The collateral damage from the last two years will impact MANY MILLIONS more than the amount of people died from it.

But it’s all going according to plan. Siloing people even more and putting them against each other. Arguing over remote work or how many jabs they should stick their five year old with. Priming the pump for the metaverse where you never have to see another human in person, ever. What a time to be alive (sarcasm)

If a kid is a screw-up, its not because of not being face to face. A successful kid will succeed, whether in person or on-line. And a lot of that success or failure streams directly from the parent(s).

On one hand, parents complain about kids and teachers not being face to face. Then they send them to school - and complain that they are being taught history or social concepts that don't align with their political views. The schools can't win one way or the other.

 

[Dorv]

Yep, most of where I hear about full WFH workforces is startups using it as a carrot to pull employees from other companies. I don't expect it to last. Over time, those companies will do one of the 3 things startups do: they'll go out of business and everyone will need to find another gig, they'll get acquired and have to conform to the policies of the new corporate overlords, or they'll be one of the very few that grows big enough quickly enough to remain independent and will have to figure out how to make WFH scale over a larger workforce or start to look more like a normal company with an office.

I work for a Fortune 50ish company that was ~30% work from home and will be about 80% future state. It’s not just startups.

 

[hagjohn]

How many in total is employed by your organization?
What is their global reach / impact / availability to consumers or are they B2B?
Does your company focus on hardware sales as well as services and have major AI work to complete?

Many corporations implemented technology for the pandemic. In fact the ability to work remotely has been there for over a DECADE: VPNs + laptops or VMs + VPNs.

The only MAJOR thing corporations implemented was a huge switch to Slack/MS Teams or similar collaborative chat software (away from Skype for Business) and also going to Zoom, when Polycom and Tandberg owned by Cisco for a few years now. Mostly because major corporations didn’t and would not implement either former big tech for video conferencing in DZ or outside of firewall and traditionally wouldn’t allow outside connections in, nor pay for a fleet of licenses for software for Polycom on laptops. Androids and iPhones existed for a long time so its not that we’re more mobile, again this has been there for over a decade now. its the ease of use of Zoom that once they encrypted traffics corporations flocked to it since you COULD use it on laptops, tablets and smartphones. You didn’t need hardware infrastructure and dedicated or knowledgeable team(s) members to support it (such as myself). Hardware companies partnered with Cisco and Zoom for great cameras and software to be implemented into existing infrastructure and the cost was negligible and cheaper than the old systems aforementioned.

Now we’re seeing silly expensive hardware again for 3D zooming where someone stands in a box or uses their smartphone for 4K 3D Video conferencing - which is a complete waste of bandwidth - would not work for those working at home.

Again its one good thing if you can work for a company in your field to work from home but in comparing to a global corporation - you gotta state what the comparison level for level is else its not ‘apples to apples’ or ‘oranges to oranges’ but smaller 1 offs here and there.

Don’t get me wrong:
I’d love for corporations to reduce expensive rental or owned property footprint and USE that money for higher pay and bonuses.

But think of the other side of the scale … many corporations would reduce your benefits since you’re at home now the majority of the time, don’t need to travel into the office, no need to support your dental since that is on your now since again you’re home more, and any child care fees subsidized would likely be taken away as you can pickup your kids from day care after business hours MUCH sooner than travelling from work. Your ask for a pay raise would also not be as strong.

Moreover major cities wouldn’t have so many people living there anymore and thus could affect major corporations not needing to have HQ in major cities- that means less taxes for roads, schools, electrical infrastructure or need for emergency services etc.

An example: Toronto, ON had just over 65K people move out of the GTA in 2021, the most ever on record in history! The city spent their entire budget in 2021 before May 3rd, 2021 and budge renewal was June 4th, 2021 - the provincial government had to bolster the city. People that live in Toronto have 12% of their property taxes paying to public transit (TTC) whether they want to or not - no choice (which makes absolutely no freaking sense when the Federal & Provincial Gov’t pays TTC yearly huge $$$ when the TTC has been running bankrupt every year. MetroLynx using taxpayer dollars for an East/West hybrid rail (subway/streetcar) across the city : East is pretty much complete except for Kennedy (end of the line) and Yonge (central) while the west is in chambers. Nobody needed the billions of dollars expense when a dedicated 2 way lane for electric buses would’ve sufficed at 1/40th the cost (like in Thornhill/RichmondHill). We all know the provincial and munipical leaders get a HUGE kickback for such infrastructure and now another is planned without any community input which is law - and the community in the east end is not needed. I live by the new MetroLynx rail and it’s a complete joke : for 4 months I see workers putting grass, yes SOD grass in-between the each rail track - for what purpose? There is not need for green here.

What I’m saying is a lot of cities would have a bad backlash not planned for with all major corporations saying no need to work in office, lets reduce office footprint and also lets reduce annual salary, benefits, etc.

Sry if that came across a rant but it’s a lot more than what a lot of people are thinking about.

I work for one of the largest organizations in the country. There is no need these days to force everyone into an office if they do not need to be there. It is called utilizing technology, you know, something that technology companies have been talking about for some time. Some will need to be in the office but a lot of people can do a hybrid approach.

If it isn't your thing, then you can go into the office and pay high gas prices, if you want.