Apple's Retail Push into China Still Limited, But Ramping Up

[zzLZHzz]

Your friends' business is killed not because of Apple, but because it's rubbish compared with Apple Store. Don't try to confuse people with the Walmart example. Apple didn't compete with your friends' store with low prices. What they did is that they focused on offering much better shopping experience including product display, demo, staff friendliness, return policy and repair services. Your friends' business focused on none of those. I'm not going to miss your friends' business at all.

you are right.
another good example is in Singapore. all the premium reseller service are crap. there is no reason for them to offer good service since there is nobody to compete with them on the service side. hence if apple open a store here, all those store has to close because they are crap. and i won't even visit them now. i just go to the online store afterall apple is price-control.

 

[ryuok]

You obviously know little about China. Google left because they failed to even make a dent against Baidu, the major search engine in China. It had nothing to do with the government and everything to do with their business related failures.

Google decided to claim their leaving of China was due to the government, as to not admit failure in one of the largest and fastest growing markets in the world.

All Google did other than close down their office in China though was change .com.cn to .com.hk. They're still serving China with no real difference. Their lies are just to keep people ignorant to the truth.

It was all about money, and Google doesn't understand China culture and what the Chinese people want in a search engine service. They failed, they left.

He may not know a lot about China, but he's right. China IS a dictatorship and please prove me wrong by pointing me to samples of press freedom, freedom of speech, independent judicial system, democratically elected leaders - essential elements of a non-dictatorship country.

And Google left because they couldn't compete? What other more bullcraps can you come up with in order to kiss the communist party's backside? Have you collected your 0.5 yuan payout today? I guess Facebook, Twitter and YouTube didn't do well because they couldn't compete with RenRen, Weibo and Youku then?

You are the kind of people who claims "China is now important" right after Apple released "China Specific" function for iOS. People like you are shameless, in the sense that you don't feel shame that people in China has to be given a different Internet that is separated from the rest of civilized world. Instead you feel proud that iOS is modified for China.

 

[Asia8]

He may not know a lot about China, but he's right. China IS a dictatorship and please prove me wrong by pointing me to samples of press freedom, freedom of speech, independent judicial system, democratically elected leaders - essential elements of a non-dictatorship country.

And Google left because they couldn't compete? What other more bullcraps can you come up with in order to kiss the communist party's backside? Have you collected your 0.5 yuan payout today? I guess Facebook, Twitter and YouTube didn't do well because they couldn't compete with RenRen, Weibo and Youku then?

You are the kind of people who claims "China is now important" right after Apple released "China Specific" function for iOS. People like you are shameless, in the sense that you don't feel shame that people in China has to be given a different Internet that is separated from the rest of civilized world. Instead you feel proud that iOS is modified for China.

China is different to most other countries in the world, systems that may work in other countries would not work in China. They can not be scaled to such levels. The Chinese government has been doing an amazing job in holding the country together and improving life regardless of what form the government takes.

Some things will need to change, but that's when the country is ready for it and when these changes wont cause more damage than good.

You put a lot of words in my mouth there. I kiss nobody's ____. Like I'd care about 0.5元 and I said nothing about Facebook, Twitter and Youtube. They're a completly different situation to Google.

It seems your arguments are almost all based on putting your own words in other peoples mouths and insulting them instead of building credible arguments.

 

[holdincourt]

The Hysan Place store certainly should be coming late this year or early 2013...given I walked by the new Hysan Place venue just yesterday!

Though I don't know why you would need BOTH Apple Stores to be on HK Island. Why not open one across the harbour in Kowloon? Come on, APPLE!

 

[Ping Guo]

You obviously know little about China. Google left because they failed to even make a dent against Baidu, the major search engine in China. It had nothing to do with the government and everything to do with their business related failures.

Google decided to claim their leaving of China was due to the government, as to not admit failure in one of the largest and fastest growing markets in the world.

All Google did other than close down their office in China though was change .com.cn to .com.hk. They're still serving China with no real difference. Their lies are just to keep people ignorant to the truth.

It was all about money, and Google doesn't understand China culture and what the Chinese people want in a search engine service. They failed, they left.

God what a steaming pile of manure. Be honest, you're a wu-mao lackey right?

Systematic intellectual property theft is China's MO. Chinese government forces foreign companies to set up joint ventures with Chinese companies. After stealing everything that's not nailed down they send their foreign guests packing. In the case of internet companies, they simply block their websites once their local copies are up and running.

Xiaonei and Renren are blatant rip offs of Facebook. (Facebook blocked)

Baidu copies everything Google does - their new mobile OS is an Android doppelgänger. (Most of Google's services blocked, Gmail and search intermittent)

Weibo is a Twitter ripoff. (Twitter blocked)

The list is a mile long really, those are just some obvious examples.

 

[TWGirl]

There are rumors for a 3rd and 4th Apple Stores in Hong Kong. One that is more certain is at a shopping mall called Festive Walk in the Kowloon Tong district, and the store is now under intensive renovation work. It’s not as big as the one at the IFC Mall, but it’s easily one of the biggest in that mall. The 4th one is rumored to be located in the Tsimshatsui district at a building called “The Toy House” (but there is no toy shop in that building, just named apparently because it’s owned by toy manufacturer).

I don't know if it's wishful thinking, but I did notice that the Simply Life bakery restaurant in Festival Walk is moving to where KFC is, and I guess that Pizza Express next door will close soon, (hardly any customers these days). That would be a prime spot for an Apple store, top floor, large open window, clear roof.

 

[Kwramm]

China is different to most other countries in the world, systems that may work in other countries would not work in China.

Nobody ever gave it a serious try anyway. Absolute emperors, absolute Generalissimos, absolute party. China never really experienced anything else in terms of leadership. To flat out say "it won't work" is you taking your mouth quite full.

And please not the "China is different" card again. Either explain how, or admit that it's just a cheap phrase to justify the status quo and you're not willing to discuss. I heard this one way too often already here in China. It's just an easy way to dismiss another person's - especially an outsider's - opinion.

Unfortunately China is not a culture that can deal with criticism, even with constructive criticism with good intentions. People rather brush you aside with "5000 years of history", "Chinese culture/people being special", etc. Every regular Chinese knows quite well that the system is rotten (unsafe food, housing prices, corruption, weak social security, etc), but they'd never admit to a stranger that this is so. But if you look at Sina, Netease and other forums people will talk about those issues quite freely.

As regards to weibo integration into OS X. I think it's good. Yes, the Chinese internet is censored. On the other hand people have their friendship networks built there and even if they would despise those services, what alternative is there? I don't think any boycott on Apple's side would help anyone. So why not make it more convenient for Chinese users to work with the services they're already using? (Actually Sina weibo is quite cool. It's facebook and twitter rolled into one. Shame it's censored, but it's a decent product despite that).

 

[Asia8]

Nobody ever gave it a serious try anyway. Absolute emperors, absolute Generalissimos, absolute party. China never really experienced anything else in terms of leadership. To flat out say "it won't work" is you taking your mouth quite full.

And please not the "China is different" card again. Either explain how, or admit that it's just a cheap phrase to justify the status quo and you're not willing to discuss. I heard this one way too often already here in China. It's just an easy way to dismiss another person's - especially an outsider's - opinion.

Population is one of the biggest obstacles for the country. With a population of 1.3 billion (last time I checked), a better social security systems just isn't realistic. Instead the government is investing a lot of money into infrastructure and growth, the quality of life is getting better, more so for larger cities first but as time is progressing even the smaller villages are seeing the benefits.

Even if the Chinese people wanted democracy, trying to coordinate voting without corruption with a population of 1.3 billion would be almost impossible. Even with the small population of America I seem to here of the dead rising back to life just to make a vote, that's dedication I guess.

That aside there seems to be the matter of cultural values, most people here are much less worried about this as they're happy with the current government are seeing consistent good changes. Most have little interest in it and are more interested in their own personal lives.

At the moment the system is not perfect, but is working and working well, most people are happy with it, life is getting better all the time and China is progressing very well. Sure China doesn't have democracy or a government like what is being used in western countries, but what is in place here is working well so far. It's not like it was 10-20 years, things have changed and it's a whole new China. Problems exist, as they do everywhere, but they're being fixed gradually.

It's not perfect, but most people are happy with how it's working overall. It's most often foreign governments, foreign media and Chinese being backed, pat on the back, paid, etc who are bad mouthing China most. You think 50c is good? You're paid much better to complain about China and say how aweful it is.

Yes, China does have problems - give it time.
Yes, China isn't a democracy - is that what it really needs/wants?

I don't claim to have all the answers, but things could be much much worse. Things are improving all the time, so something must be right enough for the time being.

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I love Chinese video/mp3 players, the only one's I've found that go above 100% sound volume. 900%+ I think. I used to be plagued by 100% on every setting and still having some music and video being almost unhearable. The overlay subtitles/lyrics that are always on top with a transparent background are great too. So I guess not everything is copied, as I can't find these features in any English software.

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I know not everyone will agree, but these are my observations and what I've found from people I talk to here. Most really don't care about the government system as long as it's making things better, which it is.

 

[coolspot18]

He may not know a lot about China, but he's right. China IS a dictatorship and please prove me wrong by pointing me to samples of press freedom, freedom of speech, independent judicial system, democratically elected leaders - essential elements of a non-dictatorship country.

China is a socialist country with a communist government. To the billion people there, surviving is more important than the freedoms you highlight. Perhaps in 20 - 30 years when China is a wealthy country will Western style freedoms become important to the people there ... but one must remember China has 4x the population of the USA; and democracy in large countries like India have not proven too successful.

Nobody ever gave it a serious try anyway. Absolute emperors, absolute Generalissimos, absolute party. China never really experienced anything else in terms of leadership. To flat out say "it won't work" is you taking your mouth quite full.

If you come from an asian family, absolutely freedom is a foreign concept. Filial piety, respect for elders, etc overrides individual freedoms. You may argue that Japan / Korea are democracies, but it was through major US interventions (wars) that their systems were switched. But even in Japan, the ruling party has pretty much remained a single one for the past 50 years...

 

[Kwramm]

China is a socialist country with a communist government. To the billion people there, surviving is more important than the freedoms you highlight. Perhaps in 20 - 30 years when China is a wealthy country will Western style freedoms become important to the people there ... but one must remember China has 4x the population of the USA; and democracy in large countries like India have not proven too successful.

If you come from an asian family, absolutely freedom is a foreign concept. Filial piety, respect for elders, etc overrides individual freedoms. You may argue that Japan / Korea are democracies, but it was through major US interventions (wars) that their systems were switched. But even in Japan, the ruling party has pretty much remained a single one for the past 50 years...

Individualism has nothing to do with China's problems I'd say. Corruption, in-transparency, a biased law system happen all over the world, regardless of religion or culture. It has to do with responsibility and integrity.

But as far as transparency goes, the Chinese communist party is one of the world's most opaque ruling bodies. There's little accountability to the people because they can't do anything about it anyway. There's no accountability to the press either because it is all controlled by the party itself. The party is only accountable to itself, and which wrongdoer would put himself or his best buddy in prison?

On the local level China will stay corrupt, because its easy to bribe people with low salaries - this happens in India too, or even in Europe. But the greediness of the upper echelons in China dwarfs everything countries like India have to offer. It even dwarfs riches accumulated by Assad or Saddam Hussein. A Chinese study showed that 95% of Chinas billionaires are party princelings or high members. The 10 richest members of the communist party congress have 10 times more money than the 10 richest people in the US congress, yet the average income in China is much much lower.

You are right, in 20 to 30 years, this might indeed become an issue, because by then everyone might have a full plate on their tables and people have time to worry about different things. You can see this already with the people who can afford computers and internet access. They do discuss problems. So far there's no critical mass and the government is good at containing any discussion.

The question is, how long will this work? Even in countries like Japan or South Korea people want a voice. They want, at least the feeling, to be heard. Hong Kongers, Japanese, South Koreans, Taiwanese all have strong Confucian traditions, untouched by a Cultural Revolution, yet I doubt they will give up the freedoms they worked for just because they're not part of Confucian tradition. Let's face it, times change, people's attitudes change. If we'd do what we did 5000 years ago, we still might live in caves.

* note: there's no absolute freedom anywhere. You're always subject to someone's laws. The question is, to what degree can you influence them and to what degree you can challenge them.

 

[ryuok]

I'm not insulting you. You, sir, are insulting yourself. You are basically saying that the people in China does not need/deserve basic rights such as freedom of speech, freedom to criticize government. In your view, the Chinese communist has done a brilliant job because they managed to not let too many people die from starving.

People who sing praise to this kind of Chinese government propaganda are either too stupid to think or benefiting from such a brutal regime. I don't know what type you are, but you are clearly treating people in China as farm animals. They just need to be fed to they don't die. Anything else is asking too much.

Why is China different? Don't give me the lame population excuse again. A country that could send people to the space couldn't even tolerant a dissident? Dissidents are either tortured or being staged with "subside". Is this what it takes so people in China can have a bowl of rice? Mind you, it's not the communist government who created the new wealth. It's the people. The communist took most of it and turned them into personal assets.

China is different to most other countries in the world, systems that may work in other countries would not work in China. They can not be scaled to such levels. The Chinese government has been doing an amazing job in holding the country together and improving life regardless of what form the government takes.

Some things will need to change, but that's when the country is ready for it and when these changes wont cause more damage than good.

You put a lot of words in my mouth there. I kiss nobody's ____. Like I'd care about 0.5元 and I said nothing about Facebook, Twitter and Youtube. They're a completly different situation to Google.

It seems your arguments are almost all based on putting your own words in other peoples mouths and insulting them instead of building credible arguments.