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It is very sad when you realize that there are hundreds of great games on Steam that can be maxed out and run flawlessly on these chips and yet, there is no official support. Really, it is not that difficult. Take the 100 top games on Steam and provide official support for M-chips and Metal, and the Mac will become appealing for those that not only use their computers for productivity.
 
Okay so performance and longevity wise, which of the these two same priced systems am I better off with:
  • Mac Studio - Apple M1 Max with 10-core CPU, 24-core GPU, 16-core Neural Engine, 32GB, 1TB SSD; or
  • Mac Mini - Apple M2 Pro with 12‑core CPU, 19-core GPU, 16‑core Neural Engine, 32GB, 1TB SSD
My guess is that the Mini will be on average faster on real world tasks (since they’ll all benefit from faster single CPU and GPU cores, but won’t always be able to use all available cores) but probably not by a game-changing margin. (Also note that the two extra CPU cores on the M2P are efficiency cores, which will have more effect on battery life than speed).

The Studio has extra front-facing ports and can support an extra display (OTOH the HDMI port on the Mini is 2.1). Also, I think the Studio is more repairable (the SSD can be replaced, even if Apple don’t allow upgrades, all the breakable ports are on daughterboards etc.)

Rather than juggling two almost identically priced devices, if you know you can use 32 GPU cores I’d consider the Studio with the $200 GPU bump, or if the M1 Max was overkill anyway, the Mini without the cpu bump…

Mostly, I’d wait for the real-world tests and r3views on issues like fan noise.
 
It is very sad when you realize that there are hundreds of great games on Steam that can be maxed out and run flawlessly on these chips and yet, there is no official support. Really, it is not that difficult. Take the 100 top games on Steam and provide official support for M-chips and Metal, and the Mac will become appealing for those that not only use their computers for productivity.
Are there really games in the top 100 that Apple users want to play that don't already have (or had) macOS support?
 
My guess is that the Mini will be on average faster on real world tasks (since they’ll all benefit from faster single CPU and GPU cores, but won’t always be able to use all available cores) but probably not by a game-changing margin. (Also note that the two extra CPU cores on the M2P are efficiency cores, which will have more effect on battery life than speed).

The Studio has extra front-facing ports and can support an extra display (OTOH the HDMI port on the Mini is 2.1). Also, I think the Studio is more repairable (the SSD can be replaced, even if Apple don’t allow upgrades, all the breakable ports are on daughterboards etc.)

Rather than juggling two almost identically priced devices, if you know you can use 32 GPU cores I’d consider the Studio with the $200 GPU bump, or if the M1 Max was overkill anyway, the Mini without the cpu bump…

Mostly, I’d wait for the real-world tests and r3views on issues like fan noise.
“Since the Mac Studio's storage controllers are housed within its SoC, swapping out or adding SSDs isn't as easy as it might seem. Tests have showed that even original Apple SSDs cannot be used to swap or expand a Mac Studio's storage unless they are the exact configurations the M1 Max or Ultra is expecting.”

 
Apple isn’t going to release OLED screens on their iPads & laptops without completely addressing brightness & burn in. I’m not aware of any 2 layer OLED screens on the market yet, and if the are I believe Apple will do them better If & when Apple releases them. 🍏👀
Apple does not make the actual panels themselves. They are either Samsung, Sony or LG. The only thing Apple does is make the hardware that drives the panel.
 
“Since the Mac Studio's storage controllers are housed within its SoC, swapping out or adding SSDs isn't as easy as it might seem. Tests have showed that even original Apple SSDs cannot be used to swap or expand a Mac Studio's storage unless they are the exact configurations the M1 Max or Ultra is expecting.”
As I said, the SSDs can be replaced even if Apple don't allow upgrades. I.e. if the SSDs fail you can replace them with the same configuration. Via an authorised service agent or via the DIY scheme (which will only sell you the permitted SSDs for your system's serial number). That's not perfect but its 100% better than the Mac Mini which would need a new mainboard if the SSDs failed.
 
It is very sad when you realize that there are hundreds of great games on Steam that can be maxed out and run flawlessly on these chips and yet, there is no official support. Really, it is not that difficult. Take the 100 top games on Steam and provide official support for M-chips and Metal, and the Mac will become appealing for those that not only use their computers for productivity.

RE Village on MBP M2 Max 38c
1440p Max settings MetalFX Quality mode 120-170 fps
2234p (3.5K) Max settings MetalFX Quality mode 100-110 fps
2234p (3.5K) Max settings no MetalFX 70-90 fps

 
Mac Studio with 32gb Ram and 512 ssd with M1 Max is the same price as the Mac mini with M1 Pro with 32 gb ram and 512. both at $2000..so ? I think you meant the M2 Pro mac mini has very little rationale to be bought with 32gb ram and 512 SSD or more
I wasn't commenting on the Mac mini at all..? 🤨 I was commenting on the higher end MBPs versus the studio.
 
The "staggered release" of Apple Silicon-based Macs causes frustration. First, the M* comes out, then the M* Pro and Max, then the M* Ultra. For example, the M2 Max in the mini and MacBook Pro temporarily obsolete the M1 Studio until it too is upgraded to the M2 Max. And we have to assume the "M2 Ultra" will be available at the same time in the Studio line. The new ASi "Mac Pro" may indeed bring back the discrete GPU concept that we've had in the Intel Macs for quite some time now. The eGPU concept is still valid, even though Apple has decided (so far) to not bring it to the ASi Macs.
 
Okay so performance and longevity wise, which of the these two same priced systems am I better off with:
  • Mac Studio - Apple M1 Max with 10-core CPU, 24-core GPU, 16-core Neural Engine, 32GB, 1TB SSD; or
  • Mac Mini - Apple M2 Pro with 12‑core CPU, 19-core GPU, 16‑core Neural Engine, 32GB, 1TB SSD
Have you picked one? Also look at these same setups.
 
Have you picked one? Also look at these same setups.
I actually decided to give the prospects of a new decent sized (i.e. not 24inch) iMac one more year. If nothing is released by end of this year then will re-assess.
 
Apple has always updated systems in this order... Those that sell in larger volumes get updated first. That just good business sense as it helps bring costs down.

If someone needs a powerful desktop (not a laptop) right now, there's no reason not buy the Ultra Studio. You can always resell it later, if you need something with more power.

14" inch MBP M2 Max 12c/38c-gpu 64 GB MEM 1TB = £3950
Mac Studio M1 Ultra 20c/48cgpu 64 GB MEM 1TB = £3999

For me, with the benchs we have had shared, I see very little reason why I would not just dock a MBP and whisper "your a desktop" in its ear. Heck, if I was then feeling really wild, I'd take it for trips outside.

I was actually in the market for a studio, didn't particularly want a laptop, but I pre ordered a 14" inch MBP M2 Max 12c/38c-gpu 32 GB MEM 2TB. If I can get that close in performance, for a better price, I genuinely can't see why I wouldn't buy the laptop.. For me, knowing in my heart I got a true desktop, as opposed to a docked laptop doesn't really make much of a difference.
 
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The "staggered release" of Apple Silicon-based Macs causes frustration. First, the M* comes out, then the M* Pro and Max, then the M* Ultra. For example, the M2 Max in the mini and MacBook Pro temporarily obsolete the M1 Studio until it too is upgraded to the M2 Max. And we have to assume the "M2 Ultra" will be available at the same time in the Studio line. The new ASi "Mac Pro" may indeed bring back the discrete GPU concept that we've had in the Intel Macs for quite some time now. The eGPU concept is still valid, even though Apple has decided (so far) to not bring it to the ASi Macs.
This happens with Intel and AMD as well. They can’t bring out all of their chips in a generation at once. They bring out the desktop, laptop, and server chips on a staggered schedule. No one has the design resource or the manufacturing capacity to do them all at once.

When you add in the chaotic supply and manufacturing environment delays, it all gets a little hard to predict. All we get are rumors from sources with variable records and then try to read the tea leaves based on history. It more of a hobby than something you can place bets on.
 
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This happens with Intel and AMD as well. They can’t bring out all of their chips in a generation at once. They bring out the desktop, laptop, and server chips on a staggered schedule. No one has the design resource or the manufacturing capacity to do them all at once.
Easy to see with massive design undertakings and complex manufacturing processes like processor chips.

Not so obvious in the case of (say) not bumping a Mac Mini or 24" iMac to (regular) M2 when the chip was launched last June, or not bumping the M1 Max Studio to M2 Max last week. Yes, it means designing new mainboards, but that's not nearly as complex as new chips (half the point of a SoC design is most of the clever stuff is in on the chip).

A M2 Max studio now would have solved the current "collision" between the top-end M2 Pro Mini and the bottom-end M1 Max Studio, whereas the M1 Ultra Studio is still comfortably "top dog" until the M2 Ultra comes out (if your workflow can use it, 100% more cores is going to beat 10-20% faster per core - and if not the Ultra wouldn't have been for you anyway).
 
The high-end M1 Ultra chip released for the Mac Studio last year is still about 9% faster than the M2 Max based on Metal scores:
  • M1 Ultra: 94,583
  • M2 Max: 86,805
  • M1 Max: 64,708
  • M2 Pro: 52,691
  • M1 Pro: 39,758
Nice, though I did spend £600 on an eGPU case and a Radeon RX 6600XT and it sits nicely (even over TB2) between the M1 Max and M2 Max.

True that my old system CPU performance is not the greatest, but having built a dual processor hackintosh years ago with 8 Xeon cores to improve video processing only to discover that Apple use the GPU for this (D-OH), I'll wait until the M3 Pro and Max come out before I jump ship.

And I still have my 16GB Mac Mini M1 for better CPU performance than my Intel iMac.

But still a great piece of engineering without a discrete graphics card.
 
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