Canalsys reports Apple ships more PCs than HP

*LTD*

macrumors G4
Feb 5, 2009
10,703
1
Canada
iPad inclusion in the numbers. It's happening.

Canalys and DisplaySearch have already included iPad numbers in the past. Only a matter of time before everyone's doing it and it becomes the accepted norm.

I feel truly sorry for the competition.

(LOL no I don't.)

Article in full:

http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/...omputers-thanks-to-ipad/?partner=yahoofinance

Apple Becomes World’s Biggest Maker of Computers, Thanks to iPad

The company that proclaimed the “post-PC era” — Apple — is now the biggest maker of PCs in the world.

That conclusion comes by way of Canalys, a research firm that has tacked against conventional wisdom in the tech analyst world by insisting that sales of iPads and other tablets belong in market share tallies for the computer industry. And so, as Canalys itself predicted in November, robust holiday sales of the iPad catapulted Apple ahead of Hewlett-Packard to make it the top PC company in the fourth quarter.

The 15 million iPads and five million Macintoshes that Apple sold during the period accounted for 17 percent of the approximately 120 million PCs shipped during the fourth quarter, Canalys said. The firm said tablets — Canalys calls them “pads” — accounted for 22 percent of total PC shipments during the fourth quarter, with Amazon’s Kindle Fire and Barnes & Noble’s Nook included.

Without the lift from tablets, the PC market looked bleak during the quarter, declining 0.4 percent from the same period a year earlier, Canalys said.

It looks as if one of the post-PC era’s star devices gave a gift to the PC industry over the holidays: growth.
 

*LTD*

macrumors G4
Feb 5, 2009
10,703
1
Canada
Yep! Can't wait to see them include games consoles, since those are surely computers as well.
That's not how consumers are using them. Which is why you won't see smartphones included either.

The iPad is not categorized based on its technical aspects, but rather how people are using them, and whether this consumer decision to use them in the manner they are is having an impact (negative) on PC sales.
 

neiltc13

macrumors 68040
May 27, 2006
3,116
6
That's not how consumers are using them. Which is why you won't see smartphones included either.

The iPad is not categorized based on its technical aspects, but rather how people are using them, and whether this consumer decision to use them in the manner they are is having an impact (negative) on PC sales.
No? So what is the difference between guy who uses Netflix and web browser on iPad compared to guy who uses Netflix and web browser on PS3?

Heck, you can plug a keyboard and mouse into a PS3, but try doing that on an iPad.
 

*LTD*

macrumors G4
Feb 5, 2009
10,703
1
Canada
No? So what is the difference between guy who uses Netflix and web browser on iPad compared to guy who uses Netflix and web browser on PS3?
The difference is that most consumers use their iPad for activities that most resemble what they would perform on a computer. I can't speak for your Netflix guy.

In any event, the attempt to argue the rightness of wrongness of such a categorization is moot. The rightness of wrongness of a trend that will shape itself into a reality (and become the new benchmark in the process) is irrelevant. Consumer preferences and their use of a device in certain conspicuous, quantifiable ways happens irrespective of your efforts to justify them vis-à-vis your current understanding of what a "computer" or "PC" should and should not be.

It's happening, and we'll only see more of this moving forward. That's really all there is to it.

----------

Misleading Article.


An iPad is not a PC.
It might be best to check your preconceptions about what a "PC" is at the door. We're living in an age of redefinitions and substantial market shifts.
 

Tinyluph

macrumors regular
Dec 27, 2011
191
0
I don't get what the point is of including iPads with laptop/desktop computer devices. Is it just to be able to say, "hey look! hey look! we're winning!" or what? We already know Apple is "winning." Their earnings call proved this thirty times over. This metric just seems like a ploy to make the OS X vs. Windows landscape look better than it actually is.
 

*LTD*

macrumors G4
Feb 5, 2009
10,703
1
Canada
I don't get what the point is of including iPads with laptop/desktop computer devices. Is it just to be able to say, "hey look! hey look! we're winning!" or what?
This is not Apple. Canalys is a research firm. So is, for example, DisplaySearch (who have also included iPad numbers in PC numbers.) Other firms are Gartner, IDC, etc. These are the folks who, based on their analysis of trends, numbers, shipments, provide us with market share reports, trend data, etc.

Canalys has nothing to "win" here.

We already know Apple is "winning." Their earnings call proved thirty times over. This metric just seems like a ploy to make the OS X vs. Windows landscape look better than it actually is.
So . . . Canalys and the rest are Apple fans? :confused:
 

firewood

macrumors 604
Original poster
Jul 29, 2003
7,817
1,060
Silicon Valley
An iPad is not a PC.
Doesn't matter what you think it is. Matters what joe consumer and enterprises are buying for many low-level generic tasks that were formerly done on PCs, and where PC manufacturers will deploy their R&D and manufacturing dollars, and what stores will stock.

No? So what is the difference between guy who uses Netflix and web browser on iPad compared to guy who uses Netflix and web browser on PS3?
Aunt Martha (and millions of other consumers) will think about buying iPads for Netflix and web browsing. Maybe a few gamer geeks in basements will do it on PS3s.

I don't get what the point is of including iPads with laptop/desktop computer devices.
It's where the money, the manufacturing and the distribution dollars are going when people think about certain needs that were commonly done on laptops the past few years.

If 22% or more of potential buyers don't need anything more than apps they can get on an iPad, whether they get a desktop, laptop or an iPad, they might well buy an iPad instead of a new laptop.
 

boss.king

macrumors 68040
Apr 8, 2009
3,451
515
Lets include smartphones and dumbphones and anything else that could possibly qualify as a computer then. Hell, I'm pretty sure I could start counting calculators. Oh wait, that wouldn't make Apple look good.

Obviously if you count only certain things then the answer will come out in your favour.
 

Rodimus Prime

macrumors G4
Oct 9, 2006
10,136
4
Doesn't matter what you think it is. Matters what joe consumer and enterprises are buying for many low-level generic tasks that were formerly done on PCs, and where PC manufacturers will deploy their R&D and manufacturing dollars, and what stores will stock.



Aunt Martha (and millions of other consumers) will think about buying iPads for Netflix and web browsing. Maybe a few gamer geeks in basements will do it on PS3s.



It's where the money, the manufacturing and the distribution dollars are going when people think about certain needs that were commonly done on laptops the past few years.

If 22% or more of potential buyers don't need anything more than apps they can get on an iPad, whether they get a desktop, laptop or an iPad, they might well buy an iPad instead of a new laptop.
And you know none of that justifies have the iPad classified as a PC. Go back and look at the stuff some of the Apple cheerleaders said about netbooks when they were really boosting the PC manufacture numbers. They called them crap and they should not be counted. Netbooks were pushing it to be classified as a PC but iPad and other tablets do not belong there at all.

End of the story is iPad should not be counted as PC market or market share. It is its own market. This is what we call craptistics for generated hits, and wanting others to pay for a more detailed break down. Lets face it nothing gets headlines and hits more than Apple so produce some BS report with heavily inflated numbers to push Apple to the top and that gets you tons of hit but the data from the basic report is worthless.

But then again that is not going to stop some cheerleaders from saying how great it is.
 

*LTD*

macrumors G4
Feb 5, 2009
10,703
1
Canada
End of the story is iPad should not be counted as PC market or market share. It is its own market. This is what we call craptistics for generated hits, and wanting others to pay for a more detailed break down. Lets face it nothing gets headlines and hits more than Apple so produce some BS report with heavily inflated numbers to push Apple to the top and that gets you tons of hit but the data from the basic report is worthless.

But then again that is not going to stop some cheerleaders from saying how great it is.
DisplaySearch indicated this as well.

http://www.displaysearch.com/cps/rd...l_apple_past_hp_to_top_mobile_pc_position.asp

When Gartner and IDC and the others start doing it (and they will), will it be "craptistics for generated hits" then as well?

Getting there already:

http://9to5mac.com/2011/05/05/idc-ipad-and-other-arm-devices-can-be-classified-as-pcs/

At what point do you go from fighting the future to just appearing weird and out of touch?
 

Rodimus Prime

macrumors G4
Oct 9, 2006
10,136
4
DisplaySearch indicated this as well.

http://www.displaysearch.com/cps/rd...l_apple_past_hp_to_top_mobile_pc_position.asp

When Gartner and IDC and the others start doing it (and they will), will it be "craptistics for generated hits" then as well?

Getting there already:

http://9to5mac.com/2011/05/05/idc-ipad-and-other-arm-devices-can-be-classified-as-pcs/

At what point do you go from fighting the future to just appearing weird and out of touch?
Points to post above and 9to5mac which is a fanboy site is hook line an sinker why they are making these crap reports. The fanboy worship sites jump all over it getting them hits (which cause money to be spent in either ads or in more detailed break down)
 

*LTD*

macrumors G4
Feb 5, 2009
10,703
1
Canada
Points to post above and 9to5mac which is a fanboy site is hook line an sinker why they are making these crap reports. The fanboy worship sites jump all over it getting them hits (which cause money to be spent in either ads or in more detailed break down)
Do you read? All they're doing is simply reporting it. LOL. The link is right there in the article.

Here is the original uh... "crap report":

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-20059895-64.html
 

Rodimus Prime

macrumors G4
Oct 9, 2006
10,136
4
Do you read? All they're doing is simply reporting it. LOL. The link is right there in the article.

Here is the original uh... "crap report":

http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-20059895-64.html
Before you ask Do I read? I could and should ask the same thing of you.
And I point back to my first post. They are "reporting" that way because OMG it gets clicks. It more proof that the media in general stop caring about the facts and more about getting eyeballs.

Simple fact of the matter the iPad does not belong in there. The very FACT that they have to state that it was added in should tell you how worthless the information is. Apple gets hits and makes great head lines. Does get the Apple cheerleaders going post links all over the place like you are doing (which in turn increasing there google search rankings) Notice a trend there. None of that is about facts but getting hits and eyeballs with the crap story.
 

maflynn

Moderator
Staff member
May 3, 2009
66,689
33,575
Boston
Simple fact of the matter the iPad does not belong in there.
The problem is this fact; with an iPad, you can do almost as much on that, as you can on a computer.

Write a letter, work on a spreadsheet, play a game, surf the net. You can create and consume content on an iPad. While some of those functions don't lend themselves to an iPad its possible and people are in fact using iPads in place of computers.

----------

If Microsoft and hardware manufacturers were successful in the late 90s to create a tablet would there be the same argument that its not a computer?

MS is now working on windows 8 that is set to run on a desktop and a tablet, so will those tablets not be considered computers? Yeah I'm using an unreleased product but it makes my point
 

*LTD*

macrumors G4
Feb 5, 2009
10,703
1
Canada
http://blogs.barrons.com/techtrader...in-client-pcs-sales-says-canalys/?mod=BOLBlog

Update: It appears that more data will be forthcoming from Canalys, so stand by. In a phone conversation this afternoon, Canalys’s principal analyst for mobile devices, Chris Jones, acknowledged that grouping desktops and laptops with tablets and other devices is controversial. However, as he explained it to me, “We do see it as one big market of mobile computing. These tablets are not just about consumption any more, people can do much more with them than when they first appeared. The application breadth has increased and they are being used more and more as business tools.”
OMG it gets clicks.

about getting eyeballs.

the iPad does not belong in there.

Apple gets hits and makes great head lines.

Apple cheerleaders

getting hits and eyeballs

crap story.

future shock
n.
A condition of distress and disorientation brought on by the inability to cope with rapid societal and technological change.
[After the book Future Shock by Alvin Toffler (born 1928).]

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition copyright ©2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Updated in 2009. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.
 

yg17

macrumors G5
Aug 1, 2004
14,935
2,534
St. Louis, MO
iPad inclusion in the numbers. It's happening.

Canalys and DisplaySearch have already included iPad numbers in the past. Only a matter of time before everyone's doing it and it becomes the accepted norm.

I feel truly sorry for the competition.

(LOL no I don't.)

Article in full:
Either the iPad is part of the "post-PC" era as you've claimed in the past, or the iPad is a PC as you seem to be claiming now by cheering it's inclusion in the numbers. You can't have it both ways.
 

*LTD*

macrumors G4
Feb 5, 2009
10,703
1
Canada
Either the iPad is part of the "post-PC" era as you've claimed in the past, or the iPad is a PC as you seem to be claiming now by cheering it's inclusion in the numbers. You can't have it both ways.
THIS, what we're seeing now, are the effects of Post-PC. It doesn't mean "without PC." It means, "after PC." The wholesale shake-up and redefinition of the standard PC market. If you prefer a different label, feel free to suggest one. It won't change what's going on.
 

roadbloc

macrumors G3
Aug 24, 2009
8,784
213
UK
That's not how consumers are using them.
Not too sure. With MS Office and Web Browsing soon coming to the Xbox, I could use my Xbox for everything I use a computer for. Writing books, Music and Video playing, Web Browsing, Email and Gaming. If I didn't need the portability of a laptop, the Xbox could be my only computer in the near future.

Including the iPad when it suits is obvious bias. If you're expanding the range of the term 'pc' from just Laptops and Desktops to Tablets as well, you need to include Game Consoles, Smartphones and SmartTVs (if they are called that). The only way to accurately calculate where this 'post-pc' shift is heading is to include everything that can do what a PC did.
 

*LTD*

macrumors G4
Feb 5, 2009
10,703
1
Canada
The only way to accurately calculate where this 'post-pc' shift is heading is to include everything that can do what a PC did.
Reality has a way of turning out quite "inaccurate."

Your personal definitions of "PC", "tablet", etc., are irrelevant to the direction in which the market is headed.

Forward your objections to Canalys and DisplaySearch, and then in good time to IDC, Gartner, etc. And then, in time, take a stand against the entire industry, that has turned your definitions inside-out. But by that time you will have probably accepted it.
 
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