Eyeing the new 13" but am wary about purchasing a new Mac with all the ARM rumors around. Any insight?
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Are the new 2020 MBPs wise investments with ARM Mac's likely out this year or next?
- Thread starter DesmoPilot
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Buy based on what your needs are and what is currently available, rather than trying to predict the future.
Get one if you need one. Don't get one if you don't need it and then hold off to see what is available next year I suppose!
Get one if you need one. Don't get one if you don't need it and then hold off to see what is available next year I suppose!
The last generation is always more stabile than a first generation.
Values skyrocketed the last 4 years on 2015 MacBook pros because of the keyboards and USB-C only.
This should likely be the best version of this Generation of the MacBook Pro your going to get.
Values skyrocketed the last 4 years on 2015 MacBook pros because of the keyboards and USB-C only.
This should likely be the best version of this Generation of the MacBook Pro your going to get.
USUALLY not as a daily driver though; unless its running Linux. However; a dual-core or dual-dual-core G5 with SSD could actually make for a decent device; even today.
That being said: Apple really ended PowerPCs life very early last time around. So if everything moves toward ARM; then WHOOPS.
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Buying the 1st gen ARM MBP would be a great mistake. I would not recommend that product until the second revision. The 2020 MBP just got 10th Gen Processors and the Magic Keyboard. What’s not to love there?
Intel on macOS will be supported for years, they started selling the Mac Pro 6 months ago and just launched a new MBP based on Intel. Even if they announce the transition this WWDC they'll still sell Intel Macs in 2020 and support them for a few years.
I bought my 16" MBP last month and I plan to keep it for at least 4 years. This is maybe my last Intel Mac, but I'm happy with it and if I needed to make the same decision today I'd still buy it.
I bought my 16" MBP last month and I plan to keep it for at least 4 years. This is maybe my last Intel Mac, but I'm happy with it and if I needed to make the same decision today I'd still buy it.
The first ARM MacBook will likely be just that, a MacBook. It probably won't be a MacBook Pro and even if it is, intel Macs won't lose support anytime soon. I'm all in to get an ARM MacBook but I have a bunch of other devices I can use as well, if it's your only computer you may benefit from buying now and joining after the first few years when all the kinks have been ironed out.
I wouldn’t wait based on a rumour of a device that may exist in a completely different format from what we are expecting.
If you want my opinion, Apple will not port macOS to Arm initially but rather continue the process of beefing up iPadOS so that it can serve as a desktop replacement for a certain segment of the market. See iPad Pro’s now supporting mouse input.
My hunch is that the first Arm Mac won’t actually be a Mac, it will be an iPad Pro 2 in 1.
If you want my opinion, Apple will not port macOS to Arm initially but rather continue the process of beefing up iPadOS so that it can serve as a desktop replacement for a certain segment of the market. See iPad Pro’s now supporting mouse input.
My hunch is that the first Arm Mac won’t actually be a Mac, it will be an iPad Pro 2 in 1.
Imagine waiting years for an ARM MacBook and then they just release an iPad with an attached keyboard lol.
I'm firmly in the camp of it'll be a low end device first where users are just mostly browsing, email and knocking out a few documents. For those users the apps will likely become dual binary with ARM support very quickly, the move to ARM will be painless and they'll have better battery life and thermals to boot.
However for someone like myself that needs to run Windows for a few things, if I can no longer do that a Mac actually isn't going to work for me at all. I'd have to go back to Windows where as currently I can run both, the best of both worlds. There is Windows on ARM but MS haven't done a great job around this so far. Hence I don't think the Pro models will move ARM nearly as quickly.
Could be wrong of course, Apple's one for burning their bridges. Either way have a 2020 MacBook Pro 13 on order and it'll do me nicely for a good few years. Will miss the early pain of the move to ARM because even though I expect Apple to do this pretty well, there is going to be pain regardless. Just look at the move from 32bit to 64bit only, they gave that a long time and still some people weren't happy because some old apps didn't work anymore.
However for someone like myself that needs to run Windows for a few things, if I can no longer do that a Mac actually isn't going to work for me at all. I'd have to go back to Windows where as currently I can run both, the best of both worlds. There is Windows on ARM but MS haven't done a great job around this so far. Hence I don't think the Pro models will move ARM nearly as quickly.
Could be wrong of course, Apple's one for burning their bridges. Either way have a 2020 MacBook Pro 13 on order and it'll do me nicely for a good few years. Will miss the early pain of the move to ARM because even though I expect Apple to do this pretty well, there is going to be pain regardless. Just look at the move from 32bit to 64bit only, they gave that a long time and still some people weren't happy because some old apps didn't work anymore.
The first gen Intel Apple products struggled with native software for a couple of years. By the time Adobe and others got their act together with true native apps, the then current Intel Macs were better than the first release. I would expect the same here. Also, Intel had a huge advantage in process tech at the time. With the TRUE 10th gen 10nm chips, Intel is pretty close to 7nm state of the art right now, so Apple's ARM chips will have to compete on design mostly rather than relying on superior process tech.
Geekbench scores for the latest iPad Pro meet or exceed any 13" MBP. Now that's not a clear "win" for the iPad Pro but it's reasonable to think the ARM architecture is going to advance more from here than Intel's architecture. Perhaps this is one of Apple's reasons for making this rumored change.
Apple's Ax chips advanced so quickly as they first started with inferior process technology when compared to then current Intel chips. They then took advantage of TSMC's resurgence. Their chip design teams were also top notch. However, even they are starting to slow down as the jump from generation to generation performance deltas have shrunk quite a bit. We've also yet to see the performance of an air cooled Ax chip. The sustained performance may go up considerably with that or it may not.
Let's see what A14 brings and see if Apple can still go back to making as big of a jump as they did earlier.
I'm kind of in the same boat, though I don't NEED Windows, it's more of a "want". In talking with someone else, they have the same view as you do - it won't be the high-end Pro models getting the ARM chips right away, it will take some time. However, after 8 years I'm about ready to replace my MBP and will probably be buying this year, likely in the Fall...
All just my opinion of course but if they come out with an ARM MacBook this year it will be targeting the more casual type users I think. It’s just the obvious place to start where say if Adobe haven’t got their apps ready no one will hugely care as those users won’t be buying that machine.
Maybe when it comes to Windows, by the time Apple does the Pro models that MS have sorted out Windows on ARM as well enough. They do have some emulation for x86 binaries but not x64 however I believe that’s coming. I don’t follow it too closely though.
Still without some kick ass hardware or such, Windows on ARM just doesn’t seem to gather much to any traction.
A computer isn’t an investment, it’s always going to lose value, like a car, not like a house. Buy what you need as late as you can, because there’s always new tech coming down the lane. The last 4 years were pretty stagnant, but hopefully once things get better regarding the pandemic, there will be some better options. That said, a first gen on a new platform is always a major risk.
If you are concerned and don't need a system right now you might want to wait to purchase until at WWDC. If any transition is happening soon there should be some announcements at that time.
Computers (unless collectibles) are not intended to be objective investments. They should be an investment in yourself. Will it make you more productive? Is it something that will help your workflow? If the answers are “yes”, then by all means buy it. If you’re looking for something new and shiny but your existing laptop works just fine and fits your needs - put the money into a stock fund and watch it grow over time.
That’s what I suspect too. They will likely bring back the MacBook, and it will be an ARM-based product. Returning them to a MacBook -> MacBook Air -> MacBook Pro lineup ... at least for a while anyway, until they transition again.
No computer is an investment.
They are either a tool to generate income (or maybe save personal time/money), or a luxury item.
If you will generate or save time/money by purchasing one then you likely have at least 12 months before the new ARM machines are out to pay it off in the same category of device.
If you were wait with no machine for 12+ months, how much money/time would you lose?
That's the question to answer.
Again - no computer is an investment. They are all very rapidly depreciating tools.
They are either a tool to generate income (or maybe save personal time/money), or a luxury item.
If you will generate or save time/money by purchasing one then you likely have at least 12 months before the new ARM machines are out to pay it off in the same category of device.
If you were wait with no machine for 12+ months, how much money/time would you lose?
That's the question to answer.
Again - no computer is an investment. They are all very rapidly depreciating tools.