Are Laptops the Future?

[peterjhill]

Originally posted by Centris 650
I use an ibook but I am currently looking at buying a powermac. While I may never NOT own a laptop I find that my wife and family need a more "stationary" computer.

Also, if laptops are the wave of the future why wasn't SJ using one during MWSF? (Just Kidding of course.)

How do you know he wasn't using a powerbook?

All I can see is a cinema display. It could be very well set to be video mirroring a powerbook under the table. That would be easier than lugging a G4 around.

My wife is looking to sell her desktop and get a laptop. She does not want to be tied to a desk to check her email. Her parents both purchased laptops last year. None of them are power users. They all appreciate the lack of clutter.

 

[primalman]

Originally posted by Centris 650
Also, if laptops are the wave of the future why wasn't SJ using one during MWSF? (Just Kidding of course.)

Maybe he is! He just is using the external monitor jack and an external KB and mouse! The Powerbook is under his desk, keeping his legs warm.

BTW, love the name! I used a Centris 650 for sooooooooooo long, even built one into a robust file server for a while. HA!

 

[MacBandit]

Re: With a portable...

Originally posted by D*I*S_Frontman
SPG,

You can actually do all of that right now with a laptop. If you use one of those Magma CardBus PCI jobs (see previous post for link) you can have 8 or more full size PCI slots for all your i/o needs. A couple of cards and you can have your wall of SCSI RAID arrays and HD displays. Of course you'll leave all of that on your desktop when you boogie off with your 17' AlBook to make that killer presentation. When you get back, just slide the card back in and wala! Fully functional and fully expandable production suite.

So you're trying to tell me that these external PCI cards can be accessed and have throughput as high as internal ones on the motherboard? I don't buy it.

Also Laptops will always lag behind in pure processor speed RAM capacity and many other things because of size, weight, and heat.

 

[Maclicious]

Originally posted by Wren
I'd have to agree that after today's amibitous unveiling of the 17 inch Powerbook... the direction is only to move forward that direction. I currently own an iMac and a 500mhziBook. I am glad that I waited today before I bought the Powerbook. I am DEFINITELY going to buy the 17 inch Powerbook ASAP! I was going to buy the Titanium's latest upgrade last November.. but Im glad I waited. The price has gone down by a couple of hundred. The advantages of having a mobile computer far outweighs the stationary desktop. Good job APPLE!!

I have an iBook 500, and was also going to buy in November--mainly I needed a bigger screen, but I also needed to be able to be mobile. Thank god I waited for the 17 incher! I placed the order yesterday, and now can't wait. I guess I'll have to wait until February, though; is that right?

 

[D*I*S_Frontman]

Portable as desktop

I run my Pismo 400/1GB RAM with the lid closed 99% of the time. Pro Apple keyboard, optical mouse, and a junky old hp 1024 x 768 monitor. Works great. Took the laptop to my mom's place and hooked up her 21" monitor to it--ran perfectly @ 1280 x 1024 and took all of 30 seconds to configure.

I have been tempted to do the Powerlogix/Newertech G4 upgrade, but for what I use it for (email, web, spreadsheet/db/word processing) it performs flawlessly. When I make my forays into audio production again (once AU gets universally adopted and all the plug-ins go OS X native), I will probably splurge on a 17" AlBook.

Once you've been bitten by the portable bug, there is no cure. Having access to everything you run on your system perfectly configured wherever you go is a powerful asset, and the productivity gains for many people are worth the cost/performance tradeoffs.

Of course, when the 17" AlBook ships with dual IBM 970's, 120GB drive and 4 GB RAM capacity (next year, fingers crossed!) the performance tradeoff won't matter. Once I can mix 48+ tracks @ 96k/24bit, anything beyond that is overkill only bats and dogs could hear the difference in.

Apple should buy out Magma and Apple brand their CardBus PCI expansion boxes, BTW. Then desktops might truly be dead...

 

[moosecat]

I've never understood why the docking station idea has not taken off, especially now that you can cram abundant computing power and storage into a tiny notebook. Seems to me it's the best of both worlds (except, of course, for cost).

I would love the 12" PowerBook along with an integrated docking station solution. I could (if I had more money, at least), have a 23" display at home, a compact 12" display on the road, and never have to worry about synchronizing between two computers, or garbage like that. Mmmm.... Sounds yummy.

 

[jettredmont]

Originally posted by topicolo
Desktop sales are dropping across the personal computer sector. Everybody from HP to Dell to Apple has suffered a slowed in their destop sales.
Why?
Practically everyone who's ever going to get a desktop already has one and they're pretty much fast enough that there won't be an upgrading frenzy anytime soon. Laptops haven't saturated the market like desktops yet.
That's partly why Apple's focusing on laptops. Another reason is that Apple usually makes more money on laptops than with them stale ol' desktops (better margins).

IMHO, the #1 reason Apple is emphasizing laptops this year is that their strengths match well against the laptop form factor, nd their weaknesses aren't as damaging there.

The G4/G3 PPCs are low-power (good for laptops) but relatively underpowered (okay for laptops because the competition sticks with underpowered chips to offset Intel's power hungry nature, bad for desktops where few real consumers care about how much power their CPU sucks up and how much heat it puts off). Aside from the CPU, Apple has a great feel for dramatic design (far more appreciated in laptops than in desktops that are usually hidden under desks anyways) and for practical design (the Powermac enclosure is really really cool how easily you can add to it, but the average consumer doesn't care about the internals of their PC and the upgrader tends to avoid Apple for other reasons; the compactness of Apple's laptop line is universally appreciated by laptop owners). And, of course, innovations are more visible on a laptop (built in Bluetooth is inconsequential to a desktop, and how long do you think it will take before some Taiwanese company is putting out a light-up USB keyboard for any old computer out there ... oops, actually already happened, although before MacWorld and definitely less elegant than Apple's design ... cruise over to Tom's Hardware to see the ugly brute). Add to that a best-in-the-world UI and crash-proofness (much more devastating when you waste precious battery minutes rebooting your laptop than when you just have to go walk around the office while your desktop reboots), and the Apple laptop is a near-perfect machine.

Apple is emphasizing the laptop because that is the market in which it is the most competitive. And, yes, many laptop owners will get a desktop to compliment their mobile device as well, so emphasizing laptops is not a losing play for the desktop group either.

As for this changing with the 970 ... I think that the 970 will change the dynamics a bit (much more powerful CPU with not a whole lot more power consumed), but that Apple's advantage will remain in their laptops.

 

[jettredmont]

Originally posted by SPG
Until you can run a laptop with four HD's two display cards, an MPEG2 encoder card, a decoder card, over a gig of ram, SCSI connects, 4xDVD burner, zip, and a full size keyboard where you want it, I'll need to stick with my above mentioned tower setup...although that 12" ti does look real sweet for a portable...

Well, there's nothing saying all that can't be FireWire devices connected to a laptop that you can take with you when you don't need the rest of it.

But, yes, if you need a bunch of stuff attached to your computer 100% of the time, a laptop is not the way to go because by definition you are not and will never be portable and hence you take on the disadvantages of the laptop form factor while enjoying none of its advantages.

Thing is, most of the consumer world doesn't need a whole bunch of extra stuff attached to their computer all the time. For them, a laptop is a great idea (and, no, you'll never know how useful a laptop with complete wireless connectivity is until you have one ...)

 

[jettredmont]

Originally posted by Kid Red


See, you forgot strudy, stronger, more durable. When you guys have kids you'll know why laptops won't replace desktops

Four kids (and a dog). One desktop. One laptop.

And, no, the kids are not allowed anywhere near an LCD screen ...

Still, around the house I find myself using the laptop a whole lot more than the desktop, even though the desktop has more power under the hood.

 

[Wren]

Originally posted by Maclicious


I have an iBook 500, and was also going to buy in November--mainly I needed a bigger screen, but I also needed to be able to be mobile. Thank god I waited for the 17 incher! I placed the order yesterday, and now can't wait. I guess I'll have to wait until February, though; is that right?

I immediately went to the flagship store here in the West Coast @ the Grove to BUY the 17 inch Powerbook but was informed that it won't be available until Spring. I was infomed that it will take at least 2 weeks. I am on their waiting list and Im really excited! I hope you don't have to wait till February.....I already have an Airport Base station but im now thinking if i should get the Airport Extreme HA!

 

[GeneR]

Originally posted by Centris 650
I use an ibook but I am currently looking at buying a powermac. While I may never NOT own a laptop I find that my wife and family need a more "stationary" computer.

Also, if laptops are the wave of the future why wasn't SJ using one during MWSF? (Just Kidding of course.)

I have a clam-shaped iBook and a G3 Tower. I use both 50/50. The ibook's great for on the road: writing, scheduling, etc. I use the tower for video editing using FCP, and working with visual effects.

The ibook has a dinky 6GB drive.
The G3 tower has 120GB.

So, I'm thinking: Powerbook at 60GB drive + 60GB+ (or more) at higher RPM than 4200 and I'll definitely get a Powerbook and use that fulltime.

But I have to say: I think if this happens then I still believe people will need a digital hub at home. The threat of losing all your work incase 1.) your laptop gets stolen, 2.) you lose it somewhere, or 3.) It's simply unavailable (i.e. at the repair shop) would seem to be rather crippling.

So, will desktops go away? I dunno. I wouldn't think so. I believe we need the backup if anything.

 

[Bear]

Originally posted by GeneR
So, will desktops go away? I dunno. I wouldn't think so. I believe we need the backup if anything.

In truth, I don't think desktops will go away either, especially since they are always likely to support more processors then a laptop could due to power and cooling requirements.

Although, in terms of your requirement for a backup machine, just keep your old laptop when you buy a new one.

Having said that, I will actually be buying a PowerMac after the next update to the product line. I need the processing power, and being able to have the extra disks internal will keep my desk area neater.

 

[pgwalsh]

Originally posted by edvniow


http://www.magma.com/pci/1slot.html

Very nice. Thanks for the link edvniow.

 

[pgwalsh]

Originally posted by JupiterZen


Wow, that was just what I was looking for. I have a Delta 1010 PCI audio card with breakout box and that was a getting in the way of my "I could get the 17''Powerbook" thoughts.

Because then I would have to buy the MOTU 828 firewire interface as well. And both the Powermac and a new audio card with 10 outputs is way over my budget

Alas, the 17" Powerbook is over by budget as well at this moment. But I find myself exploring possibilities

<edit>
Damn, just saw the price on those Magma things for that money I could just get the MOTU 828 and sell my Delta 1010.
</edit>

I have the delta 1010 as well and I liked Magma's solution until I looked at the price of the 4 slot bay. yeish. They're not cheap.

 

[yosoyjay]

Originally posted by Dignan
Why desktops are better -> Brighter screens, Bigger screens.

Thats all I need.

Use an external screen

 

[Chomolungma]

personal account

Originally posted by yosoyjay


Use an external screen

I use my TiBook at home, on the train, in the office, but in the sequencing lab PM macs do data crunching and machine monitoring. Data analysis will always requires more computing power, and I can't see desktop disappearing from my lab anytime soon. Our greenhouse microclimate machines can be monitor at home or office (a big plus). Where I work desktop have pretty much disappeared in the past year.

 

[JSRockit]

Yes, laptops are the future...especially for non-power-users (and even for some power users). I have been desktop free for about a year...and don't think I'll be going back soon. I use my computers for audio and love the fact that I can bring it with me to make songs at a friends...instead of them having to come to me. Also, If I have to play music live, I can just bring my laptop and AI and I'm ready. However, i don't think desktops are leaving anytime soon. Real powerusers/professionals really need them.

 

[pilotgi]

I agree that Apple is focusing on their laptops because there's not a whole lot more they can do to the Powermac before the PPC 970 comes along. They'll probably be a few more minor upgrades quietly announced, like faster superdrives and Firewire2.

I think one of the versions of the Powermac we will see this fall is a new "cube", similar to the Shuttle mini computer. I have the SS51G as a desktop running Linux and it's great.

Agp slot so you can upgrade the graphics card anytime, and everything else is easily upgradeable also. Processor, hard drive, optical drive all can be changed out is a few minutes.

Usb 2.0 and firewire with connectors in the front and rear, and built in lan.

I'll probably upgrade to a dvd burner when they come down below $200.

Apple could do the same thing with a new cube

 

[trebblekicked]

Originally posted by JSRockit
Yes, laptops are the future...especially for non-power-users (and even for some power users).

it's almost scary how powerful these tibooks and alubooks are. i guess i'm a "power" user (i do video compositing, editing, dvd authoring [which includes a little graphics work]), so my machines get a good workout everyday. i've abused a quicksilver 867 for a year and a half and it's still in pristine condition. but what surprises me is the tibook i bought in december. the hard drive speed (4200 RPM?!) scared the bejesus out of me, but it has passed every test i gave it. DV video captures of eleven and fourteen minutes, batch captures totaling twenty five minutes, exports of half and hour+ and not one single dropped frame, no audio drift, nothing. I did a 29 layer composition in AE and it crunched it no problem.
i still love the feel of my desktop system, but there is very little it can do that my tibook can't (especially considering that matrox won't release an os-x version of rtmac- what good is a pci slot if you don't have a useable pci- card?).

 

[alset]

While it seems certain that computers will continue to shrink, I don't believe that laptops will replace them. There is simply no way to pack as much power into a portable device while remaining efficient regarding energy and battery life. This is not to mention that a large population of frequent computer buyers are those more technically excited by the machines. As such, the need for easy expansion will always remain constant.

Dan

 

[JupiterZen]

Re: personal account

Originally posted by Chomolungma


I use my TiBook at home, on the train, in the office, but in the sequencing lab PM macs do data crunching and machine monitoring. Data analysis will always requires more computing power, and I can't see desktop disappearing from my lab anytime soon. Our greenhouse microclimate machines can be monitor at home or office (a big plus). Where I work desktop have pretty much disappeared in the past year.

I think that in situations like this, the crunching power will move to server farms that you access remotely through "thin" clients. These clients can be iMac like machines or loptops with Terminal Server like interfaces to the servers. Apple has already made something called Remote Desktop, right?

No numming and zooming right next to you. And possibly more crunching power at your disposal, this way.

 

[mmmdreg]

perhaps one day, laptops could be like portable inner cores of computers that can be plugged into a dock which is connected to a real keyboard, speakers, a real monitor and perhaps more harddrives so it's more like a desktop and perhaps even a technology that allows there to be memory slots and more processor power in the dock itself and its all combined to become a powerful desktop and then when you need the laptop as a laptop, you just unplug it and it becomes less powerful with less features sacrificed for the portability aspect and you just take all your essential files on the internal harddrive and leave the others in the dock

 

[JSRockit]

Are laptops the future? Of course they are...and desktops...and some other hybrid nonsense...it isn't going to stop at laptops.

 

[benixau]

those hybrid thingys exist. but they re overpriced and underpowered. even by pc standards.

when they come they will be like notebooks.

first for showoffs
then for big buisnesses only
then for those of use without a buiesness check account.

 

[JSRockit]

Originally posted by benixau
those hybrid thingys exist. but they re overpriced and underpowered. even by pc standards.

when they come they will be like notebooks.

first for showoffs
then for big buisnesses only
then for those of use without a buiesness check account.

What hybrids? show me one...please.