Canon EOS 60D - Made in Japan - First DSLR

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by ArmCortexA8, Aug 9, 2011.

  1. ArmCortexA8 macrumors 6502a

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    #1
    Hi all

    I have been using Digital Still Camera's for years, mainly Sony T Series and DSC-HX5V (now the HX7V) model because they are Made in Japan and the lens is certified by Carl Zeiss on all their products, so these are very high quality.

    As for photos I want to do (start) photography as a spare time hobby as I have spent over 28 years being a computer geek, so time to put some of that computing horsepower to work. I admit I do have a slight "tremor in my hands" so hence I have always opted for Sony's SteadyShot system for accuracy.

    The last Canon EOS SLR I had was one that used good old film, years ago now but feature wise pretty lax and not cheap either. Well a couple of days ago I decided to make one massive jump from over 10 years using Digital Still Cameras to a Canon EOS 60D DSLR - the gap is like the Grand Canyon :) I guess the conundrum I am in is I find it challenging to see whats worthy of a photo, I know it sounds odd but I guess this is to be expected.

    I compared many cameras, including Nikon and Sony, but after talking to some people I went the Canon, plus Made in Japan and the Canon has more features than the Sony Alpha, and Canon has the "Image Stabilizer" lens included, which the cheaper models do not have. The Nikon D7000 was actually over $400 more expensive, had a smaller (less clear) display and Made in Thailand which it should not be for its price, etc so glad I went for Canon. I didn't go for the 7D because I think that is too much overkill and extra expense considering this is my first DSLR.

    Oh and damn it feels good to be able to use a camera with a proper viewfinder, but with the option of the LCD display as well - no going back to digital still cameras now :) BTW the SD card I am using is a Toshiba 16GB Class 10 - Made in Japan too :)

    Additionally, I chose Canon because the lens mount is common and pretty economical, compared to the likes of Sony Alpha (Konica Minolta) / Nikon. All in all with some simple photos of my car and outside the pictures look absolutely amazing on the 60D - its like going from DVD to Blu-Ray :) The 60D came standard with 2 lenses - and 18-55m EFS, and a 55-250mm EFS, both with the image stabiliser as well.

    Oh and damn it feels good to be able to use a camera with a proper viewfinder, but with the option of the LCD display as well - no going back to digital still cameras now :) On a final note, since the DSLR is a lot heavier than the digital still cameras I find the D60 counterbalances any tremor I have and with the image stabilisation I find it easier and quicker to take photos with no motion blur, even with a manual zoom instead of powered zoom as on digital still cameras - the bulk actually makes it easier for me because I am grubbing the whole camera, not just keeping it in my fingers.

    Any ideas what I can photography to start my new hobby?
     
  2. Laird Knox macrumors 68000

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    #2
    Everything?

    The more you shoot the better you will get. It is digital afterall, you don't have to spend cash to develop the film. Just shoot and find what you like.
     
  3. HBOC macrumors 68020

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    #3
    So let me get this straight - you bought a camera and SD card based on the premise that it says "Made in Japan"? Hmm....

    While the 60D is nice, the D7000 has many more features and a MUCH better AF system. It has dual SD slots, which is useful. It doesn't have a flip out LCD, though.

    I don't know if you realize this, but Sony has the IS in camera, so any lens you attach to it, will have IS. You say something about digital still cameras? You mean point and shoots? Also, the 60D doesn't have a "proper VF". it is still darker and smaller than my full frame Canon:).

    I just don't understand why you are so against anything not made in Japan. Zeiss and Leica are of very high quality, but they are not made in Japan. Does that make them garbage?

    Also, you use a camera to take pictures. Am unsure why you are asking what to use it for...
     
  4. ArmCortexA8 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #4
    I compared my factors, including price, build quality, features, and the Canon stood out to be the better, and the Made in Japan was another benefit to me, plus the flip out LCD got me hooked on Canon as well - seems a lot heavier, and better build quality than Nikon and a lot better LCD display. Additionally, Canon lenses / mounts are not as expensive as Nikon / Sony Alpha. Im not paying big $$$ for something Made in Thailand - no thanks.

    I know the Sony has the IS in camera, but I prefer the lens / camera system for IS - lens / lens doing the same task. I read about the VF not being 100% but this does not worry me at all. As for my Made in Japan statement, I only buy electronics which are Made in Japan, and yes I also like Made in Germany like Zeiss / Leica as well, but cameras by these brands are well over double the price tag - a bit toooo much for my first DSLR don't you think?
     
  5. Laird Knox macrumors 68000

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    #5
    Yeah he had me scrathing my head too.

    Not if you don't buy what you ultimately want or will buy. If you ultimately want a Leica then all that Canon gear will be useless.

    But as to your original question (or what I think was your question), just get out there and shoot. You may not produce a lot of keepers to start but the numbers will get better over time.
     
  6. HBOC macrumors 68020

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    #6
    you do know that not everything made in China/Thailand/etc is not all bad, right? I just bought a cable release cable that is made in China for $3 shipped. I bet that I removed the markings on both and showed them to you, you couldn't tell what was what.

    I mean it is your money and your decision. I am just wondering if you are going to take pictures of things that were made in China, like park benches, some peoples' clothing/shoes, cars on the road, etc?
     
  7. chrfr macrumors 604

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    #7
    You don't use a computer?
     
  8. Laird Knox macrumors 68000

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    #8
    Didn't you know that Japanese cameras automagically edit out Chinese objects. :D
     
  9. supercooled macrumors 6502a

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    #9
    This thread has deteriorated fast. Let's just dismiss the little faux pas as a bad choice of words and focus on the core topic here. I'm finding myself delving into this hobby as well and for the last 2 weeks have been feverishly reading up and watching Youtube videos for advice. The stuff I'm seeing being done on the Canon 550D and 600D is nothing short of remarkable. I've got some rudimentary knowledge of photography from my days with a Canon Digital Elf S300 but apart from that, my current Canon S3 Powershot has seen very little use to date. For me though the DSLR video seems to be a whole new beast. I'd like to get into shooting some DSLRHD footage and do time-lapse/dolly shots, etc similar to the stuff you see Apple does with their product advertisements.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ye1IDJyWY1Y&list=UUo9jcfFqxruY

    BTW, is this guy (Mattsmacintosh) on these forums?
     
  10. rusty2192 macrumors 6502a

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    Kentucky
    #10
    Pick up a copy of Understand Exposure by Bryan Peterson. It is a great learning tool and seems to always be recommended to beginning photographers and for good reason. Honestly, I'm kind of surprised that I am the first to mention it.
     
  11. HBOC macrumors 68020

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    #11
    Ive yet to read that book, but I learned back in the "film" days via trial and error.
     
  12. gnd macrumors 6502a

    gnd

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    #12
    I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but the two lenses that came with your camera are made in Taiwan ... :eek:
     
  13. ArmCortexA8, Aug 9, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 15, 2011

    ArmCortexA8 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #13
    Actually incorrect, the 18-55 is Made in Taiwan, but the 55.250mm is Made in Malaysia, which is fine but I prefer the main Camera hardware Made in Japan, and yes Canon do make Japanese lenses, obviously not included as standard in this kit but the option is available. As long as the lenses are genuine Canon, I have no reason to complain. My Japanese statement is related to the main camera hardware (body), and if the lens are Made in Japan as well, bonus.

    In not complaining about what was included, but on top of all the features of the 60D, the Japanese build and flip display really make it on powerful camera and solid and built well. I decided against Nikon because in this price range of camera (at least $400 more and prefer the screen quality of the Canon) if not Made in Japan I refuse to purchase it. After all the price difference between Made in Japan / Made in Taiwan is not that much, and the savings the company make are not passed onto the consumer - therefore I avoid it.

    The 60D performs flawlessly and damn quick too, more options to sink a battleship (going from digital still camera to the 60D) and a standard and very common mount system, unlike the Sony Alpha / Nikon. Video recording is of course secondary nature, and not my primary use. Photos are my primary use for this camera and plenty more features to try. Im use to using everything on Auto, but with this SLR it probably pays to experiment with different settings and see the results.

    Of course not everything Made in China / Thailand is bad quality, but the majority of it is based on my experience with Digital Still Cameras - especially when major components are made of plastic and the device is too light to represent decent quality at its price point (plastic clips / housings instead of stainless steel), and features are stripped out to knock down cost. Cables are a different story, but when entering the domain of DSLR hardware is a whole new ball game. The old saying "you get what you pay for" is no longer true, as a Japanese made product may have more features and better quality, yet cheaper than the opposition.

    If I can get Japanese made products with reputable name at a cheaper or similar price point to the Chinese - I go the Japanese version.
     
  14. flosseR macrumors 6502a

    flosseR

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    #14
    ok let's give the Japanese and non japanese discussion a rest.
    I do suggest you buy and read the understanding exposure book. Yes you can do trial and error but beside the fact that it is a great reference, the photos also inspire new dslr photographers.

    Also, welcome to the world of never-ending upgrades...lenses cost a lot and before you know it you want to move up with your lenses :)

    As for what to shoot.. I would suggest something simple, something that you can do at home or in your yard. For example, if you have grass, lay down and get the camera as low as possible, then adjust your POV so that your entire frame is filled with grass leaves (dunno how you say that in english) and take the shot.. grass is a cliché but its a great practice subject as it is readily available everywhere...
    If you don't have grass, make a smooth surface and arrange some rocks and go low to get a perspective... be creative :) Does not matter if its all a cliché that you shoot because you need to get iINTO photography and INTO the DSLR system and how depth of field affects things.

    just my 2c.

    //f
     
  15. TheReef macrumors 68000

    TheReef

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    Location:
    NSW, Australia.
    #15
    Consider participating in the challenges here on the forums for friendly constructive feedback.
    Imo hearing what other's do and don't like about your (and others) work is a good way to improve your skills, and challenges yourself to raise the bar to the next level.

    The latest challenge is here: Fortnightly Challenge August 6-19 Reflection
     
  16. gnd macrumors 6502a

    gnd

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    #16
    Also don't forget to post your favorite photo (one per day) to the Photo of the Day thread, currently in its August issue.
     
  17. mtbdudex, Aug 10, 2011
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2011

    mtbdudex macrumors 68000

    mtbdudex

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    #17
    ArmCortexA8 - my advice;
    Join a local photography club, interact with others in real life who share your passion, go on a local photo shoot with other members.

    Do their contests, hear their C&C face to face.

    Online is great, I've learned much here and @ POTN, but frankly the dynamics of face-face also is a great learning experience.

    oh, one other thing, once you feel your photos are "quality" before you post them online watermark them, if you ever-ever think they have sale potential also register them with copyright office....my recent lesson learned.
    I used to be so against watermarks, now I've flipped 180 degrees and will watermark all my shots as routine workflow before posting online. If someone "steals" your image and removes your watermark give you much more legal grounds to stand on.
     
  18. ArmCortexA8 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #18
    Hi all

    I do shift work, and work at least 6 days a week, so finding time could be challenging, but decided this morning to do some test shows - all were on "P" mode - The lens in use is the Canon EFS 18-55mm with Image Stabiliser.
     

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  19. flosseR macrumors 6502a

    flosseR

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    #19
    Hi, nice start.. but I think you misunderstood my "grass" approach..

    i meant it something like this:
    [​IMG]
     
  20. ArmCortexA8 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    Feb 18, 2010
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    Terra Australis
    #20
    Unfortunately, as its winter here, very little grass actually grows to that length, as all the grass around my suburb is very low lying and very short. Grass (lawn) grows less during winter. There maybe bushes, hedges, shrubs, and trees but thats about it.
     
  21. acearchie macrumors 68040

    acearchie

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    #21
    What was your motivation for shooting in P mode?

    I personally think the best way to use the camera would be to shoot in M mode. If this is too difficult at the moment take an image in the dreaded green box auto mode and look at the settings that the camera decided to choose to take the photo. When you view the image on the camera these will appear in the top left hand corner of the image.

    It should read something like 1/50 8.0. This is referring to a shutter speed of 1/50th of a second and an aperture of f8.0. if you then push the Disp. button you will be able to find the iSO which for outside should be 100-200 iso in bright sunlight.

    Now with the same subject put the camera into M mode and put in the same settings that you just read off the previous photo. The shutter speed can be adjusted using the scroll wheel by your right trigger finger, the aperture adjusted by pushing the AV +/- button and scrolling the same wheel and the ISO is changed by pushing the Q button and navigating to the top right ISO function and then scrolling the wheel.

    Now take a picture and see that it looks the same. If it does then you can start to experiment. For example you could make the aperture a very large number which will make everything much darker. To counteract this you will have to reduce the shutter speed to allow the camera to take in more light or increase the ISO which will boost the digital signal that the camera has recorded.

    After some playing around you should start to learn the relationship between ISO, Shutter Speed and Aperture and should be able to just keep your camera in M and therefore have more creative control over your photos in general!
     
  22. pdxflint macrumors 68020

    pdxflint

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    #22
    My Chinese-made Macbook Pro and my Thailand-made Nikon D300 will hold up against anything made anywhere... because the quality control and design come from the companies who designed the products, set up the overseas factory or set the specs for any contract builder. My old Ford Focus was made in Hermosillo, Mexico, and has lasted longer than any Toyota or Honda made in Japan I've ever had. My Japanese built 50mm f/1.8 Nikkor is no better built than the newer Nikkor 50mm f/1.8 lenses made in China... in fact the Chinese built ones are actually smoother in focus operation. I would prefer all my stuff to be made here in the good old USA, but I don't think quality has anything to do with location of manufacture. It has everything to do with the company making the product.
     
  23. ArmCortexA8 thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #23
    I tried your suggestion, Green Mode resulted in 1/50 - 4.0 ISO 200. I switched to Manual, changed the ISO to 200, but cannot find any adjustment AV +/- button either on the camera or in-screen (live view). Additionally, pressing the Q button shows nothing top right of the screen and only shows menus on the left - Live Mode / Single Shooting / Auto (white balance) / Standard / Standard Image Quality / Flash Exposure Compensation
     
  24. mackmgg macrumors 65816

    mackmgg

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    #24
    All of his suggestions are assuming you're using the LCD only for the camera settings. Live view is slightly different. Try using the viewfinder instead. In addition to being faster (no lag), it's a lot easier to hold the camera stable with a viewfinder than the live view. Coming from most digital cameras, you may be used to the screen, but it won't take long to get into the habit of shooting with the viewfinder instead.
     
  25. acearchie, Aug 15, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 15, 2011

    acearchie macrumors 68040

    acearchie

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    #25
    I was assuming you would be shooting not in Live View mode which is suggested if you want to have more control over your images as it can be difficult to check exposure and adjust composition using the Live View mode.

    For my suggestions to work your camera LCD should look like this:

    [​IMG]

    And the AV +/- button is just right of the LCD above the Q button.
     

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