Can not defrag with SSD and HDD

Discussion in 'MacBook Pro' started by murdoc158, Oct 28, 2011.

  1. murdoc158 macrumors regular

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    Jan 8, 2007
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    West Bend, WI
    #1
    I'm using Drive Genius 3 to try and defrag my HDD. I keep getting the error:
    I've got OSX 10.7.2 installed on the SSD along with all my apps. I've got my user folder and all my music, photos, doctuments, etc. on the HDD. What do I need to do to get this to run?

    Thanks!
     
  2. GGJstudios macrumors Westmere

    GGJstudios

    Joined:
    May 16, 2008
    #2
    Why are you trying to defrag your drive?

    About disk optimization with Mac OS X
     
  3. nicfargo macrumors member

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    Dec 23, 2008
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    Nebraska
    #3
    For the love of everything that is good and holy...do not defrag your SSD. They don't need it, and in all reality you might just be wearing it down faster then it should. Also, you don't need to defrag a disk in OS X. The journaling system is way better then FAT32 or NTFS, so you don't need defrag.
     
  4. brendanryder macrumors 6502a

    brendanryder

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    #4
    This.

    Its just a waste
     
  5. murdoc158 thread starter macrumors regular

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    #5
    Somebody can't read...

    My reasoning for defragging was because my drive is just media. Itunes takes forever to import songs, Final Cut loads movies slowly, etc. I often get beach balls when importing as well.

    Anyway, for those wondering I was able to start defragging by using the guest account. Since my user folder was on the disk I was trying to defrag, it couldn't unmount the disk. The guest folder is on the OSX disk (my SSD).
     
  6. GGJstudios macrumors Westmere

    GGJstudios

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    #6
    Fragmentation isn't likely to be your problem, since Mac OS X doesn't have a fragmentation problem like Windows does. It may be a permissions issue or another culprit, but defragging is rarely useful on Mac OS X, except in some cases when partitioning a drive.
     
  7. Macman45 macrumors demi-god

    Macman45

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    Somewhere Back In The Long Ago
    #7
    Say's It All

    You WILL seriously mess up an SSD or a Mac hdd by trying to Defrag them. This isn't Windows. If you want a utility that will run what are called "Scripts" (your Mac will run these if lest idle and on anyway) but from time to time, if I happen to be away for a while and I shut my main iMac down I use this:


    http://www.macupdate.com/app/mac/11582/onyx

    Use it with care and follow the instructions. It's free, but a donation is alway's nice to keep the guy's and Girl's on track.
     
  8. shardey macrumors 6502a

    shardey

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    #8
    You probably have to create a bootable disc to defragment your startup disk. Also this is such a waste in wearability on a SSD and time.
     
  9. maflynn, Oct 29, 2011
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2011

    maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

    Staff Member

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    #9
    People he's not asking to defrag his SSD but his HD
     
  10. dusk007 macrumors 68040

    dusk007

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    Dec 5, 2009
    #10
    Just unmount it in diskutility and remount it. Then it should work.
    I am guessing some apps are using some data and have a lock on it.
    Close all the apps that might do so.
    Or restart on a fresh restart there can also be no lock on any files/folders.
    If that still doesn't work try repair premissions.

    Using diskutil in terminal with some force tags might help too although it is not the most elegant solution.
     
  11. Fishrrman macrumors G3

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2009
    #11
    "You WILL seriously mess up an SSD or a Mac hdd by trying to Defrag them"

    Seldom on MacRumors have I seen a posting as ridiculous and uninformed as this one is.

    Defragging DOES NOT "mess up" a drive with the Mac OS, and in some instances, is necessary to keep things running smoothly (specific examples: where large amounts of audio or video data are recorded, it's necessary to defrag so that large contiguous areas of the drive remain free to accept such data in continuous streams).

    To the original poster:
    I'm going to _guess_ that the reason that Drive Genius can't unmount the drive to defrag it, is because you have SOMEthing "open" or being accessed on the "target drive". So long as this remains open, the drive can't be dismounted, and you can't begin the defrag process.

    Here's how I would try to do it (may or may not work):
    1. Boot from the drive that DOES NOT have to be defragged, then
    2. When you get to the finder, "manually dismount" the "target drive" by dragging its icon to the trash.
    3. Now launch Drive Genius and go to the defragging panel
    4. Does the dismounted target drive appear there? (again, it may or may not, depending on how Drive Genius "views" drives that are dismounted but still available "on the bus", so to speak)
    5. If it DOES show up (even though it's not mounted), try defragging then.

    I believe some other previous posters mentioned that defragging may not be advisable for solid-state drives. I've yet to own one, so I can't comment on that other to say that it might indeed be true (at least for _some_ SSD's), probably due to the way their controllers work. In that case, the best way to "defrag" the contents of an SSD would be to "dupe it" to another volume or partition, re-initialize it, and then "copy the contents back" with a "re-dupe". The files will be copied over contiguously, and the drive will then be effectively defragged.

    I have defragged flash drives numerous times without problems.
     
  12. dusk007 macrumors 68040

    dusk007

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    Dec 5, 2009
    #12
    Really you aren't too much on here. I read them all the time.
    When ever some actual technical understanding of some matter would be required many people here just repeat the same BS over and over.
    This forum is good for questions like "Can it damage my computer if I sit in front of it", but for real question about 3/4 of the answers a close to worthless.
     
  13. GGJstudios macrumors Westmere

    GGJstudios

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    #13
    The answer is yes, since most of the problems facing computers is the fleshy part between the keyboard and the chair. :D
     
  14. simsaladimbamba

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    located
    #14
    pebcak ftw?
     
  15. mape2k macrumors regular

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    Germany
    #15
    Thank god 90% of the questions asked in this forum are of this type :D
     
  16. sjinsjca macrumors 68000

    sjinsjca

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    Oct 30, 2008
    #16
    Defrag an SSD? Please don't.

    Defrag makes sense for mechanical drives because it saves time otherwise spent on track-to-track seeking operations when blocks of data are scattered all over the disk. There's nothing of the sort in an SSD. No mechanical action.

    Defragging involves reading blocks of data and then rewriting them so they're contiguous, again for the benefit of a mechanical drive. Your SSD has a limited number of writes, so doing something as write-intensive as defragging will reduce its useful life. To no real benefit.

    Depending on SSD controller architecture there may be a tiny benefit in block transfer throughput for contiguous data but not enough to warrant the reduction in drive lifetime.
     
  17. mape2k macrumors regular

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    Apr 18, 2011
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    Germany
    #17
    Please read the thread. He wants to defray his HDD not his SSD.
     
  18. GGJstudios macrumors Westmere

    GGJstudios

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    #18
    Please read the thread carefully. The OP was not asking about defragging an SSD.
     
  19. sjinsjca macrumors 68000

    sjinsjca

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    Oct 30, 2008
    #19

    Your signature says you're running 4GB RAM. That would be the first thing to goose if you want better speed.

    SSDs are not "media" in the traditional sense. There are significant benefits to SSDs, and elimination of mechanical seek dwells ranks top among them. No mechanical seeks, no real reason to defray.
     
  20. GGJstudios macrumors Westmere

    GGJstudios

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    #20
    Are you reading any of the thread, or just posting for the sake of posting?
     
  21. sjinsjca macrumors 68000

    sjinsjca

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    #21
    Well, first he said HDD, then he said "I've got OSX 10.7.2 installed on the SSD along with all my apps." As you've seen, I'm not the only one reading his aim as including the SSD. EDIT: Oh, and his signature makes no mention of a secondary mechanical HDD: "Macbook Pro 15" 2.66GHz C2D, 4GB DDR3, 64GB Kingston V100 SSD, external USB SuperDrive"

    Then folks chime in, saying things like they've defragged flash drives many times with no problems. Great, I know people who've smoked cigarettes for decades with no problems. Doesn't mean it won't catch up with them.

    So okay, let's all agree: defragging an SSD is unnecessary and shortens its life. Then let's all turn to the defrag problem with his HDD. (Which also shouldn't need defragging under OS X, but at least it's not as nonsensical as defragging an SSD.)

    ----------

    Egad. Pillory the poster for being un-clairvoyant, why don't we.

    He said he's getting beachballs. Insufficient RAM is the first place to look, not fragmentation, unless his disk(s?) is really full.

    It is also woefully unclear from his original post whether he has BOTH a mechanical HDD and an SDD. That detail is not in his signature (though the external SuperDrive is a clue).
     
  22. GGJstudios macrumors Westmere

    GGJstudios

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    May 16, 2008
    #22
    The post was quite clear. First they state the problem:
    Then they give information about their configuration:
    Drive 1:
    Drive 2 (the one they want to defrag):

    It's quite clear if you actually read the post.

    The poster didn't say "read my signature". The relevant information is in the post. Many people post about a computer that isn't in their signature, many don't keep their signatures up to date, many don't have any computer info in their signatures. If you read the post, not the signature, you get all the information needed to understand the problem and the configuration.
     
  23. murdoc158 thread starter macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2007
    Location:
    West Bend, WI
    #23
    Wow this thread got out of hand quick. Again, I'm not trying to defrag my SSD. If you re-read my original post you will see I have OSX and all my apps installed on the SSD. My user folder and media are on the HDD.

    The reason I was getting errors trying to defrag was because I was logged in to my account. My user folder was on the drive I wanted to defrag. The disk could not be unmounted while I was logged in. I was able to log into the guest account (installed on the SSD since it's part of OSX) and defrag my HDD.

    Anyway...on to the reason for wanting for wanting to defrag. I'm getting unresponsive iTunes and beach balls when importing new music. My library is 85GB and about 13000 songs. Since the defrag completed it is a lot faster. I can't prove 100% that defragging is to thank, but it is much more responsive now. I'm sure a new i7 CPU would be a nice upgrade as well, but I've got to get by with what I've got.
     

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