Carrier IQ Logging Software Found on Many Mobile Phones

[kalsta]

It is, it's just not at all what was being discussed, which was my point. Kalsta's comments have nothing to do with the "Freedom" provided by open source …

[blah, blah, blah, more condescending drivel]

Anyway, none of this has anything to do with Open source at all.

So, now you're saying this discussion has nothing to do with open source, but somehow I was still off topic when I didn't limit the scope of my discussion to the 'freedom provided by open source'? Uh huh.

In case you've forgotten, the original comment I responded to began with this statement:

Whilst of course, none of this it's good. Some will see it as a price worth paying for freedom.

Firstly, it's a direct reference to the 'Carrier IQ thing'. Secondly, there's no specific mention of 'open source' software anywhere in his post. It could be interpreted as a general statement regarding the control Apple exerts over the whole product, from hardware, to carrier restrictions, to App Store approvals, etc, and the associated user experience. That's how I took it, and that's how I responded.

Then you and another commenter swept in with comments about apps being available on other platforms before the iPhone—again nothing about open source being discussed here. I clarified the point I was making (the part you seemed to take issue with), that iOS and the App Store brought about a breadth of functional variety (i.e. freedom for users to customise their phones) never before seen on any mobile platform. Then you proceeded to talk about the open source movement and how I don't understand it. And you say I 'deviated way off course'! Whatever.

Having spent some time reading Kalsta's comments carefully, I think his argument makes sense and is quite coherent.

Thanks mate. It's nice to know someone took the time to understand what I was saying.

 

[iEvolution]

Privacy is becoming a concept of the past and technology has become the fore-front of privacy invasion.

Unfortunately there are so many people out there that will just sit and take this kind of behavior.

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You don't need to be a conspiracy theorist to accept that every major tech company - Amazon, Apple, Google, Microsoft, etc - collects information on their users from the devices they distribute. In fact, this is quite obvious in almost every respect.

The fact that this comment got so highly downgraded shows that many here will just take it.

The bigger issue is at what point do we say enough?

 

[vitzr]

I don't usually resort to big letters, but it seems called for this time.

Just because something is written to a debug log...

it does NOT also mean it is being sent outside the device.

(Or even really processed.)

As any developer knows, often debug code is left in that just logs input. It's very likely that is what happened here.

It's not much different than when Apple's developers accidentally set up that location cache to last forever, instead of truncating it.

Such mistakes are what happens when developers are rushed or inexperienced, something that is far too common these days.

As a fellow engineer and computer scientist in a cross platform environment, I thank you for the Huge Letters, which I believe were completely appropriate.

Far too many people jump to conclusions, without any background knowledge, or understanding of the technical workings of their devices.

Cheers...

 

[marksman]

While a nice thought, actually watch some of the videos that clearly show the input data being sent outside the device.

This is not some kind of debug code left on the device. That is silly excuse making and ignorant of the evidence.

 

[faroZ06]

1 more reason not to deal with their junk

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Privacy is becoming a concept of the past and technology has become the fore-front of privacy invasion.

Unfortunately there are so many people out there that will just sit and take this kind of behavior.

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The fact that this comment got so highly downgraded shows that many here will just take it.

The bigger issue is at what point do we say enough?

You have 2 downrates so far. I don't really like datamining (why would I have reason to?), but people completely overreact about it. iOS tracked your locations and stored them locally ! Google tracks searches and locations !

If you don't want them to have your info, don't give them your real info when it asks. Anything they find out by themselves is non-personal information like "locations where there are the most searches". Malware and spyware are going too far, and I think only Microsoft has ever done that publicly.

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Source?

Open (he made it up )

 

[dethmaShine]

Having spent some time reading Kalsta's comments carefully, I think his argument makes sense and is quite coherent. This sort of comment is really unnecessary, slightly insulting and does nothing to further the discussion of the original topic.

This is not an open-source vs iOS issue. The fact that the software is buried so deep in the OS and is difficult to remove without specialist tools and knowledge makes it a serious issue for the vast majority of users - simply because the vast majority of users just don't know and/or don't care about hacking their phone software. i just hope this story gets into the mainstream media, especially in the UK where these issues are rather topical at the moment.

 

[adder7712]

What? Apps for smartphones existed way before the App Store

This got thumbed down?

I'm disappoint.

 

[kdarling]

Is that why the very first thing they tried to do was sue the guy who found it, until EFF intervened?

Not the best handling of the situation IMHO.

I totally agree, which is why I said they don't seem to understand the public.

If they try to stifle any reporting, they look bad. If they say nothing, they look bad. The smartest thing they could do would be to do like Apple with the location cache, and just say it was a programmer mistake that will be corrected. End of story.

(Btw, if you follow my posts, you'll know that I constantly defended Apple's developers from the similar "oh my god the sky is falling" public response in that case.)

Doesn't mean it's not sent either. If Carrier IQ are really clean about this it should be easy enough to prove.

A lot of groups watch Android closely and what goes in/out. It would've been found by now. I also think that Carrier IQ, being innocent, didn't think they had to prove anything. Again, they underestimate the mob mentality.

Can you explain why their Android software needed to receive all those events, including keypresses? Debug or not it seems a bit too much.

It has nothing to do with Android. An app developer for ANY platform, wouldn't even ask the question. When you're debugging, sometimes you turn on a lot of information to help you track down what your app is doing.

In this case, it simply needed to be turned off before going into production. In real life, this mistake happens because either 1) they got rushed, 2) they're too inexperienced to know to do so.

This reminds of all the times that someone claimed that Apple had "the patent on multitouch" and other rubbish. Tech reporting has really gone downhill these days.

Love how all your posts have to include some completely unrelated potshot at Apple.

How on earth did you take a comment about bad tech reporting and turn it into a "potshot at Apple"?