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Copy and Paste Implementation, Exchange Support for iPhone?
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Nice! I like that.I've been reading these 4 pages and was surprised that what I consider to be the easiest implementation of copy & paste has not been mentioned. The current method of positioning the cursor within text by using the magnification bubble works very well (at least for me) and is highly intuitive, let's not change this. The way I see it, a highly easy method of accomplishing this would be as follows:
CUTTING OR COPYING:
1. as today, use your finger using the magnification bubble to position the cursor at either the start or end point of the selection you want to either cut or copy
2. while maintaining your finger at that location, use your thumb to hold down the Home button and it will now highlight the text as you now continue to move your finger to the start or end of your selection
3. once finished highlighting your selection, release the Home button after which a pop-up provides the option to either cut or copy (then move finger up or down and lift to select option)
PASTING:
1. use magnifying bubble to position cursor to location you want to paste
2. while maintaining your finger at that location, use your thumb to click the Home button, after which a paste or cancel (if nothing is in the "clipboard", clicking the Home button would do nothing - it would be as if you were copying/cutting and made an error clicking the Home button)
To me, this method removes all the "waiting" proposed from other techniques as well as multi-tap complexity.
Does this seem like a valid technique or am I missing something?
Sold! I have some significant plans for our backyard, and could definitely use the help in a few years.
Copy in Leopard - Command-C
Paste in Leopard - Command-V
Please PM me for shipping information.
Seriously though, I guess this is one of the things that you miss if you use it - I almost never do copy/paste on my Palm.
I'm not entirely sure I believe the "Apple rep" explanation of why C/P isn't there, but it seems at least Apple is aware this is a PITA for its users.
The cut n paste command is probably for files. I have never known Mac OS to have a cut n paste for files.
I've been reading these 4 pages and was surprised that what I consider to be the easiest implementation of copy & paste has not been mentioned. The current method of positioning the cursor within text by using the magnification bubble works very well (at least for me) and is highly intuitive, let's not change this. The way I see it, a highly easy method of accomplishing this would be as follows:
CUTTING OR COPYING:
1. as today, use your finger using the magnification bubble to position the cursor at either the start or end point of the selection you want to either cut or copy
2. while maintaining your finger at that location, use your thumb to hold down the Home button and it will now highlight the text as you now continue to move your finger to the start or end of your selection
3. once finished highlighting your selection, release the Home button after which a pop-up provides the option to either cut or copy (then move finger up or down and lift to select option)
PASTING:
1. use magnifying bubble to position cursor to location you want to paste
2. while maintaining your finger at that location, use your thumb to click the Home button, after which a paste or cancel (if nothing is in the "clipboard", clicking the Home button would do nothing - it would be as if you were copying/cutting and made an error clicking the Home button)
To me, this method removes all the "waiting" proposed from other techniques as well as multi-tap complexity.
Does this seem like a valid technique or am I missing something?
Huh.
Now this actually seems in the neighborhood of 'best suggestion/most likely to be implemented.'
Nice!
There's one problem...
There's one problem with most of these methods: they forget that the magnifying glass only shows up in editable text fields.
What if you want to copy words off a web page or some other uneditable text?
That's tough. It's hard enough for me to get the insertion point where I want it. Trying to get text on a static page, without a prompt, will be really diffiicult.
There's one problem with most of these methods: they forget that the magnifying glass only shows up in editable text fields.
What if you want to copy words off a web page or some other uneditable text?
That's tough. It's hard enough for me to get the insertion point where I want it. Trying to get text on a static page, without a prompt, will be really diffiicult.
Which reminds me... how is it that 20+ years into the gui cut/paste era, and neither major OS provides historical cut/paste?
I remember clipboard add-ons for mac loooooonnnng ago and they're probably still available, but why is this not standard interface by now?
Indeed. UI design is hard at the best of times. Its even more so when you are effectively working in the dark, as the iPhone team are. What they are doing is completely new, and they have to get it right first time, by balancing what people expect of cut/copy/paste with the new opportunities the multitouch paradigm affords.
Well I'll be darned.
Learn something every day. Thanks!
But that's an application specific implementation.
I'm talking about OS level implementation, consistent and leveraged by all apps.
my wrists are killing me after typing this novel..
Holy crap! Do I get something for having the longest multiple-response post ever?
Although I think quite a bit can be accomplished with contexual commands and "smart tags" for things like phone numbers, email addresses, and links, you still need copy/cut and paste. If you can come up with an innovative, easy to use method of accomplishing everything you can do with cut/copy/paste without it, then by all means let me know and I'll start using it today.
Here are just a few examples:
[X] = Email, IM, TXT message, Web page
1) Rearrange text in an [X]
2) *Copy* a link from [X] into [X]
3) Look up a word from [X] in wikipedia/dictionary?
4) Copy a paragraph from a web page into an [X]
5) Copy a name from web page into address book (smart tags don't work for names)
6) Copy/Cut/Paste files in future iPhoneFinder
I don't think a good idea including the home button in this type of functionality, as it doesn't seem natural. The best part of the interface right now is that you know you can always return to home with the home button. I don't think it should be used for anything else. (I know the double tap ipod thing...)
"anti-clockwise"? lol.
. You bring up a great point, and even right hand operation would have trouble starting a highlight on the far right margin. I don't like the idea of having to use your middle finger or your thumb depending where you want to start the highlighting. Damn.. that's a blow to my original idea. I do however, think some alternative version of that would work. As i mentioed above, I really like the idea of having a "modifier" command (aka 2nd finger tap) akin to the left-click-hold to highlight on a regular mouse.
You lose. j/k. Although better than the four second idea, I think having two "layers" of finger-down and-wait is a bit much. It is dead simple though, and easy to show people.
Holy crap! Do I get something for having the longest multiple-response post ever?
Not all cut/copy is done within the context of an editable field. Web page text for instance. And adding a button elsewhere wouldn't make sense.
Although I think quite a bit can be accomplished with contexual commands and "smart tags" for things like phone numbers, email addresses, and links, you still need copy/cut and paste. If you can come up with an innovative, easy to use method of accomplishing everything you can do with cut/copy/paste without it, then by all means let me know and I'll start using it today.
Here are just a few examples:
[X] = Email, IM, TXT message, Web page
1) Rearrange text in an [X]
2) *Copy* a link from [X] into [X]
3) Look up a word from [X] in wikipedia/dictionary?
4) Copy a paragraph from a web page into an [X]
5) Copy a name from web page into address book (smart tags don't work for names)
6) Copy/Cut/Paste files in future iPhoneFinder
The problem is how to tell the interface when you are done positioning the cursor at the "start" point. What If you bring up the magnifying bubble and let go on the wrong spot. You go to reposition the starting point, but it thinks you are giving it the end point.
To have any kind of precision for selecting small text, you need to use the zoom 'bubble' to position the cursor. So the problem of notifying the interface when you want to start and end the highlighting is still there. It gets especially tricky when someone makes a mistake and wants to reposition the "begin highlight" cursor position.
Think about this for a moment. What happens when you "run" your finger across a webpage in mobile Safari. [/QUOTE]
I don't think a good idea including the home button in this type of functionality, as it doesn't seem natural. The best part of the interface right now is that you know you can always return to home with the home button. I don't think it should be used for anything else. (I know the double tap ipod thing...)
I don't think that is very intuitive. I also personally don't want them to get into the "stylus" shorthand so notorious on the legacy palm stuff. I don't know if it's the best idea, but I like the concept of keeping with the regular computer input "feel". So for highlighting, just as on a regular mouse, you would need a "modifier" action (aka left click and hold).
"anti-clockwise"? lol.
I think there is a middle ground between "quadruple tap" complexity and basic, intuitive multi-touch. The whole point of multi-touch is to use gestures/multiple finger actions to get away from a million drop-down menus (see: Windows Mobile - UGH);
I agree it is very simple, but also very time consuming. Image having to copy four discrete pieces of text.. Although only ~20 seconds, it would feel like an eternity.
Haha, I totally neglected you south paws! Sorry
. You bring up a great point, and even right hand operation would have trouble starting a highlight on the far right margin. I don't like the idea of having to use your middle finger or your thumb depending where you want to start the highlighting. Damn.. that's a blow to my original idea. I do however, think some alternative version of that would work. As i mentioed above, I really like the idea of having a "modifier" command (aka 2nd finger tap) akin to the left-click-hold to highlight on a regular mouse.I thought about the idea of having seperate "clicks" for the start and finish of the highlighting instead of having one fluid drag-motion, but in the end I came to the conclusion that it's just not as intuitive.
I think that is getting way too complicated and unintuitive. just my opinion though.
I thought guys might be interesting in hearing that I may have discovered the "perfect" solution to Copy & Paste for the iPhone & iPod touch...
Here's my thinking: You know the magnifying loupe on the iPhone? Well to bring that up (as you know) you hold your finger down for about 1/2 a second at any point in a text box. Here's the clever part... when you find the position where you want to start your Copy & Paste at you simply freeze, you hold that position (with loupe present) for about 1.5 seconds and the "navy" text selector within the loupe changes color to "green" (or any other color) right before your eyes. A subtle yet obvious clue that something is happening (i.e. hint hint iPhone / iPod touch user, you are now in select mode).
I win!
You lose. j/k
. Although better than the four second idea, I think having two "layers" of finger-down and-wait is a bit much. It is dead simple though, and easy to show people.To me, cut and paste is such a common and useful command, that I would definitly want it to be enabled by default. But I do like your idea of Apple being more open with advanced customization. I know they want to keeps things simple, but there is no reason why more advanced functionality can't be added with and on/off toggle in a prefs menu.
Hahaha. You'd have to carry one of those 12" square battery pads in your backpack. lol.LOL and just like a full computer in your pants you would carry the battery in your ever so stylish fanny (hip) pack and the computers cooling fan would turn on and not only cool the chip, but your underwear as well.
i could see touching the screen until the magnifying glass comes up, then maybe by pressing the home button at the same time, it would change the magnifying glass to a cursor... ?? ... maybe.
i know i'd love to actually see more calendar alert options. the calendar is one of the main reasons i got the phone and i'd love to be able to have an alert for, say, the second tuesday of every month.
i know i'd love to actually see more calendar alert options. the calendar is one of the main reasons i got the phone and i'd love to be able to have an alert for, say, the second tuesday of every month.
Its really quite simple.
1. Use the magnifying glass to find the start location
2. With your finger still on the glass tap anywhere with another finger to begin selecting (you do not need to keep your second finger on the glass as you move)
3. Keep your first finger on the glass and move magnifying glass to end location
4. Tap anywhere with second finger to bring up the copy/paste/cut menu
5. Move your finger up to select the action; the selection happens when your finger is removed.
This second finger tap would also be usable to in Safari to copy a link or open the link in a new window.
1. Use the magnifying glass to find the start location
2. With your finger still on the glass tap anywhere with another finger to begin selecting (you do not need to keep your second finger on the glass as you move)
3. Keep your first finger on the glass and move magnifying glass to end location
4. Tap anywhere with second finger to bring up the copy/paste/cut menu
5. Move your finger up to select the action; the selection happens when your finger is removed.
This second finger tap would also be usable to in Safari to copy a link or open the link in a new window.
Perfect example of why copy and paste is needed. At work, I will be on the road and someone will email me a tracking number for UPS or DHS and if they just email it as the number itself which is the case a lot of the time, I have to flip to safari and type in a few numbers, flip back to email, flip back to safari, or write it down and goto safari.
Such a PITA.
I had no trouble just copying and pasting on my treo.
Such a PITA.
I had no trouble just copying and pasting on my treo.
Talk about a widget I would love on my iPhone would be something like this one. http://www.apple.com/downloads/dashboard/shopping/deliverystatus.html
Bosunsfate and everyone else who questions the need for copy/paste. As a consumer, i shouldn't have to justify my need for a standard feature. Copy and paste is not some exotic feature, it's standard. Why should I as a consumer have to justify wanting the feature?. The fact that i want it is good enough. If i refuse to buy an iphone cause it does not have cut and paste, that is called capitalism (ie, the marketplace is demanding a feature and a company responds to the marketplace).. for too long, apple has demanded that the marketplace respond to it, instead of it responding to the marketplace. If you can ask the question about cut and paste, you can ask it for a lot of other things.. why do you need internet on a phone (it still makes calls without the internet right?). Why do you need email access on a phone?. Why do you even need a screen on a phone? (can you imagine apple making a smart phone without a screen cause it thinks we shouldn't have one?).. sounds ridiculous right?.. yet, you are willing to just accept apple choice in not implementing cut and paste?. What else would you accept from them?. what if steve jobs came and told you, you only needed one leg, you'd let him chop of the other?. Common... people want cut and paste cause they want cut and paste.. simple. End of story. I don't care how many time apple tells me i don't need cut and paste.. i ain't getting an iphone until it has features i want, period. If it does not have the features i want, i will not buy it.. this is called capitalism. If apple can make billions without adding cut and paste, good for them. No need for them to try to get the entire smartphone market, heck, MS and palm would like to survive, thank you very much. Good thing the iphone is not perfect eh?.
Instead of the single tap and hold for magnifier, why not just double-tap then hold? Move the finger along or down to select desired text, letting go copies it. Same action again elsewhere would automatically paste (double-tap then hold to paste into desired place).
Does it need to be any more complicated than that?
Does it need to be any more complicated than that?
Meh, don't work yourself up. Saying its a standard feature without actually saying ON WHAT is like saying shoe laces are a standard feature, before admitting that you're talking about baseball caps. Cut & Paste is NOT a "standard feature" on touchscreen cellphones. Sorry... its not.
How can you tell? Well. See if you'll make this bet. Someone dumps 5 random cellphones in front of you. Now, its a completely random sample. Now... take these pliers. Here. Now, pick any of the cellphones and if it doesn't have Cut & Paste, pull off one of your fingernails. Now, pick another phone to play again? Probably not a fun game.
Would Cut & Paste be great? Yup. But I'm not going to listen to a rant about how "standard" a feature something is, while Apple's reportedly struggling to find the best way to do it. WE WANT IT. You don't have to dream up some "entitlement" story to feel okay to pressure Apple. Pressure them ANYWAY.
~ CB
wnurse, I don't know what got your so grumpy today but you have really gone off on the wrong tangent.
No one here is saying that copy/paste is dumb idea, or that its nonsense to request it.
What people like myself are asking about are the uses and the specific needs for copy and paste. Because as software developers you have to think about how a person would use it to create something that is effective.
If you don't, then you end up creating crap. Anyway, I'd write more, but I've wasted enough time already.
Joy, Joy
Been waiting for copy/paste since the launch day of the ORIGINAL iPhone
Can't wait to use this feature and will almost daily
Been waiting for copy/paste since the launch day of the ORIGINAL iPhone
Can't wait to use this feature and will almost daily