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katanna

macrumors 6502
Original poster
May 6, 2004
345
41
I am looking for a soundbar recommendation. Wish list:
  • Around $500
  • Works well with my Apple TV 4K (1st generation) (for example, the Apple TV remote can control the volume)
  • Lets me easily stream music from my phone to the speakers without needing to turn on the TV
  • Wall mountable
Thoughts? Thanks!

Matthew
 

C0re0

macrumors newbie
Oct 18, 2020
27
10
Hi,

for that budget I would recommend the SONOS Beam 2.
Integrates well into the Apple ecosystem, has Airplay 2 functionality, Dolby Atmos support and you can wall mount it.

But generally spoken, for about 500$ you cannot expect a high-end soundbar at all. And your room size also does matter.

Alternative: 2 Homepods 2nd Gen, though the pricetag is 700. But for Dolby Atmos, you would need eARC.
That is my setup.

Kind regards!
 

HobeSoundDarryl

macrumors G5
If you regularly watch Sonos (website) and Sonos refurb (and their Ebay official account), they have had their best one- Arc- on sale for $539 this year. Just keep checking. Arc is often rated best or near the top by objective sources/reviews all over the web. Else, wait for Black Friday and have another fair chance at about that price too.

For that approximate budget and if you are certain you want a soundbar instead of a traditional setup (of which $500 would be a good starter amount), that's a great, general answer to your want. In the traditional setup, you can get the "easily stream" part by choosing a Receiver that supports Airplay 2 (many- maybe most(?)- do these days).

Traditional is superior (audio) to any soundbar and- if you like- you can mount the center speaker on the wall like you are intending with a soundbar. You could optionally start with maybe front left-center-right (speakers) now and then add on Sub and surround speakers later if budget is tight.

Traditional also means that the speaker portion won't be made obsolete by a company deciding to vintage the "smarts" portions. You can just replace the Receiver every 10-15 years and the entire speaker mix will be as up to date as possible. Good "dumb" speakers can sound just as good 20-30 years from now.

Apple spins that HPs are ATMOS but that's spin... as it is when Soundbars make the same claim. True ATMOS REQUIRES physical speakers all around you and overhead too. There is no faking it with 1 or 2 speakers or a soundbar out front. If you want ATMOS, you need to get a traditional setup with an ATMOS receiver and a goal of getting physical speakers spread around your main seating position. Else, all professional theaters would save lots of money by putting a couple of HPs or a single soundbar down front by the screen and you just won't find that in ANY cinema. Next time you go see a movie, get there early, before the lights go down, and take a good look around. Speakers will be spread all around wherever you are seated. Why? Not because the theater wants to spend fortunes on speakers all over the theater if 1 or 2 down front yields "just as good" "ATMOS" sound.

Sonos will get you closer to ATMOS if you only want to consider soundbars because you can add a couple of their 300s as surrounds and their Subwoofer too. HPs are absolutely limited to stereo only. There's not even 1 rumor that Apple has any aspirations to make them more than that.

IMO...
  • Best: Traditional (Good Receiver + quality "Dumb" speakers)
  • Middling: Quality Soundbar like Arc with the existing, already-refined capability to add surrounds and a sub
  • Low: Stereo speakers including HPs, capped at being stereo only and located only up front
  • Lower: a mono speaker of which cheapest soundbars might be lumped into this one
  • Worst: use the TV's speakers
Lastly: buy well and these can serve you for the rest of your life. This is not like buying a new iPhone or Mac where you know you are going to have to replace it in a few years (as is almost certainly the case with HPs because they are entirely dependent on iDevice "smarts"). Good speakers can be a lifetime purchase if you choose well... and they can sound as good in 2044 as they sound in 2024. Budget accordingly. We'll spend much more to own the latest iWhatever that we'll be faulting as "long in tooth" in only a couple of years... and then replacing for at least as much expense again... and then again. Consider taking a "new iPhone or two" budget and you can assemble fantastic home theater audio to never get "long in tooth" with reasonable care.
 
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chadamorrill

macrumors 6502
Sep 13, 2007
399
178
Orlando, FL
My two cents... if you room is a perfect square (or your TV sits in the middle of two walls on either side), then go for the soundbar. If it doesn't, look elsewhere. Without anything to bounce sound off of, a soundbar cannot produce sound for that open side. My family room is big, and completely open on the left side, and sound from the Beam disappeared that way. The experience was not good at all. That plus the struggles with their Sonos app, and I'm probably not recommending the Beam anyway, to be completely honest.

I sold my Beam and went two Homepod 2's. Haven't looked back once.
 

trip1ex

macrumors 68040
Jan 10, 2008
3,196
1,867
HomePods!

easily the (most) seamless option for those needs.

and you get some nice bonus features. The one I use most is hands free pause, mute, skip, go back of video. Even better now because you only have to say Siri instead of Hey Siri.

And that's only the tip of the bonus features iceberg. There's making/taking phone calls, setting alarms/timers, intercom system, texting, and more including obviously asking Siri questions. Haven't bothered with much of those myself but occasionally.
 
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mogga71

macrumors member
Apr 7, 2017
62
75
London
I have had numerous sound bars and currently have the Samsung Q990B Atmos system ... which is really good and would recommend it. I also recently paired a pair of HomePods with my downstairs Apple TV and I was blown away just how good they sound. I actually prefer the type of bass they give off compared to other soundbar packages that offer integrated subwoofers (like my Samsung). Truth be told, if I was doing it all over again I would simply go the HomePod route. I don't quite understand why Apple don't support the HomePod Minis as surrounds ... they would be great.
 

C0re0

macrumors newbie
Oct 18, 2020
27
10
Very good comments and suggestions here!

I absolutely agree, for the true Atmos experience you will need a rather complex setup with several speakers perfectly arranged, including rear speakers and speakers above your head. Most standalone soundbars have upfiring speakers to ensure that the sound bounces off the ceiling towards your hearing position. This can work quite well, dependent of your room size and layout.

I went the route „Stereo HomePods“ and they sound amazing. And I would say that the sound experience goes beyond simple stereo. Tested this with some movies and music (I have an AM subscription and tested Dolby Atmos tracks. Just search for music from Jennifer Athena Galatis and you will know what I mean).
Will never go back to my Sonos system.

Otherwise, Sonos Arc is also highly recommended, especially if you can find a good deal.
 

mogga71

macrumors member
Apr 7, 2017
62
75
London
Very good comments and suggestions here!

I absolutely agree, for the true Atmos experience you will need a rather complex setup with several speakers perfectly arranged, including rear speakers and speakers above your head. Most standalone soundbars have upfiring speakers to ensure that the sound bounces off the ceiling towards your hearing position. This can work quite well, dependent of your room size and layout.

I went the route „Stereo HomePods“ and they sound amazing. And I would say that the sound experience goes beyond simple stereo. Tested this with some movies and music (I have an AM subscription and tested Dolby Atmos tracks. Just search for music from Jennifer Athena Galatis and you will know what I mean).
Will never go back to my Sonos system.

Otherwise, Sonos Arc is also highly recommended, especially if you can find a good deal.
Jeez ... thank you so much for the heads up regarding Jennifer Athena Galatis .... the demo tracks are amazing. On the music front, probably the best Atmos sound I have come across is by a guy called Max Cooper .... his new single The Sun In A Box and especially his album Emergence (Dolby Atmos Version). They sound incredible.
 

priitv8

macrumors 601
Jan 13, 2011
4,075
655
Estonia
And I would say that the sound experience goes beyond simple stereo.
Exactly, like the AirPods headphones do. It is thanks to Apple's digital processing - binaural spatial rendering.
You can also test with this youtube video - you will hear more than stereo (here the processing result has already been recorded on youtube audio track, so any stereo setup will create the spatial sensation):
 
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katanna

macrumors 6502
Original poster
May 6, 2004
345
41
Thanks all! Our living room is very oddly shaped; it is open to a second story loft/hallway, the viewing area (couch) is under an overhang, the room is semi-open on the left to the kitchen and on the right to an entryway... just acoustically horrible. (I tried to take some photos, but don't know how much they help...)

So this is why a traditional 5.1 surround sound system isn't really feasible, because to run wires in the walls would be downright impossible. In addition to this, we have young kids, so we want something that they can't fiddle with and also we don't want a lot of volume because it would wake them up.

Given all of the above, we are not looking for "OMG this is the best surround sound ever", we are looking for "better than the built-in TV speakers". We are approaching 40 years old and we want to hear voices a bit easier (the latest TVOS should help with this), and just overall want something that sounds better than we have now. Price point is because we were hoping to ask for the soundbar as a Christmas gift.

Thanks again!
 

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HobeSoundDarryl

macrumors G5
With that new information and pics (and further clarified preferences), I’d still suggest catching Arc on sale/refurb and/or chip in towards your gift or get someone else wanting to give you a gift to chip in.

That enormous vertical space will beg for a great soundbar if you want one. And even if you want low volume most of the time, there will be other times that you might have reason to crank it a bit. Room-filling sound is significantly challenged if you go small here.

Idea 2: buy Arc yourselves and be gifted an Era 300 or two for surrounds. Black Friday and/or refurb can yield significant savings on them.

Idea 3: Sonos isn't the only game in town (just a very good one for anyone wanted a soundbar-based system). Another good option is the kind that includes a wireless sub that then connects to the surrounds. You can put the soundbar where you expect and then bass and surround sound is wireless beamed to a subwoofer module and 2 surround speakers connect to the sub. Sub is usually put on the back wall for this so that there are no wire runs left & right of the TV (Sub generally sounds just fine ANYWHERE in a room). A good suggestion that is high rated by many sources is Polk MagniFi MAX AX or Nakamichi Shockwafe Pro Bluetooth 7.1.4 Channel, though only the former and Sonos directly supports Airplay 2. A workaround for the latter is to lean on Airplay to the AppleTV to then play from the Nakamichi speakers. Again, Black Friday is likely to yield better pricing and/or, be gifted a portion of something like that Polk and then add the rest yourselves.

Idea 4: if you would rather build yourself the traditional Receiver + "dumb" speakers setup, your pictures imply that you could possibly run your wires for the rears around the far right wall (and stairs) to get back to the seating area. There's lots of products to hide these including hollow baseboards and/or various kinds of strips (example) that sit above or in front of existing baseboards and basically blends right in. Maybe you can get through the underside of the stairs? Or if you have a basement, maybe you can send a few lines down, across and then up again behind the seating area? Harder than a soundbar? YES. But if you can find a way, it will likely yield very best sound.

Again, a good starter- since you are thinking soundbar anyway- would be to go with only front left, front center & front right speakers, immediately giving you better stereo separation than ANY soundbar choice at any price. Then you can always add sub and rears later. Traditional is not necessarily about "loud"(er) but just best. And in a room with that much vertical (open) space, it would still likely be the best option for great sound- loud or quiet. Else you are asking a LOT of any soundbar and even more so of speakers like HPs and similar.

One more note: little kids grow fast and may want to crank it themselves in a few years. Teenagers tend to like their audio LOUD. Speakers- if you choose good ones- will likely still be your speakers when they are adults. Consider what you want in 2034 and 2044 vs. only 2024.

All that offered though, if the selection quality bar is dropped to "better than TV speakers", anything will likely be better. TV makers usually cheap out on built-in speakers. So just anything should sound better than the TV.
 
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bag of kittens

macrumors regular
Feb 17, 2012
135
3
inside a bag
For a room that size, I would recommend the Samsung Q990D. That will set you back about $1500 but it's the best value for great home theater audio imo.

If you are absolutely set on spending less than $500, I would go with others have said - try to find a refurbished Sonos Arc, or go with the Sonos Beam 2. The Beam 2 is an amazing sound bar at the price point.

If you watch a lot of TV/Movies, don't go with Apple HomePods. You want an actual soundbar with a center channel or else hearing dialogue will be difficult.
 

kiranmk2

macrumors 68000
Oct 4, 2008
1,638
2,253
Looking at your room I think an Atmos setup is goign to be hard due to the high ceiling and openings to the left and right of the screen. This means that upfiring solutions from the front may not bounce down off the ceiling to your seating position and any side-firing speakers to give a surround effect (such as the Arc) will likely have limited effectiveness.

It sounds from your comments that you're not overly fussed about a good Atmos effect and are mostly interested in "better than TV speakers.' My recommendations would be to trial a Sonos Beam 2 and maybe the Bose range. The Beam 2 is a 3.0 speaker that uses digital processing to imitate and Atmos effect without upfiring speakers, which might actually the best option for your setup. You can also add a Sub and rears over time if you see fit. The Bose soundbars have a good reputation, but I haven't heard them.

Of course, the Beam 2 also offers easy music streaming either via the Sonos ecosystem or simply via AirPlay 2.
 

stocklen

macrumors 6502a
Sep 25, 2013
879
1,683
Very good comments and suggestions here!

I absolutely agree, for the true Atmos experience you will need a rather complex setup with several speakers perfectly arranged, including rear speakers and speakers above your head. Most standalone soundbars have upfiring speakers to ensure that the sound bounces off the ceiling towards your hearing position. This can work quite well, dependent of your room size and layout.

I went the route „Stereo HomePods“ and they sound amazing. And I would say that the sound experience goes beyond simple stereo. Tested this with some movies and music (I have an AM subscription and tested Dolby Atmos tracks. Just search for music from Jennifer Athena Galatis and you will know what I mean).
Will never go back to my Sonos system.

Otherwise, Sonos Arc is also highly recommended, especially if you can find a good deal.
I find this really interesting and am keen to hear more from you.

I have a sonos ARC and although Sonos is far from perfect it would get my vote as a great soundbar - and the Beam at your budget was good.

Two HomePods (assuming regulars not minis) are actually more expensive that the Beam.

I do have two of them, and when I bought them the first thing I did purely out of interest is to put them under the TV and see how they sounded with ATMOS etc.
Personally I was not impressed although that's probably as I had an ARC and was used to its sound.
What particularly frustrated me is that I had no sense of sound coming from dead centre - it was always left and right and dialogue in particular seemed weird coming from the sides rather than the centre front.

That said technically they are a great option for sound and certainly as you can use them via the Audio Return Channel as the output for anything plugged into the tv... they make a great wireless option.
 

chadamorrill

macrumors 6502
Sep 13, 2007
399
178
Orlando, FL
After hearing the Sonos Beam in my open living room, I couldn't possibly recommend it for yours. The openness of your ceilings and the crappy app Sonos has currently, I think you'd be severely disappointed with the overall experience.

My vote would be for a soundbar with wireless rears and wireless sub within your $500 price point. Maybe Vizio or something like that.

PS. Re-reading your original post, the AppleTV 4k (1st gen) doesn't support ARC, so for me, that would be a dealbreaker for the Homepod 2's, unless you only have the AppleTV and no gaming consoles or antenna/cable TV or bluray players, etc. If you have any other sources, you'd want to upgrade the AppleTV to 2nd or 3rd gen in order to get ARC support.
 

moyjoy

macrumors 6502
Jul 4, 2019
315
848
New York
My two cents... if you room is a perfect square (or your TV sits in the middle of two walls on either side), then go for the soundbar. If it doesn't, look elsewhere. Without anything to bounce sound off of, a soundbar cannot produce sound for that open side. My family room is big, and completely open on the left side, and sound from the Beam disappeared that way. The experience was not good at all. That plus the struggles with their Sonos app, and I'm probably not recommending the Beam anyway, to be completely honest.

I sold my Beam and went two Homepod 2's. Haven't looked back once.

Thanks all! Our living room is very oddly shaped; it is open to a second story loft/hallway, the viewing area (couch) is under an overhang, the room is semi-open on the left to the kitchen and on the right to an entryway... just acoustically horrible. (I tried to take some photos, but don't know how much they help...)

So this is why a traditional 5.1 surround sound system isn't really feasible, because to run wires in the walls would be downright impossible. In addition to this, we have young kids, so we want something that they can't fiddle with and also we don't want a lot of volume because it would wake them up.

Given all of the above, we are not looking for "OMG this is the best surround sound ever", we are looking for "better than the built-in TV speakers". We are approaching 40 years old and we want to hear voices a bit easier (the latest TVOS should help with this), and just overall want something that sounds better than we have now. Price point is because we were hoping to ask for the soundbar as a Christmas gift.

Thanks again!

I have very high ceilings, an open kitchen/diningroom/living room floor plan and two full walls of floor to ceiling windows and my Sonos Arc + subwoofer surprises me continuously. The kitchen is off to the side as is a good sized hallway. It even sounds good if I'm in the hallway, both music and TV. And music sounded good was at the top of my list (I work in music). I use AppleTV 4k 2nd Gen. I have Atmos turned off for music.

For voices Sonos voice enhancement is great and Apple's additional enhancement is even better, especially when watching movies and shows with heavily accented characters. I will say for Succession it sounded like they were talking to me in my house so I toggled it off in the Sonos app for that show lol.

As for surround sound I don't feel like I'm at the movie theatre of course but I do have to pause sometimes to make sure sounds are coming from my TV and not inside my house LOLOLOLOL!!!!!
 

katanna

macrumors 6502
Original poster
May 6, 2004
345
41
Thank you all for your amazing wisdom, I appreciate all of it!

Question: It looks, based on the website, that the Sonos system is mix-and-match. Is that true? For example, if I get the Arc now and want to add a woofer later then a year after that add the Era speakers, is that possible/easy?

Thanks again!
 
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