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If you think that's a problem that only exists with g-map... then you haven't tried other solutions. most stand-alone GPS units can't find jack and are useless for that, which is why a brilliant person invented this thing called google.

...luckily GOD invented something called a MEMORY, which you'll have to use when you go from google back to g-map. Sadly, pasting the address won't work, since G-map uses a different format. :( THAT I would love to see changed.

...though I am still a VERY VERY happy customer of G-map, and would recommend it to anyone who doesn't live on the border of the eastern and western USA.
 
I think we're going to find out that the iphone screen is too reflective to be used as a GPS. If I hold my iphone up to my windshield, the reflection is really bad. Seems like it would be very hard to see.

Can't wait to find out.
 
If you think that's a problem that only exists with g-map... then you haven't tried other solutions. most stand-alone GPS units can't find jack and are useless for that, which is why a brilliant person invented this thing called google.

...luckily GOD invented something called a MEMORY, which you'll have to use when you go from google back to g-map. Sadly, pasting the address won't work, since G-map uses a different format. :( THAT I would love to see changed.

...though I am still a VERY VERY happy customer of G-map, and would recommend it to anyone who doesn't live on the border of the eastern and western USA.

False. My stand alone basic entry garmin model from 2008 finds most of my POIs. G-map will not even show a post office within 50 miles of me, and there are actually 3 within 10 miles. The same thing with walmarts, police station. If it can't find the most common points of interest, it's useless.
 
I think we're going to find out that the iphone screen is too reflective to be used as a GPS. If I hold my iphone up to my windshield, the reflection is really bad. Seems like it would be very hard to see.

Can't wait to find out.

You just have to angle it right. Why are you waiting to find out, you can find out now.
 
I don't like the trend towards monthly subscriptions. It feels like another way for the corporations to bleed you dry.
Google maps works for what I need. While I don't consult it while I'm driving, it is useful for when I get lost.
 
I have been playing around with navigon europe and it looks good. I will get that when the US one comes out. No subscription. I can't believe that the TomTom one is not ready. Actually I can since they couldn't even show us a demo at WWDC. Guys get ready to wait a while for Tomton.
 
I'm not sure that i understand what all of the sniveling is about in regards toa monthly subscription. I welcome different business models such as these because it provides a choice, which in turn makes the competition step up with something better. At the rate technology is moving, there is nothing wrong with using this for a year or two, and then moving on to the next best thing that comes along. Could be much cheaper in the long run.

Bryan
 
does anyone know how to change the volume of the voices? when i use my volume buttons it just adjusts my ringer volume.
 
Mini-Review

I bought the app today. I already made some assumptions in a prior post.. Here's what I've found so far:

Likes:
• GPS works really well. Gave me plenty of notice to turn.
• Nice that it says the name of the streets. (Usually reserved for higher-end GPS units)
• You can go online and enter your favorites and also plan a trip and then download the locations to your phone.
• Will give multiple ways of getting to a location (e.g. using streets vs. highways, faster or shorter)
• Traffic updates (although my town has no traffic) :)
• Allows ratings of places to see and go
• Shows restaurants, banks, airports, etc. Restaurants were a little limited for my taste.
• Directions are extremely clear on the screen and has a lot of detail, for example I could see if a highway was partially separated or how an exit ramp looked, etc. (no lane advice for my city).

Dislikes:
• The voice is a little quiet and muffled, even when playing over my stereo.
• When playing the iPod, the 2 apps seem to conflict with each other and one will stop working, usually the iPod. Need to experiment more.
• Getting a call pretty much kills your directions. Since I am on the phone all the time, this is bad. After hanging up, it has to reload the entire route.
• After searching for something and then viewing the map, you can't go back to the search results, you have to do a new search. Like if you wanted to verify which location you were looking at.
• Maps online are more up-to-date than the GPS on the iPhone. I don't understand why. My newer street, for example, shows on their planning app but not on the iPhone.

Overall, I will probably keep it until something better comes out. They need to fix being able to take a call and not interrupt the directions. Otherwise, I would have to pull over if I was truly in an unfamiliar area.
 
I agree. $10/month for turn by turn GPS is standard. Sarcasm doesn't come through well through forums.

If you think it's a bad app or don't want to use it, don't! Nothing is forcing you to buy it. It's the beauty of capitalism, the government doesn't force companies or citizens to do anything. Capitalism weeds out the winners and the losers naturally. Just look at the car companies. ;)

... well, unless of course the government took over the car industry, then it'll be interesting to see where capitalism ends and government control begins..
 
Cost of iPhone Navigation apps a balancing act...

BTW, who does not have a GPS unit nowadays? If you check on most highways, all small to medium sized cars have them attached to their windshields. Anybody who can currently afford an iPhone has most probably taken advantage of the reasonable prices of stand-alone units. As for the bigger-sized cars, most have in-dash navigation. If you are a rental customer, most carry their GPS systems, and if you are a high-end rental customer, the cars come with in-dash navigation or an external stand-alone unit as part of the package!

For international travellers, using the navigation app might be expensive, especially if it entails using a roaming charge. I am in the US and I use the Tom-Tom 920 while travelling in Europe and Canada. You can get a refurbished unit at less than $200 at Amazon, and if it means lugging one extra piece of equipment, then let it be. I do not know if you can use the free google maps app without any data connection, but I don't think so; so, a stand-alone unit system makes sense if you are not in your network!

If the app is not going to run in the background (being forced to reload maps after the phone call as per early adopters) then it might be tricky when using the iPhone while navigating in an unfamiliar city (especially like my home city, Philadelphia with all its one way roads!)

Another advantage of a stand-alone GPS unit is that, you can 'lend' it to a close family member or friend while you are not travelling and they are! I give mine to my brother all the time when he goes to the UK! I would not give him my iPhone!

For navigation apps that are being introduced now (unlike 3 years ago when they were prevalent in the Treos, I had a 650, and it was somehow cheaper to buy the monthly subscription, since the prices of the stand-alone units was higher then) they are going to compete with the following;

a) Stand-alone GPS units. Most people I know don't upgrade their units, or do so sporadically, and do not count the 'high' subscription/upgrade fees as part of the costs of operating the GPS unit. Once they buy it (for between $100 to $200,) that's it!

b) The 'free' google maps app on the iPhone. Yes, it has no spoken street names, and many other amenities that are available on a stand-alone GPS unit or a 'real' navigation app, but most iPhone users I know have already 'learned' to follow the blue dot and get to their destination. It might be dangerous and laborious to some, but it becomes like juggling two (not three) fruits after some time!

c) The feeling amongst iPhone users that they are already paying too much for the iPhone services, and the misconception that other cell-phone companies don't charge for this navigation service (they always have). Yes, AT&T charges other smartphone users for navigation services, but remember, iPhone users are the most spoiled users out there ( I am one of them, so don't throw any stones) They demand loyalty and service from BOTH AT&T and Apple, bickering to both companies when a problem arises. I remember when I had a Treo after AT&T merged with Cingular, I could not fathom complaining to Palm for the mishaps of their device for some reason. In any case, there was no real Palm store (not in my area, maybe in the Bay Area, who knows!) to walk into for a tutorial with a 'palm' genius) or to exchange one's 650 if it crashed repeatedly! Only a trip to the Cingular/AT&T store could save you! With an iPhone, you could rush to the AT&T store, and if they are unflinching, dash to the Apple store, which I presume is not too far away! With a bare-bones iPhone bill going to around $100 after taxes, iPhone users feel that they are not only entitled to freebies, but also entitled to modify their contracts (like a loan modification mortgage program LOL!!!) to run away from their two year contracts to get the latest 3GS!

To compete with all these factors, the key factor being the low cost of stand-alone GPS units, and the fact that many people have bought these units during the Black Friday deals in the US (or scrambled to get them when Circuit City was closing down!) at $100 or less, they may have to adjust their prices to make iPhone users adopt navigation as part of their interface enmass.

I do not have a big problem with AT&T and/or Apple/iPhone. I think the iPhone in general blows all phones out of the water. However, this, and other requests by iPhone users just show how much leverage you lose if you introduce a product/application/usage too late into the market.

- MMS is a feature that has been part of the most basic cell-phones for ages. Look at the situation in Iran. Basic phones are being used to broadcast pictures of the unrest worldwide by people who live in a 'third world country'!

- Video. This has always been a feature of most phones. Same Iran example. Basic phones are broadcasting video of the unrest all over the world, while iPhone 2g and 3g users with $600 phones cannot even take video!

- GPS. Everybody kept on telling Apple about the need to have GPS in their iPhone. All Treos and Blackberrys had these features ages ago, and I remember owners buying memory cards with the latest maps to insert into their Treos. At that time, it made economic sense to purchase the maps, as stand-alone GPS units were costing $300 to $600. Apple is reacting when units can cost $50 after rebates! There is just too much competition and too many options, and only hard-core iPhone users shall pay for the AT&T and TomTom navigation on the iPhone.

- Cut, Copy and Paste. It is now here with us, but hey, didn't we all complain 2-3 years ago for a software update?

-Multitasking. Yes, we know it drains battery life, but give us this option with the disclaimer in red. A Good example is the navigation app shutting down when a phone call is coming in, forcing the app to reload maps when the phone call is through! Imagine if you are taking a long 1 hour phone call! What next? They said that multitasking was impossible/unnecessary, but I saw videos of the Palm Pre! (another company that goofed big-time, riding on the success of the treos, forgetting to listen to their palm/treo-forum customers! Have you seen how little traffic treo forums get nowadays??!! Just check them out!)

- Camera with flash, front facing camera for ichat, with a 5.0 MP or better, video light, TV viewing capability, etc. These should have been out with the 3GS!!!

-Wireless keyboard. This would bridge the gap between those who think that the iPhone should have a physical keyboard (they want this keyboard because they type for long periods of time, or type lengthy documents) and those who don't. Having this type of keyboard (I had one for my treo) means that many more business people would use the iPhone for all its worth, instead of branding the iPhone as an elitist phone more suited for the 'fun' user. With prices of $99 and $199, it is no longer elitist to own an iPhone!

I could list many other examples, eg tethering, etc. Please, AT&T and Apple, please listen to your users, and you shall be amazed at just how much leverage you can have if you implement what the majority feel they need on their iPhones!

Let us have the tomtom app, together with the windshield mount, for a one-time fee of $100 max, which can be paid in monthly/quarterly installments or tacked onto your bill (with maybe an optional $20 'annual' upgrade fee that ensures that your maps are automatically upgraded every quarter) Unless you do this, then only a handful of iPhone customers shall see the need to purchase these apps!

Who agrees with me?
 
No 30 day free trial - Call AT&T


I called AT&T directly about this and spent a half hour on the phone as they checked around to try and find anything they had concerning Navigator in the iPhone. Finally, I was told the above mentioned website was for their other GPS enabled phones and NOT the iPhone. I was told being a 'much more sophisticated' piece of equipment, the iPhone was exempt from the 30 day free trial. When pushed to identify the differences in the Navigator applications between the iPhone and the other units, they were at a loss to enumerate them. However; they remained adamant there was no free 30 day trial.

Bottom Line - You will get charged for the service and don't expect a refund after 30 days.
 
Such an app wouldn't use a lot of data. Basic maps are included with the inital download.

The most common data usage would be realtively small realtime changes, like:

  • Realtime traffic updates
  • Gas price finder
Larger data usage would be relatively rare:

  • POI updates
  • Map updates

I believe that the same company (TeleNav) creates the navigator for all the main carriers.

Monthly fees make sense in that it pays for the realtime info and updates.

Back when the App Store was updated to allow subscriptions, it was obvious what they would mostly be used for. More than anything, that predicted the coming of TBT apps.

The main downside to using an iPhone as a GPS, are the app not being able to automatically continue in the background during a call, and the popup notifications that a user will have to reach over and dismiss.
 
Every Company As Some Sort Of Update

If you are like me, picky, and you checked your built in DVD based navigation in your car, you will realize that there is a yearly update for new roads etc. That new DVD , which comes usually from NAVTEQ Costs $200. Also updates for portable devices as Garmin and Magellan also come on DVD or SD cards costs between $100-150, so I am not surprize about the monthly charge , as long as they keep the datat updated every months.

My DVD update for my car cost me $199 this year, of course you can keep using your old data , till you hit a old closed rd.:apple:
 
There goes AT&T trying to raise our phone bills again. Come on!!!! I agree a one time fee, or pay per use would be better. I have a great Garmin Nuvi 765T that is awesome, but once in a blue moon i need gps and dont have it with me.

how about .99 per use, or a one time fee
 
I called AT&T directly about this and spent a half hour on the phone as they checked around to try and find anything they had concerning Navigator in the iPhone. Finally, I was told the above mentioned website was for their other GPS enabled phones and NOT the iPhone. I was told being a 'much more sophisticated' piece of equipment, the iPhone was exempt from the 30 day free trial. When pushed to identify the differences in the Navigator applications between the iPhone and the other units, they were at a loss to enumerate them. However; they remained adamant there was no free 30 day trial.

Bottom Line - You will get charged for the service and don't expect a refund after 30 days.

The iPhone IS listed for the 30 day free service. AT&T doesn't have their act together!! See the following:
http://www.wireless.att.com/cell-phone-service/cell-phone-sales/promotion/att-navigator.jsp
 
xBTW, who does not have a GPS unit nowadays? If you check on most highways, all small to medium sized cars have them attached to their windshields.

Lots of people don't, believe me. I just bought my wife her first GPS a couple of weeks ago. Maybe where you are most cars have a GPS; not around here.

remember, iPhone users are the most spoiled users out there ( I am one of them, so don't throw any stones)

You're judging that by the Internet echo chamber. There are millions of iPhone customers. How many have complained? And I'm sure if you read the Palm/WinMobile/RIM forums you'll see just as much frothing and fulminating.

Nobody likes to pay more than they are paying.

There is no question that there are compelling reasons for many people to prefer the standalone GPS over an iPhone-based one, and also reasons to prefer an iPhone app that is not network-reliant to one like the AT&T app that is. But there are also circumstances and users who will find the AT&T app a good choice. (I understand that you don't find it a good choice, and that's fine.)

1) Those who want real-time traffic updates and realize that they'll have to pay monthly for those no matter what kind of system they get may well reason that using a device they already have is more sensible than buying a new one, and that since the real-time updates require the network there is no compelling reason not to use an app that does so as well.

2) Those who are in and out of the car frequently may find it annoying to have to manage two thief-attracting dash-mounted devices. For them, the stand-alone GPS unit may be more trouble than it is worth.

3) The iPhone also can be used as a handheld GPS. Granted, other apps like the built-in map app are probably about as good for pedestrian use, but using one app for navigation simplifies things. I'm also looking forward to using it on my bicycle, which is not something I would use a typical TBT car unit for.

4) With an iPhone app, TBT directions will pause the iPod while they are spoken. With a separate unit, the iPod will continue to play while you strain to hear the GPS.

Look, there are better cameras than the iPhone camera. There are cheaper phones that make phone calls just as well as an iPhone. There are handheld gaming devices that are much better than the iPhone. You can buy an iPod for much less than an iPhone, and without a monthly fee. The reason we have iPhones is the integration of all of those functions. Integrating turn-by-turn nav is just one more element. Some will prefer non-real-time updates and a one-time fee. Some will prefer the ultimate in integration, with real-time nav data streamed to their phone, and will be willing to pay monthly for it. There is more than one model that works. If AT&T's model doesn't work for you, there are others that may. That doesn't mean that AT&T's model is bad, or wrong, or stupid. It just means that your needs don't fit that model.

BTW, one possibility that hasn't been discussed, AFAIK, but which is intriguing, is connecting a stand-alone GPS to the iPhone through the 30-pin connector, now that the 3.0 OS allows for that. It could lead to better integration of the stand-alone GPS and iPhone, getting the best from both. I'll be interested to see if any stand-alone maker moves in that direction.
 
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