Can you please add a unix section?

Discussion in 'Site and Forum Feedback' started by Intelligent, Aug 21, 2014.

  1. Intelligent macrumors 6502a

    Intelligent

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    #1
    You should add a unix section, if i have a question or i want to discuss terminal/unix commands, do i do it in OS X or Mac Programming? I think it would be nice with a unix section.
     
  2. GGJstudios macrumors Westmere

    GGJstudios

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    #2
    What about the Windows, Linux & Others on the Mac forum? If it relates to Unix commands in the OS X Terminal, I would think the OS X forum would be appropriate.
     
  3. chrfr macrumors 604

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    #3
    The vast majority of terminal/command line interaction isn't programming. I'd put it into OS X.
     
  4. Intelligent thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Intelligent

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    #4
    Ok, but what does discussing unix have to do with Windows, Linux & Others on the Mac? OS X is 100% unix so i don't understand why its "Others"?
     
  5. GGJstudios macrumors Westmere

    GGJstudios

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    #5
    If you're referring to the Unix aspects of OS X, as opposed to running another Unix version on your Mac, then that forum wouldn't apply. If you're talking about OS X as a Unix version, the OS X forum would be appropriate.
     
  6. maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

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    #6
    Anything related to terminal commands goes into OS X forum, since OS X is built from Unix

    The Windows, Linux & Others on the Mac forum us for any other OS running on a Mac
     
  7. SandboxGeneral Moderator emeritus

    SandboxGeneral

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    #7
    What if we remove 'on the Mac' from the forum Windows, Linux & Others on the Mac? Then it could encompass any other OS, regardless of whether or not it's being hosted on a Mac.
     
  8. Intelligent thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Intelligent

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    #8
    I don't see why that would be necessary, Isn't this a mac forum?
     
  9. SandboxGeneral Moderator emeritus

    SandboxGeneral

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    #9
    Isn't that what you're asking for? An appropriate forum to talk about Unix.
     
  10. Intelligent thread starter macrumors 6502a

    Intelligent

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    #10
    Nope, I'm talking about unix for mac, which is OS X (or A/UX haha). Whatever it was a stupid question, i should just ask unix questions in the "OS X" section in the future.
     
  11. maflynn Moderator

    maflynn

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    #11
    Its not a stupid question, but that's where the Unix questions end up :)
     
  12. PinkyMacGodess macrumors 601

    PinkyMacGodess

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    #12
    It might be 100% Unix, but much of that Unix has been neutered and doesn't function anymore... :eek:
     
  13. Anonymous Freak, Aug 22, 2014
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2014

    Anonymous Freak macrumors 601

    Anonymous Freak

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    #13
    Three possibilities that you could be referring to:

    1. "UNIX" type usage (X11, Perl, command-line shell scripting, etc.) within the Apple-provided tools in any version of OS X: Use the appropriate OS X subforum.

    2. Non-OS X "UNIX" on Apple hardware: Use the Windows, Linux & Others on the Mac subforum.

    3. Non-OS X "UNIX" on non-Apple hardware: MacRumors isn't really the appropriate forum for that discussion - maybe in the "Community Discussion" forum?

    I suppose you could be referring to two other UNIXes that you allude to:
    4. A/UX on an Apple 680x0-based system or AIX on an Apple Network Server system: Apple Collectors forum. Since no sane person would run them as "main" systems nowadays. :p


    Oh, and "UNIX" is just a certification that something meets certain minimum standards - it's not an "OS" itself. It's like saying a video card is "PCI Express x16" - it doesn't define the actual performance or usability, just that it meets the technical requirements as "PCI Express x16". OS X is a "UNIX" because Apple submitted it to The Open Group. Microsoft Windows NT 3.5 was officially branded a "UNIX" with its POSIX subsystem installed. AIX, HP-UX, BSD, there are many different official "UNIX" OSes out there that are not even remotely compatible with each other. UNIX has been just a buzzword for a long time now. While every version of OS X since 10.5 has been "certified UNIX" - Apple didn't actually need to change anything to achieve certification. They just needed to pay The Open Group for the pleasure.
     
  14. smithrh macrumors 68020

    smithrh

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    #14
    Eh?

    Supplanted for the vast majority of users, absolutely agree, but non-functional/neutered, couldn't disagree more.

    I wouldn't mind a unix section, but I'm not sure how much it would be used. I'd rather see a unified "Mac Troubleshooting" section...
     
  15. PinkyMacGodess macrumors 601

    PinkyMacGodess

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    #15
    Neutered as in I was having major issues connecting a friend's Mac to their dial-up provider a number of years ago. I tried everything, and ended up going headfirst into the command line, only to find out that effectively all of the Unix dial-up networking had been neutered. They were there, they ran, but did nothing... That whole layer was supplanted by the OS X overlay. I guess I wasn't all that surprised, but apparently in earlier versions, it did work.

    I called Apple, got sent to second level, and got told that 'a lot' of the UNIX/BSD/Mach has been neutered... I figure that eventually there won't be much of anything left. Evolution and all that...

    In 50,000 years, IF we survive the tea party, ISIS, SIRI, we will only have 8 fingers and toes. So I guess maybe we should get comfortable counting in octal?
     
  16. chrfr macrumors 604

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    #16
    Well, while the dialup networking might not be functional at this point (and that seems to be a totally reasonable evolution to me), whoever told you that the rest was neutered was simply making up "facts."
     
  17. PinkyMacGodess macrumors 601

    PinkyMacGodess

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    #17
    But, if you look back at my post, and READ ALL OF IT this time, I didn't say 'ALL of it', I said the Apple second level said that 'A LOT of it' was. I do remember asking what else was neutered, and he chuckled and said that he didn't know off hand... He said that there were no 'UNIX guru's' in his department.

    Being of sound mind, and no large amount of UNIX experience (besides 'cd' and 'man' and some other random commands) I waved it off and figured it out myself somehow (It was about a year ago), because I really didn't care after that phone call and wasting good valuable time I could have been outside enjoying life exactly how much of UNIX was, or wasn't, there...

    I did feel kinda cheated, somewhat, for not having the command line actually work... Especially after finding 'the command' that would work.

    So there...

    Anyone looking for dial-up networking solutions via the command line should look elsewhere (and DUMP DIAL-UP ALREADY!)...

    As far as the other UNIX commands that may also be neutered? The Apple second level guy said 'a lot'. Your mileage will apparently vary. Depending on what you want to do...
     
  18. chrfr macrumors 604

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    #18
    Again, this is nothing more than unsubstantiated remarks from someone apparently unqualified to provide any sort of useful information on the topic.
     
  19. PinkyMacGodess macrumors 601

    PinkyMacGodess

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    #19
    Me, or the 'engineer' at Apple? Either way, what does it serve to harass me? I mentioned the time I deep dove into the command line, and what I found out.

    Go play with your UNIX. I'm happy for you. /comment
     
  20. chrfr macrumors 604

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    #20
    I meant the phone support person at Apple. I wasn't trying to harass anyone.
     
  21. PinkyMacGodess macrumors 601

    PinkyMacGodess

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    #21
    Accept my sincere apologies... I didn't know whom you were having the issue with.

    And for another log on the whatever, I did find it rather odd that no one knew the UNIX utilities, or could help, if I did end up on second or a higher level... I mean, it's like built on UNIX (a permutation of it anyway) and I thought that there would be *some* knowledge base there... I mean, it would be like calling Chevrolet with a question on the internal combustion engine, and get shrugs and stuttering...

    Basically I got the 'if it doesn't work, it's not supported' dance.

    But things are what they are...

    Apologies again.
     
  22. Anonymous Freak macrumors 601

    Anonymous Freak

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    #22
    The trick is in where you draw the line of "UNIX". By the Open Group's definition, it only has to have the APIs, it doesn't have to have all the utilities bundled. And as the "GNU/Linux" purists like to point out, "Linux" is just the kernel, with no utilities at all - what makes it the complete usable system are all the utilities that GNU built. (Which is where a lot of OS X's command line utilities come from - so if you really want to go nuts on the whole "UNIX" purist thing, OS X can't be a "UNIX" because most of its command line utilities are sourced directly from a project whose name proclaims specifically that it is not UNIX.)

    While the dial-up utility you were used to may have been missing, it's almost assuredly also missing on modern implementations of AIX and HP-UX. And nobody would argue that those aren't "UNIX"es. (Unices? Unixen?)
     
  23. PinkyMacGodess macrumors 601

    PinkyMacGodess

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    #23
    But it wasn't 'missing'. It was there, and looked like it *should* work. It just had no effect on the overlaid OS X environment at all. I had thought of going more into the command line as a way of learning UNIX as my only prior exposure to UNIX had been a Convex system I used in university. The 'luster' of 'teh UNIX' of OS X was lost after that. I was so disgusted that HP ate Convex. They also killed DEC too along with an incredibly long list of other notable companies.

    But anyway... As they say 'Those were the days'...
     

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