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Are consoles doomed?

throAU said:
Caveat: CDPR promised Cyberpunk on the ps4 too
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That is true (I have the physical PS4 copy). In it's case CP2077 ran fine (for a given definition of fine) on PC but like crap on consoles. Back in the good old days folks were "okay" with games running under 30fps on console. Looking at older reviews GTA5 ran around 25fps on PS4.
 
aespana said:
I also think that this generation will last much more than the last one (if you think about it, PS4 is still getting games so..). The RAM prices hikes will eventually move some to consoles, Switch 2 or PS5.

But overall yes, this generation is a really weird one. I just that the market went crazy these last 5-6 years. First COVID, then cryptos and now AI and the RAM.
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100%. no console fanboy will admit it, but both the last two (or more in xbox?) generations of console are just PCs.

a fixed spec per generation, but they’re still just PC hardware for the most part. i mean there’s already 2 generations each of ps4 and ps5 (pro/normal) and games already accommodate that.

with the current market problems, older generation hardware is certainly going to stick around because replacing it is going to be expensive. both to manufacture and purchase.

the modern consoles aren’t a whole development methodology change from generation to generation any more (e.g., from genesis to saturn or ps1 to ps2, ps3, ps4 etc. all those jumps involved massive changes to the development environment). the new ones are just a faster version of the same basic architecture. and even if they weren’t, nobody is writing direct to hardware any more, its all via higher level APIs, so the hardware specifics are less relevant anyway.

porting to a new machine is nowhere near as hard now, it’s mostly just a graphical detail slider. given everything is written in C/C++ and using high level graphics APIs with off the shelf 3d engines, its mostly just a recompile and some IFDEFs.

vs. say back in the day when the difference between ps1 and saturn (for example) involved an entirely different rendering pipeline (triangles vs. quads), entirely different CPU architecture, number of processors, writing your own rendering engine direct to hardware, etc..
 
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throAU said:
100%. no console fanboy will admit it, but both the last two (or more in xbox?) generations of console are just PCs.

a fixed spec per generation, but they’re still just PC hardware for the most part. i mean there’s already 2 generations each of ps4 and ps5 (pro/normal) and games already accommodate that.

with the current market problems, older generation hardware is certainly going to stick around because replacing it is going to be expensive. both to manufacture and purchase.

the modern consoles aren’t a whole development methodology change from generation to generation any more (e.g., from genesis to saturn or ps1 to ps2, ps3, ps4 etc. all those jumps involved massive changes to the development environment). the new ones are just a faster version of the same basic architecture. and even if they weren’t, nobody is writing direct to hardware any more, its all via higher level APIs, so the hardware specifics are less relevant anyway.

porting to a new machine is nowhere near as hard now, it’s mostly just a graphical detail slider. given everything is written in C/C++ and using high level graphics APIs with off the shelf 3d engines, its mostly just a recompile and some IFDEFs.

vs. say back in the day when the difference between ps1 and saturn (for example) involved an entirely different rendering pipeline (triangles vs. quads), entirely different CPU architecture, number of processors, writing your own rendering engine direct to hardware, etc..
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Absolutely, PS5/Series are just PCs. I think, the Xbox Classic was also a PC but not 100% sure.

I think it is an advantage after all because it takes down the cost to port between platforms and also to PC but of course that create problems, specially to PC since a lot of ports are just terrible. Also, you have lower spec hardware that needs to be cover as the Series S (really like the size tho).

All those difference in architectures are a thing of the past.
 
aespana said:
Absolutely, PS5/Series are just PCs. I think, the Xbox Classic was also a PC but not 100% sure.

I think it is an advantage after all because it takes down the cost to port between platforms and also to PC but of course that create problems, specially to PC since a lot of ports are just terrible. Also, you have lower spec hardware that needs to be cover as the Series S (really like the size tho).

All those difference in architectures are a thing of the past.
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MS used to expose API's that was closer to the metal on their consoles than what they offered through the normal DX API. I dunno if they still do that these days.

You'd think that PC ports would be better, but the hardware is just different enough that it can cause problems.

I think it is also why a lot of development houses are migrating to UE or Unity instead of rolling their own, makes code more portable.
 
I enjoy specialized and monofunctional devices like consoles. I don't think I'll ever stop using them. I might switch to only handheld consoles in the future though if they have HDMI out. Nintendo seems to be the only ones with exclusives these days, but Steam Deck also looks nice (I know you can basically use it as a computer, but it's still a very focused product). It'd be cool if Steam devices got some timed exclusives like Half-Life 3 just to elevate the brand and perhaps prepare for Valve to enter as Xbox's replacement.
 
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throAU said:
porting to a new machine is nowhere near as hard now, it’s mostly just a graphical detail slider. given everything is written in C/C++ and using high level graphics APIs with off the shelf 3d engines, its mostly just a recompile and some IFDEFs.
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There is still bespoke hardware on consoles that is specifically used for audio and other stuff. I think I remember Last of Us devs talking about it being a big pain to rewrite that part of the code of the game to use PC's CPU since the specialized hardware is obviously not present there.
 
keksikuningas said:
There is still bespoke hardware on consoles that is specifically used for audio and other stuff. I think I remember Last of Us devs talking about it being a big pain to rewrite that part of the code of the game to use PC's CPU since the specialized hardware is obviously not present there.
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Sony did make a big deal out of 3d positional audio on the PS5.
 
I believe the current hardware climate (let's call it that) will give consoles a boost. Even with the price increases the situation is much more controllable than with DIY and gaming PCs.
 
Looks like Sony is going the subscription route in the UK. looks like to get that 9.95 per month, you hav to agree to a 3 year lease.
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timber said:
I believe the current hardware climate (let's call it that) will give consoles a boost. Even with the price increases the situation is much more controllable than with DIY and gaming PCs.
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Looks like the current environment is having the opposite effect, news stories about Sony delaying the PS6, preceiely due to the ram shortages/price hikes

PS6 Release Date Delay Corroborated in New Bloomberg Report

According to its sources, which Bloomberg claims are familiar with Sony’s plans, the company is considering pushing PS6’s release window as far out as 2029.

We’re sure that there are several factors behind this decision, but the main issue is price hikes caused by an unprecedented global demand for artificial intelligence.
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diamond.g said:
I'm not surprised. Sony would have a better time extending the console cycle and letting RAM prices come back down. Especially if the PS6 is supposed to have 30+ GB of RAM.
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We're in a really odd spot, where this could go either really bad, or settle down. I'm unsure how its going to play out. I'm hoping things settle down in 2026 but when 64GB of DDR5 RAM now costs more than a MacBook Air - memory prices have surged 300% in just six months I'm hard pressed to be hopeful.
 
maflynn said:
Looks like the current environment is having the opposite effect, news stories about Sony delaying the PS6, preceiely due to the ram shortages/price hikes

PS6 Release Date Delay Corroborated in New Bloomberg Report
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That's not what I said.
With general price increases It's more than expected that every type of device will see a larger life cycle.
What I meant is that from the consumer side I expect a larger relative portion of people to base their entertainment needs on consoles and similar one purpose devices compared with gaming and DIY PCs.
 
Well, Im with my PS5 and my PC (DDR4 but a 9060XT 16GB) so I'm good for now. These prices are just absolutely insane.

I don't thinks consoles are doomed. We all are doomed.
 
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Steam Decks are out of stock and we may not see them for a little while, due to the ram shortages, The Steam Machine has been delayed, for the same reasons. Western Digital has reported it has sold every last hard drive it will make for 2026, 2027 and maybe 2028. I think effects of putting all silicon based technology towards AI, building new data centeres and its impact on communities have yet to be full felt. I think things will be getting worse.

 
Handhelds are taking over. Handhelds like the MSI Claw 8 AI+ runs some AAA games at maximum settings. And very high demanding games like Black Myth Wokung at High settings, which is insane.

I don't see the point of Consoles anymore when we have handhelds now.
 
Heat_Fan89 said:
A former Sony exec, certainly thinks so.

www.polygon.com

The console age is ending — even PlayStation's former CEO says so

It's time to embrace our teraflop era
www.polygon.com www.polygon.com
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Good points in the article. Also consider the major factor in driving console sales, particularly xbox vs PS - Exclusives. Now that both Microsoft and Sony are pushing their games to the PC, it diminishes the demand for consoles.

I agree though with the gist of the article, how different will a PS6 be, what features will it have that I'm willing to give up on my PS5? I'm happy with the performance and graphics.

As an aside, I feel similarly on the PC, why buy a 5090, when a lower end card for 1/2 or even 1/4 of the price will produce a great image on screen with good FPS. I don't need a GPU to computer how every photon from the sun will land in a given scene, or that I can read the text of a sign in a puddle on the street.
 
maflynn said:
Good points in the article. Also consider the major factor in driving console sales, particularly xbox vs PS - Exclusives. Now that both Microsoft and Sony are pushing their games to the PC, it diminishes the demand for consoles.

I agree though with the gist of the article, how different will a PS6 be, what features will it have that I'm willing to give up on my PS5? I'm happy with the performance and graphics.

As an aside, I feel similarly on the PC, why buy a 5090, when a lower end card for 1/2 or even 1/4 of the price will produce a great image on screen with good FPS. I don't need a GPU to computer how every photon from the sun will land in a given scene, or that I can read the text of a sign in a puddle on the street.
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I do think some of PCMR has infected the console space. We never used to talk about console game framerates like we do now. We never cared about resolution like we do now.
 
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maflynn said:
Good points in the article. Also consider the major factor in driving console sales, particularly xbox vs PS - Exclusives. Now that both Microsoft and Sony are pushing their games to the PC, it diminishes the demand for consoles.

I agree though with the gist of the article, how different will a PS6 be, what features will it have that I'm willing to give up on my PS5? I'm happy with the performance and graphics.

As an aside, I feel similarly on the PC, why buy a 5090, when a lower end card for 1/2 or even 1/4 of the price will produce a great image on screen with good FPS. I don't need a GPU to computer how every photon from the sun will land in a given scene, or that I can read the text of a sign in a puddle on the street.
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The only advantage that consoles have had vs PC's is that they use a stripped down operating system to launch and play those games. So a PS5 which is according to some equivalent to an RTX 4060 can produce incredible fidelity because it doesn't have to deal with Windows 11.

Here's the problem with consoles today. They are basically locked in several years prior to their release target. If Sony was planning on releasing the PS6 in 2027, the AI memory constraints threw a monkey wrench in their plans. Because if they have to go with those specs and release the PS6 in 2028-30, that becomes seriously outdated tech.

I read an article that PC gaming is making a huge comeback and it could be another reason why Microsoft decided to bail on the console market and leave it to Nintendo and Sony.

I also agree with you regarding a 5090. I'm not a fan of RT and turn that off as well as path tracing. It doesn't add anything to the experience other than making things look a little nicer.
 
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