Closest thing to a MacBook Pro 17?

[MacBook17]

Hello to the MBP Board! Initially, I was brought here by research on a [apparently well known] GPU issue that's just started affecting our early-2011 MBP 17. Needless to say, nearly a decade of service from any small computer device is pretty respectable, but, nevertheless, time marches on, especially in the computer hardware world, so I'm forced (more or less) to research our replacement options.

Although the 2011 MBPs seem to be a bit cursed in the video arena, I have to say that the non-glare 17" display and the replaceable components on this machine have certain advantages over what I've heard about the newer MBPs. I'm resisting getting into too much detail form the start, but what are your thoughts on the thread's title? In other words, what's the closest thing out there in Apple world to what I'm typing on right now?

Not to put too fine a point on it, but this machine came with a few options that waeren't exactly cheap, at least at the time, so I'd like to at least stay up to its specs, which are as follows:

MacBookPro 8,3 (17" Non-Glare Display)

> 2.3 GHz Intel 4-Core I7 CPU

> L2 Cache (per core): 256KB

> L3 Cache: 8 MB

> 16 GB 1600 MHz DDR3 RAM

> 750GB SATA HDD

I realize that some of these spec's are probably laughable by some of today's standards, but I assure you that this was a pretty good machine back in 2011 and, as I already stated, it still serves us fairly well (intermittent GPU issues notwithstanding).

Thank you very kindly for your time and your thoughts and any helpful recommendations you might offer us ~ MacBook17

 

[glenthompson]

If you don’t need to use an external monitor you can disable the GPU and just run off the integrated GPU. I did that to my late 2011.

Any current Mac will run circles around your 17” except for screen real estate. The 16” comes close but is only available with Intel processors. If you want a M1 processor you will be limited to a 13” screen. Bigger screens probably coming later this year.

 

[MacBook17]

Glen..... Thank you kindly for the reply. I wasn't really trying to make a case for our old MBP 17 competing with a new MBP. Instead, I was trying to describe the bare minimum features that we want with a new machine. We went to the regional Apple Store earlier this year and I was surprised to find that the MBP 16 didn't come standard with features like more RAM and a larger HDD. In fact, as I recall, you had to pay a premium to get more than we have in our old machine.

As for modifying the MBP 17 that I'm typing on right now, I'm not having any luck getting any feedback on the latest fix for the GPU issue. This issue has been around for quite some time now and, given what people paid for the MBP 15s and MBP 17s, there's been a lot of discussion over the past few years about this. As I don't get much time for internet research, I'd like to know what the latest options are for an early-2011 GPU fix. Can you give me a pointer?

 

[leman]

The current machine in Apple lineup that fills the same niche as your 17” is the 16” MacBook Pro. There is not much more to say, really. Computing has changed a bit since 2011, and if your priority is having an upgradeable laptop with a large screen, you probably won’t be happy with anything Apple has to offer. In terms of specs, any current Apple laptop will outclass your 17” in every way conceivable. If you just need it for home use and can live with a smaller screen, why not get a new M1 MacBook Air?

 

[leman]

Glen..... Thank you kindly for the reply. I wasn't really trying to make a case for our old MBP 17 competing with a new MBP. Instead, I was trying to describe the bare minimum features that we want with a new machine. We went to the regional Apple Store earlier this year and I was surprised to find that the MBP 16 didn't come standard with features like more RAM and a larger HDD. In fact, as I recall, you had to pay a premium to get more than we have in our old machine.

Because the new machines use more expensive SSDs which are significantly faster than a HDD (and by significantly I mean 30x or so).

 

[nicho]

We went to the regional Apple Store earlier this year and I was surprised to find that the MBP 16 didn't come standard with features like more RAM and a larger HDD.

Quantity vs quality. The RAM and storage (SSD, no longer a HD) are lightyears ahead of those in your 17" MBP in terms of performance.

 

[ssmed]

If you are brave wait until the summer for an M'X' - likely 16", if you are not just buy the current intel 16". Almost everything out there is going to please you - the question is whether you regret not moving to Silicon if you buy the current machine. The modern 13" (soon to be 14"?) is a portable practical size with good graphics so don't think that a smaller screen will be a problem.

The M1 machines are good, but not perfect - for instance RAID disks can be somewhat fickle depending on the manufacturer of the disk and 2 ports is a pain in some circumstances, so I would wait if you want to go that route.

 

[thejadedmonkey]

I second ssmed. Wait for the 16" Macbook Pro with an M1 (or whatever Apple chip they use) processor.

 

[hallux]

I was surprised to find that the MBP 16 didn't come standard with features like more RAM and a larger HDD. In fact, as I recall, you had to pay a premium to get more than we have in our old machine.

16GB in your 2011 was an upgrade. 16GB in the 16" is the base. RAM can be managed much more effectively these days, and RAM needs are not really a standard progression upwards as some might lead people to believe.

As for the storage - yes, the standard offering might be small when you consider the sizes of some drives out there but also consider that Apple would rather that you store your stuff in iCloud (which was not around in 2011) so you can have access to it on your iPhone and iPad. Of course, that also means they get to charge you monthly or annually for that storage.

 

[Fishrrman]

OP:

If you can keep the old MBP 17" going just a little longer -- till mid summer -- the new MBP 16" with the m1x CPU will be out. These are going to be VERY nice.

It will probably be worth the wait.

Yet then again, the old saying still applies:
If you NEED now, then BUY now.
I'd be looking at the current MPB 16"...

 

[glenthompson]

As for modifying the MBP 17 that I'm typing on right now, I'm not having any luck getting any feedback on the latest fix for the GPU issue. This issue has been around for quite some time now and, given what people paid for the MBP 15s and MBP 17s, there's been a lot of discussion over the past few years about this. As I don't get much time for internet research, I'd like to know what the latest options are for an early-2011 GPU fix. Can you give me a pointer?

When mine flaked out last year I used Real Mac Mods to perform the fix. They provide instructions but I didn't feel like trying the hardware mod myself so sent it off to them. Went well except for problems with USPS returning the MBP to me. Took over 45 days to get from Philadelphia to Virginia via Priority Mail. I picked up a used 2015 MacBook Air which I've been using for the past 9 months. Not a whole lot of performance difference for my use case.

 

[JMVB]

If you don’t need to use an external monitor you can disable the GPU and just run off the integrated GPU. I did that to my late 2011.

Any current Mac will run circles around your 17” except for screen real estate. The 16” comes close but is only available with Intel processors. If you want a M1 processor you will be limited to a 13” screen. Bigger screens probably coming later this year.

And if you need an external monitor, there is also a solution with usb 3.0 - hdmi displaylink adaptor (yes, i know that 2011 model have 2.0, but it works very good)

 

[MacBook17]

JMVB..... I've been trying to figure to how to get in touch with you. Why? Because you posted to a thread started by dosdude1 in which you indicated that there's a permanent fix for the 2011 MBP GPU issue that doesn't involve "micro" soldering stations or other hardware changes. Is that correct?

Regardless, if you know of the best way to handle the GPU problem that our early-2011 (version 8.3) MBP 17 is presently suffering with, please write back with the best option.

Between work and health issues, I don't have time to read through 100s of pages of forum posts trying to figure out what the latest fix is, so your advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you for your post and your consideration ~ MacBook17

 

[MacBook17]

16GB in your 2011 was an upgrade. 16GB in the 16" is the base. RAM can be managed much more effectively these days, and RAM needs are not really a standard progression upwards as some might lead people to believe.

As for the storage - yes, the standard offering might be small when you consider the sizes of some drives out there but also consider that Apple would rather that you store your stuff in iCloud (which was not around in 2011) so you can have access to it on your iPhone and iPad. Of course, that also means they get to charge you monthly or annually for that storage.

I couldn't agree more, hallux. I clearly see the strategy behind the employment of smaller SSDs...subscription $$$. They probably got it from Microshaft, but I suppose hooking people to a regular dollar extraction has become all the rage in our video-driven world.

When you think about it, though, it's all about what you, as an individual, prefer. We use our [presently sick] MBP 17 to run a small business and, quite frankly, we've been able to open this machine up and "do things" to it without any real issues. As I understand it, you cannot do the same thing with a new MBP, so there's one downside to going with new. The other thing that this machine has over the newer retina-display-based MBPs is its non-glare 17" screen. When we had to send this machine back to Apple for warranty service, twice, we had 15" MBPs here as temporary replacements. Both of these units had retina displays and, quite frankly, I'd take the big non-glare display over the 15" retinas.

Having written that, I have not worked with the new MBP 16, so I can't really compare that to what we have fairly. Based on what I'm reading here, however, the new MBP 16 would probably be the closest thing to what we have, which, overall, we've been pretty satisfied with...

...so the next question for the MBP forum board is: What is the latest permanent fix for an early-2011 MBP 17?

As ever, thank you for your time and your kind consideration ~ MacBook17

 

[mbp17forever]

. Can you give me a pointer?

Disable MacBook Pro Dedicated GPU

Not permanent but it works. And if it breaks you can re-apply it

I understand what you say about screen real estate, if you use a 17" for so many years it's not easy to go back to smaller screens.

IMO, with an SSD / 16GB ram / Catalina Patcher on your model you get a machine that runs like new (except of video editing tasks)

Of course you can wait like most of us for a M1 16", or a 18" one someday

 

[profcutter]

Are you carrying your MBP around with you? If you’re more or less tied to one location, how about an iMac, or a Mac mini with an external anti-glare display? That could be a solution. The 2019 iMacs were still relatively serviceable, and plenty fast for Intel machines. You couldn’t change out the GPU, but you could replace the SSD, replace RAM, and even swap out CPUs.

 

[MacBook17]

Disable MacBook Pro Dedicated GPU

Not permanent but it works. And if it breaks you can re-apply it

I understand what you say about screen real estate, if you use a 17" for so many years it's not easy to go back to smaller screens.

IMO, with an SSD / 16GB ram / Catalina Patcher on your model you get a machine that runs like new (except of video editing tasks)

Of course you can wait like most of us for a M1 16", or a 18" one someday

Man, thanks for the very nice reply, MBP17Forever. As you definitely get why someone would like to stick with an MBP 17, I want to ask you what the downside of losing the AMD GPU is? Does one lose the ability to use an external monitor? Does one lose the ability to control screen brightness?

Your user name also seems to indicate a love for improving the MBP 17, as well. Assuming that the loss of the AMD GPU doesn't come with too many downsides, I love the idea of adding an SSD and a better version of OS X (we're presently at El Capitan 10.11.6). We already have 16 GB of RAM, but can the main board in the early-2011 MPBs support modern/improved RAM boards? Regardless, I'd love to overcome the GPU issue and improve the machine we have.

Thanks again. I look forward to reading your responses. ~ MacBook17

 

[MacBook17]

Are you carrying your MBP around with you? If you’re more or less tied to one location, how about an iMac, or a Mac mini with an external anti-glare display? That could be a solution. The 2019 iMacs were still relatively serviceable, and plenty fast for Intel machines. You couldn’t change out the GPU, but you could replace the SSD, replace RAM, and even swap out CPUs.

ProfCutter..... No, the MBP 17 I'm writing to you on stays anchored to a desk and its [second] MagSafe adapter at all times. As I've grown quite accustomed to this MBP 17, I wasn't even aware of the machines you mentioned.

I've never used this machine for gaming, so the native GPU in an iMac should be fine for our purposes. Can you purchase a 2019 iMac with a large anti-glare display? I definitely like what you wrote about the 2019 iMacs being user upgradable. I mean, wow, the ability to upgrade the CPU, for instance, reminds me of the grand old DIY PC days of the 90s!

By the way...what is all of this that I'm reading about Intel being inferior? I'm aware that Apple has decided to move into manufacturing their own chipsets and CPUs, but are they really going to be so superior to Intel's stuff?

 

[profcutter]

I believe the anti-glare display on the iMac became available in 2020. Those machines are very much like the earlier ones, except that the SSD cannot be upgraded, it’s soldered to the board. So it’s a choice between a more upgradable machine and an anti-glare display.

It’s nothing inherent in Intel, really, but they’ve stagnated for several years. They’ve sat on their laurels while AMD and others have caught up. Apple, it appears, has grown tired of Intel failing to update their architecture, this explains some of the problems with MacBook pros 2016-2019. Apple made their designs slimmer, for whatever reason, and the Intel chips ran too hot to get full performance in those designs.

Apple has plenty of experience developing their own chips for iPhones, etc., so they’ve started developing their own chips for Macs. The M1, for software that is designed for that chip, has impressive performance. It’s built on a more modern architecture than Intel has been able to achieve, with much greater performance in the memory and storage systems than the comparable intel chips. The M1 also runs much much cooler, and with much less of a power demand. For your work, an M1 mini might be the right choice, you can then choose your monitor to go with it. The M1 machines are the smallest, least powerful of the new apple-designed chips, but the more powerful machines aren’t due until later this year at the earliest.

An M1 Mini will far outperform your MacBook Pro 17 in every possible measure, including graphics performance. The main challenges will be: does your software run well on the new chips, and if your peripherals will work with the limited ports available on the mini. If the answer is no to either of these, it may be worth waiting for the next round of machines if your MacBook Pro will last you long enough.

 

[profcutter]

I should add, I have a 2017 iMac that my university bought for me. It is a great machine, it runs well, it’s not shockingly fast, but does all I ask it to do. I also have a 2015 MacBook Pro, but it’s frustrating to use with all the fans running constantly, and it‘s definitely showing its age. The screen on the iMac is really impressive, it’s a pleasure to use. If I was going to continue to work from home, I’d just get another iMac, but since I have a long commute for my University, I’ll probably get a MacBook Pro 16 when that’s released with the new apple chips. To hold me over, I’ve been using an iPad pro with keyboard and pencil, it’s surprisingly useful, but when you run into its limitations you remember why you have a Mac in the first place.

 

[leman]

ProfCutter..... No, the MBP 17 I'm writing to you on stays anchored to a desk and its [second] MagSafe adapter at all times. As I've grown quite accustomed to this MBP 17, I wasn't even aware of the machines you mentioned.

I've never used this machine for gaming, so the native GPU in an iMac should be fine for our purposes. Can you purchase a 2019 iMac with a large anti-glare display? I definitely like what you wrote about the 2019 iMacs being user upgradable. I mean, wow, the ability to upgrade the CPU, for instance, reminds me of the grand old DIY PC days of the 90s!

By the way...what is all of this that I'm reading about Intel being inferior? I'm aware that Apple has decided to move into manufacturing their own chipsets and CPUs, but are they really going to be so superior to Intel's stuff?

My recommendation: get an M1 Mac Mini abs a display of your choice. It’s affordable, allows you to get exactly the screen you want, it’s “future proof” (as Apple software infrastructure will only improve at this point) and it will have all the performance you might need.

 

[Fishrrman]

OP asked:
"...so the next question for the MBP forum board is: What is the latest permanent fix for an early-2011 MBP 17?"

Fishrrman's answer:
Buy a replacement Mac.
(this is not meant to be a facetious reply. It is entirely serious)

 

[leman]

OP asked:
"...so the next question for the MBP forum board is: What is the latest permanent fix for an early-2011 MBP 17?"

Fishrrman's answer:
Buy a replacement Mac.
(this is not meant to be a facetious reply. It is entirely serious)

Second this. There is little point in throwing more money at a 10 year old computer. It has rendered good service, let it retire honorably (just joking, recycle it — it is a tool that has outlived it's usefulness).

 

[McScooby]

Having had 3 logic board replacements on my 2011 17" MBP I know that these things are ticking timebombs with the GPU.
I'd personally hold off for the M1 upgraded version, you'll be left wondering where the computer fans have gone after being so used to them for so many years, but not in a bad way.

 

[mbp17forever]

Man, thanks for the very nice reply, MBP17Forever. As you definitely get why someone would like to stick with an MBP 17, I want to ask you what the downside of losing the AMD GPU is? Does one lose the ability to use an external monitor? Does one lose the ability to control screen brightness?

Your user name also seems to indicate a love for improving the MBP 17, as well. Assuming that the loss of the AMD GPU doesn't come with too many downsides, I love the idea of adding an SSD and a better version of OS X (we're presently at El Capitan 10.11.6). We already have 16 GB of RAM, but can the main board in the early-2011 MPBs support modern/improved RAM boards? Regardless, I'd love to overcome the GPU issue and improve the machine we have.

Thanks again. I look forward to reading your responses. ~ MacBook17

Well, since my AMD GPU finally failed last summer, the real and only downside when using dosdude1 software solution is the losing of external monitor through Thunderbolt port. But I think we can use a suitable USB to HDMI cable to get external monitor through one of our 3 USB ports (haven't tried it yet but i will very soon).

Regarding screen brightness and sleep mode problems, from my experience these occur only on High Sierra. I tried both El Capitan and Yosemite and controls work ok, sleep mode too. Catalina Patcher also works perfect with brightness control and sleep mode.

As i explained in another topic,when your dGPU fails, and you apply dosdude1 software solution, the best setup is to have two partitions on your SSD, and dual boot. I upgraded my machine with a Toshiba 480GB SSD and 16gb(2x8) crucial ram at 1600 MHz, so I use Catalina on my main partition and have Yosemite as a secondary OS (Yosemite is faster -boot time less than 10 seconds!- and you can use legacy software). Don't forget to install Mac Fans Control (or any other fans app) with some strict settings to keep the temperatures on your system below 60-70 C)