Bombs Away: Gulf War 2 begins Feb. 11

[brogers]

Imalave....you make a good argument and I agree with alot of what you are saying. I stated in my post that we need to stand up and try to root them out. The continued failure as you call it with respect to the war on drugs is not a reason to now stop trying. Our county is good at making messes out of things, but I prefer to look at that glass half full and pose the question "what if we simply did nothing." Drugs would be a whole lot worse.

The war on terror is in its enfancy and can not yet be messured....except by the press and I will not dignify them with an explanation. We must try and continue to try.

No administration could begin to see all the answers to this huge global problem, but I personally can not sit on the sidelines and monday morning quarterback an adminstration that is faced with something this huge. That does not mean that I blindly follow. It simply means that I fear what happens if we don't try and I, like you and everyone else here, are simply not in possession of all the facts. Therefore, I must trust and rally behind my President.

 

[alex_ant]

Originally posted by brogers
My feeling is this. No matter if it is religion, politics, oil, money or whatever, terrorist hate us and they would just soon kill us and our families, take our way of life and cram it up our #@* than look at us. They are plotting now as I type to attack us or our interest around the world. They have no problem killing our women, children and fathers. They don't care and will never care. They see us as evil. The game is afoot and will not stop.

No question, I agree 100%. But I wonder: What does Iraq have to do with all of this. What effect would leveling it and removing its government have on terrorism? My answer: Not a gosh darn lot! "But they're brewing WMD," say the pro war dudes and dudettes. Of course they are. And as the drug war has taught us, you can try as hard as you like to stamp out supply, but demand will only create more. If you want to win the war on drugs, you've got to target the demand. I believe the war on terrorism is just the same - if you want to win it, you've got to eliminate the demand for WMD.

[Mr. President, You have my full support as a citizen to be sure this kind of stuff does not happen again.

The president has my support on this as well... but instead he chooses an ineffectual course of action that will do much more harm than good in both the short and long term.

 

[brogers]

Originally posted by alex_ant

No question, I agree 100%. But I wonder: What does Iraq have to do with all of this. What effect would leveling it and removing its government have on terrorism? My answer: Not a gosh darn lot! "But they're brewing WMD," say the pro war dudes and dudettes. Of course they are. And as the drug war has taught us, you can try as hard as you like to stamp out supply, but demand will only create more. If you want to win the war on drugs, you've got to target the demand. I believe the war on terrorism is just the same - if you want to win it, you've got to eliminate the demand for WMD.

The president has my support on this as well... but instead he chooses an ineffectual course of action that will do much more harm than good in both the short and long term. [/B]

With all due respect, how do you know that. For the life of me I can't imagine the President of the United States along with his top advisers sitting around the White House and asking: "What is our most ineffective cource of action that will cause the most harm to the global community over the short and long term? Whatever it is, let's do that."

I am one lowly citizen that is not in possession of all the facts and never will be. Therefore, I must trust, rally and support.

 

[alex_ant]

Originally posted by brogers
With all due respect, how do you know that. For the life of me I can't imagine the President of the United States along with his top advisers sitting around the White House and asking: "What is our most ineffective cource of action that will cause the most harm to the global community over the short and long term? Whatever it is, let's do that."

I didn't say it was the worst... I said it was ineffectual and would do more harm than good. There would be worse options, like, I don't know, nuking Iraq as a show of force to North Korea. So this option isn't the worst, it's just, IMO, not the best. (And I'm against anything less than the best course of action)

I am one lowly citizen that is not in possession of all the facts and never will be. Therefore, I must trust, rally and support.

Your government loves you

 

[resm]

and the one who play's with fire often gets burnt....

Originally posted by Backtothemac
Oh, and there will be at least one tactical nuke used in this war. Bank on it.

there are also predictions that have been around
since Saddam invaded Kuwait:

1. this invasion will be the trigger-off for world war lll

2. 1/3 of the human population will be killed by a world war lll

3. the world economy will collaps and slide into a depression worse then 1929 with jobless rates up to 40-50 % in certain areas.

4. this depression will be accompanied by inflation.

usually depression is accompanied by deflation but if the roads of supply are cut or destroyed then the little money that will still be around will be hunting for the few goods that are still available.

Based on this horrible picture, I think it is arrogant to assume that the US can just walk in and close down Irak without trigger-off events all over the world that in the end they can't controll anymore.

Will this be the end ?

No..but surely it will be the start of an end to our political systems where incompetent and corrupt leaders know nothing better then to screw up our lifes.

Because when the "critical" mass has reached its saturation point, meaning enough people are pissed off, then changes will happen.

So, to make this a betting game I feel is distastefull and to ask for a disaster will often bring one.

 

[lmalave]

Originally posted by brogers
No administration could begin to see all the answers to this huge global problem, but I personally can not sit on the sidelines and monday morning quarterback an adminstration that is faced with something this huge. That does not mean that I blindly follow. It simply means that I fear what happens if we don't try and I, like you and everyone else here, are simply not in possession of all the facts. Therefore, I must trust and rally behind my President.

Well, I guess that's the main difference in our approaches. I personally think that's it's more important than *ever* for people to state their disagreements with the government *because* the stakes are so high. I and a lot of people have in this country have plenty of ideas, and I think they need to be heard. I haven't heard anything from the administration about a Marshall Plan for Iraq, and what I've seen from Afghanistan does not give me any hope that Bush wants to move beyond the callous policies that have made people in the region distrustful of the U.S. to begin with. Realize that Afghanistan and Pakistan were already incredibly angry at the U.S. for helping flood the region with arms and heroin to help fight the Soviets, and then abruptly pulling out and not raising a finger to help those impoverished countries clean up the mess we helped create.

And hey, I feel perfectly justified in Monday-morning quarterbacking. Unlike some sports team that is only there to provide us entertainment, Bush is OUR president and chief executive of OUR government. I won't let Bush off the hook any more than if I was shareholder of a company and I disagreed with the business strategy the CEO was promoting. I'm not going to give the CEO a free pass, and I'm certainly not going to give a U.S. president a free pass.

<edit>
Oops, I guess this is the wrong website to talk about following CEOs blindly
</edit>

 

[Phil Of Mac]

Weapons of mass destruction are far more difficult to make than drugs. The analogy breaks down there.

 

[Thanatoast]

I was emailed this today. Thought I'd post it just for fun.

(Sung to the tune: "If You're Happy And You Know It, Clap
Your Hands")

If we cannot find Osama, bomb Iraq.
If the markets hurt your Mama, bomb Iraq.
If the terrorists are Saudi
And the bank takes back your Audi
And the TV shows are bawdy,
Bomb Iraq.

If the corporate scandals growin', bomb Iraq.
And your ties to them are showin', bomb Iraq.
If the smoking gun ain't smokin'
We don't care, and we're not jokin'.
That Saddam will soon be croakin',
Bomb Iraq.

Even if we have no allies, bomb Iraq.
From the sand dunes to the valleys, bomb Iraq.
So to hell with the inspections;
Let's look tough for the elections,
Close your mind and take directions,
Bomb Iraq.

While the globe is slowly warming, bomb Iraq.
Yay! the clouds of war are storming, bomb Iraq.
If the ozone hole is growing,
Some things we prefer not knowing.
(Though our ignorance is showing),
Bomb Iraq.

So here's one for dear old daddy, bomb Iraq,
From his favorite little laddy, bomb Iraq.
Saying no would look like treason.
It's the Hussein hunting season.
Even if we have no reason,
Bomb Iraq.

 

[Mr. Anderson]

I guess it hasn't happened yet.....

any revised numbers here?

D

 

[Ovi]

Who really knows?

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