Apple's Fines in Dutch Antitrust Case Hit 50 Million Euros

[Sophisticatednut]

So long as you're not in the EU as in "based"? So Meta should just move out of the EU and base them selves solely in the US.

As in not providing services or goods to EU consumers inside the single market.

Meta as an example is threatening to leave EU because the Supreme Court struck down a data agreement with USA making it impossible for us companies to transfer data to USA for processing.

Pennies. This is a Multi Trillion dollar company.

They pay more money in fines than in taxes. And in 2018 they was fined 8% of annual revenue

They can take their time. Seems to be what they do best.

They rarely take more than a few years. And caries a 10% annual revenue as a fine

Because someone thought it might be a good idea to try something different? I mean, should we not have options? Different ways of doing things? Why "should" they communicate between them? What makes them special or unique if they all communicate with each other? I want to sell you something that is different from the others. Yes, they all communicate, but the don't have to do it the same way or be compatible to each other. Like why isn't Windows OS and macOS compatible? Or Android and iOS, and so on. If I have to make my product work with other business products. I can't innovate without still working with all these other options. What if what I want to do will break that compatibility? I can't do it? This sounds like the USB-C for all mobile devices all over again.

Same way safari, Firefox, chrome and edge are uneque but all support the same standards. Same with messages, but likely just a single standard for communication to rival platforms. It’s up to the market to negotiate a solution.
Things can be compatible on the fundamental level but still support same standards. iOS games can run on mac now, Xbox series X and PlayStation 5 have the same basic cpu and GPU hardware etc etc

iMessage can use iMessage protocol to communicate with other iMessage devices and then use standard Y when texting other platforms.

Apple uses USB C in their macs, but also thunderbolt in the same port.

Again, we blame the companies for being successful. Not the consumer that bought into one app or the other.
Sometimes to beat that dominance is for someone else to do it better. Not break them up "IF" they have done nothing wrong.

Nothing is going to be broken up, and successful companies aren’t punished, limitations are implemented to prevent dominating abuse before it’s actually a big problem and impossible to fix

Sounds impressive. It even looks impressive. I'm not impressed, as the end result here is the same. Anti-capitalism, and bias against American companies.

It’s not anti capitalism or Anti American companies. Same rules for everyone and Europe have never supported lazies fare capitalism, but a regulated one. If you don’t like it then they can stop doing business here.

And unlike USA, people who actually knows how technology works writes the bills instead of clueless politicians having meaningless hearing asking dumb questions.

 

[FyrStrike]

Call the EU’s bluff. Pull out of the market and watch them all complain to their governments about crappy choice and an Android only market monopoly. Then when the crap hits the fan and the governments say ok you can comeback. Please come back. Go back and double the prices to recover the loss.

For those who took me seriously. Chill. It was a bit of sarcasm. 😂

 

[djphat2000]

Same way safari, Firefox, chrome and edge are uneque but all support the same standards.

Yes, support the same standards because one existed first. But it took Apple to banish Flash on the iPhone for it to die. Because as a standard the world used, it sucked.

Same with messages, but likely just a single standard for communication to rival platforms. It’s up to the market to negotiate a solution.

Some would say it's up to a company to develop a solution. And one that doesn't cost the others an arm/leg in fees to make it worth they're wild. AKA "free". Which is hard to do when you're trying to innovate and make money doing it. Otherwise, use SMS. It works everywhere. IF you want something different, use one of the many messaging platforms. Which in this instance you have a standard and choices.

Things can be compatible on the fundamental level but still support same standards. iOS games can run on mac now, Xbox series X and PlayStation 5 have the same basic cpu and GPU hardware etc etc.

None of which are being forced into changing how they do business so they work with each other. Part of which I say these rules are not fair. Make Apple bend but not anyone else.

iMessage can use iMessage protocol to communicate with other iMessage devices and then use standard Y when texting other platforms.

SMS. SMS. SMS. One more time, SMS.

Apple uses USB C in their macs, but also thunderbolt in the same port.

And they should be allowed to keep innovating and not stop on one port type because some well informed/educated group of people in the EU say so.

Nothing is going to be broken up, and successful companies aren’t punished, limitations are implemented to prevent dominating abuse before it’s actually a big problem and impossible to fix

Minority Report. Pre cog. Cause we know you're going to go bad at some point.

It’s not anti capitalism or Anti American companies. Same rules for everyone and Europe have never supported lazies fare capitalism, but a regulated one. If you don’t like it then they can stop doing business here.

Its why they will never be what the US is. If the people of the EU didn't like Apple, we wouldn't be having this conversation. In fact, they like them so much...

And unlike USA, people who actually knows how technology works writes the bills instead of clueless politicians having meaningless hearing asking dumb questions.

I think they both are doing the same thing, in varying dumb ways.

 

[Skoal]

Apple is free to start their own country.

Naw, just make more laws to prove your countries care about you. More laws means a better world I say /s

 

[AppliedMicro]

None of which are being forced into changing how they do business so they work with each other. Part of which I say these rules are not fair. Make Apple bend but not anyone else.

Game consoles aren’t nearly as important (as an intermediary between a huge variety of business users/developers) a platform as smartphones.

And agreed, it shouldn’t be about Apple only - it should be about all “gatekeeping“ smartphone OS/platforms.

 

[djphat2000]

Game consoles aren’t nearly as important (as an intermediary between a huge variety of business users/developers) a platform as smartphones.

Then we are right back where we started with this being unfair. Placing monetary limits on how far a business can go is not the right way to do this. They are not important, until they are. Someone needs to tell this to Microsoft and Sony.

 

[AppliedMicro]

Placing monetary limits on how far a business can go is not the right way to do this

There‘s no monetary limits on how far Apple can go. They can choose their pricing and earn any amount they want. Regulation and laws are just being put into action to ensure healthy competition - in the very limited circumstances that companies and their services/platforms have grown too big and important for society. The conditions to be considered such a gatekeeper are being defined by law such as the DMA, some by way of objectively determinable business figures.

 

[I7guy]

There‘s no monetary limits on how far Apple can go. They can choose their pricing and earn any amount they want. Regulation and laws are just being put into action to ensure healthy competition - in the very limited circumstances that companies and their services/platforms have grown too big and important for society. The conditions to be considered such a gatekeeper are being defined by law such as the DMA, some by way of objectively determinable business figures.

Government regulation for competition is never healthy. Not to mention blackberry was important to society at one point, the consumers voted with their dollars. The earth didn’t collapse when they went under. Same with apple, are they in the same strata as food, air and water? Society won’t cave if they go under either.

 

[AppliedMicro]

Government regulation for competition is never healthy

Transport and mobile communication have proven the contrary (in Europe).
EU regulation has stimulated competition and lead to lower prices for consumers.

Same with apple, are they in the same strata as food, air and water? Society won’t cave if they go under either.

Not food, air or water, which are essential for survival. But apps are increasingly becoming essential means of communication, providing/accessing business and government services and an indispensable platform for business users offering services and conducting business (think: dating apps).

As such, mobile app platforms (the devices and software platforms distributing such apps) have become quasi-utilities or basic services.

Not as essential as food, water or electricity.
But not some random product or service that can easily be ignored or "done without" either.

 

[Sophisticatednut]

Then we are right back where we started with this being unfair. Placing monetary limits on how far a business can go is not the right way to do this. They are not important, until they are. Someone needs to tell this to Microsoft and Sony.

You aren’t back to it being unfair.

Microsoft fitta the definition, google fits the definitions and Sony also fits these definitions etc. the important part is are any of their CPS also fitting in these definitions? Xbox and PlayStation doesn’t have enough users or revenue to fitt it in EU. Sony and apple computer aren’t big or profitable enough to be covered by these regulations.

Apple Mac AppStore isn’t even capable to fit the definition as it so unpopular.
Steam could fit the definitions.

Google chrome books likely fits these definitions. Windows store probably fits these definitions.

But then we get to the important part do they also use the prohibited anti competitive actions?

Steam allow apps to exist in other stores or for developers to sell steam keys outside without paying steam any cut.

Steam actively doesn’t implement roadblocks.
iOS AppStore does actively implement roadblocks to consumers

Windows and it’s store both allow side loading and referencing other places.
Apple actively act against any ability for consumers to go outside the store.

 

[AppliedMicro]

Giving another example:

Suppose there's two car manufacturers that, together, control 95%+ of the U.S. automotive market.
Their cars will only with some specific type of fuel. One manufacturer will have their cars "locked down" to only use their approved fuel and sell all the approved gas through their own gas station network. While the other, in principle, allow for independent gas stations to sell unapproved gas - but sternly warn you of the risks and dangers of "sideloading", and, as a matter of fact, control like 95% of the gas sales sold for their cars.

Oh, and both these car manufacturers will be charging a 15% or 30% commission on every gallon of approved gas that customers are buying.

And they'll claim their duopoly is all good for product safety and able to protect consumers from dangerous fuels blowing up cars.

👉 What, do you think, would be the price level for cars and gasoline in such a market?
👉 Do you believe, government regulation for more competition would "never be healthy" in such a market?

👉 Is being able to drive a car an essential product or service for the sustenance of a person, household or family?
👉 If not, are there huge economic and social benefits from people having access to individual means of transporation, being able to drive and afford a car choose among different types of cars?

(side note: With the advent of electric cars and proprietary charging networks, the comparison may not even be as far-fetched as it sounds for ICE cars)

I don't think U.S. legislators and regulators would sit still and declare that regulation for competition is harmful under such circumstances, were they ever to arise.

 

[I7guy]

Transport and mobile communication have proven the contrary (in Europe).
EU regulation has stimulated competition and lead to lower prices for consumers.

Cell service in the US is the poster child breaking up one monopoly to find only three companies after 40 years. So no, government interference doesn’t work very well when taking from Peter to give to Paul.

Not food, air or water, which are essential for survival. But apps are increasingly becoming essential means of communication, providing/accessing business and government services and an indispensable platform for business users offering services and conducting business (think: dating apps).

Blackberry is the poster child of what happens when a cell phone company disappears literally overnight. Nothing.

As such, mobile app platforms (the devices and software platforms distributing such apps) have become quasi-utilities or basic services.

No they haven’t. I (as many of us)can get to my essentials multiple ways.

Not as essential as food, water or electricity.
But not some random product or service that can easily be ignored or "done without" either.

See comment regarding blackberry.

 

[Sophisticatednut]

Cell service in the US is the poster child breaking up one monopoly to find only three companies after 40 years. So no, government interference doesn’t work very well when taking from Peter to give to Paul.

that’s what happens when you have government made of fools.

Why doesn’t we have this problem with cell services? We have more regulations, more companies, more competition and more interoperability between cell operators network coverage.

Perhaps USA just don’t know how to regulate anything

 

[turbineseaplane]

Perhaps USA just don’t know how to regulate anything

Our political system is fully bought off by corporate interests and dark money lobbying.

America is largely broken if you aren’t rather rich

 

[AppliedMicro]

Blackberry is the poster child of what happens when a cell phone company disappears literally overnight. Nothing.

See comment regarding blackberry.

Blackberry were very good at messaging and communication back in their heyday.
They never even remotely did have the third-party app ecosystem that Apple had and has.

That's where your comparison is way off:

Blackberry is the poster child of what happens when a cell phone company disappears literally overnight.

Blackberry was a great and beloved cell phone company that made ... great handheld phones and messengers.
Apple is a computer manufacturer that makes ...great handheld personal computing devices.

Apple's devices (iPhones) arguably never were particularly great phones or messengers (Antennagate, lack of MMS, RCS...).
They have an entrenched position in their target market due to their app ecosystem.

Would anyone claim "nothing will happen" when Microsoft and their Windows OS disappears? I doubt it.
Does Apple have a comparable position in the mobile OS space to what Microsoft Windows is for desktop OS?
Probably not... but they're somewhere in between.

 

[I7guy]

Blackberry were very good at messaging and communication back in their heyday.
They never even remotely did have the third-party app ecosystem that Apple had and has.

That's where your comparison is way off:

Blackberry was a great and beloved cell phone company that made ... great handheld phones and messengers.
Apple is a computer manufacturer that makes ...great handheld personal computing devices.

Apple's devices (iPhones) arguably never were particularly great phones or messengers (Antennagate, lack of MMS, RCS...).
They have an entrenched position in their target market due to their app ecosystem.

Would anyone claim "nothing will happen" when Microsoft and their Windows OS disappears? I doubt it.
Does Apple have a comparable position in the mobile OS space to what Microsoft Windows is for desktop OS?
Probably not... but they're somewhere in between.

Blackberry had a pretty ecosystem. You are incorrect with your comment about their ecosystem.

Windows has a majority share (9x%+) of the corporate and desktop market. A near virtual monopoly. Most things that are done on windows would be hard to replicate on Linux. Not true of iOS which according to every market share reports is a minority world wide) Important stuff (not fart apps) is easily replicated. Now I’m sure we’ll argue about “important stuff”…

 

[I7guy]

that’s what happens when you have government made of fools.

The EU isn’t better.

Why doesn’t we have this problem with cell services? We have more regulations, more companies, more competition and more interoperability between cell operators network coverage.

More regulated competition, the antithesis of capitalism.

Perhaps USA just don’t know how to regulate anything

Maybe, but at least we are not taxed to death and encourage capitalism

 

[djphat2000]

Giving another example:

Suppose there's two car manufacturers that, together, control 95%+ of the U.S. automotive market.
Their cars will only with some specific type of fuel. One manufacturer will have their cars "locked down" to only use their approved fuel and sell all the approved gas through their own gas station network. While the other, in principle, allow for independent gas stations to sell unapproved gas - but sternly warn you of the risks and dangers of "sideloading", and, as a matter of fact, control like 95% of the gas sales sold for their cars.

Oh, and both these car manufacturers will be charging a 15% or 30% commission on every gallon of approved gas that customers are buying.

And they'll claim their duopoly is all good for product safety and able to protect consumers from dangerous fuels blowing up cars.

? What, do you think, would be the price level for cars and gasoline in such a market?
? Do you believe, government regulation for more competition would "never be healthy" in such a market?

? Is being able to drive a car an essential product or service for the sustenance of a person, household or family?
? If not, are there huge economic and social benefits from people having access to individual means of transporation, being able to drive and afford a car choose among different types of cars?

(side note: With the advent of electric cars and proprietary charging networks, the comparison may not even be as far-fetched as it sounds for ICE cars)

I don't think U.S. legislators and regulators would sit still and declare that regulation for competition is harmful under such circumstances, were they ever to arise.

I would normally comment on parts of this one at a time, but. This argument doesn't work IMHO. Because.

1) Apple doesn't own a carrier (Cell service) or even all the apps. Which would be more akin to the commodity of gas in this example. That part is owned by a few (former monopolies in the US) cell companies. And many different developers. So your access to the information these devices connect you to is not owned by Apple. They can be considered the car in this example. In the past. The gas came from the same place as the store.

2) Making them to be the same as the car company. Every car company sells you stuff directly, aka their branded parts and service when needed. And they prefer you to use it. You can go elsewhere, which Apple is at least waking up to more these days. Not perfect, but it's moving in the right direction. Where as cars you can more easily get 3rd party service and parts if you wish. However, in the US at least. I don't believe the manufacture has to support or warranty that item/service if it wasn't from them or a licensed service provider. I'm sure this is different in the EU.

3) Since they sell their own service and parts, they can charge whatever they heck they want for it. Like it or not. Again you can get 3rd party, and or even refurbished parts. But, unless certified by the manufacture you are on your own. Having these options does provide cheaper alternatives to the OEM, but you get what you pay for.

4) Since Apple doesn't own the service (gas, network, all apps), I can't properly equate a what if situation. But, say they did own it. They would have to own like you side 95% of it to control the market fully enough to be able to overcharge for said service(s)/apps. If we are stating they are doing so with Apps in this instance, well I can get apps for free on the store. So how is Apple overcharging me? It's their store, they could subject us all to a minimum price for all apps. Even if it was a dollar/Euro whatever. They could have done that. They don't. They never increased prices as far as I know. Only lowered them over time. This is similar to iTunes/Music purchases. It was originally .99c. Then went up because, their costs went up. Which is normal. But, apps. Those fee's stayed the same and or went down.

5) A step further would be to say well, they overcharge the developers that "DO" charge a price for their apps. And that is too high. Well, that's subjective as well. You can legitimately argue any price being too high. And all stores owners have to support the store in order for it to exist (infrastructure). And we clearly know that those that do charge a price support those that don't (subsidize). They are also free to lower their price when the commission comes down (which it has). I don't see lower prices though. They just pocket it, and keep complaining its' too high. Who gets to set the price? Gov't? Apple? The Dev's? Or the customer, willing to either make the purchase or not.

Reasons why I don't believe Apple is acting or is a monopoly. They are not abusing their power (with respect to Right to repair, again not perfect but hopefully it keeps getting better). They should also allow developers to contact the end user (provided the end user wants to be contacted by them) for other ways to pay for apps (online, or other means of subscriptions).

Apple shouldn't be treated as if they are, or "will" in some Minority Report world we don't live in. Become evil and break the world. Which again, if they disappeared from the world, it will keep spinning and people will be fine. There is many other ways to get your facebook, instagram, financial, etc stuff.

 

[djphat2000]

Blackberry had a pretty ecosystem. You are incorrect with your comment about their ecosystem.

I know plenty of people that had Blackberries that didn't need them. Mainly for BBM, and it was a BlackBerry. It was a status device as much as it was popular for BBM.

 

[Sophisticatednut]

Blackberry is the poster child of what happens when a cell phone company disappears literally overnight. Nothing.

When blackberry died and Nokia died, phones as an essential thing hadn’t developed yet.

No they haven’t. I (as many of us)can get to my essentials multiple ways.

Many of us can’t do banking without a smartphone or seamless parliaments.

In Sweden BankID is essentiall for secure identification for majority of services, booking a hospital? Verify my id with BankiD app on the phone. Calling my bank when I’m abroad or at work for an emergency? Use BankID.
Making a new loan? BankID. Verify payment in a random website or app? BankID will double check the registerd company and price.

And Sweden have some of the lowest credit card fraud because of this.

I forgot my card or the card reader is broken? I can use swish to send instant payment to the person or business+ must verify with BankID. Friend need a loan? Just swish them the money to their registerd phone number as platform agnostic

See comment regarding blackberry.

Times have changed. Just as electric vehicles must all in Eu use the same plug( including Tesla. All stations must use the universal plug standard. And we can use 1-fase 240v to 3fase 400v-800v

Ether you have a standards

Or you get whatever bullahit Tesla have in Us

 

[djphat2000]

When blackberry died and Nokia died, phones as an essential thing hadn’t developed yet.

I'd argue that's not true. At least no different than it is today. In the 80's and early 90's maybe. Still relatively new, service wasn't great, plans are expensive (for the amount of time you had). But, many people had cell phones. Smartphones, not so much. Complex and expensive for most people. But a basic cell phone from Nokia was all over the place. Couldn't miss them with the flashy light cases everyone put on them.

Many of us can’t do banking without a smartphone or seamless parliaments.

Good Job Sweden. You forced everyone to need a phone in your country to conduct business. Why can't you have both a physical ID and a digital one?

In Sweden BankID is essentiall for secure identification for majority of services, booking a hospital? Verify my id with BankiD app on the phone. Calling my bank when I’m abroad or at work for an emergency? Use BankID.
Making a new loan? BankID. Verify payment in a random website or app? BankID will double check the registerd company and price.

And Sweden have some of the lowest credit card fraud because of this.

I forgot my card or the card reader is broken? I can use swish to send instant payment to the person or business+ must verify with BankID. Friend need a loan? Just swish them the money to their registerd phone number as platform agnostic

Again, all great stuff. Not knocking it. But, you're literally in a situation where you don't have other means while complaining you don't have other means.

Times have changed. Just as electric vehicles must all in Eu use the same plug( including Tesla. All stations must use the universal plug standard. And we can use 1-fase 240v to 3fase 400v-800v

I'm for this in concept. But, even USB (Universal) doesn't have the same plug all the time. There are use cases and reasons why you have several different plugs doing basically the same thing. Having a universal would require you to have a plug that covers EVERYTHING. Even stuff not even made yet. What if you needed more pins? Or less? That would break backwards compatibility. And be confusing. So make a new plug that does the new thing, plus passes the same data from the older spec. If your charging from US 120v. It will take you forever to charge but, you can. Like USB 1. It's not the same plug as USB C or 400v-800v. You see where I'm going.

Or you get whatever bullahit Tesla have in Us

Again, we can't plan for all eventual possibilities. And when your the first to do this in a meaningful way. You have to create something "first". So it works with your invention. And many times it's not ideal at first. But, you have to do something. Over time you can refine it (maybe), if it doesn't create other issues down the line.

iPhone had the 30-pin connector at first. Then lightning. Now, eventually they will all have USB-C (most likely).

 

[I7guy]

When blackberry died and Nokia died, phones as an essential thing hadn’t developed yet.

Many of us can’t do banking without a smartphone or seamless parliaments.

[...]

I disagree. People died by getting emails and phone calls on their Blackberry. This is revisionist history to prove a false point. But more to the point, nobody needs an iphone to do banking. The world would adapt in a few days if Apple ceased operations.

 

[Sophisticatednut]

I'd argue that's not true. At least no different than it is today. In the 80's and early 90's maybe. Still relatively new, service wasn't great, plans are expensive (for the amount of time you had). But, many people had cell phones. Smartphones, not so much. Complex and expensive for most people. But a basic cell phone from Nokia was all over the place. Couldn't miss them with the flashy light cases everyone put on them.

That was actually true up untill past 2010. You didn’t need a cellphone and it made zero difference if it was locked down, they all could call, they all could text and that was it. Mail was more a business thing 99% of people didn’t care for.

Good Job Sweden. You forced everyone to need a phone in your country to conduct business. Why can't you have both a physical ID and a digital one?

Not at all. Physical ID is different from a digital ID. How do you verify who you are with a physical ID over a phone?

You are completely free to use BankID, ID cards or electronic banking. Considering it’s all privately managed outside of ID cards

Again, all great stuff. Not knocking it. But, you're literally in a situation where you don't have other means while complaining you don't have other means.

We have multiple means. It’s just extraordinary clunky without it. Now you don’t need to physically go to places to verify who you are or have unsecured ways such as pin codes or questions over the phone.

I'm for this in concept. But, even USB (Universal) doesn't have the same plug all the time. There are use cases and reasons why you have several different plugs doing basically the same thing. Having a universal would require you to have a plug that covers EVERYTHING. Even stuff not even made yet. What if you needed more pins? Or less? That would break backwards compatibility. And be confusing.

What would be confusing? It’s not the USB port, but the typ-c connection using the same charging standard. And there is zero benefits to any different USB port, they have just been after thoughts.

Needing less pins isn’t a problem. Or needing more as they have more already. You can have thunderbolt-4 speeds in your phone currently and use DisplayPort 2.0 standard etc etc. and all of this is negotiated by the industry. In the EU law it makes zero reference to any usb standard, only basic charging standards for phones to support.

So make a new plug that does the new thing, plus passes the same data from the older spec. If your charging from US 120v. It will take you forever to charge but, you can. Like USB 1. It's not the same plug as USB C or 400v-800v. You see where I'm going.

That’s the beauty of the industry being the ones who agrees to the standard to use. Eu doesn’t meddle in what this standard protocol will be. And good thing plugs can b me electrically agnostic as long as the hardware is compatible and the wires have minimum thickness etc

Again, we can't plan for all eventual possibilities. And when your the first to do this in a meaningful way. You have to create something "first". So it works with your invention. And many times it's not ideal at first. But, you have to do something. Over time you can refine it (maybe), if it doesn't create other issues down the line.

That is why industry standardization and collaboration should be encouraged to limit these problems for the market. Because as we always notice, when things are just made as a first thing it tends to become permanent. Just as “temporary” tax increases always end up permanent.

iPhone had the 30-pin connector at first. Then lightning. Now, eventually they will all have USB-C (most likely).

They will use usb-c or no port(mgsafe?)

I disagree. People died by getting emails and phone calls on their Blackberry. This is revisionist history to prove a false point. But more to the point, nobody needs an iphone to do banking. The world would adapt in a few days if Apple ceased operations.

I never said iPhones. It’s OS regulation. Ether you regulate all equally who starts to become important or non

 

[Sophisticatednut]

2) Making them to be the same as the car company. Every car company sells you stuff directly, aka their branded parts and service when needed. And they prefer you to use it. You can go elsewhere, which Apple is at least waking up to more these days. Not perfect, but it's moving in the right direction. Where as cars you can more easily get 3rd party service and parts if you wish. However, in the US at least. I don't believe the manufacture has to support or warranty that item/service if it wasn't from them or a licensed service provider. I'm sure this is different in the EU.

In EU a car company doesn’t need to warrant a third party service or part. So that’s the same. But they can’t remove your warranty for purchasing a service, repair or parts from unauthorized mechanics or unassociated dealerships as long as it follows their manuals (they are public by law). They can’t deny you service for using 3d party equipment ether etc etc

And they can’t prevent anyone to provide it or refuse to sell parts for the same price as branded dealerships

3) Since they sell their own service and parts, they can charge whatever they heck they want for it. Like it or not. Again you can get 3rd party, and or even refurbished parts. But, unless certified by the manufacture you are on your own. Having these options does provide cheaper alternatives to the OEM, but you get what you pay for.

Will likely be covers as the automobile industry as in EU.

5) A step further would be to say well, they overcharge the developers that "DO" charge a price for their apps. And that is too high. Well, that's subjective as well. You can legitimately argue any price being too high. And all stores owners have to support the store in order for it to exist (infrastructure). And we clearly know that those that do charge a price support those that don't (subsidize). They are also free to lower their price when the commission comes down (which it has). I don't see lower prices though. They just pocket it, and keep complaining its' too high. Who gets to set the price? Gov't? Apple? The Dev's? Or the customer, willing to either make the purchase or not.

It’s probably the case that they overcharge by mandating a cut they take instead of allowing competitive solutions. And when we compare same apps and services provided in play store (before google enforced the cut) or websites the price almost always are lower comparatively to the iOS AppStore payment.

 

[AppliedMicro]

Blackberry had a pretty ecosystem. You are incorrect with your comment about their ecosystem.

I still maintain they had nowhere near the ecosystem Apple and Google have.
Third-party apps just weren't very important back then.
And even though their messaging platform was popular, only a minority had blackberry phones. Most people used SMS.

Windows has a majority share (9x%+) of the corporate and desktop market. A near virtual monopoly.

Google's Play Store and Apple's App Store form a near virtual duopoly with similar (combined) marketshare.

Maybe, but at least we are not taxed to death and encourage capitalism

Oh, you shouldn't lump together all of the countries.
There are EU member states that have, for instance, flat income tax rates of 10% to 20%.

But more to the point, nobody needs an iphone to do banking.

But, realistically, a smartphone, if you want to make online purchases with a bank card - and don't want to pay high fees for teller transactions. Plus, it's more secure.

Europe isn't the retail banking backwater for that is the US. Retail banking in the EU is years ahead technologically - and that is in large part due to heavy promotion of payment schemes, secure customer authentication and, yes, heavy regulation made by the EU.