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heisetax said:
How could the PPC be better than Intel yesterday, but now Intel is so much better than the PPC used in the Mac? When were we lied to. My money would go to both times.

How is this impossible? Whenever G4 and G5 were initially released they were better than the equivalent Intel chips. It is now long after the initial release and the 3Gh and mobile G5 still aren't here. When did you stop using your brain?


My plans are to stay with the PPC Macs I have at this time. To extend the time that I can use them, I will also cancel all plans to update my software. Remember, new software requires new hardware.

So you diss PPCs up above and then say you're going to stick with them?


My opinion is support the PPC Mac if your hardware is getting very old. All others should put a boycott on all thing Apple. This could start with the Intel Macs for those that need their iPods. In recent years Apple has changed to a music company away from a computer company. This Intel move will divide the already small Mac market into pieces. Maybe too many to keep it alive.

Okay. So you want to lead a boycott of Apple and this will do what if successful? Ensure that software stops being written for the computers you own?

To many the processor does not matter. To many like me it is all about the processor. I chose the Mac 21 years ago & I still am just as anti-Intel as I was then. I was a Heath-Kit computer user before that time. They chose to make IBM Clones with Intel 8086 processors in them. Being anti Intel I chose not to follow. Now Apple is making the same decision. This time I will make the same decision, not to follow my computer manufacture. This is limiting my choices severly. That is why I must keep what I haverunning for as long as I can.

And you hate Intel because.... ? They fired you? Refused to hire you? You bought a Mac because it didn't have an Intel processor? If you're serious, that may be the dumbest reason I've ever heard for going Mac.

Well if you don't care about the OS--why not just run Intel on your PPC forever. Cheers.
 
ixus said:
By the way, for the professionals demand performances and wouldn't mind to rewrite every single line of codes from scratch, they wouldn't bother to look at the outdated x86 architecture. Good luck with your "new" Mactel PC, and be sure to read more rumors and press releases to expand your knowledges, Fanboys!

As a professional software engineer I am extremely happy that Apple is migrating to x86. Coding for something like the Cell would be completely impractical for 95% of applications. When (or if) parallelising compilers become commonplace then maybe it will be time to take another look at such an architecture but there is no reason it cannot derive from x86 just like Cell has done from PPC.

However you look at it it would be ridiculous to have everything rewritten for something like the Cell. Only a total idiot would even think this possible in the real world.

Edit: Just to clarify: the Cell is not, and never was, suitable for putting in a Mac. I'm sure that it will offer excellent capabilities to gaming but in general purpose applications it would totally cripple the computer. I am sick of the idiots on these forums talking about how great the Cell would be in a Mac. This is simply ********.
 
cube said:
Who says the PowerPC is not effective??
I think Jobs means the development and delivery of the chip to Apple was not effective and that the same would be true of the Cell chip. The article author was generalizing.

What is interesting to note is that that line in the article is in quotation marks, yet also in the third person. I have never heard Jobs refer to himself in the third person, so I think the author has misplaced some quotation marks.
Macrumors said:
The New York Times also confirms that Apple has investigated other chips as well. Apple reportedly met with Sony regarding the Cell design but Jobs "was disappointed with the Cell design, which he believes will be even less effective than the PowerPC."
 
sacear said:
I have never heard Jobs refer to himself in the third person, so I think the author has misplaced some quotation marks.
Actually, it sounds like a press briefing or the like.
 
All I can say is business is business. Jobs is no dummy, and knows what he's doing. I have every faith that this move to Intel will be the right call for Apple's plans in the near future. Well, until Intel promises more than they can deliver, and Jobs moves to AMD... 😉
 
Jobs last surprise, everything predictable from now on!

Jobs needs to get comfortable with being predictable in his old age. Everyone will know what to expect from Apple by looking at Intel's website. And as Steve said, he's set for the next 20 years with OSX.

But what if another Apple comes along and uses a better chip and makes better software? Say something 10 times more powerful than anything on Apple's map. And a nice compiler that will port xcode quickly to the mystery hardware.

Jobs will be very surprised at how many customers walk toward the bright lights. 😎
 
FelixDerKater said:
This is starting to sound a bit like the way things were moving before Jobs's exile from Apple.
Umm, no, not as a remember that, not even close. Jobs' continuous reduced responsibilities that eventually led to him leaving Apple was a politically based power struggle orchestrated by John Sculley. Sculley actually did build Apple into the worldwide company Jobs envisioned, yet Sculley also set-up Apple's weaknesses in the process. Sculley was a business visionary, but not a technology visionary (he did envision the Newton before its time though), he did not understand the technological product Apple was selling, even though he thought he did. Sculley started the downward spiral that Spindler could not reverse and eventually just gave up and continued to drive downward. Amelio just put Apple into immediate emergency triage and tried to stop the bleeding the best he could, yet all the while milking Apple for all he could get. Amelio had no technological vision for Apple and did not know what to do with all the partially completed products in Apple's R&D. Amelio knew Jobs was a technological visionary and Jobs' company NeXT had an OS that worked on the then new PowerPC CPUs. So Amelio bought NeXT and hired Jobs as a technology consultant. If anyone did not see the writing on the wall at that moment, then they just were not looking. Yet, fortunately for Apple, Macintosh, and the world, things worked out very well.
 
IBM essentially gives two excuses: First, the Apple PC market wasn't large enough. Complete BS. IBM isn't a small naive company. They did their due diligence. They had Apple sales figures and projections before the agreement took place and knew precisely what they were getting into. Second, cost. Again, complete BS. Besides the reasons noted above, their cost couldn't have wavered from projections unless there were major technical problems on their end requiring additional resources (expenses) to resolve. Frankly, if that were the case, that's their problem. But I see IBM has made no such admission.

The fact is, IBM made promises and they didn't deliver. The G5 updates have been nothing short of miserable, barely enough just to sustain the Powermac line since the it took the G5 badge. IBM promised a 3ghz G5 a year after the introduction of the 2 ghz model. It's still a no-show. No G5 of any kind for Apple laptops. All things being equal, had IBM actually kept it's end of the bargain, then their excuses might seem more worthy of attention, but it plainly obvious that they didn't. IBM is just employing a little game of misdirection. Shift attention away from it's pathetic performance with the G5, and simply exploit the general perception of Apple's low market share in hopes that everyone will just accept that familiar sounding song and not bother to closely examine how IBM actually performed under the deal. Analysts note that the impact for IBM is negligible because the Apple's G5 "only" accounted for 2 percent of the output from it's NY plant. Gee, that's interesting. What was the other 98 percent doing while Apple had to publicly postpone the introduction of G5 iMac for months due to the shortage of IBM's G5 chips? Yes, as another poster said, IBM is just playing games now.

Regarding the Intel vs PPC issue, it's a no-brainer. Apple biggest challenge going forward wasn't choosing a new CPU vendor, it was too assure software compatibility for both PPC and Intel. Apple has a reputation as being a smart company, and the plan they've come up with is effectively bulletproof. If there was a major problem, you would have heard about it by now from the developers, all of whom are conveniently gathered under one roof this time and thus easy to poll. Apple's major software providers have all come forward and signed on to the plan. In fact, virtually NONE of the software developers has come forward with a story that Apple's switch has presented major obstacles for them going forward. Thats a major (and thus far, hugely overlooked) achievement for Apple. Most of the attention has squared on the somewhat ironic fact that Apple is switching to Intel processors

Well, seeing how IBM did such a thorough job of screwing the pooch, it isn't all that ironic, as we'll see soon enough. The "osborne effect" is another issue that's dead on arrival. First, it assumes that Apple has pre-announced a product that has such tremendous appeal that it's entire computer line will be overlooked in anticipation of it. Apple hasn't announced any future products, in fact, they remain steadfastly tight-lipped about future products as they always have. Second, the switch away from PPC processors assumes that Mac buyers purchased Mac's because of the PPC processor. The fact is, blasphemous as it may sound around here right now, no one really cares about the processor. Most consumers don't even understand how a processor works, much less understand it's role is inside the computer (the megahertz myth). What consumers do care about however is the computer they buy - the box that they pay for, turn on and use everyday. I think any honest Mac user will admit that it's the combination of the OS, software, style, and machine speed (however the user may quantify it) that make up the reasons for buying an Apple box. If the OS is Mac, and the machine is fast, then it's all good. And that's where Apple wins.

All Apple needs to do with it's next hardware update, whether it's PPC or Intel, is to provide something that is roughly 20 percent faster than the machine it replaces. That's pretty much what they've done in the past and if they continue to do so, no one is going to care about what company makes the CPU inside or is going to complain.

But what about the "superiority" of the PPC design? Well, it is. Everything Apple said about the PPC is true. If I were in the market for a new computer and Apple happens to update with a faster PPC model, I'd buy it with no second thoughts. I got a faster computer than the one I had before. Good for me.

So what about all of that PPC goodness when Apple makes the switch to Intel? Two words: Moore's law. Intel has repeatedly stated the company is steadfastly committed to adhering to Moore's law. On the other hand, the G5 has only recently wheezed to 2.7 ghz, still no 3 ghz G5 and counting after a year after IBM announced it's birthday. In this case, Moore's law works decidedly in Apple's favor. When IBM's and Freescale's PPC runs out of gas (if they haven't already), along comes Intel to save the day and picks up the slack. The bottom line is the Apple customer always gets a faster Apple box, and the Intel vs PPC argument isn't going to stop it.
 
sacear said:
I have never heard Jobs refer to himself in the third person
[costanza]Steve is gettin' frustrated![/costanza]


It's fun to sling blame and watch the tech soaps, but the coming phase-out of the desktop PPC isn't necessarily IBM's "fault" any more than it is Apple's:

* Maybe IBM COULD advance the G5 line... but it would cost a lot more than they once expected. Enter Intel, who has fast chips coming based on the Pentium M.

* Maybe Apple COULD pay IBM enough for that to happen, but Mac prices would skyrocket to the point of killing the platform. Enter Intel, who reportedly has offered Apple LOWER prices than IBM did, rather than higher.

So when Apple says it's about speed and future technologies, that's probably true. And when IBM says it's about pricing, that's probably true too.

It's not always black and white. What IS clear is that in the future, IBM chips were going to be a problem for the Mac platform. And a well-planned solution is now in place with Intel.
 
~Shard~ said:
All I can say is business is business. Jobs is no dummy, and knows what he's doing. I have every faith that this move to Intel will be the right call for Apple's plans in the near future. Well, until Intel promises more than they can deliver, and Jobs moves to AMD... 😉
Or back to the PowerPC! 😱

Actually, everyone that is a Mac user should be excited and happy about this transition.

Why?

Because if Apple can make a truly portable OS, then who cares what the engine will be in the future. Ten years from now, the Mac OS could very well be running on something that is not even available today.

Flexibility is key in the tech world.

And Mr. Steve Jobs is showing how Apple leads the way.

Is the transition going to be smooth? They never are. However, for Apple, this is their third major one. Each time they get better at it.

I for one an very optomistic about the future possibilities.

Sushi
 
Thank you!

VanNess said:
IBM essentially gives two excuses:...

<snip>

The fact is, blasphemous as it may sound around here right now, no one really cares about the processor. Most consumers don't even understand how a processor works, much less understand it's role is inside the computer (the megahertz myth). What consumers do care about however is the computer they buy - the box that they pay for, turn on and use everyday. I think any honest Mac user will admit that it's the combination of the OS, software, style, and machine speed (however the user may quantify it) that make up the reasons for buying an Apple box. If the OS is Mac, and the machine is fast, then it's all good. And that's where Apple wins.

All Apple needs to do with it's next hardware update, whether it's PPC or Intel, is to provide something that is roughly 20 percent faster than the machine it replaces. That's pretty much what they've done in the past and if they continue to do so, no one is going to care about what company makes the CPU inside or is going to complain.

But what about the "superiority" of the PPC design? Well, it is. Everything Apple said about the PPC is true. If I were in the market for a new computer and Apple happens to update with a faster PPC model, I'd buy it with no second thoughts. I got a faster computer than the one I had before. Good for me.

So what about all of that PPC goodness when Apple makes the switch to Intel? Two words: Moore's law. Intel has repeatedly stated the company is steadfastly committed to adhering to Moore's law. On the other hand, the G5 has only recently wheezed to 2.7 ghz, still no 3 ghz G5 and counting after a year after IBM announced it's birthday. In this case, Moore's law works decidedly in Apple's favor. When IBM's and Freescale's PPC runs out of gas (if they haven't already), along comes Intel to save the day and picks up the slack. The bottom line is the Apple customer always gets a faster Apple box, and the Intel vs PPC argument isn't going to stop it.
Thank you VanNess for such a well written post. That is a post of just reason and insight. Something that is greatly needed among all the "Chicken Little 'The Sky is Falling'" type posts around here. Good job. Please keep up the good work. 🙂
 
its obvious apple went to intel because IBM was focusing soley on server/video game consoles. That left apple in the dark for the past 2 years and now they are like screw BIG BLUE we are going elsewhere. I like this however I was looking forward to powerful dual core 64bit processors in macs... how is intel's progress on 64bit? aren't they in that weird variable 32bit/64bit processor thing. like its not pure 64 bit...? 😕
 
Gee, that's interesting. What was the other 98 percent doing while Apple had to publicly postpone the introduction of G5 iMac for months due to the shortage of IBM's G5 chips?

Making nVidia GeForce 6800 GPUs.
 
nagromme said:
It's fun to sling blame and watch the tech soaps, but the coming phase-out of the desktop PPC isn't necessarily IBM's "fault" any more than it is Apple's:

* Maybe IBM COULD advance the G5 line... but it would cost a lot more than they once expected. Enter Intel, who has fast chips coming based on the Pentium M.

* Maybe Apple COULD pay IBM enough for that to happen, but Mac prices would skyrocket to the point of killing the platform. Enter Intel, who reportedly has offered Apple LOWER prices than IBM did, rather than higher.

So when Apple says it's about speed and future technologies, that's probably true. And when IBM says it's about pricing, that's probably true too.

It's not always black and white. What IS clear is that in the future, IBM chips were going to be a problem for the Mac platform. And a well-planned solution is now in place with Intel.
nagromme that is also a very good post. Thank you. I feel much better about reading this thread now (and this forum!). I was really feeling hammered by all the panic posts. It's not like the Macs (PPCs) were completely cancelled (a la Newton) last Monday and we won't be getting new Macs until 2006. It was just an announcement to developers to start getting ready for the "addition" of Intel CPUs (no mention of x86 specifically) into the Macintosh line-up. 😀

From what I've heard and read (yet politely correct me if I am misinformed), Jobs did not close the door on PPC (IBM and Freescale), in fact, seems he left the door open. Seems to me he simply added Intel to the CPU vendor list.
 
DPazdanISU said:
its obvious apple went to intel because IBM was focusing soley on server/video game consoles. That left apple in the dark for the past 2 years and now they are like screw BIG BLUE we are going elsewhere. I like this however I was looking forward to powerful dual core 64bit processors in macs... how is intel's progress on 64bit? aren't they in that weird variable 32bit/64bit processor thing. like its not pure 64 bit...? 😕


The entire 64-bitness is over rated in my opinion, 64bits alone don't give anyone any performance boost, you still need an OS that will fully take advantage of all the memory (4 GB and above) for it to make any sense, maybe this will matter in few years but right now I don't think it is a major issue, same as onchip mem controllers, benchmarks show how Opterons "rule" Intels offerings but those are synthetic nonrelevant benchmarks, in real world apps it doesn't make a whole lot of difference, processing times are basically similar, right now no one has any major advantage over anyone... Software hasn't catched on...

Intel is planning to go all 64bit by 2007 to the best of my knowledge (kind of fits with Apples transition, doesn't it)

Anyway, the more I read about Intel and Microsoft, the more I get a feeling that Intel doesn't like MS a whole lot, in fact they wouldn't mind of trying something new with a company that would offer another proven OS and the ability to quickly adapt to new technologies...

Intel and entire PC industry is crippled with standards of all sorts, ATX this, Parallel port that, Intel is kind of stuck because PC industry is afraid of moving at a faster pace and because of this technology is kind of crippled...

What I see with Intel and Apple, Intel has a partnership with a company not afraid of changes, not afraid of new alternate ways, and because of this I think that Apple might actually help Intel develop other better newer technologies, maybe even introduce a totally new non PPC non x86 architecture... Right now Intel has a partner that both can experiment and implement really what they really desire as Apple is the only company that controls its own hardware and software...

I am wondering about Altivec, Apple has a lot of experience with this, I wonder what it would take for Apple to help design with Intel another vector processing unit similar to Altivec on PPC...

Apple presents an opportunity for Intel to totally run away from its current designs and start from scratch with something totally new and actually implement it without MS (and PC standards) involved with it...
 
blitzkrieg79 said:
Intel is planning to go all 64bit by 2007 to the best of my knowledge (kind of fits with Apples transition, doesn't it)
t...


Intel is 64bit now (in hot cores). Will have dual-(cool)core 64bit by 2H 2006.

However, Yonah is 32bit so if first Mactels are dual-core Yonahs (PB's/mini/iBook) they will be (obviously) 32bit. Of course, they're 32bit single-core G4 now...
 
iJaz said:
He just said it was not power effective.
cell is similar to the PS2 when that came out. nobody could write good code for it... so everyone said it was crap. entirely not true. the problem with cell is it requires code that does a lot more than current stuff now does (cache handling etc.). something different is called crap. very funny ironic coming from the Mac community... 🙄
 
blitzkrieg79 said:
What I see with Intel and Apple, Intel has a partnership with a company not afraid of changes, not afraid of new alternate ways, and because of this I think that Apple might actually help Intel develop other better newer technologies, maybe even introduce a totally new non PPC non x86 architecture... Right now Intel has a partner that both can experiment and implement really what they really desire as Apple is the only company that controls its own hardware and software...

I am wondering about Altivec, Apple has a lot of experience with this, I wonder what it would take for Apple to help design with Intel another vector processing unit similar to Altivec on PPC...

Apple presents an opportunity for Intel to totally run away from its current designs and start from scratch with something totally new and actually implement it without MS (and PC standards) involved with it...
Yes, indeed. I agree with your assessment. I also wonder about AltiVec and how that is going to be handled with Intel.
 
VanNess said:
IBM essentially gives two excuses: First, the Apple PC market wasn't large enough. Complete BS. IBM isn't a small naive company. They did their due diligence. They had Apple sales figures and projections before the agreement took place and knew precisely what they were getting into. Second, cost. Again, complete BS. Besides the reasons noted above, their cost couldn't have wavered from projections unless there were major technical problems on their end requiring additional resources (expenses) to resolve. Frankly, if that were the case, that's their problem. But I see IBM has made no such admission.

The fact is, IBM made promises and they didn't deliver. The G5 updates have been nothing short of miserable, barely enough just to sustain the Powermac line since the it took the G5 badge. IBM promised a 3ghz G5 a year after the introduction of the 2 ghz model. It's still a no-show. No G5 of any kind for Apple laptops. All things being equal, had IBM actually kept it's end of the bargain, then their excuses might seem more worthy of attention, but it plainly obvious that they didn't. IBM is just employing a little game of misdirection. Shift attention away from it's pathetic performance with the G5, and simply exploit the general perception of Apple's low market share in hopes that everyone will just accept that familiar sounding song and not bother to closely examine how IBM actually performed under the deal. Analysts note that the impact for IBM is negligible because the Apple's G5 "only" accounted for 2 percent of the output from it's NY plant. Gee, that's interesting. What was the other 98 percent doing while Apple had to publicly postpone the introduction of G5 iMac for months due to the shortage of IBM's G5 chips? Yes, as another poster said, IBM is just playing games now.

Regarding the Intel vs PPC issue, it's a no-brainer. Apple biggest challenge going forward wasn't choosing a new CPU vendor, it was too assure software compatibility for both PPC and Intel. Apple has a reputation as being a smart company, and the plan they've come up with is effectively bulletproof. If there was a major problem, you would have heard about it by now from the developers, all of whom are conveniently gathered under one roof this time and thus easy to poll. Apple's major software providers have all come forward and signed on to the plan. In fact, virtually NONE of the software developers has come forward with a story that Apple's switch has presented major obstacles for them going forward. Thats a major (and thus far, hugely overlooked) achievement for Apple. Most of the attention has squared on the somewhat ironic fact that Apple is switching to Intel processors

Well, seeing how IBM did such a thorough job of screwing the pooch, it isn't all that ironic, as we'll see soon enough. The "osborne effect" is another issue that's dead on arrival. First, it assumes that Apple has pre-announced a product that has such tremendous appeal that it's entire computer line will be overlooked in anticipation of it. Apple hasn't announced any future products, in fact, they remain steadfastly tight-lipped about future products as they always have. Second, the switch away from PPC processors assumes that Mac buyers purchased Mac's because of the PPC processor. The fact is, blasphemous as it may sound around here right now, no one really cares about the processor. Most consumers don't even understand how a processor works, much less understand it's role is inside the computer (the megahertz myth). What consumers do care about however is the computer they buy - the box that they pay for, turn on and use everyday. I think any honest Mac user will admit that it's the combination of the OS, software, style, and machine speed (however the user may quantify it) that make up the reasons for buying an Apple box. If the OS is Mac, and the machine is fast, then it's all good. And that's where Apple wins.

All Apple needs to do with it's next hardware update, whether it's PPC or Intel, is to provide something that is roughly 20 percent faster than the machine it replaces. That's pretty much what they've done in the past and if they continue to do so, no one is going to care about what company makes the CPU inside or is going to complain.

But what about the "superiority" of the PPC design? Well, it is. Everything Apple said about the PPC is true. If I were in the market for a new computer and Apple happens to update with a faster PPC model, I'd buy it with no second thoughts. I got a faster computer than the one I had before. Good for me.

So what about all of that PPC goodness when Apple makes the switch to Intel? Two words: Moore's law. Intel has repeatedly stated the company is steadfastly committed to adhering to Moore's law. On the other hand, the G5 has only recently wheezed to 2.7 ghz, still no 3 ghz G5 and counting after a year after IBM announced it's birthday. In this case, Moore's law works decidedly in Apple's favor. When IBM's and Freescale's PPC runs out of gas (if they haven't already), along comes Intel to save the day and picks up the slack. The bottom line is the Apple customer always gets a faster Apple box, and the Intel vs PPC argument isn't going to stop it.

Excellent post. I am one of thoose who will buy the next big G5 that comes out. It will last me a minimum of 3 years. I believe Steve when he says we have some great PPC in the pipline. Now I just hope he is referring to the PowerMacs and not some iMacs or the MacMini.

I had my G3 233mhz for 4 years and it served me well. A nice new Dual Core 3 Ghz system will do the same for me once again. And in four years I am pretty sure Apple will have a 9 GHz Intel PowerMac that will replace my PPC.
 
kaos said:
Just from my own sampling of Apple fanatics - friends who buy a lot of Apple gear, from G5s to PBs and iPods - I think there may be a far more significant Osborne effect than Jobs and Apple realize. Personally, I used to update my PB every 9mos or so. I'm going to try and hang on to it now until Intel's real notebook procs hit in '07.

The notebooks will be out in '06 and I can tell you right now their current Pentium M processors are REAL enough to trash the crap out of any powerbook in a shootout. By midyear of '06 the G4 PowerBook is going to be a punchline in a leno gag.
 
PPC, Cell, x86 (part 1)

The switch to Intel is the obvious result of what is, and has been going on with regards to the companies in question.

1) Apple, started with the 68k, moved to PPC when it became apparent that 68k was not going anywhere. Had good luck on a few occasions, 603e hit 300Mhz before Intel or AMD. Altivec is damned powerful, in the uncommon cases that it's greatly useful. However when the G4 couldn't exceed 500Mhz for what seemed like forever... It began to really hurt. The IBM move was likewise an obvious choice at the time. Although the Legacy NeXT-based stuff was very portable, the albatross of classic was hanging around OSX's neck keeping it on PPC. At that time PPC was the only option. The IBM 970, all in all, is an incredible CPU with a great deal of promise. Fully utilized, it has the capacity to stomp anything Intel makes currently into the ground. Unfortunately GCC does not generate very optimized code for it, even after the work Apple did to make it better. IBM has XLC, as well as XLF, that generate code that will outperform GCC in nearly every instance by a mile, except that it was never made available for use by Cocoa or Carbon apps. The code can be optimized by hand, but that takes tons of develoepr time. PPC assmbly gurus are less plentiful than x86 ones, and since the Mac market is as small as it is, it's hard to convince a developer to spend tons of time optimizing by hand, since that can kill their profits. So while extremely optimized code would have made the CPU kick serious butt, very few apps are really seriously optimized to take full advantage. Furthermore the G5 generates too much heat to be moved into a laptop, and seemed to be that way for the forseeable future. Which leaves Apple using Motorola/Freescale chips which don't even have a DDR FSB yet, and while Motorola/Freescale does make CPUs that do have a better FSB, they are so seriously targeted for the embedded market that they cannot be used.

This left Apple in a terrible predicament. However they had a wildcard, and that is that NeXTStep is the most multiplatorm friendly OS ever made. So they can move to an completely alien architecture, and with a few tweaks, most Cocoa apps are ready to go onto another platform in less than a day or so. What should be realized is that if Apple does the work (and it'd be quite a bit), it should be just as easy for a Cocoa developer to port their apps to Itanium, or Xscale, or whatever the next thing that comes around is. And have one copy of their app "just work" on all platforms without any issues by the end user at all. As a matter of fact, NeXTStep already had this ability (68k, PPC, x86, PA-Risc) years ago.

More on the other companies after I eat dinner....

Note: Delicous Library was Intel-Mac compatible with only a recompile, which reportedly took 40 seconds.
 
ixus said:
CELL is ofcourse better!

This coming from an engineer who designs processors as a career right? Right? No? Then stop talking about something you don't know squat about.

Everyone needs to shut up about the cell.
OMG OMG!! Its the cell processor! Its going to solve world hunger! Cure cancer! Cure AIDS! reseed the ozone layer and decrease greenhouse gases by 60%. How will it do this? No idea but it will.
 
SiliconAddict said:
The notebooks will be out in '06 and I can tell you right now their current Pentium M processors are REAL enough to trash the crap out of any powerbook in a shootout. By midyear of '06 the G4 PowerBook is going to be a punchline in a leno gag.
Well, hopefully, by Mid 06, the Powerbooks will be intel, i would expect them to be first or second item to actually change over (after the Mac Mini perhaps).

And if Apple can ramp up the speed of changeover, don't you think they will?
 
Platform heel thickness G5 powerbooks with 20 minutes of battery life - next Tuesday? 🙄
All of you who said that G5 powerbooks were never coming out...
 
mvc said:
Well, hopefully, by Mid 06, the Powerbooks will be intel, i would expect them to be first or second item to actually change over (after the Mac Mini perhaps).

And if Apple can ramp up the speed of changeover, don't you think they won't?


Oh I know they can put a Pentium M in a PowerBook. Hell if they wanted to they could have introed a Pentium M PowerBook at WWDC. The power requirments and heat build-up is easily compairable to the G4. Less if I remember right. They could have easily throw an Intel mobo in a PowerBook case and called it done but we all know that isn't Apple's style. I fully expect a PowerBook demoed at MW to be released before 2nd quarter. I mean right NOW. Intel is demoing the chips NOW: http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/mobile/display/20050411010317.html


The kicker in the link above:

ng the demonstration at Intel Developer Forum in Tokyo, Japan, Intel showcased Yonah-based mobile computer, packed with an array of multimedia features, including a wide-screen and a web-cam, as well as a very slim and stylish desktop PC. It is unclear yet whether any of computer makers will actually employ the Yonah processor into desktops.

I know of one computer maker who will be using one and that is Apple for their Mac Mini. Dual core PowerBooks and dual core Mac Mini system with an updated and faster PowerBook at the end of the year along with the iMac probably running Pentium D's.

And look at the date stamp on that link: 04/11/2005. They have almost a year to continue to tweak this thing and when it comes out Apple is going to be able to ship these things in FORCE. No more 4 week wait times. Imagine people who order their PowerBook the day it is announced gets it in a week. That would be something.


Beyond the CPU I'm excited to get a glimpse as to what designs Apple has in store. Up til now they have had to cater to severe thermal issues. Everyone put on your thinking caps and bibs and imagine the possibilities. I’m betting Apple’s engineers are having a freaking blast with Pentium’s and possible designs. I mean imagine 2nd generation x86 PowerBook that is 1/2" thick. Excuse me. I need a cold shower.....
 
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