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Actually you didn't pay for your phone in total. You bought it at a subsidized price.

What about those people who have paid for the phone in full, not a contract price? They own full rights to the device.
 
What about those people who have paid for the phone in full, not a contract price? They own full rights to the device.

Really people! You own the phone, not AT&T's unauthorized data tethering plan!

If you can't afford the plan then get a different phone!
 
Really people! You own the phone, not AT&T's unauthorized data tethering plan!

If you can't afford the plan then get a different phone!

It's not a question of whether or not someone can afford the plan.

It's a question of rationality. Who wants to pay for a service that can use your already paid-for resources? No one.

AT&T loses nothing if I choose to use the tethering option of my phone with the data I already purchased. They only wish to gain through the additional charges placed upon tethering.
 
Here's my take on the whole AT&T tethering issue:
...snip

  • I purchase data from a carrier. Doesn't matter who. This data can be used in any way, shape or form as long as I do not exceed the amount I paid for.
snip...
While I sympathize with you, your assumption is wrong. Go read the TOS for the data plan you purchased. It explicitly states that the data is not to be used for tethering.

That said, I agree with your position in principal. AT&T 'should' be more lenient with it's policy on volume limited plans.
 
While I sympathize with you, your assumption is wrong. Go read the TOS for the data plan you purchased. It explicitly states that the data is not to be used for tethering.

That said, I agree with your position in principal. AT&T 'should' be more lenient with it's policy on volume limited plans.

While I understand that the TOS is clear about the use of data and tethering, I do not believe it is rational nor will it hold in a court of law if the statement is challenged.

The reason behind the TOS stating that the data may not be used for tethering is pure profit-based. They really aren't providing a service. They're just enabling one the phone comes with.
 
What about those people who have paid for the phone in full, not a contract price? They own full rights to the device.
Owning the phone has nothing to do with the data plan - that is something controlled by the carriers and as such, they determine what you can use and how much it will cost you.

Owning the phone removes the subsidy aspect of things - it does not mean that you have any more control over the actual service portion of owning the phone.

Put it this way. Weather you own or lease a car, you still have to pay money to get the gas your car runs on. The two things are independent of each other.

The reason behind the TOS stating that the data may not be used for tethering is pure profit-based.

And that changing things how as far as legality goes? There is nothing illegal about charging different rates for different services. Look at texting. The amount of sheer profit that they get from this is stunning - yet it is very legal for the carriers to charge whatever the market will bear for it despite the fact that it costs nothing to provide it.

Who cares that it is pure profit base. The law doesn't give a darn.
 
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Owning the phone has nothing to do with the data plan - that is something controlled by the carriers and as such, they determine what you can use and how much it will cost you.

Owning the phone removes the subsidy aspect of things - it does not mean that you have any more control over the actual service portion of owning the phone.

Put it this way. Weather you own or lease a car, you still have to pay money to get the gas your car runs on. The two things are independent of each other.

Yes, that's true.

But if I wish to use certain features of my car, I certainly do not have to pay for them. I paid for them when I purchased the car. I paid for the option of tethering when I bought my phone. Sure, the data isn't owned by me, but what I'm rationalizing here is that AT&T is wrong in how they're handling tethering.

If tethering was such an arduous thing to do, then I would understand why there would be a sizable charge, but it isn't.
 
AT&T loses nothing if I choose to use the tethering option of my phone with the data I already purchased. They only wish to gain through the additional charges placed upon tethering.

I believe that this action stems from the AT&T network already being beyond capacity in many areas.

A policy like this will ultimately serve to improve the reliability and reputation of AT&T network.

Many of the complaints about AT&T service are a direct result of heavy data demand. Wireless spectrum is a finite resource that needs to be managed. The policy was created under the assumption that the more something costs, the less people will utilize it. A deterrent policy like this will serve to reduce the overall network load. Reduced load leads to a better experience for more users, at the expense of a relative few.
 
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i believe that this action stems from the at&t network already being beyond capacity in many areas.

A policy like this will ultimately serve to improve the reliability and reputation of at&t network.
Many of the complaints about at&t service are a direct result of heavy data demand. Wireless spectrum is a finite resource that needs to be managed. The policy was created under the assumption that the more something costs, the less people will utilize it. A deterrent policy like this will serve to reduce the overall network load. Reduced load leads to a better experience for more users, at the expense of a relative few.

+1
 
I just wish there were a compromise to this.

I would love to see AT&T offering a true "business unlimited tethering" plan, even if it cost $100 a month.

The reason? There are times where I like getting the heck out of dodge, heading to places where the only Internet access would be a nearby GSM tower, so during that weekend, I'm using the 3G connection as a relatively slow, but steady pipe.
 
I'm tethering to my more data intensive laptop right now. How is this affecting anybody else's bandwidth around me?... while standing in line at the apple store waiting to buy 15 iPad 2 to sell on craigslist.
 
I just wish there were a compromise to this.

I would love to see AT&T offering a true "business unlimited tethering" plan, even if it cost $100 a month.

The reason? There are times where I like getting the heck out of dodge, heading to places where the only Internet access would be a nearby GSM tower, so during that weekend, I'm using the 3G connection as a relatively slow, but steady pipe.

There is no limit to what you can use. You just need to pay for it. That $100 will buy you almost 10GB of data.
 
Yes, that's true.

But if I wish to use certain features of my car, I certainly do not have to pay for them.

It doesn't work that way.


I paid for them when I purchased the car. I paid for the option of tethering when I bought my phone. Sure, the data isn't owned by me, but what I'm rationalizing here is that AT&T is wrong in how they're handling tethering.

Here is the thing - Phone data doesn't just work on a one-sided thing. Both parties have to provide the services needed. You paid for the capability for tethering. AT&T is willing to provide it to you, Verizon is willing to provide it to you. Not much of a choice I understand, but just because you have something in potentia, means jack if nobody can provide the service.

Guess what. When you control the network, you get to determine how the usage contacts work. Unfortunately in the US, things aren't weighed very well for the consumer - even if you have an unlocked phone.

And no. You didn't pay for the option of tethering. You bough a device that is capable of tethering. When you buy a cell phone, you buy a device that is capable of making calls. You don't buy a device that you can just dial right after you turn it on.

Again, you may be able to buy a car that goes 120 mph but that doesn't mean that you can do that right off the lot. YOu might never be able to do that legally at all ever...

If tethering was such an arduous thing to do, then I would understand why there would be a sizable charge, but it isn't.
Sadly. it doesn't matter one iota. Companies charge what the market is wiling to bear. That's the name of the game.
 
I'm tethering to my more data intensive laptop right now. How is this affecting anybody else's bandwidth around me?... while standing in line at the apple store waiting to buy 15 iPad 2 to sell on craigslist.

Have you ever had 5 bars of signal, but a site still wouldn't load? This is the reason. By using data, you are consuming from a limited pool available to a given tower. Once this resource is used up, the tower can no longer perform reliably.
By discouraging users from using 'excessive' data, they reduce the chance of a cell tower becoming overloaded.

That said, This policy seems targeted at unlimited users. If you're on a 2GB plan, AT&T shouldn't care if your using it on the phone or for tethering. I wouldn't be surprised if once they eliminate the remaining unlimited plans, that they remove the tethering restriction and go simply to metered usage.
 
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Have you ever had 5 bars of signal, but a site still wouldn't load? This is the reason. By using data, you are consuming from a limited pool available to a given tower. Once this resource is used up, the tower can no longer perform reliably.
By discouraging users from using 'excessive' data, they reduce the chance of a cell tower becoming overloaded.

<sarcasm>
 
Have you ever had 5 bars of signal, but a site still wouldn't load? This is the reason. By using data, you are consuming from a limited pool available to a given tower. Once this resource is used up, the tower can no longer perform reliably.
By discouraging users from using 'excessive' data, they reduce the chance of a cell tower becoming overloaded.

That said, This policy seems targeted at unlimited users. If you're on a 2GB plan, AT&T shouldn't care if your using it on the phone or for tethering. I wouldn't be surprised if once they eliminate the remaining unlimited plans, that they remove the tethering restriction and go simply to metered usage.

I'm sorry but I truly disagree, in this argument 1 or 2 high use people out of lets say 25 are tethering in your Starbucks and thus taking all the bandwidth, But At&t would easily sell the other 23 people tethering and thus if all 25 are tethering at the same time ( this has happened to me away at a Hotel) then the bandwidth is so overwhelmed that its like having no signal.

Again blaming people for the shortfalls of At&t is not right, its not our fault the network is weak, it's At&t.

If I use 4 gb a month Data on unlimited or with 2gb+2gb makes no difference but so many of you argue and argue it is........ makes no sense at all.

4gb = 4gb of use no matter what the plan

the abusers are the ones using 10's of GB a month some are saying they are using 5gb a DAY!:eek: They would be singled out no matter the plan.:mad:

I honestly think this silly argument of Metered ( the 2=2gb plan with tethering) or the 2gb and tethering is ok is just jealously with the unlimited grandfathered people........ get over it people, Data=Data and these statements truly annoy me.

At&t is on a crusade like Apple is with JB and both don't care about anything but getting people.
 
I'm gonna try that justification when I take my gf to the all you can eat Brazilian steakhouse tonight. I'm gonna purchase my meal and share it with my gf! When they try to make me pay for hers, I'm gonna present 20 pages of comments saying that I have every right to share my meal since I paid for it!
 
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I'm sorry but I truly disagree, in this argument 1 or 2 high use people out of lets say 25 are tethering in your Starbucks and thus taking all the bandwidth, But At&t would easily sell the other 23 people tethering and thus if all 25 are tethering at the same time ( this has happened to me away at a Hotel) then the bandwidth is so overwhelmed that its like having no signal.
This is why AT&T provides wifi at these types of high congestion areas. You admit to having experienced overloaded cell towers in areas where tethering is likely to occur (hotels). It stands to reason that charging extra for the service will reduce the number of users able to tether. Therefore reduce the load on the tower. Therefore reduce the chance of the tower becoming overloaded. You may not like it, but you're own argument supports my conclusion.

4gb = 4gb of use no matter what the plan
I agree with you and said as much in the second paragraph.
 
This is why AT&T provides wifi at these types of high congestion areas. You admit to having experienced overloaded cell towers in areas where tethering is likely to occur (hotels). It stands to reason that charging extra for the service will reduce the number of users able to tether. Therefore reduce the load on the tower. Therefore reduce the chance of the tower becoming overloaded. You may not like it, but you're own argument supports my conclusion.


I agree with you and said as much in the second paragraph.

Yes but instead of AT&T monitoring use, which is, well easy to do,
they are going after all that tether without a plan.

I think this is a witch Hunt.

I'm against the tether fee because as Clark Howard would say "Its a Junk Fee". In reality Tethering costs At&t nothing.

the real focus should be abuse, At&t and all of us should guard against it..

If people as a community would of told these idiots who use 100GB a month that they are abusing the system and not go WOW great, like so many of the posts the last few years maybe this would of never happened and the number would have been way less then the proposed 300,000.

I have an unlimited plan there is no add on option for tethering, its unfair that I have to give it up to add tethering.

Its the Data use thats the problem not the plan.

Do we agree? sure on some points.

But one thing you should agree on, At&t's system has sucked in many places for quite some time and its not our fault for buying and using the data, a lot of this is At&t's fault.
 
But one thing you should agree on, At&t's system has sucked in many places for quite some time and its not our fault for buying and using the data, a lot of this is At&t's fault.

Yes, the reliability of the network is the carriers responsibility. I take it a step further and don't have a problem with users of unlimited plans using excessive data. AT&T sold it to them, and they have the right to use it.

Unfortunately this has lead to issues in the network, so now AT&T needs to take action to address them going forward. Hopefully in a way that is unobtrusive to most users.

The first step was to cease the sale of new unlimited contracts. The current step is to enforce the terms of the existing contacts.

(Legally this was probably their only option. If AT&T agreed to unlimited contracts, they would have a hard time fighting the heavy users directly. They could not have changed existing terms since that could void contracts all together.)

--Beyond this point is speculation--

The coming 4G roll out will likely bring an end to unlimited contracts. Since, new capacity will become available at the same time, the network may actually end up being under utilized. In order to encourage slow growth of metered data usage onto the new network, I would expect tethering restrictions to be removed for 4G data TOS.
 
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Yes, the reliability of the network is the carriers responsibility. I take it a step further and don't have a problem with users of unlimited plans using excessive data. AT&T sold it to them, and they have the right to use it.

Unfortunately this has lead to issues in the network, so now AT&T needs to take action to address them going forward. Hopefully in a way that is unobtrusive to most users.

The first step was to cease the sale of new unlimited contracts. The current step is to enforce the terms of the existing contacts.

(Legally this was probably their only option. They would have a hard time fighting the heavy unlimited users because AT&T sold these unlimited contracts. They could not have changed existing terms since that would void contracts.)

--Beyond this point is speculation--

The coming 4G roll out will likely bring an end to unlimited contracts. Since, new capacity will become available at the same time, the network may actually end up being under utilized. In order to encourage slow growth of data usage onto the new network, I would expect tethering restrictions to be removed for 4G data.

Oh yes I understand what they are doing and feel they have to do,

But the tethering issue and the use issue should be different.

At&t also has it in the contract that Unlimited is abused after 5gb of monthly use.

I see it as a legal mess, they call it unlimited and then try to cap it at 5gb and then sell a 4gb plan ( 2+2 plan) and try to say when they print "Unlimited" it means 5gb........ Honestly it will not fly in the face of a judge.

I truly think when reason comes to play in court At&t will lose on the Unlimited Cap, you see At&t was able to call it a 2gb plan, if they wanted to limit the unlimited then they should of called it the 5gb plan instead they called it Unlimited because they knew people would leave if they didn't.

the tethering thing, I think I'm less sure on, but I think the courts may say what I have said, that Data=Data no matter from the phone or laptops.

Use is the issue not if you tether or not.

Thats where we differ I feel that tethering is not a problem for any of us, its the high use that some feel unlimited means.

I know all the internet providers cell and Home have cracked down on high use of bandwidth.

50 or more GB a month is too much on Cell plan that I agree.

No offense anybody but when you tether 50gb your asking for the phone police to come and get you.........:p
 
Option 3; STOP trying to cheat the system, and START using your iDevice the way the manufacturer designed it and the way your carrier supports it. (Is it unfair? YES! Are all of us iPhone users getting hosed, even though there's now two carriers? YES)

And while you're at it, knock off the piracy with the napster/limewire/torrent crap.

(Yeah, I said it! SOMEBODY had to!)

So you said bend over and take it like a man? Bad advice. I'm waiting for my broadband company to want to charge me a separate data plan for each computer I have on my router.

This is why we need more competition in the wireless world, not less. I hope the Fed's block the ATT purchase of T-Mob.
 
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