Consumer Reports Says Apple Pay Cash is the Best P2P Mobile Payments Service

[69Mustang]

That sounds like a good technical argument that I can’t counter! I just know that I’ve read in multiple places that the wireless/radio connection to the card slots is less stable, has less range and is less secure than NFC. Tokenization being separate issue.

I read this in a Mashable article, and I’ve read a handful of other articles that have said similar things. I don’t know the science and engineering well enough to draw my own conclusions, so I rely on what I read and hope that it’s not hype or spin...

“Tod Beardsley, engineering manager at security firm Rapid7, told Mashable that Samsung's use of "extremely legacy technology" is not a good thing. We should be moving away from this technology, not repurposing it.

"Don't get me wrong, I love old tech," Beardsley said. "Most hackers do. But pretty much anything that extends the practical usage life of magstripes is going to be hugely suspect."

Do me a favor. Go back and read that article. A couple of things should immediately jump out at you. 1. You're relying on an article that is over 3 years old. Wouldn't it be a bit more prudent to use something more recent? 2. That quote from Beardsley... appears with no context nor any reference to the fact that a. MST is tokenized and contains no personal information and b. is not legacy magstripe tech, but a variation that uses the underlying principles to communicate with legacy tech.

Based on the quote, it doesn't even seem as if Beardsley understands what MST is. He's criticizing terminal magstripe tech that is used to read your actual info on your actual credit card. That's not what MST is or does.

 

[Beck Show]

I’m not a fan of Venmo for a few reasons. Number one being that their customer service told me that after you delete a card or bank account from your profile, they continue to have it saved in their system for “security reasons” for an indeterminate amount of time. The same is true if you deactivate your account. Also, Apple Pay Cash and the Square app are the only services that allow you to add cash to yourself, which can be convenient. For those reasons and the greater security, I stick to APC.

 

[69Mustang]

I'm currently using a Gear S3 and it's definitely not as good of an experience as Apple Pay, despite being usable "everywhere". For one thing, "everywhere" is in quotes because that hasn't been the case for me; I've had failures nearly every time I've attempted to use it with smaller terminals (such as the Ingenico iPP series or Verifone VX820) as they'd get confused seeing both NFC and MST being read. And I'm not even getting into the many places that have terminals that aren't customer accessible, which no mobile wallet will help with.

Additionally, there are extra steps involved in getting the payment process started with Samsung Pay. Unlike with the Apple Watch where you can just double-tap the side button and hover it over the terminal, you have to tap the Pay button on the card you want to use. I get that this is probably needed because of MST, but still, I'd be okay with an option in the settings for Apple Watch like behavior with the understanding that you'd only be able to use NFC (at least without the extra interaction).

My quote isn't framed in the context of "which is better". My quote was about clearing up misinformation about MST. Whether Apple's or Samsung's Pay implementation is better, is immaterial to the discussion point.

 

[Broken Hope]

Come on apple UK. Need it now.

Just use PayM, instant and pays directly into the persons bank account.

 

[iGeek2014]

Just use PayM, instant and pays directly into the persons bank account.

Indeed it does but I’ll be honest I’ve never used it although I’m sure there are plenty who have done so.

Think Apple Pay Cash would be easier for those who have a few friends/colleagues etc that own iDevices which support the feature?

 

[tmiw]

My quote isn't framed in the context of "which is better". My quote was about clearing up misinformation about MST. Whether Apple's or Samsung's Pay implementation is better, is immaterial to the discussion point.

While MST is a thing that Apple Pay does not have and you're correct for mentioning it, my point was more that having it doesn't necessarily translate to better acceptance. Depending on the person and where they spend their money, it very well could end up being that Samsung Pay is effectively no different than Apple Pay in that regard. Heck, more places accept NFC now than a couple years ago, so IMO the advantage isn't as good as it used to be. YMMV, of course.

(On that note, note that Samsung Pay is NFC only in some countries even if the MST hardware exists in the device. For those people, there's effectively no difference.)

 

[69Mustang]

While MST is a thing that Apple Pay does not have and you're correct for mentioning it, my point was more that having it doesn't necessarily translate to better acceptance. Depending on the person and where they spend their money, it very well could end up being that Samsung Pay is effectively no different than Apple Pay in that regard. Heck, more places accept NFC now than a couple years ago, so IMO the advantage isn't as good as it used to be. YMMV, of course.

(On that note, note that Samsung Pay is NFC only in some countries even if the MST hardware exists in the device. For those people, there's effectively no difference.)

Again, not really sure where you're going here. MST doesn't work in countries that don't have MST hardware... uh, okay I guess. Diesel doesn't work in a gasoline engine. It's really not a measuring contest. Just clearing up earlier misconceptions.

 

[DeepIn2U]

Consumer reports saying something ‘positive’ about Apple an Apple Pay? That’s astonishing. Apple Pay is convenient enoughfor me where I don’t need my debit card all the time and is supported heavily in my area.

Likewise.

Unfortunately here in Canada I have to work with auto deposit via eTransfer between my son, mother, sister and myself.

 

[tmiw]

Again, not really sure where you're going here. MST doesn't work in countries that don't have MST hardware... uh, okay I guess. Diesel doesn't work in a gasoline engine. It's really not a measuring contest. Just clearing up earlier misconceptions.

Most terminals overseas still have magstripe readers, even if they're taped over or otherwise not commonly used.

Anyway, carry on.

 

[DeepIn2U]

Cash App > Apple Pay (P2P) service hands down. Cash app is straight to the point. Venmo has too much nonsensical BS, I don’t care to know that Anne sent Alex money for the movies. Apple Pay (P2P) is one sided. Don’t trust Facebook. Never used the Zelle standalone app but Zella is tied into my banks apps so transferring is easy.

Curious if a device is using your bank, and most banks are part of eTransfer, what’s the point in using a third party service?

 

[sidewinder3000]

Do me a favor. Go back and read that article. A couple of things should immediately jump out at you. 1. You're relying on an article that is over 3 years old. Wouldn't it be a bit more prudent to use something more recent? 2. That quote from Beardsley... appears with no context nor any reference to the fact that a. MST is tokenized and contains no personal information and b. is not legacy magstripe tech, but a variation that uses the underlying principles to communicate with legacy tech.

Based on the quote, it doesn't even seem as if Beardsley understands what MST is. He's criticizing terminal magstripe tech that is used to read your actual info on your actual credit card. That's not what MST is or does.

I’m not relying on a three-year-old article, I read it, and several other articles, three years ago. I remember the time that several articles give the impression that it was not as secure. Haven’t really been compelled to read any more about it since because it doesn’t really matter to me that much or effect my experience. More and more companies keep converting to Apple Pay terminals, which makes playing with my phone more and more convenient. Even the hold outs like Best Buy and CVS are finally coming on board. But looking at it the article again, it does appear like he is shooting from the hip a bit. As often happens with the tech press, they write about things right when they come out, but rarely follow up with real world test once something has been out for a few months. The sites that do revisit the reviews I always find to be a little more reliable.

It’s entirely possible that the underlying technology behind the strip is as secure as NFC, though that does seem counterintuitive. Somehow, if it truly is as secure, then I am curious why Apple wouldn’t use it, since that would help Apple Pay be accepted in more places.

It may have to do with the user experience, which appears to be a bit more finicky when using that strip. I rarely ever see anyone using Samsung Pay out in the wild, so that observation is very anecdotal, but the few times that I have been behind people in line who are using it, it has resulted in delays because people don’t use it right. Apparently there is a right way and a wrong way to do it, but I have no idea what that is because I’ve never used it.

 

[69Mustang]

I’m not relying on a three-year-old article, I read it, and several other articles, three years ago. I remember the time that several articles give the impression that it was not as secure. Haven’t really been compelled to read any more about it since because it doesn’t really matter to me that much or effect my experience. More and more companies keep converting to Apple Pay terminals, which makes playing with my phone more and more convenient. Even the hold outs like Best Buy and CVS are finally coming on board. But looking at it the article again, it does appear like he is shooting from the hip a bit. As often happens with the tech press, they write about things right when they come out, but rarely follow up with real world test once something has been out for a few months. The sites that do revisit the reviews I always find to be a little more reliable.

It’s entirely possible that the underlying technology behind the strip is as secure as NFC, though that does seem counterintuitive. Somehow, if it truly is as secure, then I am curious why Apple wouldn’t use it, since that would help Apple Pay be accepted in more places.

It may have to do with the user experience, which appears to be a bit more finicky when using that strip. I rarely ever see anyone using Samsung Pay out in the wild, so that observation is very anecdotal, but the few times that I have been behind people in line who are using it, it has resulted in delays because people don’t use it right. Apparently there is a right way and a wrong way to do it, but I have no idea what that is because I’ve never used it.

First, understand that I'm not trying to tell you what to do. Just offering advice. It would probably work better for you if you stop guessing so much. You admit your relying on 3 yr old info. You don't have enough interest to update that info, but you have enough interest to engage in incorrect supposition about what it is, what it does, and how to use it. There's no right way and wrong way to use it. You literally go through the same process as NFC. Here's an updated visual for you.

Apple probably doesn't use MST because of the 20 or so patents that Samsung has on the tech. Nothing counter-intuitive about it. Apple doesn't want to pay licensing fees.

 

[Böhme417]

Do me a favor. Go back and read that article. A couple of things should immediately jump out at you. 1. You're relying on an article that is over 3 years old. Wouldn't it be a bit more prudent to use something more recent? 2. That quote from Beardsley... appears with no context nor any reference to the fact that a. MST is tokenized and contains no personal information and b. is not legacy magstripe tech, but a variation that uses the underlying principles to communicate with legacy tech.

Based on the quote, it doesn't even seem as if Beardsley understands what MST is. He's criticizing terminal magstripe tech that is used to read your actual info on your actual credit card. That's not what MST is or does.

I've found this curious for some time, because I thought tokenization was only supported by the card companies if it conformed to the EMV specification, which, to my knowledge, MST does not. It only includes contactless by NFC or by chip contact.

 

[sidewinder3000]

First, understand that I'm not trying to tell you what to do. Just offering advice. It would probably work better for you if you stop guessing so much. You admit your relying on 3 yr old info. You don't have enough interest to update that info, but you have enough interest to engage in incorrect supposition about what it is, what it does, and how to use it. There's no right way and wrong way to use it. You literally go through the same process as NFC. Here's an updated visual for you.

Apple probably doesn't use MST because of the 20 or so patents that Samsung has on the tech. Nothing counter-intuitive about it. Apple doesn't want to pay licensing fees.

I appreciate the information. The advice is unnecessary. I’m not guessing. Nor am I “relying” on old information. It’s just stuff I read a few years ago. I’m not defending a POV. I could give a rats ass, honestly. You had some updated info and I acknowledged that it wasn’t my area of expertise and that you were likely correct. Not sure what else there is to say or why you decided to go into the advice giving business. Thanks for the technical insight.

 

[Broken Hope]

I’m not relying on a three-year-old article, I read it, and several other articles, three years ago. I remember the time that several articles give the impression that it was not as secure. Haven’t really been compelled to read any more about it since because it doesn’t really matter to me that much or effect my experience. More and more companies keep converting to Apple Pay terminals, which makes playing with my phone more and more convenient. Even the hold outs like Best Buy and CVS are finally coming on board. But looking at it the article again, it does appear like he is shooting from the hip a bit. As often happens with the tech press, they write about things right when they come out, but rarely follow up with real world test once something has been out for a few months. The sites that do revisit the reviews I always find to be a little more reliable.

It’s entirely possible that the underlying technology behind the strip is as secure as NFC, though that does seem counterintuitive. Somehow, if it truly is as secure, then I am curious why Apple wouldn’t use it, since that would help Apple Pay be accepted in more places.

It may have to do with the user experience, which appears to be a bit more finicky when using that strip. I rarely ever see anyone using Samsung Pay out in the wild, so that observation is very anecdotal, but the few times that I have been behind people in line who are using it, it has resulted in delays because people don’t use it right. Apparently there is a right way and a wrong way to do it, but I have no idea what that is because I’ve never used it.

Probably the main reason is that the other countries that accept Apple Pay aren't as behind as the US, in the UK well over 95% of shops have contactless so Apple Pay works pretty much everywhere, so supporting MST would be pointless.

 

[sidewinder3000]

I appreciate the information. The advice is unnecessary.

Probably the main reason is that the other countries that accept Apple Pay aren't as behind as the US, in the UK well over 95% of shops have contactless so Apple Pay works pretty much everywhere, so supporting MST would be pointless.

That makes sense. When I have gone to Europe it always seems as though the payment terminals they have there are way more advanced. I remember 10 years ago having waiters bring remote credit card terminals to my table in London. We here in the US definitely seem to be lagging further behind.

 

[DeepIn2U]

Likewise.

Unfortunately here in Canada I have to work with auto deposit via eTransfer between my son, mother, sister and myself.

Hi Everyone,

Canadian here and I just noticed a listing in my Settings, iCloud, Payment & Shipping listing showin Apple Pay Cash!

I updated my bank card yesterday (TD Debit-Visa) and just below I see this with no balance. Of course since I live in Canada I cannot activate it. Nor do I see it in my wallet.

iPhone 8
TD Bank
^ same setup as my girl has. Both update our bank cards within 2 days of one another yet only I have this.

Confirmed iCloud is a Canadian address; never a USA address (App Store or iTunes Store).

Is there anyone else in Canada have this?