Chinese Consumer Group Demands Answers From Apple Over Older iPhone Slowdowns

[I7guy]

Yikes. They’re going to lose billions for selling defective phones.

Here’s the proof: degraded iPads are not throttled. Apple released a statement saying it “only applies” to iPhones and that the iPads, regardless of degradation, are not throttled by the “fix”, or, what it really is: the recall workaround.

They got caught. Simple as. Recall every iPhone after the 6 and make this right, Apple! The courts are going to suggest it anyway, once you start losing every lawsuit.
[doublepost=1516098714][/doublepost]

Tim Cook will be fired shortly. I don’t expect him to make it to 2019, if very far into 2019. Consumer backlash hasn’t begun yet, once the media blows up with reports of Apple losing, or settling all of these lawsuits - he’s out.
[doublepost=1516098928][/doublepost]

The United States House of Representatives also want more answers. They want to know what fix is in store other than the software throttling. France government is also involved.

Three different countries GOVERNMENTS are involved now, as well as 34 separate law firms. LMAO!! @ anyone who thinks Tim isn’t being dismissed.

Believe you me when Tim Cook announces $87B in revenue the only place he is going is up. These lawsuits are like a fly buzzing around ones’ head. Nothing more.*

*Obviously no one knows the real outcome and there seems to be a lot of wishful thinking, which almost never seems to come true.

 

[RickInHouston]

I mean. They gave a legitimate explanation. Not sure why people aren’t happy with it - it makes sense and is much preferred to shutdowns.

Do you really think they are telling us everything?

Good Lord!

 

[macTW]

They gave no explanation, and the slowdown was implemented secretly before this all went public. Furthermore, there is one other way to fix this: instead of slowing down users' phones, replace the defective batteries for them. Why are they defective, you ask? As 69Mustang says:

Degration doesn’t cause shutdown. Degration causes lower charge capacity and lower ability to push capacity. So in the uncommon instances the cpu needs to draw more power than is available, the cpu slows to draw less power instead of trying to draw more and shutting down as a result.

People choose to make up whatever they want when they see the headline “Apple slows phones intentionally!” without understanding what is happening, why, or how infrequent it is. Such a placebo effect, “oh my phone is slow 24/7, it must be Apple slowdown”
[doublepost=1516123767][/doublepost]

That was not an explanation. That was a cover up press release. It was very carefully crafted with the help of management and lawyers. The explanation that battery degrades over time is not something new. We all know battery degrades over time. So Apple being Apple just tried to create more smokescreen with that release. The actual explanation should have been that people should upgrade every two years. And apple is trying to. Ake it easy to upgrade by slowing down the phone. That's the truth. We all know it. At this point, I just want to see how long Apple can keep going with this explanation.

So you’re saying the worlds most valuable company is knowingly and clearly engaging in illegal acts that would threaten their entire value...?

Ok. Believe whatever you want. Oh hey, I think I see a unicorn across the street.

 

[xpxp2002]

as IP6 user you would talk differently. This crap just half killed perf. of phones which were COMPLETELY FINE and without any reboots etc. before they introduced this trash. They just more than deserve it.
[doublepost=1516106463][/doublepost]
their explanation is unsatisfactory

Better than have a phone that randomly shuts down during calls anywhere from 0-45%. I had a 6s that did this for months.

You can all complain because it’s something to complain about, but the fix is still far better than the problem you’d all be complaining about if it weren’t addressed.

 

[macTW]

I want to know why my 4S can’t type letters on a screen. It was lightning fast for the first 3 OSes. Then each update made it slower and slower.

Now it’s completely useless.

No one will convince me that this wasn’t done on purpose. No OS optimization for newer phones would cause a perfectly fine device to take 10 seconds per letter to type. My old VIC 20 from 1980 can type letters on a screen with no lag.

Purposeful slowing of older devices has been happening long before this particular issue.

Yes. A phone with 1/2 GB RAM running software designed for 3 GB RAM devices running slowly must be intentionally slowed. Apple must knowingly be risking their entire company’s value by knowingly engaging in illegal 24/7 slowing down of phones. Even though the battery degradation and cpu throttling is infrequent and at peak cpu draw times only.

 

[neutralguy]

Degration doesn’t cause shutdown. Degration causes lower charge capacity and lower ability to push capacity. So in the uncommon instances the cpu needs to draw more power than is available, the cpu slows to draw less power instead of trying to draw more and shutting down as a result.

People choose to make up whatever they want when they see the headline “Apple slows phones intentionally!” without understanding what is happening, why, or how infrequent it is. Such a placebo effect, “oh my phone is slow 24/7, it must be Apple slowdown”
[doublepost=1516123767][/doublepost]
So you’re saying the worlds most valuable company is knowingly and clearly engaging in illegal acts that would threaten their entire value...?

Ok. Believe whatever you want. Oh hey, I think I see a unicorn across the street.

I think you forgot about 2007-2008 Financial Market crash. How many valuable and famous companies were engaged in illegal/immoral acts? What about Wells Fargo and the fake accounts scandal? Will you call Wells Fargo a valuable and reputable company? Every company tries to push the boundaries until they are caught. After all, they want to grow their bottom line every possible way.

 

[SchmeeX]

Do they have difficulty reading? Apple have already done this.

Apple should just copy and paste their last statement on the matter.

O

Degration doesn’t cause shutdown. Degration causes lower charge capacity and lower ability to push capacity. So in the uncommon instances the cpu needs to draw more power than is available, the cpu slows to draw less power instead of trying to draw more and shutting down as a result.

People choose to make up whatever they want when they see the headline “Apple slows phones intentionally!” without understanding what is happening, why, or how infrequent it is. Such a placebo effect, “oh my phone is slow 24/7, it must be Apple slowdown”
[doublepost=1516123767][/doublepost]
So you’re saying the worlds most valuable company is knowingly and clearly engaging in illegal acts that would threaten their entire value...?

Ok. Believe whatever you want. Oh hey, I think I see a unicorn across the street. smh.

The people on this forum just have no clue what they’re talking about. I think the only wronging *may* have been Apple’s forwardness on the subject, but really it’s a grey area. It’s another case of something highly sophisticated, but when consumers come across it they all become engineers and decide what is best without any technical knowledge. iPhone’s are small, and over time can’t handle peak power loads with degraded batteries and incredibly upgraded and sophisticated operating systems. Now, everyone with a slow phone just assumes it’s the battery and then comes to the conclusion, like someone above, that it’s something bigger because “when his phone is charging it’s still slow”. Well you dingus it’s obviously not the battery then and there’s x amount of other reasons your phone may be slow.

You would not believe the amount of people going into Apple Store’s right now, assuming their phone is slow because Apple wants them to buy a new phone but they “know it’s the battery because they saw it on the news.” I can only hope the next generation of consumers is smarter than this, but again we will have more complex systems and the circle continues. I used to get pretty pissed off with people’s incompetence and lack of knowledge, but it’s just built in to half these people and there’s no changing it.

 

[tzm41]

Degration doesn’t cause shutdown. Degration causes lower charge capacity and lower ability to push capacity. So in the uncommon instances the cpu needs to draw more power than is available, the cpu slows to draw less power instead of trying to draw more and shutting down as a result.

People choose to make up whatever they want when they see the headline “Apple slows phones intentionally!” without understanding what is happening, why, or how infrequent it is. Such a placebo effect, “oh my phone is slow 24/7, it must be Apple slowdown”
[doublepost=1516123767][/doublepost]
So you’re saying the worlds most valuable company is knowingly and clearly engaging in illegal acts that would threaten their entire value...?

Ok. Believe whatever you want. Oh hey, I think I see a unicorn across the street.

I think you are missing the point here. People are much more angry at the counter-transparency attitude they have had than the fact that batteries do degrade.

What percentage of other smartphones on the market, including those flagship Android phones, have implemented a slow down to prevent a shutdown that is otherwise inevitable, after as short as a year? If their batteries are up to par with industry best practices, why would they degrade so fast that Apple needs to implement a slow down? When the battery degrade to a certain level it might indeed lose the ability to output the max voltage it is designed to. If that's the case, Apple needs to be transparent. When slowing down the phone is not the only remedy, why wouldn't Apple provide battery replacement service to affected customers before this was exposed? If a model of car's speed is slow down after two years of purchase because of an aged gas tank, I bet you the manufacturer is going to be replacing people's tanks, maybe charging a fee.

 

[macTW]

I think you are missing the point here. People are much more angry at the counter-transparency attitude they have had than the fact that batteries do degrade.

What percentage of other smartphones on the market, including those flagship Android phones, have implemented a slow down to prevent a shutdown that is otherwise inevitable, after as short as a year? If their batteries are up to par with industry best practices, why would they degrade so fast that Apple needs to implement a slow down? When the battery degrade to a certain level it might indeed lose the ability to output the max voltage it is designed to. If that's the case, Apple needs to be transparent. When slowing down the phone is not the only remedy, why wouldn't Apple provide battery replacement service to affected customers before this was exposed? If a model of car's speed is slow down after two years of purchase because of an aged gas tank, I bet you the manufacturer is going to be replacing people's tanks, maybe charging a fee.

Re the first paragraph: and I’m ok with that. If they’re upset purely at the lack of transparency, they have every right to be. But many forum members here are upset that their phones are “slow 24/7” and blame that on this debacle. That’s the idiocy of this debate.

Apple does provide battery replacements, and now provides them cheaper. They missed the mark by allowing batteries with >80% degradation to be replaced, as every placebo-ed user who thinks the 24/7 “slow” is this will take batteries from those who need them.

As for android phones... you’re lucky if you’re getting any sort of software updates after a year

 

[kdarling]

Yes. A phone with 1/2 GB RAM running software designed for 3 GB RAM devices running slowly must be intentionally slowed.

Saying that Apple deliberately sends older devices OS updates, which slow them down because of less RAM, is not very helpful in their "intentional slowing" defense

Apple must knowingly be risking their entire company’s value by knowingly engaging in illegal 24/7 slowing down of phones. Even though the battery degradation and cpu throttling is infrequent and at peak cpu draw times only.

Well, that's one of the unknown points. Is it infrequent? A lot of users think not.

Still haven't seen a definitive test where out there yet. Has there been one?

 

[Bawstun]

Saying that Apple deliberately sends older devices OS updates, which slow them down because of less RAM, is not very helpful in their "intentional slowing" defense



Well, that's one of the unknown points. Is it infrequent? A lot of users think not.

Still haven't seen a definitive test where out there yet. Has there been one?

Well there was the whole “certain 6S serial numbers” recall and then they extended it to all 6S’s I believe, so they knew something was wrong. Why else not limit it to just the 6S models, but also extend it all all future ones as well?

And if degradation has anything to do with it, why did they specifically say it didn’t effect iPads? Regardless of their battery’s wear or cycles?

 

[aylk]

Apple must knowingly be risking their entire company’s value by knowingly engaging in illegal 24/7 slowing down of phones. Even though the battery degradation and cpu throttling is infrequent and at peak cpu draw times only.

In my experience, if your battery is below 60% the slow down is permanent. Even when plugged in.

 

[Michael Goff]

I disagree. No one was questioning whether batteries degrade over time. That's a known fact. Also a known fact is that degradation doesn't normally cause sudden shutdown. More importantly, Apple's battery management algorithms are about mitigating that sudden shutdown, not simple battery degradation. So a simple disclaimer would have done nothing. Too many people are pointing to general battery degradation as the genesis of the problem. That ain't true at all.


I 100% agree. When you tell a customer, if your battery doesn't fail our test you may as well put your money back in your pocket... to paraphrase Jobs, you're doing it wrong.

Except for the fact that it can. As batteries age, they’re not able to put out as much power. If the processor asks for more power than the battery can provide, it will shut down. This can also happen when it’s extremely cold.

I’m not talking milliamperes, I’m talking about voltage.

 

[69Mustang]

Except for the fact that it can. As batteries age, they’re not able to put out as much power. If the processor asks for more power than the battery can provide, it will shut down. This can also happen when it’s extremely cold.

I’m not talking milliamperes, I’m talking about voltage.

Nowhere in my quote do I say that battery degradation can't cause a shutdown - especially not in he portion you bolded. I'm really not sure where you think you and I have disagreement.

 

[44267547]

Nowhere in my quote do I say that battery degradation can't cause a shutdown - especially not in he portion you bolded. I'm really not sure where you think you and I have disagreement.

To be fair, I think your statement might be misconstrued (Or is not worded appropriately) by others when you stated "Also known fact that is Degradation doesn't normally causes sudden shut down." @Michael Goff is saying when batteries become older, they depreciate in power exerted, thus resulting it can power off if the processor is requiring more power That the battery cannot supply. It could be some general confusion based on your Post.

 

[Michael Goff]

Nowhere in my quote do I say that battery degradation can't cause a shutdown - especially not in he portion you bolded. I'm really not sure where you think you and I have disagreement.

To be fair, I think your statement might be misconstrued (Or is not worded appropriately) by others when you stated "Also known fact that is Degradation doesn't normally causes sudden shut down." @Michael Goff is saying when batteries become older, they depreciate in power exerted, thus resulting it can power off if the processor is requiring more power That the battery cannot supply. It could be some general confusion based on your Post.

Thank you for giving me the quickest way of helping me out. Guess I misunderstood.

 

[69Mustang]

To be fair, I think your statement might be misconstrued (Or is not worded appropriately) by others when you stated "Also known fact that is Degradation doesn't normally causes sudden shut down."

Misconstrued. It's worded entirely appropriately. You capitalized the D in degradation when it would have been more appropriate to capitalize the N in normally. We all understand batteries degrade. No one is arguing that. Sudden shutdown is abnormal behavior. Sudden shutdown is what Apple's algorithm is designed to mitigate, not battery degradation. So a disclaimer that says batteries degrade over time would be useless, contrary to the recommendation of the post that I replied to originally.

@Michael Goff is agreeing with what I said. That's why I said he and I have no disagreement.