Can I suggest an additional section to 'special interests'

[Snow4maen]

Hi

The special interest subsection of the forums has further subsections for such things as 'audio' 'photography', is there a reason there is no subsection for 'writing'? It would be nice to have a place for those who write to share apps they use, workflow. Examples of writing?

Just an idea.

 

[Madonepro]

I second that.

 

[Madonepro]

Hi

The special interest subsection of the forums has further subsections for such things as 'audio' 'photography', is there a reason there is no subsection for 'writing'? It would be nice to have a place for those who write to share apps they use, workflow. Examples of writing?

Just an idea.

I 'reported' your post, and made a recommendation that they seriously review your request, as I believe it has merit, and as one of the pillars of the creative tree, should be there with the others. Disappointedly, I have not heard back, and this thread hasn't been responded to. @arn @Weaselboy

 

[Snow4maen]

I 'reported' your post, and made a recommendation that they seriously review your request, as I believe it has merit, and as one of the pillars of the creative tree, should be there with the others. Disappointedly, I have not heard back, and this thread hasn't been responded to. @arn @Weaselboy

I’m wondering if it may be problematic owing to the potential for some writing to be political in nature and that that then causes a moderation headache? But I suppose it could be done with the caveat that political ideas must be excluded?

 

[Scepticalscribe]

I 'reported' your post, and made a recommendation that they seriously review your request, as I believe it has merit, and as one of the pillars of the creative tree, should be there with the others. Disappointedly, I have not heard back, and this thread hasn't been responded to. @arn @Weaselboy

I’m wondering if it may be problematic owing to the potential for some writing to be political in nature and that that then causes a moderation headache? But I suppose it could be done with the caveat that political ideas must be excluded?

Bear in mind that the vast majority of the staff are volunteers (in other words, they do not receive a salary), and must juggle their MR work with other commitments, personal and professional.

My sense is that they may well be discussing this among themselves, prior to arriving at a decision, and, if they are, it is better for them to take the time to do this properly before implementing something new, rather than having to hastily (and retroactively) amend a rushed, and insufficiently thought through, change.

 

[maflynn]

I have not heard back, and this thread hasn't been responded to. @arn @Weaselboy

They usually wait and see how these discussions turn out here in the SFF forum before responding. As it stands, this request has not been met with unrivaled enthusiasm. @arn and the admins have been keen on avoiding forum bloat, i.e., creating too many sub forums that will generally be inactive.

The Special Interests forum, is organized with functions that tie directly into using a Mac. Graphic Design, Digital Videos, Digital Audio and to a lessor extent photography are activities closely tied with Macs. The software and specialized skills are such that having distinct forums for those areas makes sense.

Writing doesn't have that level of immersion in Mac ecosystem. I'm not diminishing the skills needed to write but its not a technology driven specialty that has close ties with Apple products and services.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

They usually wait and see how these discussions turn out here in the SFF forum before responding. As it stands, this request has not been met with unrivaled enthusiasm. @arn and the admins have been keen on avoiding forum bloat, i.e., creating too many sub forums that will generally be inactive.

The Special Interests forum, is organized with functions that tie directly into using a Mac. Graphic Design, Digital Videos, Digital Audio and to a lessor extent photography are activities closely tied with Macs. The software and specialized skills are such that having distinct forums for those areas makes sense.

Writing doesn't have that level of immersion in Mac ecosystem. I'm not diminishing the skills needed to write but its not a technology driven specialty that has close ties with Apple products and services.

You make some very good points, and, until relatively recently, I would have been broadly in agreement with you, to a certain extent, about the relative importance of writing in the tech world.

However, with the development of AI - a transformation that seems to be hurtling towards us at warp speed - I'd argue that emphasising the importance of writing in tech, (and in Apple) - on a tech platform - is of considerably greater importance now, than may have been the case, earlier.

 

[Snow4maen]

They usually wait and see how these discussions turn out here in the SFF forum before responding. As it stands, this request has not been met with unrivaled enthusiasm. @arn and the admins have been keen on avoiding forum bloat, i.e., creating too many sub forums that will generally be inactive.

The Special Interests forum, is organized with functions that tie directly into using a Mac. Graphic Design, Digital Videos, Digital Audio and to a lessor extent photography are activities closely tied with Macs. The software and specialized skills are such that having distinct forums for those areas makes sense.

Writing doesn't have that level of immersion in Mac ecosystem. I'm not diminishing the skills needed to write but its not a technology driven specialty that has close ties with Apple products and services.

Not to pick at your comment but to my mind graphic design and photography can just as easily be done on a PC, the Adobe suite runs on PC too. I have known a professional photographer who worked exclusively on PC. There are refinements to the Mac, that arguably make it a better writing platform. Integration with iCloud is, in my opinion, nicer and better to use than OneDrive. There are several writing apps that are Mac only. A fair few use Ulysses. And in regard to Scrivener, the Mac version is better and gets the latest updates, while the PC version lags behind. There are also environment apps for the Mac for focus while you are working. However, even if writing is not technically Mac specific, a lot of writers do choose Mac. As it is a more creative platform. A place to share workflow, apps, and writing I think would be nice. But of course that is just my preference. It may not be as popular as I would like to think.

 

[maflynn]

However, with the development of AI - a transformation that seems to be hurtling towards us at warp speed - I'd argue that emphasising the importance of writing in tech, (and in Apple) - on a tech platform - is of considerably greater importance now, than may have been the case, earlier.

AI is not going to increase the importance of tech writing but rather the opposite. The technical writing field will largely be replaced by AI, much the way its displacing programmers.

Not to pick at your comment but to my mind graphic design and photography can just as easily be done on a PC, the Adobe suite runs on PC too

yes it can, but it has historically been the domain of Macs, regardless the software being used in those areas are fairly complex and require specific training, and time learning. What does writing need? A thesaurus, dictionary and a word processor (or typewriter)

Edit: I mean no disrespect by the comment of what a writer needs, Steven King reportedly still uses a typewriter, I have a friend who wrote a large paper using a typewriter and putting words to paper, so to speak needs a level of talent, gifts and knowledge of the English language that I'm in awe in how some people can easily put words together.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

AI is not going to increase the importance of tech writing but rather the opposite. The technical writing field will largely be replaced by AI, much the way its displacing programmers.

This could possibly very much be the case, though I cannot say with any confidence as it is not my area of expertise; for now, I will defer to your judgment on the matter.

yes it can, but it has historically been the domain of Macs, regardless the software being used in those areas are fairly complex and require specific training, and time learning.

Fair enough.

What does writing need? A thesaurus, dictionary and a word processor (or typewriter)

Ah, here, I will beg to differ.

This is because writing needs much more than simply "a thesaurus, dictionary and word processor (or typewriter)".

Writing needs reading - lots and lots of reading - which is what enables someone to develop an ease, a facility, a familiarity, with the written word, perhaps even an aptitude for the written word.

And the problem with AI - and we are already seeing the lamentable consequences of this in education - is that the perfectly natural human reflex, or default, preference for doing things the easy way, means that many people will be getting out of the habit of any sort of writing, (because essay writing, or term paper writing, requires more than comprehension and regurgitation - it requires you to think about what you wish to say, and how you may wish to say - write - it, how you set about the business of putting your thoughts on paper in a manner that makes sense and is easily understood by the reader) and relying, instead, on AI.

An academic arms race of the most dismal and depressing kind.

Therefore, to my mind, this is an even stronger argument for a section on writing - a skill I would prefer not to see lost, devalued, or deemed unnecessary, in a world where AI will offer some sort of text at the drop of a proverbial hat.

 

[Snow4maen]

AI is not going to increase the importance of tech writing but rather the opposite. The technical writing field will largely be replaced by AI, much the way its displacing programmers.


yes it can, but it has historically been the domain of Macs, regardless the software being used in those areas are fairly complex and require specific training, and time learning. What does writing need? A thesaurus, dictionary and a word processor (or typewriter)

Edit: I mean no disrespect by the comment of what a writer needs, Steven King reportedly still uses a typewriter, I have a friend who wrote a large paper using a typewriter and putting words to paper, so to speak needs a level of talent, gifts and knowledge of the English language that I'm in awe in how some people can easily put words together.

While you can of course use a typewriter, or perhaps Word on a PC. I personally think the Mac OS environment is a great aid to writing on computer. There are refinements that I think make the workflow simply easier and better than on Windows. If you have lots of things open on a PC it can be a headache. On a Mac, the work environment allows Mac specific things, like hiding apps to tidy up and viewing many apps at once with ease. I am reminded of the old days when the Macintosh first came out. For many it's GUI meant a much more enhanced work environment for writing, imagine writing a novel in DOS? IIRC Douglas Adams wrote A Hitchhikers Guide To The Galaxy on a Mac, he didn't have to but I'm sure he enjoyed it much more than on a PC. Of course Word is the de facto writing standard, and it's arguably better on a PC. However, it largely depends on the content you are creating. If you are writing a letter, or essay, or report. Yes Word would be great, but to my mind writing a novel in Word would be unnecessarily difficult. And speaking of dictionaries, Mac has one built in. I don't believe a PC does. For me personally I am very dyslexic, so using a typewriter is not possible, it needs to be a computer.

 

[Snow4maen]

I might say. While I may make my argument for a Mac being my personal preferred system and environment to use for writing, it is of course very true you can almost as well use a PC. In the end it depends really on how popular such a sub forum would be? If those who make the decisions deem is lacking in popularity, then arguably it may not be worth administering. In which case perhaps it's not the best idea? However, I personally thought it WOULD be popular.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

While you can of course use a typewriter, or perhaps Word on a PC. I personally think the Mac OS environment is a great aid to writing on computer. There are refinements that I think make the workflow simply easier and better than on Windows. If you have lots of things open on a PC it can be a headache. On a Mac, the work environment allows Mac specific things, like hiding apps to tidy up and viewing many apps at once with ease. I am reminded of the old days when the Macintosh first came out. For many it's GUI meant a much more enhanced work environment for writing, imagine writing a novel in DOS? IIRC Douglas Adams wrote A Hitchhikers Guide To The Galaxy on a Mac, he didn't have to but I'm sure he enjoyed it much more than on a PC. Of course Word is the de facto writing standard, and it's arguably better on a PC. However, it largely depends on the content you are creating. If you are writing a letter, or essay, or report. Yes Word would be great, but to my mind writing a novel in Word would be unnecessarily difficult. And speaking of dictionaries, Mac has one built in. I don't believe a PC does. For me personally I am very dyslexic, so using a typewriter is not possible, it needs to be a computer.

It is entirely possible to write a book in Word; I've written a history book (yes, it was published, by an academic press and was well received and well reviewed) in Word.

However, I take your point about the dictionary on Macs; in any case, while I'm not dyslexic, I must admit that I find it exceptionally useful, for I find myself consulting it frequently.

 

[Snow4maen]

Also for those who require laptops, arguably a Mac would be a better choice if not only for portability and battery life?

 

[M4th]

I’m wondering if it may be problematic owing to the potential for some writing to be political in nature and that that then causes a moderation headache? But I suppose it could be done with the caveat that political ideas must be excluded?

Probably just me, but it seems like most everything anymore is political in nature. Twas ever thus?

 

[eyoungren]

@Snow4maen, I support your request for a forum specific to writing. I'd be interested in that. That said, as @maflynn mentioned, it takes some considerable effort. The subforum members here (PowerPC Macs) crusaded for at least a year to get an Early Intel Mac forum because most of us own EIM (Early Intel Macs).

Specifically, Arn sees no reason to add another forum if he perceives that the topic has low demand by itself, or that it could not support itself by thread/post generation. He isn't interested in adding forums that have the potential to become ghost towns.

I can't say that is the case here, I don't know. But, if it's truly what you want you need to wage a campaign. You have to get enough of the members who want this posting about it in current forums where there is at least some connection to writing and people letting Arn know directly that they support this. Arn can be direct messaged and he does respond.

Ultimately, we got our EIM forum, but it took some doing and enough people carrying water for it to happen. I'm sure Arn got sick of hearing from us.

 

[Snow4maen]

Probably just me, but it seems like most everything anymore is political in nature. Twas ever thus?

This is true, whether you are writing in general, or writing fiction, it can be highly politically charged. There would need to be room to accept this so that political themes don't draw personal insults. This is a forum and these days politics is very sensitive. And this could be problematic. However, literature is an art. So I might argue we shouldn't shy away from it. But it could just be a headache to moderate. Critique is deadly important, so long as it has merit, but political bashing for the sake of it, is unlikely to amount to good writing.

 

[Snow4maen]

I have no idea how to do this, my apologies. But might it be an idea to test how popular such a sub forum would be with a poll? For example, questions could include. Are you a writer? Amateur, unpublished is fine. Do you consider the Mac to be your system of choice for you profession/hobby? And do you have a Mac specific workflow? And Would you want to see a sub domain for writing? Or any suggestions for questions welcome, if there is little interest, then it's not worth it.

 

[Snow4maen]

Also, I belong to a local writers group. It is my hobby, I am very much amateur. But I love it and I like my books. I like to attempt poetry, and stories. And in my writing group, some writing has had a political bent, but that never causes any trouble, the group is good natured, and has a sense of humour, I think they are all quite lovely. We just support each other with our writing. Is that possible here?

 

[Snow4maen]

Some possible suggestions for sub forums in a writing section...

Grammar and punctuation
Fiction
Non-Fiction
Poetry, including Haikus and Limericks
Academic Writing
Writing apps and workflow, tips and advice.
Publishing tips.

 

[Madonepro]

Some possible suggestions for sub forums in a writing section...

Grammar and punctuation
Fiction
Non-Fiction
Poetry, including Haikus and Limericks
Academic Writing
Writing apps and workflow, tips and advice.
Publishing tips.

I'd like to see a writing prompts thread too, maybe as a weekly contest, or monthly.

 

[Snow4maen]

I'd like to see a writing prompts thread too, maybe as a weekly contest, or monthly.

Great idea! This is exactly what we do with our local writers group. We recently had a limerick competition, and this months theme is Surprises! So we will all write whatever we feel like with that theme.

 

[Madonepro]

Great idea! This is exactly what we do with our local writers group. We recently had a limerick competition, and this months theme is Surprises! So we will all write whatever we feel like with that theme.

Awesome. Rose are red, violets are blue, I'm a schizophrenic, and so am I...

 

[Snow4maen]

Awesome. Rose are red, violets are blue, I'm a schizophrenic, and so am I...

Well, it isn't the most epic literary effort by my estimation. And it's totally the wrong depiction of schizophrenia, I would say more akin to multiple personality disorder.

 

[Snow4maen]

With the sub sections, somehow I have left out Children's Literature. That would be nice to include.