Boot into Mojave with RX-560 and (unconnected) HD5770

Discussion in 'Mac Pro' started by PianoPro, Sep 5, 2018.

  1. PianoPro, Sep 5, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2018

    PianoPro macrumors regular

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    Sep 4, 2018
    #1
    Has anyone been able to boot into Mojave with an MSI RX-560 (or any other metal video card) and also an HD 5770 installed in a Mac Pro (mine's 2010)? I just get black screens. I would like to know if its possible.

    The 5770 isn't connected to any monitors. I just want it in the Mac Pro so I can hook it up to get the boot manager screen when needed later. I've tried switching the slot positions of the 560 and 5770 and that was no help.

    Mojave works fine if I remove the 5770 board. Is there any way to get the Mojave boot process to ignore the 5770 when installed?
     
  2. bookemdano macrumors 65816

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    #2
    Have you tried connecting a monitor to the 5770 during boot? You should do that.
     
  3. PianoPro thread starter macrumors regular

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    #3
    Yes. That doesn't help. I normally use 2 (or 3 monitors) so that was the first thing I tried. I get the boot screen (which works if I boot into something other than Mojave), or the booting progress screen with the 5770 connected but then it hangs prior to the Mojave login screen.
     
  4. bookemdano macrumors 65816

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    #4
    Try booting in verbose mode and see if you can see where in the process it's failing.
     
  5. usna92 macrumors member

    usna92

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    #5
    I have just updated attempting that configuration tonight. I will say that I needed to pull my HD5770 to get Mojave to install and boot. It didn't look like it sent the boot signal to my monitor, so I cycled the power and turn the monitor back on. Got the standard screen. I am considering going RX-580 for some future proofing.
     
  6. PianoPro thread starter macrumors regular

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    #6
    Right that's normal. Can't install with 5770 present.

    So after installing you can now power up from cold start and boot into Mojave with 5770 and RX-560 in Mac Pro? Do you also have HS on another drive?

    I've done that and it goes completely through the black screen/white text verbose mode and then goes to white screen with progress bar and immediately hangs there.
     
  7. usna92 macrumors member

    usna92

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    #7
    I would not recommend putting the 5770 back in. See if you can get to work with one monitor on the RX480 and then see if you can get it through the boot cycle.
     
  8. PianoPro thread starter macrumors regular

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    #8
    Everything works fine using only the RX-560 (with 1, 2 or 3 monitors connected). But I'm trying to keep the 5770 in the Mac Pro (unconnected to a monitor) to later use to get a boot switcher screen when needed. In that configuration, both cards installed, I can not boot into Mojave. Can you do that?
     
  9. usna92 macrumors member

    usna92

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    #9
    Nope. Bad result. I suspect there is some form of metal capability checking. The 5770 does not support metal.
     
  10. PianoPro thread starter macrumors regular

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    Sep 4, 2018
    #10
    Right. I know the 5770 does not support metal. I was hoping if it wasn't connected to a monitor that Mojave would ignore it and still run with it just sitting there unconnected. Or there might be some way (hack?) to get Mojave to ignore it.

    I had read that some people have made that work with the older ST-120 non-metal Mac Pro card (again unconnected). But I can't find any of those postings now, nor anyone that said they got that to work with the 5770.
     
  11. usna92 macrumors member

    usna92

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    #11
    I think Mojave is checking the PCI bus now. I saw other users ignoring the Metal check on install, by using some terminal commands to bypass the Firmware update and metal check. I also only saw that working with Nvidia cards as well. It might have something to do with the fact that the 5770 has a valid EFI that is getting checked on boot? I am guessing at this point, but I suspect that unless someone creates a workaround in the boot order, it isn't going to work. Are you booting into windows? I was able to install Mojave without a boot screen, including the firmware update. I suspect the video card efi requirements are going away for firmware updates, at least based on my Mojave update.
     
  12. PianoPro thread starter macrumors regular

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    Sep 4, 2018
    #12
    Apple fixed the firmware update without efi issue.

    Now I hope, but don't expect, they will somehow give us back boot progress screens/boot manager screen for selected cards (at least the 2 they recommend - the MSI 560 and the Sapphire Pulse 580) which is why I bought the MSI 560.

    But since I doubt the latter will happen I would like to keep one of my 5770 in the Mac Pro (unconnected when using Mojave). It appears Apple is checking to be sure there are no non-metal cards in the Mac Pro else they won't let Mojave boot. But as I said, there were reports of this working with the older 120 non-metal card. I was hoping to verify that and find out if anyone had got a 5770 to do this, with or without some hack.
     
  13. MIKX macrumors 65816

    MIKX

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    #13
    PianoPro

    What GPU power cables are you using with BOTH GPU's installed ?
    Personally I would not install the 5770 at all.
     
  14. PianoPro thread starter macrumors regular

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    #14
    Is it not clear that I want the 5770 to get the boot switcher screen? You can't get it with the RX560 or an RX580.

    The 5770 uses one 6-pin cable. The MSI RX-560 uses no cable at all. There is still another unused 6-pin GPU cable because I was running 2 5770's.
     
  15. h9826790 macrumors G5

    h9826790

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    #15
    Did you try only boot 10.14 with the 5770 in there (NO RX560)?

    I know you have no intention to use the computer in this way, but it may able to tell us more about "If 5770 can boot to desktop in 10.14".
     
  16. PianoPro thread starter macrumors regular

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    #16
    Yes. Doesn't work.
     
  17. bookemdano macrumors 65816

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    #17
    So then the problem has nothing to do with the combination of the 5770 and 560, right? If it won't boot with just the 5770 (and you've already demonstrated that the 5770 works properly in HS) then I think you're SOL.
     
  18. MIKX macrumors 65816

    MIKX

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    #18
    In the Macrumors/Mac Pro thread when we see posts about multiple GPS we all think about GPU power cabling.

    if you want to boot to a particular drive. . in your current setup . . .boot into Mojave .. select System preferences/ "Startup Drive" .. assuming that you want to boot into Sierra, El Capitan, mavericks etc. .. . select your choice and restart.

    These new AMD cards WILL NOT give you an EFI boot screen at present.

    I also suggest that you create a "My System SIGNATURE" in your Macrumors account preferences. . that saves us having to guess what setup you're running.

    In any case, the 5770 is so old and definitely NON-Metal. You can get and easily flash a HD 7950 3gb /HD 7970 3 gb or R9 280 X . . these are all EFI flashable, Got to the Netkas site and read up .. .as we all did.
     
  19. PianoPro thread starter macrumors regular

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    Sep 4, 2018
    #19
    I agree the combination of the 560 and 5770 is not what keeps it from booting. It's the mere presence of the 5770 that causes Mojave to not boot.

    That said, what I asked in my original post was simply has anyone here made it work? i.e. has anyone found a workaround or hack to do it? And I explained I'm not trying to get the 5770 to actually operate from within Mojave - so that would not be misunderstood, because I know that will not work.

    I agree I'm probably SOL trying to have the 5770 also (unconnected) inside the Mac. But I read (somewhere in the last few months that I can no longer find) reports of using the older GT-120 non-metal card in the same way - just sitting in the Mac waiting to be used later to get the boot switcher scheme. That's what prompted me to try it with the 5770 in the first place. I'm now thinking I either misread those reports, or that they were only talking about putting the 120 back into the Mac when needed and didn't make that clear.
     
  20. h9826790 macrumors G5

    h9826790

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    #20
    That's the problem. It works with the GT120, but few betas ago. May be Apple just changed the rule in later beta, and macOS won't boot if not all GPUs are METAL supported.

    There is not much discussion in this area, because the boot screen is quite useless in daily use, and not many users care if they can keep the card inside the cMP. In fact, most of us prefer to remove the emergency card, because we want to keep the card safe, and don't want to burn its life span unnecessarily.

    Without proper driver support in 10.14, the card will be drove my the EFI only. Which means no proper power management available. Most likely it will run hot even idle. that is not good for the card itself, and any other electronics inside the PCIe compartment.

    May be you are just bad luck, may be your card is partly faulty and causing some issue, may be Apple really changed something. It's hard to know until more reports from other users.
     
  21. PianoPro thread starter macrumors regular

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    Sep 4, 2018
    #21
    I get that. But that is not my issue.

    I get that too. I'm an electronic design engineer that has been using multiple Macs since 1984, so I'm familiar with the standard methods of using them. In my case I'm also want to boot back from Windows into several Mac OS's. That creates problems because of Bootcamp/MacPro/Win10 incompatibilities. There are workarounds to that but they are not convenient like the Boot Screen Manager is.

    I understand that. That's why I was trying to put the 5770 in the Mac.

    That's a good suggestion. I just posted here looking for help for the first time so I wasn't yet familiar with that.

    I know there are other cards I could flash, but I have 2 now unused 5770's, so I hoped I could use what I have to do what I wanted before going to the trouble of getting and flashing other cards. But I appreciate your suggestion.
    --- Post Merged, Sep 6, 2018 ---
    Thanks for the reply.

    I appreciate confirmation that it worked with the GT120. That is what I remember reading. So maybe it would have once worked with the 5770 too, but now neither work in the latest betas. I just loaded Mojave for the first time with the latest beta so I wouldn't have seen it "possibly" work before.

    I understand it is not a usual request, but booting back from Win10 causes some other inconveniences without the boot manager screen.

    Interesting point about the 5770 idle power if no proper drivers available in 10.14. I thought it normally ran at around 35 watts disconnected in idle (my memory could be wrong), and my RX-560 only uses 60 watts (hence no aux power connector on it) but funny things could happen on the 5770 without proper drivers.

    I tried 2 5770 cards so I don't think a defect is the problem. I suspect that Apple has now changed the beta to prevent this, that makes sense so people won't get into trouble trying to use the 5770 (or 120) in Mojave. Again, I was just hoping someone knew of a method or hack so that Mojave would ignore the unused 5770.

    Thanks again for your reply.
     
  22. h9826790 macrumors G5

    h9826790

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    #22
    I bet the power draw will be way higher than 35W even nothing is connected. That 35W heavily rely on the driver, which will let the GPU goes into low power state (low clock speed for both GPU and VRAM). Without driver, the GPU and VRAM will stay at the max clock speed all the time. Even no loading, the power draw can easily be 2x higher than normal idle.

    If you have Windows, you can do a simple test.

    1) Boot into Windows
    2) go to device manager
    3) uninstall the 5770's driver

    You may be surprised that the card can still display (because the EFI will take over again once driver is unloaded), and you can still monitor the card's power draw / temperature etc.

    It will be quite hard to determine the card's power draw in Windows. But you may monitor the temperature. That will be a very good indication that if the card really idle as per your expectation.

    I did this test on my GT120, and the card idle at 70C. Obviously not the normal idle at all.

    Anyway, you are not the only one dual boot Windows / MacOS. I am also running High Sierra + Windows 10 (EFI mode). All I need is just a simple terminal command to allow me boot the Windows. Don't need any boot screen for that.

    Many users also use Bootchamp, Bootrunner, etc to dual boot Windows. All these methods are way faster than using that boot manager. I used that boot manager before. All I remember is that need lots of time to scan through all partitions, and then present me the boot options.

    If you use HFS+ for macOS, and legacy mode for Windows 10. Then all you need is just select your next startup disk in system preference. Definitely don't need the boot screen.
     
  23. PianoPro thread starter macrumors regular

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    Sep 4, 2018
    #23
    I'm really glad you brought this to my attention. I hadn't thought about what could happen to the 5770 power draw without a proper 10.14 driver. For that reason alone, I'll probably give up on this idea.

    There were also other reasons I wanted to keep the 5770 in the Mac Pro, I just didn't want to complicate my question to explain them. The High Sierra RX-560 drivers are apparently not too good. It has some strange video glitches and frame buffer (apparently) problems when run in full screen 1080p mode in some games, even with no movement at all on screen. Weird problems. For instance, I can simply bring up the Mac Force Quit window on a 2nd monitor and then place it near the edge of the 1st monitor (but still on the 2nd monitor) and everything works fine on monitor 1. Talk about a weird workaround. But move that window a few pixels farther over on the 2nd monitor and the image on the 1st monitor breaks up badly. And I really haven't explored using the RX-560 with some older Mac OS's that I keep around for a couple of rarely used HS/Mojave incompatible applications. So as I said, I didn't want to go into all that, but there were other reasons to keep an HD5770 in my Mac Pro.

    BTW, my RX-560 seems to work flawlessly in Mojave with the same examples that don't work well in HS. So Apple seems to have much better drivers for the RX-560 in 10.14.

    Again thanks for your insights. That was the kind of info I was hoping to get.
     
  24. crystalidea macrumors member

    crystalidea

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    Apr 3, 2014
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    #24
    I wish I found this thread before... This must be highlighted in big bold letters somewhere...
    macOS 10.14 won't boot unless all installed GPUs support METAL
    I wish I could make a small usb powered screen for boot screens with GT120... have to forget that.
     
  25. JoSch macrumors 6502

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    Feb 22, 2013
    #25
    I could boot Mojave with a HD5770 installed with the legacy patch applied.
     

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29 September 5, 2018