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Buttonless iPhone X - solution to a problem that didn't exist?

A lot of advancements in tech are solutions 'to problems that didn't need to exist'. Was a physical keyboard such a problem that touch screen one HAD to replace? No, but it did. I can't be bothered to think of other examples, but as time moves on - people get more used to these changes. Whilst I think now, the removal of the home button is horrible and I wouldn't buy the X because of that (and other reasons) - I think in a year or two it'll become more normal and most people will get on board with it. It's the same with the PLUS phones, I thought 'woah those are WAY TOO BIG' but now I have one and it's perfect, and I've gotten used to it in the 4/5 days that I've had it.

Some people don't like change, and that's okay. I agree the home button wasn't a problem, but then again, neither was typing in a passcode to get into your phone. Touch ID made it easier, and in time we'll find that a full screen with no buttons at all will be easier (I HOPE)
 
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JazzyGB1 said:
No I had no idea, but that would support my argument that facial recognition and the new gestures are 'work arounds' rather than improvements. :)
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Ah! It was floating in the rumors that they had extreme difficulties with it. Face ID is the future but I think they knew many would hesitate to leave a less secure but more familiar technology.
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Knowimagination said:
According to you that's why they were implemented. To me it looks like a nice improvement to the UI, but it isn't one that would make sense on the 8 and 8 Plus because of the home button.

After using a software home button on the S8 Plus I am greatly looking forward to a swipe gesture when I get my X.

Also as far as the premise of the thread it doesn't make any sense. The iPhone X isn't a solution to anything, it is an improvement on the previous hardware and it has implemented changes. There is no way for us to say at this point if it is better or worse, but to me it looks like it is going to be a great improvement over my previous iPhones.
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This is just not true at all, they have already said they have been working on Face ID for over a year.
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It’s true. You think they only wanted one or the other? Likely they wanted both, knowing people would be hesitant to leave a less secure but familiar Touch ID.

Where were you between July and September? Almost every rumor discussed the quality of face id and the difficulty with in screen Touch ID.
 
macTW said:
Ah! It was floating in the rumors that they had extreme difficulties with it. Face ID is the future but I think they knew many would hesitate to leave a less secure but more familiar technology.
[doublepost=1506533893][/doublepost]
It’s true. You think they only wanted one or the other? Likely they wanted both, knowing people would be hesitant to leave a less secure but familiar Touch ID.

Where were you between July and September? Almost every rumor discussed the quality of face id and the difficulty with in screen Touch ID.
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Your post made it sound like Face ID was a last minute thing thrown together after in screen touch ID failed. If that's not what you meant that's fine, but it seems like touch ID was cut from the X long before "a month before announcement".
 
DaveOP said:
They very specifically introduced the iPhone X as a look into the future. If they had the technology to make the entire screen a fingerprint sensor, I bet they would have. Many have tried, the tech just isn't there yet. They kept the iPhone 8/8+ around for people who feel the way you do. It has the same processor, and many of the same features. If you don't like the X this year, don't buy it. This is pretty simple.
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Yep... I passed on the X. No regrets. Been using a Plus for 3 years... and prepared to go with the 8 Plus for 2 more.

The big turnoff for me was the Apple Koolaid they were trying to sell at the keynote...

"You had a 1 in 50k chance of getting your phone unlocked by a random fingerprint with Touch ID... it's now 1 in 1M with Face ID."

Really? You think I give a rats about that?

If someone wants your phone bad enough they'll get it. I'll go with the proven phone design and Touch ID for another year or two and let someone else beta test Face ID on a buttonless phone.

Hey Apple... if you want me interested in the X... come out with an X Plus next year and put Touch ID on it.
 
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JazzyGB1 said:
Apple's decision to remove the touch ID/Home button on the iPhone X is a very poor one IMO.

I get that they were going for the whole phone is a screen effect...but they didn't achieve it anyway.

The middle top of the screen is lost to camera's, speakers etc, so it's removal was pointless

I could understand it if they'd made the whole screen a finger print sensor for example, so that touching the screen anywhere with your finger or thumb would then open it up - that would have offered an improvement by making it easier to unlock.

However the removal of the button completely alters the whole functionality of the phone, with users having to learn 'workarounds' to compensate for the functionality that has been lost by removal of the button.

The home button enabled shortcuts for app selection, screen shots and resetting that were long established to those familiar with using an iPhone - it was also an easy and convenient way to return to the home screen.

The removal of useful functionality isn't 'progress' and seems again (like with the headphone socket) to be change for the sake of it.

Plenty of Android phones manage to be waterproof with a headphone socket!

Every phone is operated by a hand anyway, so using a digit of your hand to unlock the phone is natural and expected.

Facial recognition is all well and good, but if it was really an improvement they could have added this 'feature' to the iPhone 8.

All face recognition really does is give Apple an alternative way to open the iPhone and make a little more screen available.

To the end user it offers no benefits in functionality - none.

There's already plenty of android based phones out there with no physical home button.

If Apple were that convinced that the extra screen space offered was so important they too could have chosen this path long ago.

It's a totally bizarre decision that conflicts with their past stance completely.
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The same was once said about physical keyboards.
 
Knowimagination said:
Your post made it sound like Face ID was a last minute thing thrown together after in screen touch ID failed. If that's not what you meant that's fine, but it seems like touch ID was cut from the X long before "a month before announcement".
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I never mentioned the profession of face Id. I assumed you knew they had been working on it for a while. They also were working on beneath the screen Touch ID... until a month prior.
 
Whilst I don't agree with them those who want the home button to stay probably have the view if it's not broken don't try to fix it. I do think the pros outweigh the cons.

Personally I'm fine with removing the home button and using Face ID and gestures instead. I'm sure it's something I will get use to. Touch ID doesn't always work for me anyway as my fingers tend to perspire a lot. I'm sure Face ID will work much better for me.
 
TravisPNW said:
Hey Apple... if you want me interested in the X... come out with an X Plus next year and our Touch ID on it.
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Not sure where the confusion is or what some don't understand, Apple is not bringing touch ID back to the iPhone anymore. They stated that clearly that face ID is their future. Touch ID is in existence now with the current iPhones, but after the iPhone X for future iPhones, touch ID will no longer be in existence. So making hopeful requests isn't something that Apple is going to entertain.

Federighi acknowledged this in an interview.

https://daringfireball.net/2017/09/iphone_x_event_thoughts_and_observations
 
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Not sure if this is helpful or not, but I just watched a video showing 11.1 beta features, where the Accessibility icon can be used in conjunction with 3D Touch to go to your home screen.


I never really thought how this could be of benefit, but with the Home Button-free X, it may help a few people out?
 
macTW said:
I never mentioned the profession of face Id. I assumed you knew they had been working on it for a while. They also were working on beneath the screen Touch ID... until a month prior.
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that's just not true.

FACE ID AS THE REPLACEMENT FOR TOUCH ID
Apple made this decision well over a year ago. Perhaps the fundamental goal of iPhone X was to get as close as they could to an edge-to-edge display. No chin whatsoever. There were, of course, early attempts to embed a Touch ID sensor under the display as a Plan B. But Apple became convinced that Face ID was the way to go over a year ago. I heard this yesterday from multiple people at Apple, including engineers who’ve been working on the iPhone X project for a very long time. They stopped pursuing Touch ID under the display not because they couldn’t do it, but because they decided they didn’t need it. I do believe it’s true that they never got Touch ID working, but that’s because they abandoned it in favor of Face ID early.

I don’t know why recent supply chain rumors suggest Apple was scrambling to get Touch ID working on iPhone X as late as this summer, and no one at Apple seems to know either. Disinformation campaign from competitors?
Click to expand...

https://daringfireball.net/2017/09/iphone_x_event_thoughts_and_observations
 
Eh, was using gestures with my BlackBerry PlayBook back in 2013 or so. Worked really well. This will probably work well too.

Still not buying an X though, £1299? On yer bike.
 
Like always, when Apple releases a new feature, people will bash it. When the product is used by the masses, the features will get familiar and praised by the same users that would have bashed them months/weeks before.

Apple design is trusted and work as intended, that was always the case.
 
JazzyGB1 said:
Apple's decision to remove the touch ID/Home button on the iPhone X is a very poor one IMO.

I get that they were going for the whole phone is a screen effect...but they didn't achieve it anyway.

The middle top of the screen is lost to camera's, speakers etc, so it's removal was pointless

I could understand it if they'd made the whole screen a finger print sensor for example, so that touching the screen anywhere with your finger or thumb would then open it up - that would have offered an improvement by making it easier to unlock.

However the removal of the button completely alters the whole functionality of the phone, with users having to learn 'workarounds' to compensate for the functionality that has been lost by removal of the button.

The home button enabled shortcuts for app selection, screen shots and resetting that were long established to those familiar with using an iPhone - it was also an easy and convenient way to return to the home screen.

The removal of useful functionality isn't 'progress' and seems again (like with the headphone socket) to be change for the sake of it.

Plenty of Android phones manage to be waterproof with a headphone socket!

Every phone is operated by a hand anyway, so using a digit of your hand to unlock the phone is natural and expected.

Facial recognition is all well and good, but if it was really an improvement they could have added this 'feature' to the iPhone 8.

All face recognition really does is give Apple an alternative way to open the iPhone and make a little more screen available.

To the end user it offers no benefits in functionality - none.

There's already plenty of android based phones out there with no physical home button.

If Apple were that convinced that the extra screen space offered was so important they too could have chosen this path long ago.

It's a totally bizarre decision that conflicts with their past stance completely.
Click to expand...
what do you think phones will look like in 10 years? There will be no buttons at all anymore. Things will evolve and keeping around old tech will not happen with any manufacturer. Things are just started to change into more full screen devices and will continue to get thinner and be more futuristic in a sense.
 
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Thank goodness for all the iPhone X naysayers...gives me hope that I can snag a Nov 03rd pre-order on Oct 27th, haha!! :D
 
Relentless Power said:
Not sure where the confusion is or what some don't understand, Apple is not bringing touch ID back to the iPhone anymore. They stated that clearly that face ID is their future. Touch ID is in existence now with the current iPhones, but after the iPhone X for future iPhones, touch ID will no longer be in existence. So making hopeful requests isn't something that Apple is going to entertain.

Federighi acknowledged this in an interview.

https://daringfireball.net/2017/09/iphone_x_event_thoughts_and_observations
Click to expand...

That's cool and all... but I guess you didn't detect my sarcasm.

Any any rate, I would like to go back and watch the keynote from 3 years ago and find out if Touch ID was the future then too. I don't remember how they pitched it...

For me... passing on the X was an easy choice. No matter how you slice it it's a 1st gen device with unproven Face ID. I used the 6 Plus and 6s Plus for the last 3 years... comfortable with both the screen size and Touch ID. I'd have kept the 6s Plus if it didn't have a fading ear speaker and a horrid battery life that needed charging after 4-5 hours of streaming at work.

So... do I go with

a) The 8 Plus - basically a hardware upgrade over what I've used for 3 years available now

or

b) an X with a smaller/narrow screen... a ugly af notch... and a beta Face ID with availability that could very well not be until early 2018?

Option a was the easy choice.

I have no problems embracing change. I just have this gut feeling that iPhone X/Face ID v2/v3 will be better than v1... and I've got no problems waiting it out with the iPhone 8 Plus until then.

Did the same thing with the Watch... just got my first one... Series 3.

Anyway, enjoy your beta X phones :)
 
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TravisPNW said:
That's cool and all... but I guess you didn't detect my sarcasm.

Any any rate, I would like to go back and watch the keynote from 3 years ago and find out if Touch ID was the future then too. I don't remember how they pitched it...

For me... passing on the X was an easy choice. No matter how you slice it it's a 1st gen device with unproven Face ID. I used the 6 Plus and 6s Plus for the last 3 years... comfortable with both the screen size and Touch ID. I'd have kept the 6s Plus if it didn't have a fading ear speaker and a horrid battery life that needed charging after 4-5 hours of streaming at work.

So... do I go with

a) The 8 Plus - basically a hardware upgrade over what I've used for 3 years available now

or

b) an X with a smaller/narrow screen... a ugly af notch... and a beta Face ID with availability that could very well not be until early 2018?

Option a was the easy choice.

I have no problems embracing change. I just have this gut feeling that iPhone X/Face ID v2/v3 will be better than v1... and I've got no problems waiting it out with the iPhone 8 Plus until then.

Did the same thing with the Watch... just got my first one... Series 3.

Anyway, enjoy your beta X phones :)
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Great, thanks for letting us all know. Your passive-aggressiveness is on point. It's a phone, not a major life decision. You will be happy with your 8, we will be happy with our X.
 
DaveOP said:
Great, thanks for letting us all know. Your passive-aggressiveness is on point. It's a phone, not a major life decision. You will be happy with your 8, we will be happy with our X.
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That's the difference between you and me...

I like to have a product in hand and use it before I declare whether or not I'm happy with the product.

I refuse to say I'm happy with a product that isn't even open for pre-orders for another month just because it's made by Apple.

Passive aggressive? LOL

Get over yourself. Nobody cares what phone you buy, least of all me. I just stated the reasons for why I bought mine... not because I need your approval.
 
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macTW said:
I trust proven rumor sources than “I have a buddy there” on a random forum any day of the week. Sorry bud.

Just because they committed to face Id doesn’t mean they chose to exclude Touch ID. It’s not exclusive, clearly they tried for both knowing some users wouldn’t be comfortable leaving Touch ID.
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Not sure where you get the "i have a buddy there" from.

John Gruber, who was actually at the Keynote, talking to Apple employes in the Hands-on area and also had an interview with Craig Federighi about FaceID seems like a better source to me than some sketchy rumors, that are nothing more than rumors.
 
DaveOP said:
Great, thanks for letting us all know. Your passive-aggressiveness is on point. It's a phone, not a major life decision. You will be happy with your 8, we will be happy with our X.
Click to expand...

Completely agree here. People can't seem to accept that we could be happy with the X, including Face ID. I think it's going to be great and I've been looking forward to a gesture based iPhone for some time now.
 
TravisPNW said:
That's the difference between you and me...

I like to have a product in hand and use it before I declare whether or not I'm happy with the product.

I refuse to say I'm happy with a product that isn't even open for pre-orders for another month just because it's made by Apple.

Passive aggressive? LOL

Get over yourself. Nobody cares what phone you buy, least of all me. I just stated the reasons for why I bought mine... not because I need your approval.
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It's a phone. A PHONE. I am sure it will be fine. I have never purchased an iPhone I didn't enjoy. I am not worried about the X, and I am really glad you like your 8.

The post I quoted was full of slams on the X and people who buy them. If you can't see the passive aggressive nature, I am sorry for you.
 
DNichter said:
Completely agree here. People can't seem to accept that we could be happy with the X, including Face ID. I think it's going to be great and I've been looking forward to a gesture based iPhone for some time now.
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Excellent. I hope you enjoy it as much as I'm enjoying my 8 Plus.

I've stated my reasons for why I passed on the X... being IMHO the prototype that it is. In the end nobody cares what phone I buy, you buy, or anyone else buys. It's all about what phone they buy.

BTW, I'm not being passive aggressive.. I'm being brutally honest. LOL

:)
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DaveOP said:
It's a phone. A PHONE. I am sure it will be fine. I have never purchased an iPhone I didn't enjoy. I am not worried about the X, and I am really glad you like your 8.

The post I quoted was full of slams on the X and people who buy them. If you can't see the passive aggressive nature, I am sorry for you.
Click to expand...

Well I'm sorry you took it that way... that wasn't my intent.

It's the beauty of posting on the internet. Take care! :)
 
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