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Chase Launches 'Chase Pay' Payments Service to Compete with Apple Pay

tmiw said:
Apple Pay just uses NFC, which is an open standard. There are no UX standards for though, so retailers do all sorts of things. Like continuing to ask for a signature/PIN. Or require the customer to explicitly say they want to use Apple Pay before the terminal's even turned on. It's not a seamless experience for customers right now.
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Apple Pay doesn't "just use" NFC. The interface is designed by Apple with built-in security. The technology that Apple Pay uses is NFC.

Retailers can require extra steps, like signatures, but it's still the easiest and most safe form of payment when it's turned on and ready. Moving forward most retailers will remove the extra steps, but that will take time and it won't ever be perfect.

My original post said "in five years" and for good reason. If you want to have a discussion about whether Apple Pay is a viable payment option throughout the country in 2015, it isn't. I never said it was. Come back to me in 2020 and we'll see where it stands.
 
bboucher790 said:
Apple Pay doesn't "just use" NFC. The interface is designed by Apple with built-in security. The technology that Apple Pay uses is NFC.

Retailers can require extra steps, like signatures, but it's still the easiest and most safe form of payment when it's turned on and ready.

My original post said "in five years" and for good reason. If you want to have a discussion about whether Apple Pay is a viable payment option throughout the country in 2015, it isn't. I never said it was. Come back to me in 2020 and we'll see where it stands.
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Which would be fair if everyone played the long game, but most companies don't. All they're going to see is that "only" 15% of iPhone owners used Apple Pay at least once (and fewer use it frequently) and conclude that it's not worth the effort or cost. In a few years that might change, but who knows, retailers might end up going with terminals that can't do NFC on their next upgrade cycle.
 
DesterWallaboo said:
I've already told Target's corporate HQ that I'll not be using their stores until they support ApplePay. CurrentC is a joke.
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Then dip your card and sign.

Target's CEO already said he'd love to support Apple Pay and that he'd work on it once chip & pin was done. I'm sure Target is more focused on finishing their chip & pin RED card roll out.
 
tmiw said:
Which would be fair if everyone played the long game, but most companies don't. All they're going to see is that "only" 15% of iPhone owners used Apple Pay at least once (and fewer use it frequently) and conclude that it's not worth the effort or cost.
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Cart before horse. If said retailers would enable NFC on their terminals (and most of the new terminals support it) I'd be using Apple Pay.
 
kds1 said:
Airlines would be better off using NFC and encryption.
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Why?

They already confirm your identity separately. The only other purpose the QR code serves is to say that the passenger named so and so is assigned seat such and such on flight n.
 
tmiw said:
Which would be fair if everyone played the long game, but most companies don't. All they're going to see is that "only" 15% of iPhone owners used Apple Pay at least once (and fewer use it frequently) and conclude that it's not worth the effort or cost. In a few years that might change, but who knows, retailers might end up going with terminals that can't do NFC on their next upgrade cycle.
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I disagree, most large companies will, even if the percentage of people using it initially is small.

CVS and others choose not to support Apple Pay because they are intertwined in CurrentC. Once CurrentC fails, and it will, you'll see a shift towards phone payments being accepted. Even if CurrentC dies a slow death, most major retailers will support Apple Pay within five years time.

Small Businesses using Sqaure or other POS systems can upgrade to support Apple Pay for almost nothing. It costs $40 for a business to add an Apple Pay reader to their pre-existing hardware. Last week I went to a local burger chain here in New York that uses a POS system called Clover and they said they recently upgraded to support NFC payments. It's happening as we speak.

The process is slow, but it's coming. Remember, McDonald's only started accepting credit cards in 2002.
 
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bboucher790 said:
I disagree, most large companies will, even if the percentage of people using it initially is small.

CVS and others choose not to support Apple Pay because they are intertwined in CurrentC. Once CurrentC fails, and it will, you'll see a shift towards phone payments being accepted. Even if CurrentC dies a slow death, most major retailers will support Apple Pay within five years time.

Small Businesses using Sqaure or other POS systems can upgrade to support Apple Pay for almost nothing. It costs $40 for a business to add an Apple Pay reader to their pre-existing hardware. Last week I went to a local burger chain here in New York that uses a POS system called Clover and they said they recently upgraded to support NFC payments. It's happening as we speak.

The process is slow, but it's coming. Remember, McDonald's only started accepting credit cards in 2002.
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If it was just CurrentC retailers doing that, I'd agree. Unfortunately retailers that aren't part of CurrentC are keeping NFC disabled as well. For instance, Kroger and Safeway aren't bothering (the former is turning on EMV now and the latter just has "insert or swipe" on the screen). The thing that I'm wondering about though is why they bothered to get the highest end terminals if they weren't going to use all the features.
 
tmiw said:
If it was just CurrentC retailers doing that, I'd agree. Unfortunately retailers that aren't part of CurrentC are keeping NFC disabled as well. For instance, Kroger and Safeway aren't bothering (the former is turning on EMV now and the latter just has "insert or swipe" on the screen). The thing that I'm wondering about though is why they bothered to get the highest end terminals if they weren't going to use all the features.
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Within a few years the tides will change, that's the point. It's natural for some of the big guns to sit back and wait. It's not just flicking on a switch and you're good. You need to train employees, among other things. Retailers would be stupid to skip on purchasing NFC systems in 2015. Even if you don't launch NFC immediately, you need to be prepared for future roll out.

I worked for Disney and there were lots of things that just "sat there" until it was officially released. It's not abnormal for large companies to delay implementing new technology into their pre-existing systems.
 
tmiw said:
If it was just CurrentC retailers doing that, I'd agree. Unfortunately retailers that aren't part of CurrentC are keeping NFC disabled as well. For instance, Kroger and Safeway aren't bothering (the former is turning on EMV now and the latter just has "insert or swipe" on the screen). The thing that I'm wondering about though is why they bothered to get the highest end terminals if they weren't going to use all the features.
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That's unfortunate about large grocers, but not surprising. They have almost as much to gain from datamining customer habits as Walmart/Target. I'm sure they bought the higher end terminals to future proof in case Apple or Google can be swayed to add loyalty cards to their Wallet apps in a way that allows consumers to opt-in to tracking.
 
Flunkyturtle said:
At present line item detail isn't passed into a payment transaction, the card based systems just simply aren't built to take that. Wallets however CAN get that detail if they want it as it comes from the retailer, it means the wallet can be built with more loyalty stuff in mind, but i don't believe this functionality has been built on any of the wallets yet.

This is my gut feel where things will go in the next 18 months, with a combination of beacons in stores, wallets providing data back to merchants for fraud, marketing etc, while the consumers get's a better experience or discounts or whatever.

People will do all kinds of stuff for a free pen.... Watch this space.

Edit - just to add, the wallets online can get this now, but the wallets in store need to be passed the line item info into the wallet, it could work but again i don't think anyone has built this yet, it would need to work with till systems so it's complex.
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Actually you'd be surprised how far they take current card-based systems as far as investigating who buys what from where... Re-read your CC agreement and you'll find they can share the data they glean from your purchases with anyone who wants to "partner" with them... All the way up to the MC/Visa/AmEx/Disc level and back down the other side to retailers.

The only real difference with MCX members is they kinda/sorta agree to mutually help each other fill in the blanks about purchases made outside of their own company to make a more complete picture of the customer.
 
tasset said:
That's unfortunate about large grocers, but not surprising. They have almost as much to gain from datamining customer habits as Walmart/Target. I'm sure they bought the higher end terminals to future proof in case Apple or Google can be swayed to add loyalty cards to their Wallet apps in a way that allows consumers to opt-in to tracking.
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The worst part about it is that grocers are the single most important category for Apple. For a lot of people, that and gas are the vast majority of spending; if the local Safeway or Kroger doesn't have it, they're going to forget about Apple Pay completely and never bother using it. (Whole Foods and Trader Joe's, while supporting Apple Pay, don't have nearly the reach that Safeway, Kroger and Walmart do.)

Honestly, with all the breaches that have happened, the requirements to have fully integrated payment processing should have been dramatically increased, to the point where it's no longer practical for all but a few to bother. Adoption of NFC and EMV would likely be faster than it currently is had Visa/MC done so.
 
So much hate for Chase right now. Per Tech Crunch: "Chase Pay will allow Chase’s 94 million credit, debit and pre-paid card customers the ability to make in-store, in-app and online purchases, beginning in 2016."; "Chase touts a number of advantages it has over some current mobile payment systems, noting that Chase consumers will be able to use the service on “virtually all” smartphones, and will be able to pay at places where other mobile payments don’t always work – like gas stations and drive-through windows, for example."
 
candle said:
So much hate for Chase right now. Per Tech Crunch: "Chase Pay will allow Chase’s 94 million credit, debit and pre-paid card customers the ability to make in-store, in-app and online purchases, beginning in 2016."; "Chase touts a number of advantages it has over some current mobile payment systems, noting that Chase consumers will be able to use the service on “virtually all” smartphones, and will be able to pay at places where other mobile payments don’t always work – like gas stations and drive-through windows, for example."
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Here is my problem with Chase Pay/CurrentC/QR-based payments: Security. I don't mind Samsung Pay or Android Pay grifting off Apple's goodwill in this case IF their secure element/tokenization works as well; a rising tide floats all boats. But this chintzy QR-based system is likely to be used by those who can least afford the inconvenience of identity theft or dispute charges with Chase- those with lower income. Who else would not move up to an Android or iPhone with more secure payment methods but is technically aware enough to know about and use mobile payments?

And one single mis-hap or hack on their QR-based system will make all the news outlets as: "largest bank in US hacked, mobile phone payment systems declared insecure". I can see the public fright setback the legitimate mobile payment methods years in public trust.
 
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tasset said:
Here is my problem with Chase Pay/CurrentC/QR-based payments: Security. I don't mind Samsung Pay or Android Pay grifting off Apple's goodwill in this case IF their secure element/tokenization works as well; a rising tide floats all boats. But this chintzy QR-based system is likely to be used by those who can least afford the inconvenience of identity theft or dispute charges with Chase- those with lower income. Who else would not move up to an Android or iPhone with more secure payment methods but is technically aware enough to know about and use mobile payments?

And one single mis-hap or hack on their QR-based system will make all the news outlets as: "largest bank in US hacked, mobile phone payment systems declared insecure". I can see the public fright setback the legitimate mobile payment methods years in public trust.
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It's debatable whether Samsung Pay would actually help the other two. Remember, merchants don't even need to do anything to make Samsung Pay work because of the technology underlying it.
 
I'm not sure that ChasePay will really "compete with" Apple Pay (although it will, on some level); it seems designed to compete with CurrentC, which will be a QR code based system that will circumvent credit cards in favor of a more ACH based system (doesn't Walmart hate Visa?). The CurrentC model will hurt Chase, so it makes sense for Chase to have a QR code system that still uses its credit cards. Of course, Chase supports Apple Pay so it still makes money from those customers.
 
Its amazing how quickly people go on the defense when we read the word compete. Chase isn't going away from Apple Pay. its now apart of the DNA. Don't forget they were one of the first major banks to do it. They are not competing with Apple Pay for consumers, they are going the merchants another option, remember Walmart, Target, Sunoco, Kohl's, Best Buy, Rite Aid, CVS, Lowe's, Sears, Shell, Michaels, 7-Eleven don't accept Apple Pay, so its wise for a business to try to pick up some of these large retailers.
 
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dlewis23 said:
As a Chase customer I'm rather annoyed they waste there time with this stuff. Instead of giving people a batter interest rate or improving customer service they waste money on these stupid things no one is going to use.
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Rates are based on credit!
 
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